DYohn
Emo VIPs
Posts: 18,340
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Post by DYohn on Dec 7, 2010 14:12:33 GMT -5
....At this point, they should probably at least modify their website and change Internal Volume Control: Digitally controlled in increments of 0.5db to Internal Volume Control: Digitally controlled in linear increments of 0.5 on a 0 to 80 scale. ..... Steve But, even that is not correct. The way is is now there is no uniform step. The lower volume settings make a huge change in output, while the upper region makes very little. Like an inverse log function? Hmm.
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Post by rockguitar on Dec 7, 2010 14:21:17 GMT -5
I also called Emotiva today and talked to Lonnie about the volume control. I wanted to bring up a proposed solution for the volume control by using a resistor to approximate a log volume control. They are looking for a more "elegant" solution. Basically it sounds like they are investigating incorporating a log taper into the microprocessor of the unit. I also mentioned to him the Lavry Dac is programmed to do this using the same DAC chip, so hopefully a solution gains some traction. Apparently Dan is in China right now, trying to resolve this issue. So as Lonnie told me they "are paying attention to us." BTW, its the first time I've ever talked to him and he was a very courteous gentleman
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Post by rockguitar on Dec 7, 2010 14:23:41 GMT -5
But, even that is not correct. The way is is now there is no uniform step. The lower volume settings make a huge change in output, while the upper region makes very little. Like an inverse log function? Hmm. It's linear my friends Here's my measurements posted in the other thread. "URL=http://img97.imageshack.us/i/xdapic.jpg/] [/URL]
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tonys
Minor Hero
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Post by tonys on Dec 7, 2010 21:43:31 GMT -5
Great news...! Thanks rockguitar. Tony ;D
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Post by sharkman on Dec 8, 2010 0:29:47 GMT -5
Damn. They had the XDA running at the Rocky Mountain festival. Couldn't they tell something was up with the volume? I am disappointed in Emotiva, this is the last time I buy a brand new release from them. I do not want to send this thing across the continent so they can fix it. Once they figure out how to fix it. Is this Emotiva's very next released product since the UMC? Two problems in a row.
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cawgijoe
Emo VIPs
"We made too many of the wrong mistakes." - Yogi Berra
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Post by cawgijoe on Dec 8, 2010 7:46:24 GMT -5
The volume issue doesn't affect everybody. Those who are not using the XDA-1 as a preamp are ok. Even some who are using the preamp function of the XDA-1 with less efficient speakers seem to be ok......at least some of them.
I won't be able to play with mine till December 25th, but I don't foresee any issues since I will be using a Pioneer VSX-01 receiver.
Having said that, this issue needs to be fixed quickly for future XDA-1 sales. For those who already bought them and want them fixed once a solution is identified, hopefully Emotiva will have a pain-free process to do this.
I don't regret having bought this product or the ERC-1 when it was first released.
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Post by katjith on Dec 8, 2010 9:47:00 GMT -5
Cawgijoe is right.It doesn't affect anything if it is used as a DAC through a pre-amp.Mine works just fine with volume set to 80.0 through my Sherwood pre-amp.The sound is gorgeous!!!!!!! I have two other DACs MSB Tech Full Nelson and Parasound DAC1100. Emotiva sounds better than both of those DACs. Ranjith from San Diego
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Post by Poodleluvr on Dec 8, 2010 10:01:14 GMT -5
Only half true and from a long term perspective, IMO this is not a 'sound' mindset....(pun intended...LOL)
While I intend to use my XDA-1 with the debuting XSP-1, though now using it XLR direct to XPA-1s w/o my USP-1, it is my belief that in the name of continuous improvement, Emotiva will most likely manufacturer a subsequent DAC within the next 5 years while mine and yours is still under factory warranty.
Now, if Emo comes out with a subsequent DAC within 5 years, and I desire to sell the dated model w/factory warranty remaining to upgrade to their new DAC offering, how do I sell my 'version' on the used market so I can put the cash towards their new model?
In closure, what I'm saying is, if there truly is an issue here, and an opportunity presents itself to remedy the issue, I'd get it modded because years down the road, you may find yourself later 'holding the bag' per say...
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Post by wizardofoz on Dec 8, 2010 10:56:32 GMT -5
Did a lot of testing today... with another few bro's here in Singapore and we will write a good of it deal up ... but seems at least with the UPA-1/2 amps the volume is less of an issue ( ERC-1 as source and Klipsch KG .45/ERM-1's as speakers)
Coax seemed to be the better option from the ERC--1 vrs Optical ... Compared very favourably with a 5 yr old Benchmark DAC 1 IIRC the model correctly Bal out had a very slight edge on the RCA...very very slight at that, granted the UPA-1 is not really differential. RCA via a USP-1 seemed to be very similar too compared with balanced direct to UPA-1
more to follow in a dedicated thread ...
