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Post by Porscheguy on Feb 24, 2014 18:08:28 GMT -5
I am about to purchase some speakers from a local audio company. Is it normal to bargain the price down? Has anyone here had any luck doing so? How much of a discount if any should I ask for? Thanks for any replies in advance Huge margin in speakers at B&M level. At least 100% m-up some speakers are much more. Not sure about Sandy Gross' no discount agreement. Thats price fixing and illegal. I can sell what I own for whatever I want and so can they.. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2014 18:17:13 GMT -5
Well they only sell through authorized dealers. You might have some wiggle room. Lead with something like this. "Do you ever run sales on these speakers? Are you running any type of promotions right now? When is the best time to buy?" This indicates to him that you want some sort of deal and are willing to wait for a good deal, even if your not. If you are going to enter negotiations, receive no love, and you still think there is a chance for a discount be prepared to walk away. Give him a card and say "Call me when you are running your next special maybe I will still be in need" and thank him for his time. They might tell you GoldenEar won't let them discount their product, like B&W. It has to come from the company itself. If you find they wont budge on the pair and you are okay with full MSRP ask them "What will you do for me if I purchase a whole set?" I am in sales. Keep in mind they are prepared for you. The majority of the population doesn't wake up and say "Hey honey, I'm going to go down to the local audio shop and take on the sales guy today" Really what you want to do is get the salesman talking. Chances are he will over talk the sale and will offer you all the information you need to know. Don't have your credit card in hand. It's ok to walk away, even if you just go have a beer to think about it. You can come back 20 minutes later and make your purchase. Most people that say they will beback never do. He might say "Hey hang on a second let me get my manager and see if we can work something out" If he asks you "What do you think is fair" Be prepared to answer that question and don't offend him. A lot of people get embarrassed to negotiate. If you don't ask most likely you will not receive. Hope this helps Excellent post, Pop. Superb advice.... |
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novisnick
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Post by novisnick on Feb 24, 2014 18:20:07 GMT -5
Way off topic but.... What's up with that Andrew? I noticed they replaced your Pendragons. C'mon man...I know we are on the Emotiva forum, but are they really besting your Tektons? Based on the review you wrote (pendragon) it's hard to imagine those leaving your HT room.  I didn't realize I was a Pendragon spokesperson. In all seriousness, I still have my Pendragons -all of them -and I still very much enjoy them. The same way I enjoy my Bowers & Wilkins CT8.2 LCRs speakers too. There is no best speaker IMHO, just different. Right now I'm enjoying my Stealths, but next week I might be in the mood for Pendragons, or maybe Bowers & Wilkins. Or maybe I'll be into a pair of 30 year old JBL horns? You never know with me. Andrew, I have a mint pair of JBL CF 120 s that sound amazing, thought you'd like to know. Nick |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2014 18:35:58 GMT -5
Or you could just buy Stealth 6s and know you're getting the best deal w/o having to haggle.  Andrew, The stealths are on my list. Would you say the tweeter is comparable to the tritons? As I type this I am listening to piano/acoustical on a pair of demo triton sevens, and my god is the tweeter, and the mids nearly perfect. |
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kse
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Post by kse on Feb 24, 2014 19:26:53 GMT -5
Not sure about Sandy Gross' no discount agreement. Thats price fixing and illegal. I can sell what I own for whatever I want and so can they.. You're confusing price fixing with retail (or resale) price maintenance. They are two entirely different things. The one I was referring to was the latter. You are correct that price fixing is illegal. RPM is not and is a practice that takes place between manufacturer and reseller (distributer) all the time. |
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Post by Porscheguy on Feb 24, 2014 19:32:28 GMT -5
Not sure about Sandy Gross' no discount agreement. Thats price fixing and illegal. I can sell what I own for whatever I want and so can they.. You're confusing price fixing with retail (or resale) price maintenance. They are two entirely different things. The one I was referring to was the latter. You are correct that price fixing is illegal. RPM is not and is a practice that takes place between manufacturer and reseller (distributer) all the time. Call it what you like, but it is illegal for a manufacturer to prevent a dealer for selling something at any price they want. For some it is a scare tactic like Apple, Sonos and Bose are guilty of. Someone should have the "stones" to sue one of these manufacturers. Although the margin is very small from the manufacturers. Not so with Golden Ear, they are a brick and mortar brand, they other 3 really are not. |
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kse
Emo VIPs
Hello me, meet the real me.
