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Post by dougc on Apr 3, 2013 21:02:40 GMT -5
tiwer1, To give you another confirmation, my UPA-500 and XPA-200 operate the same way. UPA-500: Standby (LEDs off) to ON (LEDs blue) immediately XPA-200: Standby (LEDs off) to Power Up (LEDs red) for a couple of seconds to ON (LEDs blue) Thanks for the confirmation. They must all be working correctly.
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Post by dougc on Apr 3, 2013 21:13:19 GMT -5
It looks like when our AVR's go out we will be forced to switch to a dedicated preamp. The mas-market avr's don't have preouts anymore (yamaha, onkyo, pioneer, denon). On top of that finding good RCA cables are becoming rare, who would have thought.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2013 4:31:17 GMT -5
Excellent! Yes that is exactly how mine operate. Thank you for your dedication . Greatly appreciated!
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Post by AudioHTIT on Apr 6, 2013 13:49:39 GMT -5
On top of that finding good RCA cables are becoming rare, who would have thought. You're kidding right?
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Post by dougc on Apr 6, 2013 14:51:56 GMT -5
Unfortunatly I'm not. At least not around the Portland / Vancouver area. I mean I can buy the 1.99 cheapo's all day long. After buying my UPA 700 I decided to clean up my system a little and go with 3ft cables opposed to the 6ft. I have gone to 5 major places and could not find 3 pairs of 3ft. matching rca cables. Even Radio Shack only had 1 pair. Bestbuy 1 pair of 6ft'rs. Who would have thought.
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Post by AudioHTIT on Apr 6, 2013 20:22:28 GMT -5
Well you can get some nice BlueJeans cables delivered to your door for a reasonable price, good quality cable and connectors, any length, various colors, made in USA, and they're not far from you in Seattle.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2013 0:34:50 GMT -5
It looks like when our AVR's go out we will be forced to switch to a dedicated preamp. The mas-market avr's don't have preouts anymore (yamaha, onkyo, pioneer, denon). On top of that finding good RCA cables are becoming rare, who would have thought. I had a Denon AVR-1910 but it didn't have preouts, so I got a refurbed AVR3312CI for 50% msrp from a Denon authorized online vendor. It was around 600 dollars, considering I just wanted the preouts, but happy using Audyssey now that I have tinkered with it after having it all these years. You can get highly reviewed cables from where that guy spoke of, there is also monoprice as well, but not sure if they do rca or how they would compare. I have gotten HDMI cables from Monoprice and had no issues. The ML speakers are to be arriving at a location Monday, so when the guy goes to get them and brings them to the store that I bought from, I will go get them. Keep you informed.
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Post by dougc on Apr 7, 2013 12:12:01 GMT -5
You guys are missing the point. There are a ton of places we all can order good RCA cables online. The point is: What happened to just running to the local Best Buy, Radio Shack, etc ? I mean 95% of the time we have a cable fail it's at a wrong time. We are in the middle or getting ready to listen wether it be a movie or music. So what? We go online and wait 3-5 days plus s/h $ ? That doesn't do me any good now. I mean I have 6 stereo systems hooked up around my place all older. With equilizers, tuners,vcrs, cassettes,older CD or dvd players even an 8 track. All require analog rca connection.What pisses me off is the electronic companies are forcing everything digital and taking away our analog options, Wether it be the cables or the hookup options on the back of our equiptment,S-video,composit,rca,ect. Thats my point. Thats like having a 68 Camero or a 57 Chevy and the manufacter saying ; Sorry we don't offer carburated motors anymore. Sorry I guess I got onto a little tangent there. Doug
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2013 12:21:07 GMT -5
You guys are missing the point. There are a ton of places we all can order good RCA cables online. The point is: What happened to just running to the local Best Buy, Radio Shack, etc ? I mean 95% of the time we have a cable fail it's at a wrong time. We are in the middle or getting ready to listen wether it be a movie or music. So what? We go online and wait 3-5 days plus s/h $ ? That doesn't do me any good now. I mean I have 6 stereo systems hooked up around my place all older. With equilizers, tuners,vcrs, cassettes,older CD or dvd players even an 8 track. All require analog rca connection.What pisses me off is the electronic companies are forcing everything digital and taking away our analog options, Wether it be the cables or the hookup options on the back of our equiptment,S-video,composit,rca,ect. Thats my point. Thats like having a 68 Camero or a 57 Chevy and the manufacter saying ; Sorry we don't offer carburated motors anymore. Sorry I guess I got onto a little tangent there. Doug Yeah I see what you mean there now. Totally agree. And to charge $20+ on an optical cable lol. It is a pain in the butt. I have not looked for analog cables locally in many years, I am not sure what Radio Shack has in town, but I bet it's an arm and a leg. If you had to have something to tie over though, I would like to think they have somethin' lol :S.
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Post by 1960broookwood on Apr 7, 2013 12:29:45 GMT -5
Turns and earns--Not much point in stocking something that does not sell.
