DC-1

[novisnick]

Thanks Keith,
I got my corner piece of Birthday cake, It should arrive next week. I'm sure I'll need help with it.
Peace,
Nick

[ews0899]

Hi All-

Have been running my new DC-1 for the last four days and it just continues to get sweeter and sweeter. Thanks to the forum members for their suggestions to "wait a few days" (Garbulky, Boomzilla) as it is unbelievable what it has done for my Gallo's. Crisp, clean sound without being clinical, just presents the music/sound the way it's meant to be heard. One happy Emo customer here.

Happy listening!

Ed

[GreenKiwi]

Huuuh... what's this in the box? A new USB connector... I can't speak to whether or not it improves the quality of the bits as they go through, but it certainly makes all the 1s and 0s look better as they zip from my computer to the DC-1. It is an ultra sexy USB connector, though maybe a touch stiff.

On a separate and more important note, I can't believe how much better this is than the O2/ODAC combination I was using. These Beyer T70s have been dramatically improved.


It will be interesting to see if the sound improves even more.

I do think it a little odd to be seeing people have such great changes after leaving it on. I wonder whether it is a case of the DC-1 not impressing when you first listen to it because it's so clean and neutral, and then people go back and listen to the DAC they were comparing it with and the difference becomes apparent. In the spirit of "you shouldn't actually hear a DAC or preamp". I'd be really interested to see if someone did a test of a COLD DC-1 compared to a HOT DC-1. Maybe cold going through the HOT's analog input... then swap.

[garbulky]

Oct 21, 2013 14:11:11 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

Huuuh... what's this in the box? A new USB connector... I can't speak to whether or not it improves the quality of the bits as they go through, but it certainly makes all the 1s and 0s look better as they zip from my computer to the DC-1. It is an ultra sexy USB connector, though maybe a touch stiff.

On a separate and more important note, I can't believe how much better this is than the O2/ODAC combination I was using. These Beyer T70s have been dramatically improved.


It will be interesting to see if the sound improves even more.

I do think it a little odd to be seeing people have such great changes after leaving it on. I wonder whether it is a case of the DC-1 not impressing when you first listen to it because it's so clean and neutral, and then people go back and listen to the DAC they were comparing it with and the difference becomes apparent. In the spirit of "you shouldn't actually hear a DAC or preamp". I'd be really interested to see if someone did a test of a COLD DC-1 compared to a HOT DC-1. Maybe cold going through the HOT's analog input... then swap.

What USB cable? Did you get some fancy cable to go with your DC-1?

[Deleted]

I got one too. A 1m USB cable very high quality. Just too short for my application

[GreenKiwi]

Looks to be their new USB cable. It has a very nice feel.

[Jim]

Oct 21, 2013 15:48:53 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

Looks to be their new USB cable. It has a very nice feel.

So better feel means better sound, amiright??

[GreenKiwi]

Oct 21, 2013 15:57:50 GMT -5 Jim said:

Oct 21, 2013 15:48:53 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

Looks to be their new USB cable. It has a very nice feel.

So better feel means better sound, amiright??

It makes all the 1s and 0s feel sparklier when they get to the other side. =P

I have not done an AB and probably won't. I don't believe that digital cables and systems have much of an effect when driven well within their designed operating regions. Driving 44/16 over a 1m USB is well within the design specs. And adding to that the DC-1 has both async USB and ASRC. I don't expect to be able to hear a difference.

That being said it is a beautiful cable. Nice connectors and woven exterior. It feels like a high end cable should feel.

[klinemj]

Didn't you get your DC-1 a while ago? I'm confused about the sudden comments of getting a new cable in the DC-1 box. Maybe I should go look in the box that mine came in!

Mark

[GreenKiwi]

@klienmj I did get my DC-1 a while ago... but then this sale came along.... and I had 100 emo bucks... and my desk at work didn't have a DC-1... soooo.... well.... now it does =D

The good thing is that now I don't have to waste any more of my time looking for DACs or headphone amps, so I'm really saving money. (At least that is what I tell myself.)

