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Post by oregonbill on Jul 3, 2012 20:05:49 GMT -5
Very nice. Do we get 1500 dollars of Emo House money to play with to help us purchase this beast?
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jamrock
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Post by jamrock on Jul 3, 2012 20:09:07 GMT -5
There is a kind of peculiar "authoritative punchiness" with which high powered amps playback audio that is immediately apparent (to me). I have no explanation for it but I find it addictive. It is as if the speaker cone is eternally linear. No strain, no distortion. No whimpy amps for me when I intend to indulge in serious listening
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Pauly
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Post by Pauly on Jul 3, 2012 20:14:07 GMT -5
There is a kind of peculiar "authoritative punchiness" with which high powered amps playback audio that is immediately apparent (to me). I have no explanation for it but I find it addictive. It is as if the speaker cone is eternally linear. No strain, no distortion. No whimpy amps for me when I intend to indulge in serious listening Unless you have very efficient speakers. Then there's not as much of a performance gap between high powered and low powered amps imo. Provided that the low powered amp is being run within it's limits of course It's very hard to hear any difference in punchiness, strain, or distortion between my Mini-X and XPA-5 on my 100db sensitivity speakers.
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Post by edoggrc51 on Jul 3, 2012 20:28:49 GMT -5
Quit being a sissy lala Nate. The XPR is a lightweight compared to my 125lb Cinenova. I must be in that .01% then. ;D Just curious, have you had the chance to try out a high powered amp in your system before?? You might be surprised at the results. Wow, the Cinenova weighs almost as much as the motor in our bikes, Eric ;D Seriously bro! That's why they put handles on this thing. ;D
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Pauly
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Post by Pauly on Jul 3, 2012 20:33:05 GMT -5
Hmmm, that reminds me. At 90+ pounds, I was kind of hoping to see rack handles on the XPR amps. Most people don't like the look of handles on amps, but they really can be useful at times.
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Post by edoggrc51 on Jul 3, 2012 20:35:26 GMT -5
Hmmm, that reminds me. At 90+ pounds, I was kind of hoping to see rack handles on the XPR amps. Most people don't like the look of handles on amps, but they really can be useful at times. Full disclosure: I removed the handles so that the amp would fit in the stand. That made moving the fat pig a total pain in the a$$!!! lol
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Post by Poodleluvr on Jul 3, 2012 20:39:04 GMT -5
Hmmm, that reminds me. At 90+ pounds, I was kind of hoping to see rack handles on the XPR amps. Most people don't like the look of handles on amps, but they really can be useful at times. IMO, I find rack handles on amps as about attractive as love handles. ;D
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Post by garbulky on Jul 3, 2012 20:40:04 GMT -5
Nice job Dan. I can only imagine the reviews. "We hooked this thing up in our cathedral and the dome cracked. The veil was ripped and we heard God's voice. It was clear, punchy with deafening authority. The dead were resurrected and spoke to us and we heard them in full surround sound glory."
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Pauly
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Post by Pauly on Jul 3, 2012 20:42:30 GMT -5
Hmmm, that reminds me. At 90+ pounds, I was kind of hoping to see rack handles on the XPR amps. Most people don't like the look of handles on amps, but they really can be useful at times. IMO, I find rack handles on amps as about attractive as love handles. ;D Now that was pretty funny ;D.
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jamrock
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Post by jamrock on Jul 3, 2012 20:53:59 GMT -5
I'm as objectivist as anyone can be. If the Mini-X and the XPR-5 are operating at matched levels without clipping, you'd be unlikely to hear any difference. However, as the level changes, that equillibrium is destroyed and the "better" amp will shine through. One area of understanding audio and critical listening is "soft clipping" Many can't or don't recognize it for what it is. It is most apparent only during comparative listening. That "authoritative punchiness" that I earlier referred to is a phenomena you experience at higher listening levels. It is like unto hearing good bass at low listening levels for the 1st time. Something akin to what good damping factor should accomplish. It is more easily experienced than explained though
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Post by ottaone on Jul 3, 2012 21:03:29 GMT -5
Me like. Nice price too. I bought an Anthem MCA-50 in 2005 for 2,000 Canadian at about 3.20 per watt. This beast is 90 cents a watt plus the benefits of class H. Simply amazing! Should be perfect for some Maggies. Congrats to Emotiva!
