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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 16, 2018 15:21:22 GMT -5
it is puzzling, i agree, that some have issues and some don't. It’s pretty much expected, by me anyway. Much the same as with the XMC-1 4K update, it very much depends on, in order of troublesomeness, what is connected to it, what cables are used and what the numerous settings are. Like pretty much everything HDMI/HDCP related by the time we work our way through those things, learn the tricks, update the cables if/where required, the number of issues drops dramatically. Follow the useful tips from other early adopters and a couple of software updates later and the posters stop posting. UMC-1, UMC-200, XMC-1 and now RMC-1, the journey is pretty much the same. Cheers Gary
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Post by rhale64 on Dec 16, 2018 16:58:29 GMT -5
I have to admit at this point I am a bit disappointed in the RMC1. But I am pretty sure these things can be ironed out. And I am pretty sure if they can't be that we could get our money back. Especially for the buzzing sound.
I didn't have a processor for about 6 months. I sold my home and the people that bought it wanted the XMC1 and all my equipment in the deal. So I knew the RMC1 was close and figured I would hold out. I had the OPPO205 to use as a stop-gap until it came out. I figured even if it had issues it would still be better than what I was using.
I wanted Atmos. I had all my amp channels ready. All my speakers ready. Just no means to make it all work. So I jumped in with both feet when the RMC1 came out. I almost jumped ship about two months prior. I went to check out the Anthem. But was very disappointed in the looks. So waited some more. Then thought long and hard about the Marantz 8805. But wanted Dirac.
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Post by Bonzo on Dec 16, 2018 17:31:43 GMT -5
No offense Bonzo, but I don't believe you are an owner yet you are posting in this thread after asking for only owners to post. I agree with you 100%. However, this thread, as do most threads, got off track quickly. The very first page has several non-owners. Glad to see people can listen. 🤐 And its been off topic a lot. There are no less than 5 pages talking about Atmos pinning and the new Dolby laws, in general, not about how the RMC handles them. Thank you for the kinds words. As a humorous reply, being the one that started this thread, I want to quote Albus Dumbledore from the Half Blood Prince when Harry says, "I didn't think we could apparate while in Hogwarts professor," to which Dumbledore replies," well, sometimes, being me, has its privileges." I agree. And while on that topic, I have asked twice now about the "feel" of the front knob to which I don't believe anyone has replied. So how does it feel? While we are talking, I just want to shout out a big KUDOS to you for really being a large voice in this thread, and doing all the things you have done and informed us of here. Your posts have been terrific. I'd also like to say I respect your patience. My Dad had great patience and I always admired that about him. That gene did not pass on to me though, at least not entirely. There is no way I would be as patient as you about the issues you are having. After the second one came back much the same, I'd be calling Emotiva either for my money back, or a loaner XMC-1 to fill the gap until they got the RMC fixed. You are a better man than I in this regard for sure. Anyway, enough off topic garble. How does your knob feel? 🤣😂
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Post by deewan on Dec 16, 2018 17:32:18 GMT -5
I have to admit at this point I am a bit disappointed in the RMC1. But I am pretty sure these things can be ironed out. And I am pretty sure if they can't be that we could get our money back. Especially for the buzzing sound. Since my 30-day window is fast approaching, I'm going to email and verify. Again, I think a lot of these issues can be resolved with a firmware update, but I also think a lot of my disappointment could have been sidetracked if Emotiva would have communicated to me the troubles we may see. I knew there would be small issues. I was prepared for small issues. Heck, at first I enjoyed finding them so I could report back and make this product better. But at this point it's a 3-4 minute process to get the RMC up and running and then I have no idea if I'll make it through a movie without having to force a full reboot.
