What amps for Mirage speakers?

[rh]

Hi All,

First, great forum you have here. I'm wondering if someone can guide me on what amp/amps to get for my system. I have a Mirage surround sound with:

2x OMD-28
1x OMD-C2
2x OMD-R

I was initially going to get the XPA-5 to drive the system. Then, after reading more I thought I would get the XPA-5 for the center and surrounds (I have 2 more OMD-R that I haven't hooked up yet) and get an XPA-2 for the mains. Now I'm wondering if I should get the XPA-5 and 2 XPA-1's.

So, the choices are:

Option #1
1 XPA-5 for all 5 speakers

Option #2
1 XPA-5 for center and surround
1 XPA-2 for mains

Option #3
1 XPA-5 for center and surround
2 XPA-1 for mains

I'm probably leaning towards Option #2 as the best bang for the buck solution. I'm guessing the XPA-2 will drive the OMD-28's very well.

I'm looking forward to your thoughts. By the way, I'm probably split 50/50 on 2-channel music vs. Home Theater.

Thanks,
Robert

[Vermont99]

If money is not a issue I would go with option #3. The XPA-1's are unbelievable, I could not believe the all around improvement in 2 channel and HT when I added the XPA-1's to my system. Also when will you get to pick up the XPA-1 again at the current sale price? ;D

[monkumonku]

I've heard that the 28's need lots of power. If you have the money and space I would get the XPA-1's, mainly because that way you will never be second-guessing yourself and you might as well take advantage of the sale prices being offered now. The XPA-2 would be good also, but you'll always be thinking you should have bought the XPA-1 so just do it now and have peace of mind.

[briank]

+3, Definitely option 3. The 28's need the power and mono-blocks rule for music. :-)

[tjf120]

Check my signature below. I have the same system.

I originally started out with an XPA-5 as a 'trial' product from Emotiva. Sounded too good to be true, high quality amp at low price with a ton of power??

Well, a year later, I now have 3 XPA-1s (L/C/R) and an XPA-5. Bottom line, the OMD28s require a ton of power. I don't know if you could get by with an XPA-2 driving them, not sure if anyone else on the forum has an XPA-2, but anything less will not really 'open up' the speaker.

I bought my XPA-1s at the same sort of buy 2 get em on sale, so didn't think it was that much more over an XPA-2.

So, from my experience, Option 3.

If someone has something good to say about Option 2, I'd be curious to try it if money is an issue.

[rh]

Thanks for the replies.

I just find it hard to believe that the XPA-2 would have a hard time driving the OMD-28's. It's rated for 300 watts per channel into 8 ohms (the OMD-28's are 6 ohm).

While I can get the XPA-1's, I am unsure if the benefit will exceed the cost. As with most of the Emotiva crowd, I'm looking to get the best value. For example, if the XPA-2 gets me 95% of the way for less than half the money, I would probably be willing to take that trade off.

Hi tjf,

I'm interested to hear your impressions going from the XPA-5 to the XPA-1's. Can you share your thoughts? Have you tried an XPA-2? How are you liking the speakers?

Thanks,
Robert

[roadrunner]

Robert

Where music is such a major part of your usage for the HT system I would strongly advise you to get the XPA-1 amps. They will provide a much improved listening experience; and, if sound quality is important in your music enjoyment the XPA-1 is well worth the incremental costs. If the HT were primarily for movies, I don't know that the improvement in sound would be significant enough to warrant to upgrade.

You will enjoy your system which ever option you select, but the OMD-28s thrive on power. The more clean power you feed them the better they perform. That means you should select either option 2 or option 3; and if your budget allows, option 3 will provide musical performance on a whole new plateau. Enjoy your new system.

[NorthStar]

Option #3.

Et Bienvenu au Lounge Robert!

[strindl]

Nov 30, 2010 16:21:57 GMT -5 rh said:

Thanks for the replies.

I just find it hard to believe that the XPA-2 would have a hard time driving the OMD-28's. It's rated for 300 watts per channel into 8 ohms (the OMD-28's are 6 ohm).

While I can get the XPA-1's, I am unsure if the benefit will exceed the cost. As with most of the Emotiva crowd, I'm looking to get the best value. For example, if the XPA-2 gets me 95% of the way for less than half the money, I would probably be willing to take that trade off.

Hi tjf,

I'm interested to hear your impressions going from the XPA-5 to the XPA-1's. Can you share your thoughts? Have you tried an XPA-2? How are you liking the speakers?

Thanks,
Robert

I've got a pair of XPA-1's as well as an XPA-2 and an XPA-5 and have been able to compare them side by side on different speakers.
The XPA-1's are the best...no question. The XPA-2 isn't far behind at all though. I use my XPA-2 in my bedroom system to drive a pair of power hungry 4 ohm Magnepan 1.6's and it does a fantastic job with that.

There's really no wrong answer going with either an XPA-2 or a pair of XPA-1's...I'm certain you will be in audio heaven with either. If you want to spend the extra money, the XPA-1's are the ticket. If you'd rather save half that and get an XPA-2, I'm sure you'd be very happy that way as well....with some extra money left in your checking account.

[Deleted]

Robert, welcome to the Lounge.

Ultimate AV Magazine reviewed and tested the Mirage OMD-28.

