Amp Combination Suggestions

[Mark]

Hi,

New to the board. Thanks "Secrets of HTHF.." .Trying to decided on what combination of amps. Speakers:

Mains: Martin Logan Vista's (4ohm 20-400 watts per channel)
Center: ML Passage (6ohm 20-300 watts per channel)
Surrounds: ML Vignette (6 ohm 20-250 watts per channel)

Opt 1. XPA2 +XPA5
Opt 2. UPA2+UPA5
Opt 3. UPA1x2 + UPA 5
Opt 4. XPA2+UPA 5
Opt 5. UPA1x2+XPA5

Have lots of other stuff to buy for the room so would like to not spend extra if something is not going to make a significant difference.

Something about an XPD(?) or something like that coming, but couldn't find any info. Should that be factored in?

Thanks for your input!~ Mark

[ausman]

7x upa-1's or wait til the xpr-7 come out..

if money is no object

7x xpa-1's
or
7x xpr-1's ( when the are releases for public consumption)

a 3rd possibility:

1x xpa-1
4x xpa2's..

upa-2, upa-5 and upa-7 have the same output power so there is no benefit in splitting hairs over the 3 amps..

7x upa-1's = 1 xpr-7.

my personal opinion level match the output of your amps and it should be good listening for all around..

if I had the choice, given the space I got now, 7x upa-1's are the best i got to use, otherwise it would xpa-1's or xpr-1's all the way.. otherwise 1x xpa-1 and 3x xpa-2's are my second choice...

ultimately it's up to you what you want to use the cheapest xlr amp is the upa-1 and likely the best option for right now, I could never see the point in the xpa-2 and xpa-5 combo for the simple fact you are putting the center and surround on the xpa-5 200-300 watts per channel and 300-500 watts per channel, your mains are going drown the center channel...

going the route of use 1x xpa-1, 3x xpa-2's giving you the option of running the mains and surrounds on the xpa-2's and the xpa-1 dedicated for center channel use....
there is many way to flog a cat like this for setup after all it up to you what you plan to use at the end of the day..

[Poodleluvr]

Well, I'm a mono block guy...

So, personally, I like the stack of 7x upa-1s option...

Separate power supplies for each channel.

And, I'd wait until Black Friday to order...

And then, as Jim Cramer would say-- Back up the truck!

[jackfish]

Two UPA-1s and a UPA-5 should be good unless you have a monsterous room.

[carlp336]

i have a upa2 for rears and an xpa5 for main and surrounds.

[Poodleluvr]

Here is another way to look at it:

Have a home party with you and 6 hungry guests...

Now, to feed them and you, order a 7 foot party sub....

Option 1: Cut up the sub into 7 exact size pieces; whereas, each person enjoys their very own sandwich...

Option 2: Considering how you cut up the 7 foot party sub, some folks end up taking bites out of the same sandwich...


Now, Bon Appetit!

www.subwayohio.com/index.cfm?form_prod_id=1_3&action=product

[cgolf]

I like mono blocks at least for the front so either 2 UPA-1s or an XPA-2 (not mono but lots of headroom) for the front. If you only have 2 surrounds, then an XPA-3 for the center and surrounds is good. If you have 3 or 4 surrounds then either a UPA-5 or XPA-5 for the center and surrounds.

Good news is, with Emotiva, most any combo will provide ample power and sound fantastic!!! ;D

[roadrunner]

To make a recommendation on which amps to use with your ML speakers we really need to know more about the size, shape, layout, and construction mateials for you listening room. We also need to know about your listening habits. Do you like to listen at reference level or higher? What genre of music do you listen to? Do you have rugs? ... wood floors? tile floor? .. number, location and size of doors and windows? ...curtains? ...what type? ...wall and ceiling treatjment? ...size, type, location, of furniture? All of these things, and more, influence how much power you will need for your ML speakers.

If you seldom listen at loud sound levels the UPA series amps will work for you. If you are a music lover, the ML don't really sing unless you feed them lots of power. The more clean power you feed them the better they sound, even at reduced volume levels.

Unless you have a smallish listening room or you only listen at low sound levels, you will probably be happiest with the UPA-1s or some combination of XPA series amps. If you have a HUGE listening room then you will probably want the XPA-1s or choose from the new XPR SERIES amps.