I drive a 54 year old Chevy--And don't expect to pull into a local dealer and buy parts off the shelf.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2013 12:41:14 GMT -5
Any nearby car audio shops? Apples to oranges. Car stereo systems do not use digital cables for audio. If they don't have RCA cables they have a big issue. I am trying to keep this on topic. RCA cables are still widely used and some cases there is no digital option even on new car radios. When I did a custom install of speakers...touchscreen head unit...and an amp in a vehicle...there was no digital cables as an allowed option.
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Post by dougc on Apr 7, 2013 16:31:56 GMT -5
Now your starting to get the point, 1960brookwood what if your carburator wnt to s--t and they told you ; Sorry we don't sell rebuild kits or carburators anymore. And Tyler are you trying to get me with that apples to oranges stuff. LOL thats not gonna work, At least not this time. Better see a review on the Logans tommarrow. Doug
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Post by knucklehead on Apr 7, 2013 16:40:57 GMT -5
It looks like when our AVR's go out we will be forced to switch to a dedicated preamp. The mas-market avr's don't have preouts anymore (yamaha, onkyo, pioneer, denon). On top of that finding good RCA cables are becoming rare, who would have thought. Denon 3313 and up AVRs have preamp out - so does Onkyo 709/717 and up - HK 3600 and the latest iterations - Marantz? Not sure but I think the 5xxx and up all have preamp out jacks. FWIW the UMC-200 is cheaper and sounds just as good. At least in comparison to my last AVR - the Onkyo NR818. It seems like the lower end AVRs would benefit more from preamp out jacks since the further up the food chain you climb in AVRs the better the amps are.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2013 3:13:10 GMT -5
It looks like when our AVR's go out we will be forced to switch to a dedicated preamp. The mas-market avr's don't have preouts anymore (yamaha, onkyo, pioneer, denon). On top of that finding good RCA cables are becoming rare, who would have thought. Denon 3313 and up AVRs have preamp out - so does Onkyo 709/717 and up - HK 3600 and the latest iterations - Marantz? Not sure but I think the 5xxx and up all have preamp out jacks. FWIW the UMC-200 is cheaper and sounds just as good. At least in comparison to my last AVR - the Onkyo NR818. It seems like the lower end AVRs would benefit more from preamp out jacks since the further up the food chain you climb in AVRs the better the amps are. Yup . The 3312 which is the 2012 model also not current, has the preouts too, which is what I have. I have grown fond of the Audyssey feature, even while having a dB meter. I would love to see that implemented into an Emotiva product. Everything was muddy sounding on my speakers until I applied the flat response curve to counter inconsistencies of the speaker and the room acoustics...to its effect anyways. Even in 2ch I prefer Audyssey flat, and I listen to vinyl so its sort of funky to throw a toss up like that even then. Pre-Pros are so expensive except for the Emotiva's, which is great. For now I cannot imagine life without Audyssey, but for those who can, they have a superb major cost effect option with Emotiva, thankfully. dougc, the apples to oranges was about the other guy. It seemed a bit trollish and I did not want to inflate the goofy comparison that was completely off topic, cars vs cables lol. I implemented cars with cables and the vehicles do not use digital cables for head units that I have seen yet . His mechanic might not have em no, but a car audio shop should. I will get you the ML review hopefully soon. The speakers are to arrive somewhere in WA today, I am not sure if its at the audio shop or not, or if they have to go pick them up. I am also waiting after that point for when a audio store worker drives to the location I need to go to, so I am not sure what day that will be. I should be able to get the speakers on that day. Keep you informed.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2013 15:44:56 GMT -5
I got the MartinLogan Motion 40's, and Motion 30 yesterday from the dealer. I had seen the speakers on a different showroom's floor, and in Frys Electronics earlier on, with very poor lighting in both places. The speakers look very good with decent lighting, and are very very dark, otherwise. Luckily that does not affect performance lol. The Motion 30 is a pretty small center, but is the biggest in its line, while performs to what seems to present it as a bigger speaker. I absolutely am loving the Folded Motion Tweeter. There is not much shrill, I am assuming whatever miniature amount is left, is due to the recordings or the room acoustics (mainly hear it from some loud rock/metal). Dialog is many steps better than the Infinity set. I was curious on the dispersion of sound, which turned out to seem like less outwards, compared to the Infinity's, but blended inwards (center direction) in a whole better attitude. Hard to believe that I had so much faith in those Infinity's. The Infinity's were killer for what I paid for them. I am more than happy that I got them. I am hoping to sell my existing Infinity's (minus the sub), to help fund towards a set of Motion 15's. I would either go for another set of Motion 15's for rears, or go with a different sub first. The sub is great...to my knowledge, but look how that turned out with the other speakers lol. The Emotiva's are doing wonders. Considering the jump from 8ohm to now being at 4ohm resistance per speaker, I get more wattage through, especially on the XPA-200.