[tjhenry]

I don't want to de-rail the current topic, but I thought I'd add my thoughts about the DC-1. I received it this past Friday and immediately plugged it into my system. I fed it the optical out from my BDP-51 disc player and I also have the XDA-2 fed a coax digital signal from the same player. I have a demo CD I made of various types of music. A compilation of songs that I've used for the past 5 years or so when evaluating new components. Identical interconnects to my Cayin A-50T and levels matched as closely as possible through headphones. Variable output was used on the DC-1 since the XDA-2 always runs through variable output. ASRC on the DC-1 was on since I prefer the ASRC on with the XDA-2 (yes, I know there are some technical differences there). With this set up, I was able to instantly change inputs on the Cayin to compare the XDA-2 and DC-1.

My findings are very similar to others when comparing the XDA-2 to the DC-1. Basically, more better everything: resolution and soundstage. My system may not be as revealing as others, but I didn't feel it was a "night and day" difference. The differences were noticeable, but it wasn't like a blanket had been pulled off my speakers.

Listening to the DC-1 more, I think it is probably better than the Benchmark DAC1 I used to own. I say probably because I don't have the DAC1 available for a true side by side comparison. I'm going off memory. But, I used the DAC1 nearly every day for over a year, so I feel confident in my opinion. The biggest difference when I compared the XDA-2 to the DAC1 in my system was soundstage width. The DAC1 gave a larger soundstage. The DC-1 soundstage is also bigger than the XDA-2. Resolution of detail was also slightly better through the DAC1 as compared to the XDA-2. But, now I feel I'm hearing at least the same resolution through the DC-1 as the DAC1. The DC-1 clearly has greater resolution than the XDA-2. The biggest thing I notice about the DC-1 when I think about the DAC1, is the lack of grain and brightness in the DC-1. The Benchmark could get a little harsh. The DC-1 is smooth and detailed. I haven't heard any other Benchmark components (DAC1 USB, DAC1 PRE, DAC1 HDR), but according to reviews, the units above the basic DAC1 improved the sonics by reducing the brightness and harshness.

Long story short, and feel free to yell at me because I'm drawing a conclusion without any solid data, but I'm betting the DC-1s performance is neck and neck with the DAC1 HDR. Yes, my conclusion is flawed since I can't compare the DC-1 directly to the DAC1, but I feel the DC-1 is better than the basic DAC1. A friend is going to loan me his Cambridge Audio 840W power amp and I'm going to get a DAC1 HDR to compare directly against the DC-1. I'm going to run either the DC-1 or DAC1 HDR direct into the amp. So, it may be a completely inappropriate conclusion, but at least I'm going to collect the data...after the fact. Yes, feel free to argue about results bias now, but I don't have any problem if the DC-1 falls short of the DAC1 HDR. I'm very happy with my DC-1 (especially at $499) and I'm not sending it back, regardless of the results of the DAC1 HDR comparison.

[ews0899]

The USB cable is a promo offered free with the purchase of DC-1 as listed on the product page.

[ews0899]

Free 1 meter USB cable with the purchase of a DC-1 (a $24.99 value).

[jeffnyc]

What benefit is there with XLR output from the DC-1 to either XPA-1 or XPA-100? Is the DC-1 fully balanced?

[tjhenry]

I'm curious if anyone has done the math on the effective resolution of the DC-1. I'm not sure if I'm doing it correctly, so if someone has done this, please let me know. If I understand correctly, you add the difference in dB from the noise floor of the 16 bit vs the 24 bit signal and then add that to the 16 bit maximum of 96 dB. Then, you just solve for bits using the quantization formula (6.02 x bits x dB). For example, the information I found on the Musical Fidelity M1CliC was a gain of 20 dB in the noise floor when the bit depth was increased from 16 to 24. So, 20 dB + 96 dB = 116 dB. 6.02 x bits x 116 dB; 116 dB/6.02 = 19.3 dB. The writer of the analysis specified the M1CLiC as having 19 bits of effective resolution (which was stated to be excellent), so I think I'm correct.

