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Post by wilburthegoose on Dec 19, 2020 21:19:15 GMT -5
Ps. Off topic. Apple products should be patched as soon as you can after a patch is released. Adversaries are attacking Macs and exploiting patching related vulnerabilities frequently these days.
MacOS is built on Unix flavored base, and trust me, it requires rapid patching to keep safe. It’s not 2005.
Let’s just say I’m qualified in this area professionally.
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 19, 2020 21:38:39 GMT -5
The exception is if you're using your Apple product "sandboxed" with no connection to the internet or any network at all. No internet or network connectivity? No update needed. NOTE: This is a RARE circumstance - If you're not sure, then wilburthegoose is right and you NEED the updates! One could argue that a good firewall between the internet and your network should, in theory, be sufficient, but the entire US Government and some grinning Russian hackers belie that theory... And I'm NOT qualified in this area professionally, so when in doubt, listen to Wilbur!
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Post by audiobill on Dec 20, 2020 6:55:11 GMT -5
@dyjohn observed : "IMO "what you're missing" is power utilization, noise, heat, and stability. Something like a Nuc (or an NAS) running a dedicated OS and the server software does so mostly without fans and much more efficiently than a Mac or Windows PC." I honestly have never heard the sonic impact or have even seen the measurement of these factors, and instinctively doubt that anyone could reliably demonstrate their effect. With the Mac Mini M1, lightning fast , quiet and cool running for $639 compared to a Roon Nucleus for more than double the price, I struggle to justify the difference in price for these intangibles. www.pcmag.com/reviews/apple-mac-mini-m1-late-2020 Also, the Roon Nucleus is pretty much a single use computer, where a Mac Mini of course can do anything you want, with future alternative uses if/when you may no longer run Roon. For an "Apples to Apples" comparison, I'm ignoring the DIY route, although an NUC is easy enough to build. But even still, an NUC costs close to the Mac, with no warranty and limited support. I especially like being able to create REW filters and load them into Roon's DSP convolution engine within the same computer, in addition to compatibility with everything else in my home. Best,
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Post by DYohn on Dec 20, 2020 10:03:19 GMT -5
@dyjohn observed : "IMO "what you're missing" is power utilization, noise, heat, and stability. Something like a Nuc (or an NAS) running a dedicated OS and the server software does so mostly without fans and much more efficiently than a Mac or Windows PC." I honestly have never heard the sonic impact or have even seen the measurement of these factors, and instinctively doubt that anyone could reliably demonstrate their effect. With the Mac Mini M1, lightning fast , quiet and cool running for $639 compared to a Roon Nucleus for more than double the price, I struggle to justify the difference in price for these intangibles. www.pcmag.com/reviews/apple-mac-mini-m1-late-2020 Also, the Roon Nucleus is pretty much a single use computer, where a Mac Mini of course can do anything you want, with future alternative uses if/when you may no longer run Roon. For an "Apples to Apples" comparison, I'm ignoring the DIY route, although an NUC is easy enough to build. But even still, an NUC costs close to the Mac, with no warranty and limited support. I especially like being able to create REW filters and load them into Roon's DSP convolution engine within the same computer, in addition to compatibility with everything else in my home. Best, NOTE that my comment said nothing about "sonic impact" only about power utilization, stability and potential for quieter operation. That said, I do understand your point but I remain an advocate for single-use computer as a music server as the "best" solution. And I think the systems that run the Sonic Orbiter based OS and Roon are bullit-proof. At least mine is and has been for years.
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Post by klinemj on Dec 20, 2020 19:26:35 GMT -5
That said, I do understand your point but I remain an advocate for single-use computer as a music server as the "best" solution. And I think the systems that run the Sonic Orbiter based OS and Roon are bullit-proof. At least mine is and has been for years. Big fan of the Sonic Orbiter stuff. I don't know what they are doing, but it's rock solid and I have heard sonic improvement via their gear. I have no idea why, and I don't care. And, I love Roon also. It's so easy to use, and the metadata is amazing. Mark
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 21, 2020 13:13:31 GMT -5
I've a friend who uses jRiver and continually rags me about how I should ditch Roon and go back. I'm not convinced. When I make a change in Roon - it is implemented. When I used to make changes in jRiver, nothing would change - when I asked why, the usual reply was "that feature isn't implemented on Mac yet." Not a good way to win friends and influence people...
But my decision is made - I'm a Roon user and plan to stay that way.
