NorthStar
Seeker Of Truth
"And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison
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Post by NorthStar on Oct 26, 2011 21:28:11 GMT -5
I have just ordered an 8x8 MiniDSP in order to remove all bass management, XO & EQ from the UMC-1. I will set all the speakers to full range and run all 7.1 channels through the MiniDSP. The 8x8 has a built in matrix switcher which allows you to sum all the channels to a sub channel and then has an individual 6 band PEQ for all channels. This way I can use pure direct mode for 2 channel listening with subs while also having correct bass management and EQ for movies. How much money did you have to invest (8x8 MiniDSP & extra interconnects)?
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Post by weeman on Oct 26, 2011 21:43:34 GMT -5
I have just ordered an 8x8 MiniDSP in order to remove all bass management, XO & EQ from the UMC-1. I will set all the speakers to full range and run all 7.1 channels through the MiniDSP. The 8x8 has a built in matrix switcher which allows you to sum all the channels to a sub channel and then has an individual 6 band PEQ for all channels. This way I can use pure direct mode for 2 channel listening with subs while also having correct bass management and EQ for movies. How much money did you have to invest (8x8 MiniDSP & extra interconnects)? The 8x8 MiniDSP was $399US and I will be using the onboard RCA connectors for all the channels expect SW which will be balanced. Already have heaps of spare RCA cables from over the years so no added costs on interconnects.
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NorthStar
Seeker Of Truth
"And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison
Posts: 0
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Post by NorthStar on Oct 26, 2011 22:46:49 GMT -5
Ok, thanks. ...Are you happy with your decisions so far? ...Or you want to wait till you get your MiniDSP?
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Post by weeman on Oct 26, 2011 23:15:23 GMT -5
Ok, thanks. ...Are you happy with your decisions so far? ...Or you want to wait till you get your MiniDSP? Yep, so far am pretty happy. The UMC-1 is a great value Pre-Pro with excellent SQ, it just has an unusual bass management setup and limited EQ.
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NorthStar
Seeker Of Truth
"And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison
Posts: 0
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Post by NorthStar on Oct 27, 2011 0:23:22 GMT -5
Thank you!
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Post by Nemesis.ie on Oct 27, 2011 4:28:04 GMT -5
Nice! Please post a review of the unit/plugins and also how you get on - i.e. any "odd effects" that might appear with all channels set to full in the UMC-1.
Also, one reason I've not looked at getting an 8x8 is that I don't see an advanced plugin yet. It would be really nice to be able to have REW do auto-filters for all 8 channels. I'd plan to use an 8x8 and a standard 2 x 4 to cover all source channels + 4 subs.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2011 4:56:15 GMT -5
Yes, equalization is seriously screwed up and probably won't be fixed as it is a "feature" rather than a problem.
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Post by weeman on Oct 27, 2011 5:56:31 GMT -5
Nice! Please post a review of the unit/plugins and also how you get on - i.e. any "odd effects" that might appear with all channels set to full in the UMC-1. Also, one reason I've not looked at getting an 8x8 is that I don't see an advanced plugin yet. It would be really nice to be able to have REW do auto-filters for all 8 channels. I'd plan to use an 8x8 and a standard 2 x 4 to cover all source channels + 4 subs. The 8x8 has all the advanced biquad functions built into the standard plugin. I am currently using a balanced 2x4 for EQ for 2 subs but will probably EQ them as 1 with the 8x8. The power amp for my Subs has 8x PEQ for each channel so I could use that as well if I had to. I will be using the REW auto-filters for all 8 channels and will post before and after graphs.
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Post by Nemesis.ie on Oct 27, 2011 6:34:21 GMT -5
Awesome!
I don't suppose there are delay-lines in the plugin too (with a decent range available)?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2011 7:09:59 GMT -5
It's sad that a longer delay isn't possible with the miniDSPs. IMHO bass management is the most basic and essential feature of a pre-pro and a major flaw of the UMC-1.
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Post by weeman on Oct 27, 2011 15:45:03 GMT -5
Awesome! I don't suppose there are delay-lines in the plugin too (with a decent range available)? There is 15ms delay per channel (double the 7.5ms on the 2x4 units). I still don't think this will be enough for my horn loaded orbit shifters, but it should be close.
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Post by nojevah on Oct 28, 2011 12:56:05 GMT -5
IMHO bass management is the most basic and essential feature of a pre-pro and a major flaw of the UMC-1. +1 (HDMI support is not perfect too, but let's accept HDMI/HDCP itself is lame)
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Post by stephen on Nov 29, 2011 19:41:44 GMT -5
I concur with the assessment that bass management on the UMC-1 was poorly thought out, but what we are missing is a signal flow/engineering block diagram (in the UMC-1 manual) as I would expect from professional audio gear (look at the Yamaha 01V96 or M7CL digital mixing console manuals, for example) which would allow us to understand the internals.
EDIT: Perhaps 'poorly thought out' is too strong of a phrase, but in the current schema the UMC-1 is missing an EQ for the summed subwoofer output useful for correcting for room deficiencies. Ideally, EQs for this purpose on all output channels would be parametric. It can't take that much DSP computational resources to implement biquad filters for a 4-band parametric EQ, although I suppose it depends on maximum allowable slope (Q)... It just dawned on me, however, that I bet the UMC-1 is making use of whatever EQ functionality is integrated into the Cirrus(?) chipset vs. giving the UMC-1 its own DSP resources? Or, there are other constraints on the architecture done on purpose in response to an SQ requirement (analog summing,...)...
For example, where in the signal flow are the delays derived from speaker distances applied? Are these offset by group delay introduced by the crossover/EQ digital filters? Where in each signal path does EmoQ inject its test signals?
If the LFE EQ is prior to signal summation with the lower parts of the other speaker group crossovers, what is this Subwoofer crossover setting I see and where is it applied in the signal chain? High pass or low pass? If low pass, what happens to the information above that frequency? If, as was mentioned in one of the other threads, it is injected back into the main speakers, where in that signal flow does it occur?
My list of questions to understand the internals continue... With proper documentation, however, an educated engineer or user (as I would assume most enthusiasts who purchase from Emotiva are) could derive all of the 'what-if' scenarios and outcomes themselves.
I saw similar confusion in the threads asking if the 7.1 input was sampled by an ADC and then sent out via the DAC, or if it was an analog connection via mechanical relay when that input was chosen -- a simple block diagram of the UMC-1 would resolve all of this confusion!
Otherwise, I'm an engineer relatively pleased with the UMC-1 bang for the buck...
If something like this has already been made available, please direct me!
Thanks, Stephen
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