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Post by deewan on Dec 16, 2018 17:38:21 GMT -5
I agree. And while on that topic, I have asked twice now about the "feel" of the front knob to which I don't believe anyone has replied. So how does it feel? Yea, I've been avoiding the knob question mostly because everyones taste and "feel" for quality is different. Does the knob feel as nice of quality as the MMI knob in my wife's Audi S4? No. Does it feel as cheesy as the volume (turn only) knob on the old UMC-1? No! It's somewhere in the middle. I think a little more resistance when turning would have helped make the knob feel more robust and higher quality, but that's my opinion. It doesn't feel cheap, but it doesn't feel like it came from a high quality German car. The only thing I will say is I like using it a lot more than the up/down/left/right buttons on the XMC.
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Post by Bonzo on Dec 16, 2018 17:40:33 GMT -5
To those mumbling about owners and how a non-owner created this thread, who really cares? Does it matter who started it? I don't think it does. I just started it because the first owner's thread got hijacked right from the get go. So I made this one in hopes to make it better for everyone. I did it to help, not hinder. I already got called out once saying I broke some sort of etiquette, to which I still say "really?" The fact is it simply doesn't matter who started the thread, at all. The other fact is that while I asked for owners only, nobody listened to that and most people just did what ever they wanted. 5 pages of yet MORE Atmos discussion? Come on. So I'd at least like to ask people stop talking about who started the thread, and do your best to keep it on topic, not about Atmos generalities etc. Thank you. I'll try to shut up now too. 😎
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Post by Bonzo on Dec 16, 2018 17:43:18 GMT -5
I agree. And while on that topic, I have asked twice now about the "feel" of the front knob to which I don't believe anyone has replied. So how does it feel? Yea, I've been avoiding the knob question mostly because everyones taste and "feel" for quality is different. Does the knob feel as nice of quality as the MMI knob in my wife's Audi S4? No. Does it feel as cheesy as the volume (turn only) knob on the old UMC-1? No! It's somewhere in the middle. I think a little more resistance when turning would have helped make the knob feel more robust and higher quality, but that's my opinion. It doesn't feel cheap, but it doesn't feel like it came from a high quality German car. The only thing I will say is I like using it a lot more than the up/down/left/right buttons on the XMC. Thank you, that helps.
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Post by mgbpuff on Dec 16, 2018 19:15:29 GMT -5
A processor is a very complex product that must work with a mountain of differing existing products both new and old In addition the main functions are dependent on 3rd parties, such as the HDMI Consortium which has controlled standards abysmally throughout the years, room correction software companies, in this case Dirac, who don't have their act together, and immersive codec companies, who also do not have their act together and are fighting each other. Then there are the integrated chip manufacturers who are trying to implement all of these original technologies and of course the biggest customers come first. On top of that, if a component manufacture is trying to be cutting edge, the problem is magnified, and almost impossible if that manufacturer is small. You guys want a miracle, but you are part of making the miracle happen. *bleep*, *bleep*, *bleep* and, believe me, that miracle will not happen and you will be doomed spending $20,000 to $30,000 to get all the features that this product is trying to give you for $5,000. Show some patience, give feedback and this unique and affordable product will finally materialize. Until then, since Emotiva really depends on you early adopters, I would like to see the company respond and give information in a more free manner, especially when they have decided to release prematurely. I would love to buy one now and help, but I am long retired and income is limited, so it will be a year or so until I can manage it, but if I must spend over $10000, it will never happen. Complicated product, yes. But they could not have done a way better job vetting this product by using more people here as testers before releasing this product? In effect, I think that's what they are doing, before they release in mass. Early adopters are assumed to be willing to help with the initial surge of vetting issues.
