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Post by sharkman on Dec 11, 2012 17:10:33 GMT -5
This forum has a lot of "audiophile members" who have mistakenly proffered that 5.xx is all that is needed to experience all the glories of surround sound. Therefore, any discussion or argument for additional channels (even 7.xxx discrete) is shoved aside. Additionally, Emo discontinued their 7 channel line previously because of slow sales. I and many others have argued that the reason for the seemingly inadequate sales was due to misguided advertisement by Emo. The UPA-7 (I own one) was advertised as a replacement for the enemic AVR, but it did not offer more power on paper (it has much better drive capability than a similarly rated AVR). However, Emo has promised to make a 7-channel amp of similar power rating as the XPA-5 (200 wpc). I was hoping for at least 250 wpc. I would not expect to see a 7-channel PA (low priority for Emo) before 2014. The XMC-1, Reference Series speakers, RS subs, UMC-500 and replacements for the Ultra & X Series speakers would be higher priorities than a 7 channel HP amp that Emo seems unmotivated about. I'm with you on that Jam. When I was ready to buy an amp Emotiva had nothing in a 7 channel so I went elsewhere. It does look like a 7 channel with at least 200 wpc is a long way off. |
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Post by Jim on Dec 11, 2012 20:38:11 GMT -5
I think the REAL challenge is convincing someone who has an AVR with built in amplification to go with another solution that in some people's minds, "wastes" the AVR power they paid for. Most preamp/processors are easily $1K+ (non AVR), unless you consider the Emotiva UMC processors.
An XPA-7 or UPA-7 would be a clear DUH if you don't have an AVR.... but that's a small minority. The 1, 2, 3 are easy sells if you focus on your fronts.
I don't think it was misguided advertisement.... It's just an uphill battle. It actually seemed like the UPA-7 started getting recognition, but at the worst possible time, just before it was discontinued.
Now, that being said, I think the XPA-7 would fill a void.
Just my 2 cents!
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Post by The Mad Norseman on Dec 11, 2012 21:58:24 GMT -5
I think the REAL challenge is convincing someone who has an AVR with built in amplification to go with another solution that in some people's minds, "wastes" the AVR power they paid for. But that's why Emo (and some others) make the very logical recommendation to let someone's AVR power a pair of the surrounds (or rear surrounds), and let the front/main set/pair(s) be driven by an external 3, or 5 channel (Emo!) amp. The best of both worlds!  |
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Post by Jim on Dec 11, 2012 22:15:09 GMT -5
Yep........ I agree!
Speaking of that, I did a fun analysis of peak levels, peak RMS and RMS levels of 5 channels (L, C, R, SL, SR) on about a dozen movies.. I can share it if anyone wants it (XLS).
I learned some interesting things about relationship of levels between the channels. Some movies, the surrounds did very little, on a couple the signal levels peaked as high or higher than the LCRs!
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Post by htinparadise on Dec 12, 2012 1:19:03 GMT -5
Yep........ I agree! Speaking of that, I did a fun analysis of peak levels, peak RMS and RMS levels of 5 channels (L, C, R, SL, SR) on about a dozen movies.. I can share it if anyone wants it (XLS). I learned some interesting things about relationship of levels between the channels. Some movies, the surrounds did very little, on a couple the signal levels peaked as high or higher than the LCRs! I'm not agreeing with anything here except the obvious above, that a 7 channel amp is not entirely useful in a HT system, not as functional as say an XPA2 coupled with tower mains and an XPA5 with Center and Surrounds. To that end, and the fact that 11.2 is just around the corner, Emotiva ought to focus on more functional XPA4. Consider a complete 11.2 system with an XPA2, an XPA5 and an XPA4 for Front Heights and Front Wides... Likely, in many other folks minds, an XPA4 just makes more functional sense than an XPA7. Enjoy the music in 11.4, HTinP |
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Post by broncsrule21 on Dec 12, 2012 1:51:20 GMT -5
I think the REAL challenge is convincing someone who has an AVR with built in amplification to go with another solution that in some people's minds, "wastes" the AVR power they paid for. Most preamp/processors are easily $1K+ (non AVR), unless you consider the Emotiva UMC processors. An XPA-7 or UPA-7 would be a clear DUH if you don't have an AVR.... but that's a small minority. The 1, 2, 3 are easy sells if you focus on your fronts. I don't think it was misguided advertisement.... It's just an uphill battle. It actually seemed like the UPA-7 started getting recognition, but at the worst possible time, just before it was discontinued. Now, that being said, I think the XPA-7 would fill a void. Just my 2 cents! The problem is that most people that just spent x amount of cash on a 125 wpc avr. Doesnt want to beleive that the upa-7 will blow its doors off. |
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Post by Jim on Dec 12, 2012 9:08:10 GMT -5
To that end, and the fact that 11.2 is just around the corner, Emotiva ought to focus on more functional XPA4. Consider a complete 11.2 system with an XPA2, an XPA5 and an XPA4 for Front Heights and Front Wides... HTinP I'm not aware of any content that is actually mastered with more channels than 7.1 (or encoded for that matter). While I know that there are fans of 9+ channels, as long as the content in the additional channels is "made up", I have very little interest. Most reviews of 9+ channel systems are rather lackluster too. It's a neat idea.......... There isn't really any purpose for an XPA-4. You might as well just buy an XPA-5. You'll have slightly higher capabilities with 4 channels anyway, because of the unused 5th. |
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Post by briank on Dec 12, 2012 10:09:27 GMT -5
Quote from htinparadise: "I'm not agreeing with anything here except the obvious above, that a 7 channel amp is not entirely useful in a HT system, not as functional as say an XPA2 coupled with tower mains and an XPA5 with Center and Surrounds. " I beg to differ, I'll gladly put my 7 channel amp up against your XPA-2/XPA-5 combo for music or movies.  |
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Post by sharkman on Dec 12, 2012 11:24:44 GMT -5
Hey, that's cheating, you've got a Lexicon!  |
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Post by Jim on Dec 12, 2012 11:25:49 GMT -5
Hey, that's cheating, you've got a Lexicon! Wouldn't it be funny if Lexicon was actually manufactured by...... ;D (Just kidding, just kidding!!!!) |
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Post by sharkman on Dec 12, 2012 11:30:03 GMT -5
By ATI actually, are you familar with them?
