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Post by Boomzilla on Jun 15, 2019 21:21:15 GMT -5
...I don't mind provocative posts as long as you own it. Don't go out of your way to poke the bear, and then cry victim when it starts chasing you. The only "provocative" part of the original post was the last sentence. If it was typed in the heat of "WTF," then I think it should be excused as hyperbole. If he meant it, then it's a free country. Either way, why should HE be called out for chastisement over a single sentence? "Incentivized reviews" bothered him, and I can't say that he's wrong. But if one really expects anything but positive reviews on the MANUFACTURER'S website (where reviews are actually part of advertising), then one is unrealistic. Want a more accurate review? Go to a third party site that has no motive to skew the review content either way.
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Post by tslack on Jun 16, 2019 0:51:19 GMT -5
...I don't mind provocative posts as long as you own it. Don't go out of your way to poke the bear, and then cry victim when it starts chasing you. The only "provocative" part of the original post was the last sentence. If it was typed in the heat of "WTF," then I think it should be excused as hyperbole. If he meant it, then it's a free country. Either way, why should HE be called out for chastisement over a single sentence? "Incentivized reviews" bothered him, and I can't say that he's wrong. But if one really expects anything but positive reviews on the MANUFACTURER'S website (where reviews are actually part of advertising), then one is unrealistic. Want a more accurate review? Go to a third party site that has no motive to skew the review content either way. No argument on the free country front. Just pointing out that the causal relationship between the OP and the response was not surprising.
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Post by cwt on Jun 16, 2019 5:44:00 GMT -5
Ime a bit indignant and put out about all this . If Ime to be paid off [ and I don't mind at all ] a Big Mack just doesn't cut it . One of these thanks mcdonalds.com.au/menu/bbq-bacon-angusSeriously ; as an example ;where does the scales balance towards here - A magazine whose lifeblood is advertisements or a small gesture as a thanks ? Didn't see any comparisons being made between these two ; distinct lack of negativity towards the former speaks volumes to me .. While were at it ; if a paid reviewer in a magazine has measured specs in his review I value that considerably more than one who doesn't
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Post by sounder on Jun 24, 2019 9:13:57 GMT -5
Gee, the angry fans are out in force! I didn’t “skewer” or “crucify” anyone, didn’t get in anyone’s face, and didn’t try to tell emotiva what to do. I just shared what I saw, because it was a surprise to me. I wondered if anyone else noticed. But, what the heck... I guess I deserve to be attacked for that. If you had simply asked what incentivized reviews are, I would agree with you. But you didn't. Instead you swore, threw shade, and effectively grabbed a torch shouting "Who's with me?" I don't mind provocative posts as long as you own it. Don't go out of your way to poke the bear, and then cry victim when it starts chasing you. Please show me where I swore, shouted, or asked "who's with me?". I own what I said, which is that I was surprised to see this PostScript, and wondered if it bothered anyone. That's all, and I own that. But, I won't own up to swearing or torch grabbing. You own that part.
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Post by 405x5 on Jun 24, 2019 10:07:04 GMT -5
" I noticed an asterisk at the bottom of the reviews, and it says this: " * All reviews have been incentivized. " WTF?! If that's the case, how can I have any faith in those reviews? I can see a few are paid, particularly some of the early ones. But, ALL of them? Honestly, that put an end to my shopping at Emotiva. Does this bother anyone else?" Ha! (not in the least!) Reviews, along with your concern and any other disclaimers, etc. are just one of the guidelines and part of the process when gear shopping. I would respectfully suggest that it would be short sighted to have something like that eliminate a brand or product from the wish list. At the end of the day, both the producers and the reviewers have a vested interest in what goes on. Bill
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Post by AudioHTIT on Jun 24, 2019 10:08:55 GMT -5
If you had simply asked what incentivized reviews are, I would agree with you. But you didn't. Instead you swore, threw shade, and effectively grabbed a torch shouting "Who's with me?" I don't mind provocative posts as long as you own it. Don't go out of your way to poke the bear, and then cry victim when it starts chasing you. Please show me where I swore, shouted, or asked "who's with me?". I own what I said, which is that I was surprised to see this PostScript, and wondered if it bothered anyone. That's all, and I own that. But, I won't own up to swearing or torch grabbing. You own that part. I think you brought up a legitimate issue, however, based on a few words, the tone of your post (to me) already showed a bit of outrage. I think, “ Honestly, that put an end to my shopping at Emotiva.” might be dramatized as “ lighting the torch”, and “ Does this bother anyone else?” could similarly be scripted as “ who’s with me?”. I read your words to say “because of this activity I’m not buying any Emotiva products, what about you?” You have already decided you don’t like this practice. I actually wasn’t aware of the practice, and I’m glad you brought it up, I just think your choice of words didn’t invite an honest explanation.