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Post by Bonzo on Dec 16, 2018 19:48:02 GMT -5
Complicated product, yes. But they could not have done a way better job vetting this product by using more people here as testers before releasing this product? In effect, I think that's what they are doing, before they release in mass. Early adopters are assumed to be willing to help with the initial surge of vetting issues. Oh, it is. That's exactly what they are doing, or exactly what they did should I say. And as usual, they are doing it all wrong. Many will accept it and find no issue. For others like me, words like sly, deceptive, and even underhanded come to mind. Yep, I said it. They should have made it VERY clear to first batch buyers that they were in fact beta testers, but, they didn't. Saying a buyer should just assume this is pure and utter hogwash. Sweeping dirt under the rug as it is said. Here's what SHOULD happen next. Either they do not release batch 2 before they thoroughly FIX the issues, OR, they make it VERY clear to batch 2 buyers that units will have issues. Not all buyers are knowledgeable like us here on this forum. Buyers should not have to assume. Make it freely clear and I would consider all good. As history has shown, Emotiva is good for fixing MOST of the issues, but never ALL. All a person needs to do is pick their poison. Unfortunate if you ask me.
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Post by davidl81 on Dec 16, 2018 19:52:49 GMT -5
Getting back on topic of Roc operation and performance. I watched many of the same movies I showed the kids last night. Polar Express (disc and played through the Oppo) which induced the first instance of buzzing I had heard out of the RMC was played without a single issue. No buzzing, no audio breaks, click or pops of any sort. Next I threw in Big Hero 6 (file and played through movie streamer) which produced audio dropouts. About 11 minutes into the movie I lost all audio. Switching inputs was the only way to get audio back. I then went back to the Oppo and Home Alone. 18 minutes into that movie I heard a quick audio dropout for a fraction of a second but audio instantly returned. I am at a complete loss as to the cause and the remedy. So the movie night was canceled. I actually canceled next weekends movie night too since I have no idea if the RMC will have a new firmware that fixes these issues by then. No idea what to do, but I will be sending an email asking about the return policy. The quick audio dropouts are tolerable, but how the Roc is acting now it's a joke. All good will I had for Emotiva is gone. They still provide excellent customer service and great value for things like amps, speakers and DACS, but I'm to the end of the line with their processors. Which is really to bad. I want to support them, but I don't want to make my rooms perform suffer only to support a company. If I hear from Emotiva about possible fixes I will stick it out some. If it doesn't like like they have a remedy, let the shopping begin for a new processor. Has Emotiva swapped out your RMC for a new one already? I thought maybe they had, but I can’t quite remember. I think that the RMC will be a great unit, but it may take 6-8 months to get it there. The Emotiva staff is just not big enough to test out these processors with all of the various combinations of equipment out there. They do in a way depend on the first round of buyers to be somewhat beta testers. I do believe that early adopters should be given some sort of extra return period, but that’s a different topic.
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Post by mgbpuff on Dec 16, 2018 19:55:20 GMT -5
In effect, I think that's what they are doing, before they release in mass. Early adopters are assumed to be willing to help with the initial surge of vetting issues. Oh, it is. That's exactly what they are doing, or exactly what they did should I say. And as usual, they are doing it all wrong. Many will accept it and find no issue. For others like me, words like sly, deceptive, and even underhanded come to mind. Yep, I said it. They should have made it VERY clear to first batch buyers that they were in fact beta testers, but, they didn't. Saying a buyer should just assume this is pure and utter hogwash. Sweeping dirt under the rug as it is said. Here's what SHOULD happen next. Either they do not release batch 2 before they thoroughly FIX the issues, OR, they make it VERY clear to batch 2 buyers that units will have issues. Not all buyers are knowledgeable like us here on this forum. Buyers should not have to assume. Make it freely clear and I would consider all good. As history has shown, Emotiva is good for fixing MOST of the issues, but never ALL. All a person needs to do is pick their poison. Unfortunate if you ask me. Prick you with a pin and you spew out more verbiage than Tolstoy!