Posts: 1,947
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Post by kse on Feb 24, 2014 19:54:24 GMT -5
You're confusing price fixing with retail (or resale) price maintenance. They are two entirely different things. The one I was referring to was the latter. You are correct that price fixing is illegal. RPM is not and is a practice that takes place between manufacturer and reseller (distributer) all the time. Call it what you like, but it is illegal for a manufacturer to prevent a dealer for selling something at any price they want. For some it is a scare tactic like Apple, Sonos and Bose are guilty of. Someone should have the "stones" to sue one of these manufacturers. Although the margin is very small from the manufacturers. Not so with Golden Ear, they are a brick and mortar brand, they other 3 really are not. Ok. I'm not going to elaborate, Google can do that for you if you'd like to educate yourself on the topic. Look up grey market while you're at it. |
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Post by Andrew Robinson on Feb 24, 2014 20:00:24 GMT -5
Or you could just buy Stealth 6s and know you're getting the best deal w/o having to haggle. Andrew, The stealths are on my list. Would you say the tweeter is comparable to the tritons? As I type this I am listening to piano/acoustical on a pair of demo triton sevens, and my god is the tweeter, and the mids nearly perfect. Same tweeter material/design, ours has a slightly different crossover, which I believe makes it a bit smoother and more refined top to bottom. Plus it's powered, meaning it's always driven to its optimum potential. Nothing is wasted, as is the benefit of powered loudspeakers. |
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Post by monkumonku on Feb 24, 2014 20:50:06 GMT -5
You're confusing price fixing with retail (or resale) price maintenance. They are two entirely different things. The one I was referring to was the latter. You are correct that price fixing is illegal. RPM is not and is a practice that takes place between manufacturer and reseller (distributer) all the time. Call it what you like, but it is illegal for a manufacturer to prevent a dealer for selling something at any price they want. For some it is a scare tactic like Apple, Sonos and Bose are guilty of. Someone should have the "stones" to sue one of these manufacturers. Although the margin is very small from the manufacturers. Not so with Golden Ear, they are a brick and mortar brand, they other 3 really are not. Many years ago I recall there were certain brands that I was told could not be discounted, due to what I believe were called "fair trade laws" (I could be wrong about the name). In other words, the law actually prevented discounting. There was a suit brought against it and that law was overturned, which allowed stores like Fedco, a membership department store that sort of a forerunner to Costco in my area, to discount merchandise previously disallowed. However, I noticed over the years that the practice of not allowing discounts for certain items came back and that practice seems to be alive and well today. It would seem to me to be illegal but legal or not, it exists. |
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Post by Darksky on Feb 24, 2014 23:47:07 GMT -5
Andrew, sometimes it is hard to remember that you have so much (almost) at your disposal. I too, was surprised to see you swap out the Pendragons after your stellar review. Based on that review, I am considering a pair for my bedroom. I would look at the Stealths if I was not already invested in my current EMO amps.
Your being a pro in the field gives you a perspective most of us will never be able to afford.
I enjoy your posts, you bring a lot to the forum.
-Bradley
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Post by pop on Feb 25, 2014 0:16:56 GMT -5
Way off topic but.... What's up with that Andrew? I noticed they replaced your Pendragons. C'mon man...I know we are on the Emotiva forum, but are they really besting your Tektons? Based on the review you wrote (pendragon) it's hard to imagine those leaving your HT room. I didn't realize I was a Pendragon spokesperson. In all seriousness, I still have my Pendragons -all of them -and I still very much enjoy them. The same way I enjoy my Bowers & Wilkins CT8.2 LCRs speakers too. There is no best speaker IMHO, just different. Right now I'm enjoying my Stealths, but next week I might be in the mood for Pendragons, or maybe Bowers & Wilkins. Or maybe I'll be into a pair of 30 year old JBL horns? You never know with me. I think it is mostly the bold claim of that review that will keep you glued to the Pendragons. Off the top of my head I can't recall another review that compared 2.5k speakers to 30k even 70k sets. Either way, that review definitely peaked my interest. I remember reading somewhere that ya'll had been toying around with the Pendragons in office, yes? This makes me feel comfortable waiting for the new passive line. Not to say ya'll are trying to recreate what Eric has done, but maybe something of that caliber.....? See how I am leading you? Take the bait! |
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Post by TempTag on Feb 25, 2014 1:33:26 GMT -5
I just bought 2 pairs of GoldenEar speakers from a local authorized dealer (a week apart) and got a discount on both pair. (First pair was a fairly significant discount.)
It never hurts to ask...