.....Sensitivity (Efficiency) --- 83dB's

.....Nominal Impedance --- 6 ohms

Unfortunately you give no facts about the size of your room which greatly effects the power required. The 83dB's is way below the Mirage published spec of 87dB's. They need more than twice the power (4 dB's increase) one would estimate from reading the Mirage spec of 300 watts unclipped at 6 ohms. Thus I would conclude from the test results that up to approximately 750-800 watts per channel (300 watts plus increase of 4 dB's is about 700-800 watts) would be more practical in demanding circumstances.

If you take 83dB's at one meter and relate that to a maximum volume output of 110db's in your room, it would take 512 watts to reach that sound level. It is not unusual for a quality speaker and sound source, both music and movies, to reach 105-110dB's especially on peaks in the average room . Understand that the sensitivity spec is only one meter away and would produce less volume at normal listening distances. For example for the OMD-28 with 512 watts at 6 ohms:

.....at one meter/3 feet --- 110dB's

.....at two meters/6 feet --- 103.98dB's

.....at three meters/9 feet --- 100.46dB's

.....at four meters/12 feet --- 97.96dB's

.....at five meters/15 feet --- 96.02dB's

The XPA-2 delivers approx 400 watts RMS into 6 ohms (marginal at best IMO). The XPA-1 delivers approx 750 watts into 6 ohms. These amps will of course produce more power for instantaneous peaks. Take a typical listening seat at 9 feet away from the OMD-28. We can estimate it will take:

.....512 watts/6 ohms to produce 100dB's

.....750 watts (XPA-1) to produce 101-102dB's (a very realistic level)

.....1024 watts to produce 103 dB's

.....2048 watts to produce 106dB's.


Some may nitpick with these figures some, but they are from a well known review group and indicate the extreme power that the Mirage OMD-28 can require to reproduce very loud volumes on music and movie soundtrack peaks. This is very revealing information about the tremendous power required for a quality built speaker of well below average sensitivity. You have heard folks claim that the OMD-28's need lots of power. This explains why. The XPA-1 is your best bet to insure that the amp very seldom if ever goes into clipping driving these power hungry speakers.

For me the XPA-1 is a huge no-brainer for these speakers and well worth every extra dime! ;D

[tjf120]

Nov 30, 2010 16:21:57 GMT -5 rh said:

Hi tjf,

I'm interested to hear your impressions going from the XPA-5 to the XPA-1's. Can you share your thoughts? Have you tried an XPA-2? How are you liking the speakers?

Thanks,
Robert

I do not have an XPA-2, just the XPA-1s and an XPA-5.

As Chuckie's Math points out, the XPA-5 just could not properly drive the OMD28s. I knew when I was listening to music on them they didn't sound right. Then I bought the XPA-1s...and it elevated the speaker to a new level of performance. Absolutely love the setup now. I simply don't know how I would get a better sounding setup for the $$ (Vanns Mirage prices and Emotiva amps).

[jackfish]

Why not two Emotiva XPA-1s for the low frequency section and two Emotiva XPA-1s for the mid and high frequency sections with a passive bi-amp configuration? See attached.

[oat07]

Nov 30, 2010 16:50:13 GMT -5 roadrunner said:

Robert

Where music is such a major part of your usage for the HT system I would strongly advise you to get the XPA-1 amps. They will provide a much improved listening experience; and, if sound quality is important in your music enjoyment the XPA-1 is well worth the incremental costs. If the HT were primarily for movies, I don't know that the improvement in sound would be significant enough to warrant to upgrade.

You will enjoy your system which ever option you select, but the OMD-28s thrive on power. The more clean power you feed them the better they perform. That means you should select either option 2 or option 3; and if your budget allows, option 3 will provide musical performance on a whole new plateau. Enjoy your new system.

+1

I have the smaller OMD-5s and OMD-C1 (the OMD-15s will be used for my mains in the future). Mirage is being a little conservative with their power recommendations. These small bookshelf speakers require alot of power to drive them. I am talking twice as much as my old Infinity Beta 50s (8 ohm, dual 8in subs). I have to turn the volume up 50% more in my same setup with the XPA-5 and UMC1. The more power the better.

[tjf120]

Dec 1, 2010 9:31:03 GMT -5 jackfish said:

Why not two Emotiva XPA-1s for the low frequency section and two Emotiva XPA-1s for the mid and high frequency sections with a passive bi-amp configuration? See attached.

Ha...that is definitely the most expensive option.

Because of my cables, I was unable to span the 14" separation between the binding posts on the XPA-1. So I passively bi-wired my L/C/R.

I know this will fire off a bunch of discussion, but I was unable to hear any noticeable difference after bi-wiring. Again, I left them bi-wired because of the binding post problems, but I don't see the benefit.

I think true bi-amping with x-overs etc may help, but given the investment to do that, don't think its worth it.

All I know, if my Iron can pump 15 amps of current through a pretty thin piece of wire....the 10 gauge wire can more than handle the signals to the speakers.

Bi-wiring was a fun experiment for me...I think people are only going to believe it if they do it....

[rh]

Wow! Thanks for all of the great information and experiences everyone! There is truly a wealth of knowledge here.

Chuckienut,

Thanks for the very thorough explanation and the lesson. I never would have guessed the need fo that kind of power. It really drives home the point.

Thanks,
Robert