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Post by creimes on Apr 7, 2017 12:00:10 GMT -5
Don't tell me about rising costs, try living outside the US, Emotiva has become one of those brands for the rich, of course this is not their own fault but the US dollar is very expensive for us Cheap compared to Aussie price Buy At :$3,999.00Cheers Gary Hey $250 more really isn't all that bad considering I'm only a 60 minute drive from the US and you are a 14 hour flight from the US
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Post by jamco on Apr 7, 2017 12:29:22 GMT -5
I strongly prefer the pricing approach described in Dan’s email and here’s why. I no longer have to wait on a purchase to save a stinking buck or feel like I’m biting the bullet by paying the non-sale price. For example, I missed a sale on the XSP-1, was patiently waiting for another sale with funds in hand, then the price went up and now other financial priorities are in the mix. So yeah, Dan’s change works out for me and I hope he stays the course.
On a related note, before seeing Dan's email and your posts this morning I attended an annual Music Matters event last night at a regional audio shop. While I've made purchases from this shop for the past 30 years, my business with them has slowed considerably after taking a chance on Emotiva. Last night it was cool listening to all the new audio gear, as well as the crazy and outrageous Moon 888 monoblock amplifiers with Focal Maestro Utopia speakers. However, I left the event reflecting on how Emotiva's approach of offering awesome gear at affordable prices had made them my first source when considering new audio gear since late 2014. I also thought about how I look forward to attending my first Emofest.
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Post by Bonzo on Apr 7, 2017 12:36:48 GMT -5
You are making this personal when in reality it's just business. Honestly, I don't think I am. I'm just following along. I think Dan is making it personal. His posts aren't fully business oriented, they are very much personally oriented. And his main explanation for switching is so customers don't get mad. That's personal if you ask me. I don't have any problem with someone keeping it business or making it personal. Either is totally fine. But it certainly seems to me some people here like to jump back and forth when ever it suits them, and that's something I do have problems with. I would call it hypocritical actually. I have explained the minutia in detail before and I'm not going to take the time to do it again. Suffice it to say, the people who bought full price the year Dan said there wouldn't be sales got duped, plain and simple. So I guess you just don't care whether people are honest or keep promises. Your prerogative. I do, and I happen to hold people to higher standards than that. I hold myself to high standards in those regards, and I expect the same in return. Plain and simple. And, I don't jump from one side to the fence to the other just to fit my needs at the time. That is true. But shifting back and forth between policies becomes much like a bait and switch, aka a scam, and it's shifty at best. Let's say for example we give Emotiva the benefit of the doubt for a couple years ago - lesson learned - and let by gones be by gones. But if the same pattern plays out again this year, and again since this is just an example I say if here, then I will call bull schiit. I will see the "no more sales policy" as a fake promise simply to boost turnover now during a typically slower time. If you don't / can't / won't see it that way, then I'd say you would be being naive. But since that's all just hypothetical right now, all we can do is kick back and wait and see. If we were betting on this, I'd bet the odds are 60% we see a sale in 2017, and more like 98% we see a sale in 2018. Hence why in my previous posts I said "will", not if.
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Post by netzer0 on Apr 7, 2017 14:28:38 GMT -5
Meh... Kinda getting tired of this crap. Prices have been rising since I started purchasing gear from emotiva and can't really say quality has gotten better from China made to US made... Prices WERE increased for the dealer model... don't forget about that. Not really about rising costs of electronics... Not sure other stuff is rising in price at the same ratio as is being told here. I get it, their business their ball. But they need to remember that when you start nearing prices of other reputable brands that is where heads will turn towards. It happened to me with the processor and if I didn't already have emo amps I would likely have gone other routes. I think I'm beginning to like the old Emotiva not the new "class H" brand they are seeking to become. Who knows.. Prices were NOT increased for the dealer model. Who else is building and selling fully balanced, 600 watt mono-block power amplifiers for $1,199.00?? Radio silence.... And by the way, the new Class H amplifier are better in very respect than the models they replace. Peace and love. Big Dan Dan, can you comment on new Class H audio quality of the XPA-1m vs the current XPA-1 with Class A mode enabled? Obviously these are very different amps... thanks!