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Post by Jim on Dec 12, 2012 11:31:19 GMT -5
By ATI actually, are you familar with them? I wasn't, I just started reading up on ATI out of curiosity. Interesting. |
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Post by briank on Dec 12, 2012 11:43:41 GMT -5
It's a very good amp but overpriced like most Lexicon stuff. ATI builds a lot of gear for various companies and i think they do a great job with their build quality. I was able to get the RX-7 for $2400 as it was a dealer display unit. It was not hooked up and in mint condition. Anyway, I don't want to get us off topic so back to the XPA-7 discussion! |
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Post by htinparadise on Dec 12, 2012 12:33:25 GMT -5
Quote from htinparadise: "I'm not agreeing with anything here except the obvious above, that a 7 channel amp is not entirely useful in a HT system, not as functional as say an XPA2 coupled with tower mains and an XPA5 with Center and Surrounds. " I beg to differ, I'll gladly put my 7 channel amp up against your XPA-2/XPA-5 combo for music or movies. The topic never was about a 7 Channel Lexicon, but the mystical Emotiva XPA7, was this not understood? Happy listening, HTinP |
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Post by Jim on Dec 12, 2012 13:42:32 GMT -5
But we're talking about a product that isn't being sold yet, and won't be due out for a while. Besides, we're only on page 6... we still have plenty of pages to go way OT. |
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bkdc
Minor Hero
Posts: 24
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Post by bkdc on Dec 12, 2012 13:53:46 GMT -5
I wasn't, I just started reading up on ATI out of curiosity. Interesting. ATI makes great amplifiers. The ATI 2000 and 3000 series (also rebadged by another direct internet sales audio company) are phenomenal values on sale or B-stock. There aren't many 5 or 7 channel multi-channel high power fully balanced amplifiers out there and there, and there are many fewer affordable ones. The ATIs are built like tanks and they're made in the USA if you care about that stuff. 30,000 µF capacitance per channel on the ATI 2000 series, 36000 µF per channel on the 3000 series, fully balanced differential design. Even on sale, they're twice the cost of an Emotiva for the same power output. I still consider them very good value. |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Dec 12, 2012 14:30:53 GMT -5
With the XPA-7 Emo would have two AVR competitors for complete HT systems; UMC-200 & UPA-700 for $1200 (retail), and XMC-1 & XPR-7 for ~ $2700. There could of course be variations with the UMC-500, as well as U & X series cross combos, but these would be the high and low end. One would compete well with the mid-line AVR's, and the other's performance would walk all over the AVR flagships. These would also appeal to HT enthusiasts who aren't interested in AVR's and seek out quality separates.
I don't have room for the 7RU XPA-5 & XPA-2/3 alternative, and even the XPA-7's 5RU is a challenge, I think a two piece system (processor/amp) for HT offers great performance, flexibility, and convenience. The XPA-7 would be the logical and great companion for the XMC-1, I hope Emo can find a way to slip this amp higher in the priority list.
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Post by Jim on Dec 12, 2012 14:37:33 GMT -5
I don't have room for the 7RU XPA-5 & XPA-2/3 alternative, and even the XPA-7's 5RU is a challenge, From post #1 "You know it's a coming.... XPA-7.... 7x200 RMS, all channels driven. Soon. 4RU tall." Is it not 4RU? |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Dec 12, 2012 18:58:07 GMT -5
I don't have room for the 7RU XPA-5 & XPA-2/3 alternative, and even the XPA-7's 5RU is a challenge, From post #1 "You know it's a coming.... XPA-7.... 7x200 RMS, all channels driven. Soon. 4RU tall." Is it not 4RU? I remember another post from Dan comparing it to the XPA-5, something like 2 more channels, beefier PS, and 1U taller. Since the XPA-5 is 4RU, that would make the XPA-7 5RU. Don't remember where I saw it, I'd be happy if it came in at 4U but I'm planning on 5. |
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Post by dean70 on Dec 13, 2012 17:47:21 GMT -5
... or a modular design that shares the same platform as the XPR-5, where you can choose 5 or 7 channels when you order (or add extra amp "modules" later on) |
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