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Pauly
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Post by Pauly on Jul 3, 2012 21:06:12 GMT -5
I'm as objectivist as anyone can be. If the Mini-X and the XPR-5 are operating at matched levels without clipping, you'd be unlikely to hear any difference. However, as the level changes, that equillibrium is destroyed and the "better" amp will shine through. One area of understanding audio and critical listening is "soft clipping" Many can't or don't recognize it for what it is. It is most apparent only during comparative listening. That "authoritative punchiness" that I earlier referred to is a phenomena you experience at higher listening levels. It is like unto hearing good bass at low listening levels for the 1st time. Something akin to what good damping factor should accomplish. It is more easily experienced than explained though Oh I know exactly what you mean, Jam. I'm just saying that with very easy to drive speakers, lower powered amps CAN sound every bit as good, and "punchy" as high powered amps, even at higher volumes. Just as long as you don't push the low power amp into clipping and distortion. That goes for low volume listening too. IMO of course. With average to low sensitivity speakers, yes, I would also take as much power as I can afford(especially for HT). Sorry everybody, for getting off topic.
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Post by dragonV on Jul 3, 2012 22:01:40 GMT -5
Probably the processor... but hey, whatever I say will get me into hot water! The XPR-2 is nearly ready, followed closely by the XPR-1. Preamp and processor are not as far along, but substantial work HAS been done on both, and they ARE coming... for sure. Our goal is simple; One brand to rule them all. We're like BMW, start with a 1 Series and move your way up to a big ol' 7 Series!! Cradle to grave. That's us!! Awesome Dan. Matching xpr cd player?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2012 22:25:56 GMT -5
Hey Eric, I'm not a sissy, if I do end up buying a XPR-5, I'll hire someone to put it in the rack!
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Pauly
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Post by Pauly on Jul 3, 2012 22:36:20 GMT -5
Ahhh, a smart sissy. ;D
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Post by sharkman on Jul 3, 2012 23:12:41 GMT -5
Love the look of it and the power specs but my days of 80+ lbs amps, are gone for ever. Quit being a sissy lala Nate. The XPR is a lightweight compared to my 125lb Cinenova. But 400 watts per channel is something I'll never need, and I suspect about only .01% of home theater owners would need. So now 200, or 3-- I must be in that .01% then. ;D Just curious, have you had the chance to try out a high powered amp in your system before?? You might be surprised at the results. So now 200 or 300 watts isn't considered 'high powered' enough? At any rate, the percentage of those who have tried a 400 wpc amp is very small. Like I said, only .01% or so of home theater owners would actually need this amp. Those with rooms 30' x 50' or more. I don't need that in my 14 x 25 foot room with my 93 sens speakers, but go for it if only to impress your friends. My next 1500+ purchase will be a pre-pro, not another amp.
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Post by wizardofoz on Jul 3, 2012 23:31:54 GMT -5
the only things that would convince me for this beast is full differential for all inputs and winning a lottery to pay for it, oh and an XMC to drive it.
I just hate the look...I dont care how thick the front panel is. Kraemer will give it a makeover I bet if he gets one. I assume there will be an ugly processor to match it.
Seriously a hide it somewhere you wont see it...at least my gear is that way for HT but where my HT gear is is also my 2 channel setup. All housed in a 6ft high rack which apart from half a dozen source boxes and my intenet connections is full of Emo gear.
Dont get me wrong...I am a fBIG an but not of this new look.