Boomzilla
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Post by novisnick on Dec 21, 2020 13:21:22 GMT -5
I've a friend who uses jRiver and continually rags me about how I should ditch Roon and go back. I'm not convinced. When I make a change in Roon - it is implemented. When I used to make changes in jRiver, nothing would change - when I asked why, the usual reply was "that feature isn't implemented on Mac yet." Not a good way to win friends and influence people... But my decision is made - I'm a Roon user and plan to stay that way. Boomzilla I’ve been a Roon user for some time now, Lifer. Mac Mini to my SOtM streamer and on to the Brooklyn and so on. Every once in a Blue Moon I’ll run JRiver to my RMC-1. Doesn’t take long to remember why I switched. Also enjoy the lack of the bi-monthly request to upgrade for upgrades that will come some day.
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Post by bluemeanies on Dec 25, 2020 11:14:24 GMT -5
Fairly new to ROON via Mac Mini - PS Audio DSD..LOVELY..still navigating ROON and I contains worth the investment..IMO. Pretty sure I am staying put.
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Post by klinemj on Dec 25, 2020 14:04:14 GMT -5
I've a friend who uses jRiver and continually rags me about how I should ditch Roon and go back. I'm not convinced. When I make a change in Roon - it is implemented. When I used to make changes in jRiver, nothing would change - when I asked why, the usual reply was "that feature isn't implemented on Mac yet." Not a good way to win friends and influence people... But my decision is made - I'm a Roon user and plan to stay that way. Boomzilla For me, I found nothing to like about JRiver other than it did a good job of batch converting a bunch of WAV files to FLAC after I learned WAV didn't keep the track number with the metadata on rips. After that, I found it was just complex to use and didn't add any value (and, as reported many times...not happy with the owners' and their "stories" about what it does that it doesn't do...). Mark
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 25, 2020 21:36:43 GMT -5
Yeah, my audio amigo, who is not particularly computer-astute just LOVES jRiver because it is so tweakable. If some tweak doesn't work, he just assumes that HE's at fault rather than the flaky software.
I'm the opposite. If I paid for it, I expect it to work as advertised. And I get perpetual razzing from Loungers who think that my expectations are far too high. But I'm an independent consultant in my field and I don't tell clients that I can do things that I can't. It's bad business, and a sure way to lose clients. But expectations are apparently far lower in the audio world - You don't hear a difference from our $10,000 speaker wires? What's wrong with YOU? Our software doesn't work as advertised? We're STILL better than the other guys' programs - If you pay us extra for our new beta, maybe your problem will go away (or not...).
OTOH, you DO get virtually every feature you can imagine with jRiver - It's just that you have to keep imagining that they work... Is that hyperbole? To an extent, yes. Most of jRiver's features DO seem to work, but at least some of them (and often the features you need the MOST) seem to have (usually) minor bugs.
Is Roon any better? I think that it is, but occasionally, only slightly better. You pays your money you takes your choice. Until I find another program with equivalent features, stability, and sound quality, I'm sticking with Roon.
Boom
Postscriptum - And before somebody asks, exactly WHAT features do I dislike about Roon?
1. The Roon backup program has a tendency to lose data when it is used. I've lost favorites tags completely, cover art (sometimes), and occasionally metadata by using the Roon backup feature. 2. Playback can be quirky - The Roon Community boards are FULL of folks who fight lags, dropouts, etc. Even with Roon's assistance, some mysteries persist. 3. Roon's interfaces with TIDAL and Qobuz can be tricky. Once you get the services working, they seem fine, but setup can be irritating. 4. Not all gear is Roon compatible. Roon may or may not see your DAC or streamer as an endpoint. And if that's the case, then not only Roon but also the manufacturer will be happy to postpone doing anything indefinitely by blaming each other. Is this Roon's fault? No, but you won't be happy if you can't use your DAC or new streamer because Roon doesn't like it.
Cheers - Boomzilla
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Post by DYohn on Dec 26, 2020 11:00:47 GMT -5
Postscriptum - And before somebody asks, exactly WHAT features do I dislike about Roon? 1. The Roon backup program has a tendency to lose data when it is used. I've lost favorites tags completely, cover art (sometimes), and occasionally metadata by using the Roon backup feature. 2. Playback can be quirky - The Roon Community boards are FULL of folks who fight lags, dropouts, etc. Even with Roon's assistance, some mysteries persist. 3. Roon's interfaces with TIDAL and Qobuz can be tricky. Once you get the services working, they seem fine, but setup can be irritating. 4. Not all gear is Roon compatible. Roon may or may not see your DAC or streamer as an endpoint. And if that's the case, then not only Roon but also the manufacturer will be happy to postpone doing anything indefinitely by blaming each other. Is this Roon's fault? No, but you won't be happy if you can't use your DAC or new streamer because Roon doesn't like it. Cheers - Boomzilla 1. I don't know what you may be doing wrong, but I have never had issues like that. 2. I also have read the comments on the Roon Community forums. Most of the time these seem to be people who either are trying to make the software do things it is not designed to do or who are using some non-standard setup, or using computers with older OS versions. Again, I've been using Roon since shortly after Meridian spun it off as a separate company in about 2013, and no such issues. 3. Roon is the best interface by far for Qobuz. Much better than their supplied UI. I have no experience with Tidal. The only "setup" I had to do with Qobuz was to subscribe to their service and then to log in on the Roon "Services" setup page. Then there is was, no muss no fuss, as a part of Roon. 4. Not all gear is compatible, no. Users must know what they are doing.