[twilkins]

Assuming a normal size room: with music involved 2xUPA-1s with an XPA-5; no music involved an XPA-3 and 2xUPA-2s for surrounds.

[twilkins]

Oops - scratch the UPA-2s and go for the UPA-5 for surrounds. Looks like about $150 less.

[Poodleluvr]

www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/manufacture/0907/

"Secrets of Amplifier And Speaker Power
Requirements Revealed!"

"Article by Alan Lofft as supplied by Axiom Audio"

A few excerpts of article with link and credit provided above:

"As audio/video hobbyists, most of us grew up thinking that if we have an amplifier with 50 watts of rated output power into 8-ohm speakers, and that combination produces reasonably clean and loud music, then by doubling the amplifier power to 100 watts per channel, the system would then play twice as loud. Many readers likely still believe that. Not so."

"Therefore, a 100-watt amplifier will produce sound only slightly louder than a 50-watt amplifier."

"From all this you can see the huge power requirements inherent in reproducing real-life acoustic sound levels in average or big rooms."

"But the truth is that if we are seeking real-life acoustic sound levels in our listening rooms, there's a very persuasive argument for very large, powerful amplifiers. And if your speakers are less sensitive (and many are), then the power demands rise even more dramatically. Sizeable rooms and greater listening distances will also increase power demands tremendously."

"And what many of us don't realize until we hear it, is that clean undistorted loud sound often does not sound that 'loud.' The key here is that in most or our home listening, there are small amounts of distortion caused by a lack of dynamic headroom (but more on that next month). It's the distortion that makes it sound 'loud' in a domestic setting. To remove those distortions and increase dynamic headroom relates to even more power. We've become accustomed to accepting some distortion with our reproduced music, because all amplifier's distortion ratings gradually increase as they approach their output limits or slightly clip the audio signals. When that happens, we turn down the volume, because distortion starts to intrude on our listening pleasure, and it sounds 'too loud.'"

"The lesson in all this is that you can never have too much power, and that big amplifiers rarely damage speakers. Little amplifiers driven into clipping burn out speakers. In the scheme of high fidelity, that last barrier to realism is having enough power and being able to approximate real-life loudness levels."

[Mark]

Thanks eveyone not only for the responses but for responding so quickly.

I may be more confused. I don't think space wise 7 of anything will fit. Needs to go into a cabinet in the bar where all the wires terminate. (Don't worry, was build with amp heat in mind, vented and room for a cooling fan if needed.) Besides the amps, will need to get an Oppoe 83(se?? topic for another post. ) Xbox, and power conditioner. I've heard that ML's need lots of power, but an XPA 1 might be a bit much. Not to mention the room issue. Speaking of room. It's a 1/2 bar 1/2 home theater room. Bar area is 12x18 with tile floor. Theater are is 14x21 with carpet. Will probably be 50% movies, 50 % music. Music will be everything from Depeche Mode to 1500's vocal.

At the moment, leaning towars 2 UPA-1's and an XPA-5. Now over to the Processor forum to see if anyone has a UMC that works. Love the look of all together, but doesn't look like may people are pleased.

THanks again!

[jeffakamax]

Speaking from experience... I have a set of SL3's for my mains. As I am sure you kow by now, Martin Logans while being excellent speakers are inefficient and power mongers. I have always been of the school thinking that your amp on the mains should be 2x (minimally) the speaker rating. I like it loud and I like headroom. Feed the ML's right and you will love them!

That being said, I would not go with anything less than an XPA-2 for the mains.

[Nemesis.ie]

3 x UPA-1 for the front - I am a fan of all 3 front configs being the same (yes, I am a bit biased too).

You can then look at surround options - 2 x UPA-2, 4 x UPA-1, XPA-5, UPA-5 etc.

[virgil]

THis is a very interesting topic for me too. Considering you have 8 Ohms speakers, sensitive, have somebody actually confirmed that for example a combination of an XPA2 for L/R + an XPA5 for Center and Surrounds, actually sounds better than just using an XPA5? Can the difference be heard at normal listening levels (below reference)?

[selkec]

I noticed a big difference going from an xpa-5 to xpa-1's. Way more dynamic even at lower volumes. I had to sell them all unfortunately. I have an xpa3 for now. Its fine but after having so much more power I miss it. If you have the funds I say go for the big boys and never look back otherwise you will always be wondering what if.