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Post by rbk123 on Jun 24, 2019 11:28:13 GMT -5
Agree with AudioHT. No big deal (imo) but there are those who are more sensitive in both the pro/anti Emo camps.
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Post by thrillcat on Jun 24, 2019 11:29:56 GMT -5
Please show me where I swore, shouted, or asked "who's with me?". I own what I said, which is that I was surprised to see this PostScript, and wondered if it bothered anyone. That's all, and I own that. But, I won't own up to swearing or torch grabbing. You own that part. I think you brought up a legitimate issue, however, based on a few words, the tone of your post (to me) already showed a bit of outrage. I think, “ Honestly, that put an end to my shopping at Emotiva.” might be dramatized as “ lighting the torch”, and “ Does this bother anyone else?” could similarly be scripted as “ who’s with me?”. I read your words to say “because of this activity I’m not buying any Emotiva products, what about you?” You have already decided you don’t like this practice. I actually wasn’t aware of the practice, and I’m glad you brought it up, I just think your choice of words didn’t invite an honest explanation. I'm with you on this. The tone was incendiary, and I don't know of anyone who actually reads the letters WTF as three letters, and not three words. It's absolutely profanity. I'm not offended by profanity, I don't think any one combination of letters is any better or worse than another, or is going to keep me out of some imaginary afterlife. To me, it's about respect, and it's about how those words are used to portray an emotion. The was an incendiary post, with a valid point. I have posted reviews on the Emotiva site before, I honestly can't remember if they offered any sort of incentive that convinced me to post, but I think I just posted them. Then was informed after posting that I had received a $5 or whatever credit toward my next Emotiva purchase. I have never once used it, because A) $5 is really nothing on my purchases, and B) it expires by the time I'm ready to make another purchase. Suffice it to say, it's never swayed any review one way or another.
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 9,940
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Post by KeithL on Jun 24, 2019 11:30:49 GMT -5
I've got to throw my two cents in here... (And, yes, this is my personal opinion on the subject.)
I would like to think that every adult knows enough to take reviews as what they are... A comment, made by someone, about a product, for a reason... (Nobody does anything without a reason...) If you're a paid reviewer, who makes your living doing product reviews, then we probably know what that reason is. And we also understand that, while a paid reviewer may aim to be impartial, there is a limit to their impartiality. Paid reviewers who tend to review products harshly tend not to get hired to review very many products. (Nobody hires individual reviewers who rate their products poorly; and nobody buys ad space in magazines whose reviewers routinely pan their products.)
We do have a lot of fans who love their Emotiva products enough to take the time and effort to write a positive review. However, to be quite honest, most customers actually expect their product to work well, and don't feel obligated to write a review saying that it did what it should. But, in contrast, most of the people who aren't pleased with their purchase, for whatever reason, see it as their right and duty to complain, often in the form of a bad review. As a result, not nearly everyone writes a review of every purchase they make, and the reviews we do get to see tend to be biased towards the negative. In a sense, everyone who writes a bad review is "incentivised" - by having an opportunity to "get their complaint in print". Therefore, it hardly seems unreasonable to provide some sort of incentive for everyone, including happy customers, to take the same effort to post a review of their experiences. (Some sites, like Amazon, try a little harder to pester everyone to write a review, but we think that's sort of annoying.)