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Post by deewan on Dec 16, 2018 20:06:14 GMT -5
Has Emotiva swapped out your RMC for a new one already? I thought maybe they had, but I can’t quite remember. I think that the RMC will be a great unit, but it may take 6-8 months to get it there. The Emotiva staff is just not big enough to test out these processors with all of the various combinations of equipment out there. They do in a way depend on the first round of buyers to be somewhat beta testers. I do believe that early adopters should be given some sort of extra return period, but that’s a different topic. My first RMC had hardware issues and was replaced by Emotiva after 1 week. The second Emotiva had the same software issues as the first and is starting to display more issues. Well I agree it's difficult for Emotiva to test all various combinations of equipment out there, I know they tested with an Oppo player like what I own. If i were using some unique computer player or a odd movie streamer I could understand. But Emotiva has used Oppo before and that is what I own. In addition to all the issues I have already stated, I am attempting to watch a movie off my movie server tonight. Before the 5:00 mark I experience a loud and quick buzz followed by a loud static sound. It honestly scared me. Lasted about 2 seconds. Since that point I had one or two really quick audio drops. But now I'm upstairs posting on the Emo board as my RMC reboots since I completely lost audio and couldn't get audio to return even with a quick power cycle. Hopefully the full reboot fixes the issue.
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Post by davidl81 on Dec 16, 2018 20:17:56 GMT -5
Has Emotiva swapped out your RMC for a new one already? I thought maybe they had, but I can’t quite remember. I think that the RMC will be a great unit, but it may take 6-8 months to get it there. The Emotiva staff is just not big enough to test out these processors with all of the various combinations of equipment out there. They do in a way depend on the first round of buyers to be somewhat beta testers. I do believe that early adopters should be given some sort of extra return period, but that’s a different topic. My first RMC had hardware issues and was replaced by Emotiva after 1 week. The second Emotiva had the same software issues as the first and is starting to display more issues. Well I agree it's difficult for Emotiva to test all various combinations of equipment out there, I know they tested with an Oppo player like what I own. If i were using some unique computer player or a odd movie streamer I could understand. But Emotiva has used Oppo before and that is what I own. In addition to all the issues I have already stated, I am attempting to watch a movie off my movie server tonight. Before the 5:00 mark I experience a loud and quick buzz followed by a loud static sound. It honestly scared me. Lasted about 2 seconds. Since that point I had one or two really quick audio drops. But now I'm upstairs posting on the Emo board as my RMC reboots since I completely lost audio and couldn't get audio to return even with a quick power cycle. Hopefully the full reboot fixes the issue. IMO with the issues you are having I think it makes sense to return it and buy a “fill in” for the time being. You can get a used 8802a for like 1700 on eBay that will hold most of its value for the next 6-8 months. At that point hopefully the RMC will be a more solid unit and then you can buy it again. I know it must be frustrating to not only spend that type of money, but invest that type of time in a product that for you is not working very well. I do wonder how many other owners are having these issues?
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Post by adaboy on Dec 16, 2018 21:38:15 GMT -5
Real quick I have to give it to the moderators and Emotiva here for allowing this dialog. Well done Ladies and gentlemen 👏.
I say that as it's pretty humbling for such a highly anticipated rollout, that didn't go as expected.
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Post by deewan on Dec 16, 2018 21:44:48 GMT -5
IMO with the issues you are having I think it makes sense to return it and buy a “fill in” for the time being. You can get a used 8802a for like 1700 on eBay that will hold most of its value for the next 6-8 months. At that point hopefully the RMC will be a more solid unit and then you can buy it again. I know it must be frustrating to not only spend that type of money, but invest that type of time in a product that for you is not working very well. I do wonder how many other owners are having these issues? I can't imagine returning the RMC to only buy it later. For me, that makes no sense. If it goes back, it will be the last time a Emotiva processor is in my home because whatever it is replaced with won't be a step back like the 8802. It will be a horizontal move or improvement, only I'm guessing at a much higher cost. If I buy something like the 8802 but with an end game of owning the RMC, then I'll just keep this RMC and wait for a stable software update. As I eluded to earlier. I'm guessing there are about 20 owners out there. There are at least 4 (plus me) on here reporting similar issues. There are a few on AVS reporting issues. and I know of 2 RMC's that are currently for sale as I assume people are still hoping to flip them and make some money. If 20 units is correct, you have roughly half the owners stating they have issues. The other half... who knows. They don't seem to post positive or negative things. Or maybe the actual owner count is closer to 10. I only recall a handful of people posting about getting an order in from the first batch, and how many people that aren't on this board or AVS would have been checking the Emotiva website to buy a $5000 processor before 8am on Nov 15th?