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Post by Gary Cook on Apr 7, 2017 17:58:08 GMT -5
Hey $150 more really isn't all that bad considering I'm only a 60 minute drive from the US and you are a 14 hour flight from the US I'd drive the 60 minutes if I could and for me yes it's a 14 hour flight, but it's still cheaper than buying one locally. Cheers Gary
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Post by Axis on Apr 7, 2017 18:16:22 GMT -5
Hey $150 more really isn't all that bad considering I'm only a 60 minute drive from the US and you are a 14 hour flight from the US I'd drive the 60 minutes if I could and for me yes it's a 14 hour flight, but it's still cheaper than buying one locally. Cheers Gary I remember seeing an Audio lounge in Australia that folks would get together and buy Emotiva gear in a group. That was a long time ago. Who knows what will happen with new trade agreements. Hope you guys and others around the world can get a good deal buying audio gear from the US. Us Americans like to sell things and make profit. If you will not buy because prices are to high it does no one any good. I see Emotiva setting up for friendly sales internationally and maybe things look up and prices go down for foreign sales of Emotiva gear. Things do change.
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stiehl11
Emo VIPs
Give me available light!
Posts: 7,261
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Post by stiehl11 on Apr 7, 2017 18:24:36 GMT -5
Prices were NOT increased for the dealer model. Who else is building and selling fully balanced, 600 watt mono-block power amplifiers for $1,199.00?? Radio silence.... And by the way, the new Class H amplifier are better in very respect than the models they replace. Peace and love. Big Dan Dan, can you comment on new Class H audio quality of the XPA-1m vs the current XPA-1 with Class A mode enabled? Obviously these are very different amps... thanks! Even though I'm not Dan, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that his comment is: ...the new Class H amplifier are better in very respect than the models they replace. The two major differences is that the new XPA-1m has a SMPS that replaces the boat anchor toriodal transformer of the XPA-1 and it's power delivery is Class H. Other than that, it's still Class A/B just the same as the XPA-1. The SMPS shouldn't matter as long as it can keep up with the power. The current XPA line uses a different SMPS but otherwise hasn't seen reviewers speak negatively about it. The Class H power delivery is similar to their top-of-the-line XPR reference amplifiers that they offered until recently. Furthermore, most (not all) people can't hear a difference between Class A and Class A/B, YMMV.
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Post by yeahwicked on Apr 7, 2017 18:26:14 GMT -5
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Post by Skulletino on Apr 8, 2017 0:24:19 GMT -5
I think this is a good move, although I'm now kicking myself for not making a purchase back in December! Was pretty close to buying amps but couldn't justify it without a new home theater to put them in this year. Anxiously awaiting the RMC and will proceed from there. Keep making great products!
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bootman
Emo VIPs
Typing useless posts on internet forums....
Posts: 9,358
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Post by bootman on Apr 8, 2017 10:11:18 GMT -5
Prices were NOT increased for the dealer model. You don't have to believe him, just do the math. If prices went up 40-50% that would be indicative of a typical dealer markup.
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Post by Jim on Apr 8, 2017 12:03:59 GMT -5
You are making this personal when in reality it's just business. Honestly, I don't think I am. I'm just following along. I think Dan is making it personal. His posts aren't fully business oriented, they are very much personally oriented. And his main explanation for switching is so customers don't get mad. That's personal if you ask me. I don't have any problem with someone keeping it business or making it personal. Either is totally fine. But it certainly seems to me some people here like to jump back and forth when ever it suits them, and that's something I do have problems with. I would call it hypocritical actually. I have explained the minutia in detail before and I'm not going to take the time to do it again. Suffice it to say, the people who bought full price the year Dan said there wouldn't be sales got duped, plain and simple. So I guess you just don't care whether people are honest or keep promises. Your prerogative. I do, and I happen to hold people to higher standards than that. I hold myself to high standards in those regards, and I expect the same in return. Plain and simple. And, I don't jump from one side to the fence to the other just to fit my needs at the time. That is true. But shifting back and forth between policies becomes much like a bait and switch, aka a scam, and it's shifty at best. Let's say for example we give Emotiva the benefit of the doubt for a couple years ago - lesson learned - and let by gones be by gones. But if the same pattern plays out again this year, and again since this is just an example I say if here, then I will call bull schiit. I will see the "no more sales policy" as a fake promise simply to boost turnover now during a typically slower time. If you don't / can't / won't see it that way, then I'd say you would be being naive. But since that's all just hypothetical right now, all we can do is kick back and wait and see. If we were betting on this, I'd bet the odds are 60% we see a sale in 2017, and more like 98% we see a sale in 2018. Hence why in my previous posts I said "will", not if. You've really got that "mountain out of a molehill" thing down to a science. Nice work!