If that math is right, then the DC-1 has an effective resolution of at least 19 bits. The FFT traces for the noise in 48 kHz/24 bit data show a bit of a discrepancy when looking at different sample rates (48 kHz = -147 dB, 88.2 kHz = -142 dB, 96khz = -142 dB). The noise floor for 16 bit data was -122 dB. So, worst case would be 142 - 122 = 20. 20 + 96 = 116. 116 dB/6.02 = 19.3 dB of effective resolution for the DC-1. This value could be slightly better depending on the real numbers of the noise with 24 bit data.

Just as a reference, I read the current real world maximum effective resolution is 21 bits based on errors in the DAC and the math it uses. I was curious to do the math for the DC-1 to see how it compared with other DACs that have effective resolution data available.

[Deleted]

i just went cross-eyed after reading that lol

[tjhenry]

Ha. I gave myself a headache doing the math.

[Jim]

I think I recall Dan saying something like that it comes to within 1db of the theoretical maximum - and Lonnie agreeing. (Implying that the design and performance were very very good)

I'm sure someone smarter than me can better comprehend that .

[hemster]

Oct 22, 2013 11:14:41 GMT -5 tjhenry said:

Ha. I gave myself a headache doing the math.

The way I figure, the DC-1 adds up to a heck of a nice DAC which differentiates itself in the DAC sector from the rest by integrating superb sound. At the current 40 percent discount it subtracts from the list price and helps transform one's system. It is absolute value IMHO. Every day it is used it compounds the value to the listener. The warm-up time variable is intriguing but it's high SQ is a constant. I really don't feel like computing the math, dunno about the remainder of the audience. 

[eveningsky]

Hello TJHenry,
Hello all,

I am also considering the DC1.
I own the XDA1 and the Benchmark DAC1.

I wish to share my experience with the DAC1 and the XDA1, and a comparison (believe it or not) between the two and a the analogue audio out through the mini 1/8 inch jack of my Mac Pro desktop computer.

I am ashamed to say this, but these are my experiences / opinions on what I currently own and use:

On much of my music content, it does not seem to matter very much, within reason, what DAC I use, because so much of my music content is simply, not very good SQ. And trying to spend too much on my sound system is simply a waste of money.

When I listen to a good quality sound source, just that better quality source alone, leads to a massive improvement in SQ.

The XDA1 sounds somewhat shrill and somewhat "digital" but it brings a smile to my face and to my ears, every time listen to it. It is simply a wonderful product. The dynamic range and detail are simply stunning, given a good sound content. And not infrequently, the SQ on some well known music CDs, older and current, is simply an embarrassment / shockingly poor.

My great frustration and embarrassment is the Benchmark DAC1. I purchased this unit years ago for a considerable price, wo a discount (per company policy). Nicely build. Good connections. All connections work perfectly. It synchronizes the digital inputs perfectly. The volume rheostat has begun to fail. But folks, the SQ from this DAC1 unit, cannot compare to the XDA1 which is IMO clearly far superior. It cannot even compare to the analogue out connection from my early 2008 Mac Pro. I cannot believe it so I tested it several times with several sources of music. The SQ from my Mac Pro is simply better / clearer / more pleasant, with equal detail, and this difference is to my ears NOT subtle.

I do not have experience with more modern iterations of the Benchmark products, and probably will avoid them in my future. I wish them well. They seem to enjoy excellent professional reviews, and are probably good. But how quickly technology overtakes so many technology based products. Especially with small innovative companies like Emotiva. And given their relatively high cost ... . I do not see the point.

I am playing into stereo powered monitors from the company Mackie model HR824.

So this is my experience with the DACs I own. I am strongly considering the DC1, currently on sale. But to be honnest, my routine Mac Pro sound card is really surprisingly good. And my XDA1 is simply wonderful.

Best wishes,
ES