I've got to add something else here - which should be obvious. We are not one of the very few remaining subscriber-supported product review magazines or websites. (Believe it or not there are very few review websites and YouTube channels who don't have some sort of plan to "monetize" their reviews.)
We are a manufacturer. We sell products... and we're quite proud of the products we sell. And this is our website we're talking about here... so we think of it sort of like a catalog.
So, yes, we do like good reviews a little bit more than bad ones.
And we don't feel at all guilty for providing a tiny bit of incentive to happy customers to share their experiences with everyone else.
If you've ever perused our forum you'll know that, compared to other manufacturers, we're quite liberal when it comes to NOT censoring what people post. (If you really want to spend the time to do the research you can join our forums for free.)
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Post by thrillcat on Jun 24, 2019 11:34:20 GMT -5
I would also add that the reviews on the site are marketing. Just like a commercial for the new blockbuster movie with people from a free, advance screening talking about how awesome the movie is.
Do you make your theatrical choices based on what some 16yo who just talked her way through a 2 hour action movie because she saw it for free, didn't care about the movie, but might get on TV if she says something nice says?
I don't. I spend my money based on the trailer. On the specs. On the features. Not based on someone else's opinion.
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Post by tropicallutefisk on Jun 24, 2019 12:46:13 GMT -5
I do read product reviews but I take them with a grain of salt. Usually I look at several good and bad with my attention given to what is said, not necessarily the rating. Ultimately though, my purchase is most influenced my previous brand experience and opinions of people I trust.
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Post by adaboy on Jun 24, 2019 12:55:37 GMT -5
I think you brought up a legitimate issue, however, based on a few words, the tone of your post (to me) already showed a bit of outrage. I think, “ Honestly, that put an end to my shopping at Emotiva.” might be dramatized as “ lighting the torch”, and “ Does this bother anyone else?” could similarly be scripted as “ who’s with me?”. I read your words to say “because of this activity I’m not buying any Emotiva products, what about you?” You have already decided you don’t like this practice. I actually wasn’t aware of the practice, and I’m glad you brought it up, I just think your choice of words didn’t invite an honest explanation. I'm with you on this. The tone was incendiary, and I don't know of anyone who actually reads the letters WTF as three letters, and not three words. It's absolutely profanity. I'm not offended by profanity, I don't think any one combination of letters is any better or worse than another, or is going to keep me out of some imaginary afterlife. To me, it's about respect, and it's about how those words are used to portray an emotion. The was an incendiary post, with a valid point. I have posted reviews on the Emotiva site before, I honestly can't remember if they offered any sort of incentive that convinced me to post, but I think I just posted them. Then was informed after posting that I had received a $5 or whatever credit toward my next Emotiva purchase. I have never once used it, because A) $5 is really nothing on my purchases, and B) it expires by the time I'm ready to make another purchase. Suffice it to say, it's never swayed any review one way or another. "keep me out of some imaginary afterlife." While sitting here at Church camp, I felt this was a little unnecessary. Regardless of your beliefs no need to be disrespectful.
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Post by sounder on Jun 24, 2019 14:02:11 GMT -5
Okay fair enough. While tone is largely in the reader's opinion and how they read it, I agree WTF does sound like profanity, and for that I apologize. I didn't mean it in that way. I meant it more like "really?" I don't think they need to compensate people for good reviews, and their products are good IME. I also respect that Emo is honest that they are all compensated in some way.
I would not say I was or am "outraged". But, it changes my opinion of a company I've highly respected for a long time. I've always thought of Emo as a company that is open to telling it like it is, and let the reviewers speak for themselves. Emotiva can choose to market their products in the way they choose, and I respect that. More power to Emotiva!