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Post by Jim on Jul 3, 2012 23:34:28 GMT -5
Awesome! Glad to see it finally arrived. Specs look great.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2012 0:23:51 GMT -5
So now 200 or 300 watts isn't considered 'high powered' enough? At any rate, the percentage of those who have tried a 400 wpc amp is very small. Like I said, only .01% or so of home theater owners would actually need this amp. Those with rooms 30' x 50' or more. I don't need that in my 14 x 25 foot room with my 93 sens speakers, but go for it if only to impress your friends. My next 1500+ purchase will be a pre-pro, not another amp. First, before I respond to this post, let me say congratulations to Big Dan and company for introducing a marvelous HT/5 channel amp at an amazing price. First thing I did was take a look at the AP test results ..... all 5 channels over 400 watts into 8 ohms with less than 0.013% THD and all 5 channels over 600 watts into 4 ohms with less than 0.028% THD. Now that is very impressive for under $2000! That's a Grand Slam in my opinion. Brilliant! Simply brilliant! Secondly, let me suggest to Sharkman and other who think this XPR-5 super power amp is overkill to read the post I made below some months ago. Hopefully they will read the entire quote, which I believe is pretty accurate, so I don't have to keep reposting this (except for those who don't believe it is true, there are many other quotes I can post that come to the same relative conclusion, one for example that shows a speaker requiring about 25-50 watts at fairly loud levels and suddenly 800 watts for peak dynamics from the sound source, this was from a very high quality dynamic source and not MP3). Many folks IMO are too much into making power requirement estimates based on the speaker sensitivity and playback loudness and forgetting many other factors such as sensitivity is only at one meter, etc. Let me mention that Klipsch recommends: 250W RMS/1000W Peak Power Handling/8 ohms for their RF-7II speaker which is specified at 101dB sensitivity. They consistently recommend 4 times the RMS rating for peak power output. To repeat what I posted recently in another thread: Quote from an article at Enjoy The Music.com www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/manufacture/0708/Real Life Speaker Loads
The ability of an amplifier to produce undistorted dynamic passages of music is frequently mistaken as its continuous (RMS) power output rating. However, this specification is useful only to approximate the amplifier's ability to reach the desired loudness of the sound at the listening position — and no more. Alan Lofft from Axiom Audio has shown in Enjoy the Music.com (1) that if you want to reproduce the illusion in your living room of standing next to a grand piano, then peaks of 109dB would be required. To reproduce realistically a peak loudness of 109dB using the speaker with a sensitivity of 88dB to 89dB located 12 feet from the listening chair, the amplifier must produce about 400 watts peak power. To reproduce realistic peaks of a rock band, the amplifier must produce 4000 watts of peak power. Nearly the same power capabilities are needed to approximate the realistic experience of a symphonic conductor at the podium.
These projections are accurate only if the speaker in question has purely resistive impedance. However, loudspeaker loads comprise complex impedances with both resistive and reactive (capacitive and inductive) components. Such impedance can be depicted as a vector with its magnitude (modulus) and angle (phase), and both vary with frequency. In general, the voltage and current waveforms, in complex impedance load, are out of phase with each other and therefore, to characterize accurately a speaker's load impedance, both modulus versus frequency and phase versus frequency plots must be known. Frequently, the phase angle is much more crucial to the speaker load than the modulus alone. Their peaks and dips, as a rule, do not coincide with each other. Because of those disparities, the resulting actual load can be very severe at frequencies that would not be intuitively obvious from looking at the separate plots.
To deal with this phenomenon, Keith Howard (2) introduced the figure of merit he has labeled Equivalent Peak Dissipation Resistance (EPDR). This is, simply, the resistive load that would give rise to the same peak power device dissipation as the speaker itself. Using EPDR as a figure of merit, the speakers can be compared directly with each other. It is an excellent idea, and John Atkinson of Stereophile has supported its use (3). However, speaker manufacturers are not utilizing it, and amplifier manufacturers are not demanding it.
Using the B&W 805 speaker, with 87.5dB/W/m sensitivity, and the powerful Music Fidelity amplifier, Howard did a number of measurements of produced peak SPL from a few recorded classical pieces. He found that peak SPL can be as high as 120dB at 10 feet from the speakers. The measured peak power at this peak was 3.4 kW (3400 watts). While this output is extremely difficult to achieve we still should remember that B&W 805 is only a bookshelf speaker (albeit an excellent one) and the comparison with more difficult-to-drive speakers would be most instructive. For example, the estimate for B&W 803D for the same recordings is that its peak power requirement would be as high as 7 kW (7000 watts!). Many speakers have even more reactive loads making truly enormous demands of the amplifier power delivery.If you have ultra HD uncompressed music sources and want realistic dynamic peak outputs in your room, get as much power as you can afford. (Now watch, someone will post that the XPR-5 is only 3dB's louder than the XPA-5 ..... Good Grief! ;D ;D ;D) (A speaker playing at 105dB's with the amp already clipping will be perceived as at "ear bleeding" levels due to the audible distortion ..... the same speaker with a higher power amp will play at 110dB's and be actually louder but still clean (not ear bleeding) because the amp is still within its clean power capability).
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Post by wizardofoz on Jul 4, 2012 0:40:30 GMT -5
I wonder if it really is fully differential ... from balanced inputs all the way to the output stages
"Topology: Fully discrete, dual differential, high current, short signal path Class A/B amplification with Optimized Class-H™ power supply topology."
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