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cawgijoe
Emo VIPs
"We made too many of the wrong mistakes." - Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,895
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Post by cawgijoe on Dec 8, 2010 11:36:08 GMT -5
Only half true and from a long term perspective, IMO this is not a 'sound' mindset....(pun intended...LOL) While I intend to use my XDA-1 with the debuting XSP-1, though now using it XLR direct to XPA-1s w/o my USP-1, it is my belief that in the name of continuous improvement, Emotiva will most likely manufacturer a subsequent DAC within the next 5 years while mine and yours is still under factory warranty. Now, if Emo comes out with a subsequent DAC within 5 years, and I desire to sell the dated model w/factory warranty remaining to upgrade to their new DAC offering, how do I sell my 'version' on the used market so I can put the cash towards their new model? In closure, what I'm saying is, if there truly is an issue here, and an opportunity presents itself to remedy the issue, I'd get it modded because years down the road, you may find yourself later 'holding the bag' per say... It would definitely be worth more to the buyer. I agree......if a reasonable fix is presented, I would have it modded whether I would ever use the preamp function or not.
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Post by rogerwilco on Dec 8, 2010 13:43:18 GMT -5
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Post by sharkman on Dec 8, 2010 20:31:04 GMT -5
Can anyone recommend another brand DAC with volume so it can be connected directly to the amp? It doesn't look like the DACmagic has volume.
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Post by bobbyt on Dec 8, 2010 20:59:51 GMT -5
Volume control means preamp.
A "DAC with volume" is a combined DAC + preamp.
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Post by rclark on Dec 8, 2010 21:14:22 GMT -5
Did a lot of testing today... with another few bro's here in Singapore and we will write a good of it deal up ... but seems at least with the UPA-1/2 amps the volume is less of an issue ( ERC-1 as source and Klipsch KG .45/ERM-1's as speakers) Coax seemed to be the better option from the ERC--1 vrs Optical ... Can you elaborate? I have it connected to the ERC-1 via optical, but you're saying coaxial is the way to go? went ahead and tried it and happy result! ERC-1 to XDA-1 via my brand new MacUltra Silver+ cable is a marked improvement over the optical cable. Such a shimmering top end clarity there. Wow! And the cable isn't even burned in. I have some unused silver RCA cables laying around and want to try them.
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Post by sharkman on Dec 8, 2010 21:17:29 GMT -5
You can call it whatever you want, I suppose. Perhaps you consider the XDA to be a "combined DAC + preamp". What I want is a unit just like the XDA except with a properly implemented volume control. I prefer to call it a dac with volume.
It looks like it's a harder to find feature than I thought(at least at under $500 or so). Maybe I should just keep the XDA and buy a pre-amp.
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Post by ajani on Dec 8, 2010 21:30:30 GMT -5
You can call it whatever you want, I suppose. Perhaps you consider the XDA to be a "combined DAC + preamp". What I want is a unit just like the XDA except with a properly implemented volume control. I prefer to call it a dac with volume. It looks like it's a harder to find feature than I thought(at least at under $500 or so). Maybe I should just keep the XDA and buy a pre-amp. A DAC with volume control is still not that common... And some of the ones that do (like my Benchmark DAC1) don't have a remote... If the volume control on the XDA-1 was properly implemented then it would be an incredible value in terms of features... I really hope Emotiva finds a fix soon...
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Post by bobbyt on Dec 9, 2010 0:32:33 GMT -5
You can call it whatever you want, I suppose. Perhaps you consider the XDA to be a "combined DAC + preamp". I do consider the XDA to be a DAC+preamp--and the reason I was excited to see it is that, like you, I haven't seen many of them. Standalone DACs don't have volume controls because the preamp they send the signal to does that. Standalone preamps take an analog signal from a DAC or integrated CD player (transport + DAC combo). Combining the DAC and preamp seems like the most logical setup to me, but there are surprisingly few affordable ones out there.
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mrla
Minor Hero
Posts: 73
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Post by mrla on Dec 9, 2010 0:42:22 GMT -5
any word from emo as to how to correct these overexcited volume numbers - yet???
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Post by honk on Dec 10, 2010 3:26:29 GMT -5
I guess no ... maybe a Emo technician can give us some data for a Voltage divider (circuit diagram; resistor types etc.) to reduce the gain about 60%.
I will solder a custom XLR cable to connect the XPA-1s then ...
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Post by honk on Dec 10, 2010 5:22:57 GMT -5
Input impedances:
XPA1 Unbalanced – 20kohms Balanced – 18kohms
XPA2 Unbalanced ‐ 23.5kohms Balanced ‐ 33kohms
XPA3 Unbalanced – 47kohms (wrong manual figures?) Balanced – 33kohms
XPA5 Unbalanced – 23.5kohms Balanced – 33kohms
So, the powermonster XPA1 got balanced only the half resistance at the input ... I guess a minus 6-12 dB divider would be fine. Will 2xR1 / R2 4.7k / 20k ohm fix the prob?
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