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 25, 2014 3:32:10 GMT -5
A local dealer has had a pair of Klipsch Heresy III speakers in stock for about a year now. Their list price is $1,700 per pair plus tax. Knowing that the dealer was eager to move them, I offered $800 the pair and the dealer said yes.
In audio deals (as in high school dating): If you don't ask, you don't get.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2014 10:46:04 GMT -5
Im returning my demo pair of triton sevens today. I think im going to try a pair of stealth 6 before I make my final decision. Hopefully they will satisfy. If I do go with the stealth 6 I will probably start with three of them for LCR, and a pair of SVS sb 2000. With a umc 200.
Thanks again for all the great advice and help everyone.
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 25, 2014 11:25:00 GMT -5
According to this, several previous laws actually PREVENTED manufacturers from setting and enforcing minimum sale prices for their products. A later change made things so that it was no longer forbidden to so so, and several states then passed laws allowing manufacturers to set minimum prices. (The unreasonable issue seems to be that some of these fair trade laws prevented resellers from selling below suggested price EVEN IF THEY HADN'T SIGNED AN AGREEMENT NOT TO DO SO WITH THE MANUFACTURER. In other words, you couldn't sell their products below their set price even if you hadn't agreed not to; you were legally bound by the same agreement that OTHER resellers had signed. So the manufacturer was able to prevent ANYBODY from selling their products below their suggested price.) In 1975, the changes allowing this were repealed, and "fair trading" again became illegal (and the state and local laws requiring resellers to unilaterally "honor" manufacturers' price requirements were repealed/invalidated). legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Fair-Trade+LawsCall it what you like, but it is illegal for a manufacturer to prevent a dealer for selling something at any price they want. For some it is a scare tactic like Apple, Sonos and Bose are guilty of. Someone should have the "stones" to sue one of these manufacturers. Although the margin is very small from the manufacturers. Not so with Golden Ear, they are a brick and mortar brand, they other 3 really are not. Many years ago I recall there were certain brands that I was told could not be discounted, due to what I believe were called "fair trade laws" (I could be wrong about the name). In other words, the law actually prevented discounting. There was a suit brought against it and that law was overturned, which allowed stores like Fedco, a membership department store that sort of a forerunner to Costco in my area, to discount merchandise previously disallowed. However, I noticed over the years that the practice of not allowing discounts for certain items came back and that practice seems to be alive and well today. It would seem to me to be illegal but legal or not, it exists. |
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Post by monkumonku on Feb 25, 2014 11:36:33 GMT -5
According to this, several previous laws actually PREVENTED manufacturers from setting and enforcing minimum sale prices for their products. A later change made things so that it was no longer forbidden to so so, and several states then passed laws allowing manufacturers to set minimum prices. (The unreasonable issue seems to be that some of these fair trade laws prevented resellers from selling below suggested price EVEN IF THEY HADN'T SIGNED AN AGREEMENT NOT TO DO SO WITH THE MANUFACTURER. In other words, you couldn't sell their products below their set price even if you hadn't agreed not to; you were legally bound by the same agreement that OTHER resellers had signed. So the manufacturer was able to prevent ANYBODY from selling their products below their suggested price.) In 1975, the changes allowing this were repealed, and "fair trading" again became illegal (and the state and local laws requiring resellers to unilaterally "honor" manufacturers' price requirements were repealed/invalidated). legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Fair-Trade+LawsMany years ago I recall there were certain brands that I was told could not be discounted, due to what I believe were called "fair trade laws" (I could be wrong about the name). In other words, the law actually prevented discounting. There was a suit brought against it and that law was overturned, which allowed stores like Fedco, a membership department store that sort of a forerunner to Costco in my area, to discount merchandise previously disallowed. However, I noticed over the years that the practice of not allowing discounts for certain items came back and that practice seems to be alive and well today. It would seem to me to be illegal but legal or not, it exists. The bottom line from the article you linked above seems to be this: With fair-trade laws off the books, retailers and the market determine at what prices goods will be sold.But in reality, it seems some manufacturers do not allow this. They do not allow any retailer to discount their products except under manufacturer-authorized circumstances, and then everyone has to offer the same discount. So what's up with that? |
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Post by garbulky on Feb 25, 2014 12:14:10 GMT -5
According to this, several previous laws actually PREVENTED manufacturers from setting and enforcing minimum sale prices for their products. A later change made things so that it was no longer forbidden to so so, and several states then passed laws allowing manufacturers to set minimum prices. (The unreasonable issue seems to be that some of these fair trade laws prevented resellers from selling below suggested price EVEN IF THEY HADN'T SIGNED AN AGREEMENT NOT TO DO SO WITH THE MANUFACTURER. In other words, you couldn't sell their products below their set price even if you hadn't agreed not to; you were legally bound by the same agreement that OTHER resellers had signed. So the manufacturer was able to prevent ANYBODY from selling their products below their suggested price.) In 1975, the changes allowing this were repealed, and "fair trading" again became illegal (and the state and local laws requiring resellers to unilaterally "honor" manufacturers' price requirements were repealed/invalidated). legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Fair-Trade+LawsThe bottom line from the article you linked above seems to be this: With fair-trade laws off the books, retailers and the market determine at what prices goods will be sold.But in reality, it seems some manufacturers do not allow this. They do not allow any retailer to discount their products except under manufacturer-authorized circumstances, and then everyone has to offer the same discount. So what's up with that? I know next to nothing about this stuff. But I imagine it's a "suggestion" and if they don't follow it, they don't get any more speakers? |
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Post by Darksky on Feb 25, 2014 12:28:11 GMT -5
/\ BINGO!