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Post by dougc on Apr 12, 2013 21:34:15 GMT -5
Well it sounds lik your pretty happy with them. Thats good. I have been courious as to how the folded motion tweter compares with my BG Neo3pdr's. I am totaly brain dead from my week, I am going to kick back by the fire with my wife (in our backyard) crank some tunes and party. I'll post more tomarrow.
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Post by dougc on Apr 13, 2013 12:18:11 GMT -5
Tyler as far as selling your speakers and trying to figure which to go with. Well of course that has to be your decision. Personally I would go with the surrounds. I only say this from personal experience. When I started building my own speakers to replace my Paradigms, I started with my 2 subs (L/R). Then I built my mains, and followed up with the center. I was on a roll, surrounds next. Not, the economy took a dive, my cabinet shop folded, and I became unemployed for 2 yrs. That was 2 yrs ago. So for the last 4yrs I have been listening to different surrounds than my mains/ center. With my Yamaha the sound was ENTIRELY different between the front and the surrounds. It was quite annoying. Since I've bought the UPA 700 the sound is a lot closer to the same, which has made it a lot more enjoyable. The bottom line is the sound is still different. I guess what I'm trying to say is, the surrounds carry the full freq. spectrum, and thats what you hear. The subs only carry a small portion, 40-60hz of auditable sound. To me it's a no brainer, but thats just my opinion. Later, Doug
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2013 9:24:18 GMT -5
dougc. You are absolutely correct, the sides and rears are more important to match first. I think I will do the sub last, and then I want to get a refurbed Denon in a year or so, that has Audyssey XT32 instead of my XT. My sub has this weird noise that it makes that I seem to only hear at idle, not sure what it is. I ordered a sub cable for the heck of it, and to see if it makes a difference as well for the weird noise. I have a hunch it is something internal to the sub, who knows. The tweeters in the Martin Logans, are of something else altogether . The guy at Magnolia told me he had a friend that was in church I think it was, and there was instruments used and so forth, while the only speakers he knew of that could match close to that sound was the Martin Logans...which he claims to own quite a few that match. I was listening to songs that hit up to 20khz on the meters in the program, and the tweeters were running pristine and there didn't seem to be any added flavor. The Infinity's were a pain with that type of use. I can play these at much higher on my Denon's audio scale, while having it at 75dB Reference level. The Martin Logans are actually more loud with less trim, I am guessing that the XPA-200 going to 4 ohms which is rated almost twice the wattage as 8 ohms made a difference. The Center is on the UPA-700 and seems to still be similar. The speakers were rated as less efficient by a dB but yeah...not complaining. These speakers are a pleasure for extended listenings, the Infinity's were not anywhere near tolerable after the length of an album or maybe less, maybe a few minutes on metal type music even. Besides the tweeters, the other HUGE difference I have noticed, is the lack of a certain sound, which is very good, and in which I had no idea I was hearing without comparison. The Infinity set has a "wood" sound, that is very far up with the sound produced..very distinctive. The Martin Logans have chambers that are to not be very resonant apparently, so it was a total change to adapt to. While the ML's at first sound very flat to what I am used to, given that, I have gotten used to it and the clarity gained back of course is much worth it. There isn't anything I have played that bothers me with the speakers that would bother me with the Infinity's. I spend yesterday with my Father building a center ch stand, that sits behind the tv and props the Motion 30 above the tv (Height of center is the height you could set the center on the Fronts in a linear fashion. It sounds much better than below the tv in front. Stand was build from an entertainment center I was going to throw away, mixed with a very thick new square cut wood with 5 screws between two flat pieces of wood. Painted it black, and put rubberish black cabinet liner over the top and stapled underneath. I could sit on the thing it is so sturdy (also looks really nice). If I could describe the speakers, I would say anti-resonant, clean sound with at least on par spatialisation. *Lack of emphasis on tones, so it may fit with some and not with others. If articulate is what you want, it is superb. The bass is actually great with them, much better than the Infinity's...and more than I would have ever expected. My dad asked if the sub was on for the track (Kiss From A Rose - Seal). Not my normal listening material but a decent variance for a few parts.
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Post by dougc on Apr 16, 2013 21:56:19 GMT -5
Congratulations it sounds like you have hit a winner. I still can't help but to wonder how the folded air motion tweeters sound , compared to the BG neo3 pdr's that I'm useing. Martin Logan used my tweeters for a number of yrs. Then recently switched, I am curious if they sound better or they got a better contract. I know curiosity killed the cat. Unless Magnolia will let me bring in one of my speakers as a comparision I'lll never know. Gotta go, Doug
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2013 11:00:09 GMT -5
dougc, that is a very good reason to be curious. I have nothing else to compare in the same type of tweeter. If you happen to be anywhere around the Snohomish, WA area, let me know and you can stop by if you want to hear them, unless you have a Magnolia near. Or if its not a burden you can compare yours here, whatever it may be. It definitely is hard to say without your own ears to give a listen to compare what your personal preferences are. I am more than happy with these ML's, anxious but gladly waiting to fill the surrounds out and change the sub in time.
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