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Post by brbecker on Dec 16, 2018 21:52:55 GMT -5
Watched Ant Man last night. I had audio drop outs, loud screeches and a pop during the movie.
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Post by adaboy on Dec 16, 2018 21:53:18 GMT -5
IMO with the issues you are having I think it makes sense to return it and buy a “fill in” for the time being. You can get a used 8802a for like 1700 on eBay that will hold most of its value for the next 6-8 months. At that point hopefully the RMC will be a more solid unit and then you can buy it again. I know it must be frustrating to not only spend that type of money, but invest that type of time in a product that for you is not working very well. I do wonder how many other owners are having these issues? I can't imagine returning the RMC to only buy it later. For me, that makes no sense. If it goes back, it will be the last time a Emotiva processor is in my home because whatever it is replaced with won't be a step back like the 8802. It will be a horizontal move or improvement, only I'm guessing at a much higher cost. If I buy something like the 8802 but with an end game of owning the RMC, then I'll just keep this RMC and wait for a stable software update. As I eluded to earlier. I'm guessing there are about 20 owners out there. There are at least 4 (plus me) on here reporting similar issues. There are a few on AVS reporting issues. and I know of 2 RMC's that are currently for sale as I assume people are still hoping to flip them and make some money. If 20 units is correct, you have roughly half the owners stating they have issues. The other half... who knows. They don't seem to post positive or negative things. Or maybe the actual owner count is closer to 10. I only recall a handful of people posting about getting an order in from the first batch, and how many people that aren't on this board or AVS would have been checking the Emotiva website to buy a $5000 processor before 8am on Nov 15th? This was more accurate I presume?
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 17, 2018 0:46:06 GMT -5
how many people that aren't on this board or AVS would have been checking the Emotiva website to buy a $5000 processor before 8am on Nov 15th? I'd guess quite a few customers received notification emails that aren't posters on here. The Emotiva email is how I found out about the pre sale, before I even looked on here. Cheers Gary
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novisnick
EmoPhile
CEO Secret Monoblock Society
Posts: 27,213
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Post by novisnick on Dec 17, 2018 1:41:43 GMT -5
how many people that aren't on this board or AVS would have been checking the Emotiva website to buy a $5000 processor before 8am on Nov 15th? I'd guess quite a few customers received notification emails that aren't posters on here. The Emotiva email is how I found out about the pre sale, before I even looked on here. Cheers Gary Thats how I found out.
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Post by cwt on Dec 17, 2018 2:21:31 GMT -5
Real quick I have to give it to the moderators and Emotiva here for allowing this dialog. Well done Ladies and gentlemen 👏. I say that as it's pretty humbling for such a highly anticipated rollout, that didn't go as expected. Sadly entirely predictable once that November 15 date was mentioned and the "what year was that " comments started putting pressure on making that precise date... Common knowledge to anyone doing due diligence research [ unless 5k isn't a big deal ] that the beta tester "pool" is usually inadequate ; curiously haven't seen any posts from any ''usual suspects" field beta testers -only owners - which equates to a very small initial release as Deewan postulates As they mentioned they had trepidations about releasing too many initially - Dan clearly said in the nov podcast they wanted to catch any issues close to home so available in the US only . I certainly cant see a general full release without a few more firmware updates ; now that would tarnish things Squeaks and pops sounds a hell of a lot like my old cary 11a before they sorted it out ; not good for fragile tweeters Another factor saying wait is the complexity of the RMC1 ; its got double the circuitry of say a 8802 as its dual differential balanced ;just like the Denon AVPA1HD was . New ADI chipset ; new Panasonic hdmi board - working with problems o/seas = US only.
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