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Post by charlieeco on Apr 8, 2017 15:30:25 GMT -5
Let´s be honest, we love SALES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, come on !!!!
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Post by Axis on Apr 8, 2017 15:36:48 GMT -5
Let´s be honest, we love SALES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, come on !!!! Emotiva has been having sales as long as they have been around. There were times when I had my 10% off card using it with a sale that I knew Emotiva was the loosing side of the sale and as a proud member of the capitalist Americans I hate to see a company go down because of sales. Ms Kathy is not going to let Big Dan do that. Big Dan wants to have sales and everyone get great gear for great prices. He is the Dude.
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Post by Gary Cook on Apr 8, 2017 18:24:55 GMT -5
You don't have to believe him, just do the math. If prices went up 40-50% that would be indicative of a typical dealer markup. Too easy. An XSP-1 pre price rise was $US900, plus $US150 for freight to Australia, that's $US1050. An XSP-1 currently is SA1,999 from my local retailer via the Australia Distributor (neither of which have stock BTW). So if I wanted to buy an XSP-1 I am no better off than I was buying direct, I can't listen to one and I'd have to wait for the next shipment, which would quite possibly take longer than the direct shipping from the always fabulous Emotiva customer service. The current exchange rate is $A0.75 to $US1.00. so $US1050 = $A1400. Comparing $1,999 with $1,400 shows a $599 mark up or 43%. Obviously shipping in bulk is going to save quite a bit on the single unit $US150 cost, so your 40% to 50% is easy to see. Cheers Gary
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Post by yeahwicked on Apr 8, 2017 18:47:07 GMT -5
You don't have to believe him, just do the math. If prices went up 40-50% that would be indicative of a typical dealer markup. Too easy. An XSP-1 pre price rise was $US900, plus $US150 for freight to Australia, that's $US1050. An XSP-1 currently is SA1,999 from my local retailer via the Australia Distributor (neither of which have stock BTW). So if I wanted to buy an XSP-1 I am no better off than I was buying direct, I can't listen to one and I'd have to wait for the next shipment, which would quite possibly take longer than the direct shipping from the always fabulous Emotiva customer service. The current exchange rate is $A0.75 to $US1.00. so $US1050 = $A1400. Comparing $1,999 with $1,400 shows a $599 mark up or 43%. Obviously shipping in bulk is going to save quite a bit on the single unit $US150 cost, so your 40% to 50% is easy to see. Cheers Gary You're right mate, the Leafs got it bad too. Used to be good, Now I don't know why I bother, Indicative of the shiit over priced choice we have here I suppose. I'm left with grey importing = no warranty, given my experience, you >> need<< that warranty.