Another tool that manufacturers use is the lowest advertised price agreement.
That keeps retailers from advertising a product at a price which is below a set number.
Retailers may choose to violate a manufacturer's rule, but it might be for the last time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2014 14:49:28 GMT -5
Well they only sell through authorized dealers. You might have some wiggle room. Lead with something like this. "Do you ever run sales on these speakers? Are you running any type of promotions right now? When is the best time to buy?" This indicates to him that you want some sort of deal and are willing to wait for a good deal, even if your not. If you are going to enter negotiations, receive no love, and you still think there is a chance for a discount be prepared to walk away. Give him a card and say "Call me when you are running your next special maybe I will still be in need" and thank him for his time. They might tell you GoldenEar won't let them discount their product, like B&W. It has to come from the company itself. If you find they wont budge on the pair and you are okay with full MSRP ask them "What will you do for me if I purchase a whole set?" I am in sales. Keep in mind they are prepared for you. The majority of the population doesn't wake up and say "Hey honey, I'm going to go down to the local audio shop and take on the sales guy today" Really what you want to do is get the salesman talking. Chances are he will over talk the sale and will offer you all the information you need to know. Don't have your credit card in hand. It's ok to walk away, even if you just go have a beer to think about it. You can come back 20 minutes later and make your purchase. Most people that say they will beback never do. He might say "Hey hang on a second let me get my manager and see if we can work something out" If he asks you "What do you think is fair" Be prepared to answer that question and don't offend him. A lot of people get embarrassed to negotiate. If you don't ask most likely you will not receive. Hope this helps Well I went and returned the sevens. And basically used everything Pop said above. In the end he offered me 15% off, so needless to say I'll have my triton 2's next week. Thanks for all the great advice. Now I have enough left over for a nice new emo amp! |
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Post by pop on Feb 25, 2014 15:03:29 GMT -5
Well they only sell through authorized dealers. You might have some wiggle room. Lead with something like this. "Do you ever run sales on these speakers? Are you running any type of promotions right now? When is the best time to buy?" This indicates to him that you want some sort of deal and are willing to wait for a good deal, even if your not. If you are going to enter negotiations, receive no love, and you still think there is a chance for a discount be prepared to walk away. Give him a card and say "Call me when you are running your next special maybe I will still be in need" and thank him for his time. They might tell you GoldenEar won't let them discount their product, like B&W. It has to come from the company itself. If you find they wont budge on the pair and you are okay with full MSRP ask them "What will you do for me if I purchase a whole set?" I am in sales. Keep in mind they are prepared for you. The majority of the population doesn't wake up and say "Hey honey, I'm going to go down to the local audio shop and take on the sales guy today" Really what you want to do is get the salesman talking. Chances are he will over talk the sale and will offer you all the information you need to know. Don't have your credit card in hand. It's ok to walk away, even if you just go have a beer to think about it. You can come back 20 minutes later and make your purchase. Most people that say they will beback never do. He might say "Hey hang on a second let me get my manager and see if we can work something out" If he asks you "What do you think is fair" Be prepared to answer that question and don't offend him. A lot of people get embarrassed to negotiate. If you don't ask most likely you will not receive. Hope this helps Well I went and returned the sevens. And basically used everything Pop said above. In the end he offered me 15% off, so needless to say I'll have my triton 2's next week. Thanks for all the great advice. Now I have enough left over for a nice new emo amp! Hey that's awesome man! Good job! So you ended up with like $450 off? That's HUGE! You took that salesman for a walk. HAHAHA |
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