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Post by Hair Nick on Jun 24, 2019 14:05:30 GMT -5
Talking about reviews, Andrew just did a video on this topic:
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Post by garbulky on Jun 24, 2019 14:28:31 GMT -5
The obvious thing is that 5 (emo)bucks is not about paying for a purposefully skewed positive review. If anything it's an incentive for people to POST their review rather than not. It's also a nice token of appreciation by Emotiva. Not really controversial.
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Post by Hair Nick on Jun 24, 2019 14:36:50 GMT -5
We have it set to give users $15 for submitting a review an an additional $15 for sharing it on social media. So if you leave a review you get $15. If you share it, you should receive a $30 code.
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Post by rbk123 on Jun 24, 2019 14:46:26 GMT -5
I'm with you on this. The tone was incendiary, and I don't know of anyone who actually reads the letters WTF as three letters, and not three words. It's absolutely profanity. I'm not offended by profanity, I don't think any one combination of letters is any better or worse than another, or is going to keep me out of some imaginary afterlife. To me, it's about respect, and it's about how those words are used to portray an emotion. The was an incendiary post, with a valid point. I have posted reviews on the Emotiva site before, I honestly can't remember if they offered any sort of incentive that convinced me to post, but I think I just posted them. Then was informed after posting that I had received a $5 or whatever credit toward my next Emotiva purchase. I have never once used it, because A) $5 is really nothing on my purchases, and B) it expires by the time I'm ready to make another purchase. Suffice it to say, it's never swayed any review one way or another. "keep me out of some imaginary afterlife." While sitting here at Church camp, I felt this was a little unnecessary. Regardless of your beliefs no need to be disrespectful. So you're saying his tone was incendiary? Interesting....
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Post by Boomzilla on Jun 24, 2019 15:35:03 GMT -5
As for those who claim that reviews are worthless, I must politely disagree. The value of a reviewer's comments about a specific product is directly proportional to how much you (the reader) know of the reviewer's likes and dislikes. You don't have to agree with the reviewer to find the comments valuable. For example, we once had a local movie-reviewer whom one of my coworkers absolutely despised. So I asked him, "Bill, if you hate that reviewer so much why do you read his reviews?" Bill replied "I know that if the reviewer likes a movie, I won't enjoy it at all, and if the reviewer gives the movie a strongly negative review, then I know that I'll just LOVE that one!"
The value of any review is dependent on familiarity with the preferences of the writer. So ultimately, what I'm saying is that reading a review by someone you don't know is of little value. But if you know what the reviewer likes and dislikes, then you can use a review as a measuring stick, and translate the reviewer's biases against your own. Once this happens, a review can become a useful tool, whether or not you agree with the reviewer.
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Post by creimes on Jun 24, 2019 18:48:07 GMT -5
We have it set to give users $15 for submitting a review an an additional $15 for sharing it on social media. So if you leave a review you get $15. If you share it, you should receive a $30 code. My $30 from my BasX A-100 review was no way fueled by the money but more the performance and price ratio of the amp, the $30 did come in handy when i bought a second one haha. Chad
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Post by Jessica on Jun 24, 2019 21:04:05 GMT -5
I wouldn’t read much into the term “incentivized”, its a simple disclosure that a few dollars in EmoCash has been offered to the writer for taking time to write the review. In no way does the EmoCash come close to buying a good review. Its just a kind gesture by Emotiva. Don’t let their disclosure make you think that they are paying any significant amount of money for a review, what I received wouldn’t cover almost anything they offer for sale, but it was a kind gesture all the same. This is NOT a reason to crucify Emotiva, please look elsewhere! Hi everyone. Thought I'd chime in. Nick already clarified the incentive we give for completing and sharing a review. Our language and the way that is written is 100% all about disclosure. We are not buying reviews - which is how it sounds it was interpreted. The language is purposely written the way that it is because we were advised legally to do so. The incentive we give ($15 and $30) is really a nominal thank you for taking the time to complete a review. If other websites don't have that language, they really should! Our company is all about transparency. We'd rather tell you what's up than not say anything at all - which I find is the road most people and companies take. To the original poster - I hope you stick around with us! Hopefully you can see where we are coming from.
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