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Post by adaboy on Apr 8, 2017 19:13:52 GMT -5
You don't have to believe him, just do the math. If prices went up 40-50% that would be indicative of a typical dealer markup. Ok, you brought this up so I'll take it a step further. Yes you 100% correct about the dealer discount(s) in general of around 30%-40% depending on the product. Here is where you a mistaken. Prior to the Dealer model and the price increase Emotiva kept 100% of all profit on all sales. Tell me hypothetically of course why would Emotiva be so eager to give up 30%-%40 of there profit just to have a dealer model??? I call BS on Big Dan's comment, please note this is not towards you Bootman in any shape for or fashion. Any business man can see where I'm going with this but again I still bought a A700 last month so I still like the company's class AB products. It does suck though when the ole wool gets flying around toward our eyes. Some drink the Kool-aid others keep the BS meter to themselves, and others call a spade a spade. Again I'm not trying to put anyone including Big Dan down just stating the obvious. Thanks
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Post by adaboy on Apr 8, 2017 19:19:52 GMT -5
You don't have to believe him, just do the math. If prices went up 40-50% that would be indicative of a typical dealer markup. Too easy. An XSP-1 pre price rise was $US900, plus $US150 for freight to Australia, that's $US1050. An XSP-1 currently is SA1,999 from my local retailer via the Australia Distributor (neither of which have stock BTW). So if I wanted to buy an XSP-1 I am no better off than I was buying direct, I can't listen to one and I'd have to wait for the next shipment, which would quite possibly take longer than the direct shipping from the always fabulous Emotiva customer service. The current exchange rate is $A0.75 to $US1.00. so $US1050 = $A1400. Comparing $1,999 with $1,400 shows a $599 mark up or 43%. Obviously shipping in bulk is going to save quite a bit on the single unit $US150 cost, so your 40% to 50% is easy to see. Cheers Gary Thanks Gary! Sorry I missed your post before I responded. This exactly what I'm talking about (Radio Silence) Hahahahah
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Post by Gary Cook on Apr 8, 2017 19:34:26 GMT -5
Too easy. An XSP-1 pre price rise was $US900, plus $US150 for freight to Australia, that's $US1050. An XSP-1 currently is SA1,999 from my local retailer via the Australia Distributor (neither of which have stock BTW). So if I wanted to buy an XSP-1 I am no better off than I was buying direct, I can't listen to one and I'd have to wait for the next shipment, which would quite possibly take longer than the direct shipping from the always fabulous Emotiva customer service. The current exchange rate is $A0.75 to $US1.00. so $US1050 = $A1400. Comparing $1,999 with $1,400 shows a $599 mark up or 43%. Obviously shipping in bulk is going to save quite a bit on the single unit $US150 cost, so your 40% to 50% is easy to see. Thanks Gary! Sorry I missed your post before I responded. This exactly what I'm talking about (Radio Silence) Hahahahah For clarity, of course Emotiva is fully entitled to make whatever business decisions they decide. But I feel behoved to point out the downsides of those decisions for their loyal customers. Whether it changes their minds or not doesn't really matter. But it seems to me that Emotiva have some respect for their customers' opinions and I have no problem with respectfully supplying mine. Quite possibly the change to an Australian Distributor/Retailer model has resulted in more sales volume and profit for Emotiva, if so then it's the right choice. If it hasn't, then possibly I have pointed out the reasons as to why. Cheers Gary
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Post by adaboy on Apr 8, 2017 19:37:36 GMT -5
Thanks Gary! Sorry I missed your post before I responded. This exactly what I'm talking about (Radio Silence) Hahahahah For clarity, of course Emotiva is fully entitled to make whatever business decisions they decide. But I feel behoved to point out the downsides of those decisions for their loyal customers. Whether it changes their minds or not doesn't really matter. But it seems to me that Emotiva have some respect for their customers' opinions and I have no problem with respectfully supplying mine. Quite possibly the change to an Australian Distributor/Retailer model has resulted in more sales volume and profit for Emotiva, if so then it's the right choice. If it hasn't, then possibly I have pointed out the reasons as to why. Cheers Gary I completely agree with you here. Just wanted to point out that prices did increase. Thanks
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Post by vneal on Apr 9, 2017 6:38:39 GMT -5
We're doing very well and it's all due to loyal customers like you guys here. Thank you!! I DID want to eliminate the sale thing couple of years ago and I blinked. I've been kicking myself ever since. What you don't see here on the Lounge is the number of unhappy/angry calls we get after a sale ends... no matter how long we run it, or extend it, and no matter how long it's been sine the sale was over!! These people are upset because they missed the deal and feel like they are over-paying. Also, the guy or gal who paid retail before the sale feels like they got ripped off...again, it doesn't really matters how long it been. And it affects the value of used gear.. a lot. Just like a car. The resale value is typically based on the lowest "market" price. So, if you paid retail and then trade, it's based on a lower value. That does not engender good feelings either. So, I'm glad we finally did this and we we'll stick to it. In the long run, I believe you will be better served and we'll be able to keep overall pricing down. Peace, Big Dan P.S. UFL is, of course, still honored, as are the remaining few 40% cards still out there. I am in sales and I agree with your policy 100%. It is the most fair to the buyer as well as the seller. It actually will help protect our investment. Used prices will be higher. Brand loyalty in the long run will also be higher. For example: McIntosh, Tag watches, Yeti they all have a MAP programs that are extremely enforced. Everyone knows the cost of entrance. I think its the greatest thing that could happen to the brand. Lastly the image just went up
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