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 26, 2020 14:00:54 GMT -5
4. Agreed - If you don't do your homework, you can end up with problem-children equipment
3. Agreed - The issue I had was that Qobuz had issued me a temporary gift-code registration number for the duration of the review, and their system was being antsy about the temporary registration.
2. Partial - You're right that a lot of people on the Roon Community board either cause their own problems, or have obsolete hardware. But that's not ALL the people there by a long shot. Sometimes, Roon can just be peculiar about certain hardware combinations that SHOULD work perfectly per Roon's specifications.
1. You're an industry veteran with a LOT of experience. Just because things work perfectly for YOU (who probably tweaked the settings to fix any problems without thinking about it) doesn't mean that a LOT of others get the same results. The Roon engineers whom I worked with extensively during my review of the Nucleus Plus agreed that there might be some bugs in the backup program, and said that they're working on them.
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Post by DYohn on Dec 26, 2020 14:55:02 GMT -5
Boomzilla, I really am not asking if you agree or not. I am just stating my experience.
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Post by klinemj on Dec 26, 2020 19:25:52 GMT -5
I'm no industry veteran at all. I'm a relative newby to streaming. But, for me...Roon just works UNLESS: 1) The DAC I am tying to access is not "Working"...as in...not powered up or has its brain confused and needs to re-boot. 2) I am feeding to my XMC-2 via its USB Stream input via my UltraRendu. It appears the XMC-2 doesn't like Roon's USB input through "certain" computers.
Other than that, Roon "just works" for me. And, I also never have had issues with my library, but it's almost fully ripped by JRiver into FLAC. I know you have a lot of different formats from various sources with often manually entered metadata. I don't. Might make a difference.
Mark
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Post by brubacca on Dec 26, 2020 22:07:26 GMT -5
I'm having a bit of struggle with Ropieee and using the official 7" display. I have been flashing , reflashing, switching up gear, rinse.. repeat for two days and I can't get this thing to work.
Ugh. I'm about to bail on it.... Most Roon items work for me, but this is frustrating. Maybe I'll check out Volumio. Just thought of that.
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Post by Casey Leedom on Dec 26, 2020 22:16:08 GMT -5
I'm still waiting for Roon Labs to recompile the Mac OS Roon client application for the M1 ARM. Not that it's a high-performance application and I'm sure that Rosetta2 will do a fine job with the old Roon x86 binary ... I just don't want to pollute my new machine with dead technology ... :-)
Casey
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Post by klinemj on Dec 27, 2020 8:39:13 GMT -5
I'm having a bit of struggle with Ropieee and using the official 7" display. I have been flashing , reflashing, switching up gear, rinse.. repeat for two days and I can't get this thing to work. Ugh. I'm about to bail on it.... Most Roon items work for me, but this is frustrating. Maybe I'll check out Volumio. Just thought of that. I never considered using one of those tiny displays. My vision is too bad and I didn't want to have to go up to the device. I just use my Surface tablet for controlling the Pi. Mark
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Post by brubacca on Dec 27, 2020 23:11:07 GMT -5
I'm having a bit of struggle with Ropieee and using the official 7" display. I have been flashing , reflashing, switching up gear, rinse.. repeat for two days and I can't get this thing to work. Ugh. I'm about to bail on it.... Most Roon items work for me, but this is frustrating. Maybe I'll check out Volumio. Just thought of that. I'm an idiot. Needed to restart (I just rebooted my rock) the Roon Server.
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Post by brubacca on Dec 27, 2020 23:13:28 GMT -5
I'm having a bit of struggle with Ropieee and using the official 7" display. I have been flashing , reflashing, switching up gear, rinse.. repeat for two days and I can't get this thing to work. Ugh. I'm about to bail on it.... Most Roon items work for me, but this is frustrating. Maybe I'll check out Volumio. Just thought of that. I never considered using one of those tiny displays. My vision is too bad and I didn't want to have to go up to the device. I just use my Surface tablet for controlling the Pi. Mark Actually I am really liking it. I just got it working. I don't need it for control although it does have play, pause and forward/reverse track. I have it setup at my headphone station. Its cool because after I send the 4 hour playlist to the zone I can use it for pause/plat or skip to next song. Its not a full control point for me, but its proving to be nice. I'll try to post a picture on Monday.
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Post by LuisV on Feb 2, 2021 12:07:58 GMT -5
Introducing Roon 1.8...
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