DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 9:51:21 GMT -5
I watch streaming HD content all the time via Netflix and Amazon... Dyohn and I are going to agree today. I too stream HD content all the time. I prefer Vudu myself, but Netflix is a close second. And yes, they are HD, for if Blu-ray is the "standard" then the only thing that makes something HD or not HD is pixels and, well, Netflix streaming, Amazon VOD, Vudu etc. are all HD. Just so we're clear . Sorry, I guess I have been disagreeing with you lately. No ill intent meant. We love the flexibility of streaming but we also love using BRD for watching movies where better image quality and much better sound quality are wanted, or for those titles simply not available to stream. The problem with relying on streaming as a sole source for content is that not everyone has broadband internet access sufficient for the best HD quality, and not everyone has a broadband service that is stable and reliable enough to ensure it will always be there (that would be my house.) I think that using WiMax via the vacated analog television spectrum would have been a great way to bring broadband to nearly the entire country almost overnight, but the brain trust at the FCC seems to have other ideas in mind for that bandwidth. IMO streaming HD content is much more a "niche" product that is BluRay content delivery. For now anyway.
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bootman
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Post by bootman on Aug 8, 2013 10:09:55 GMT -5
I think that using WiMax via the vacated analog television spectrum would have been a great way to bring broadband to nearly the entire country almost overnight, but the brain trust at the FCC seems to have other ideas in mind for that bandwidth. You mean the spectrum sold to wireless companies vs having a publicly owned, government run nationwide network? Yeah, that ain't happening.
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 10:23:29 GMT -5
I think that using WiMax via the vacated analog television spectrum would have been a great way to bring broadband to nearly the entire country almost overnight, but the brain trust at the FCC seems to have other ideas in mind for that bandwidth. You mean the spectrum sold to wireless companies vs having a publicly owned, government run nationwide network? Yeah, that ain't happening. Hell at this point I'd take either if it brought WiMax to the table.
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Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 8, 2013 11:59:26 GMT -5
I would agree with you on many of your above points, however, one demographic that people in our hobby fail to recognize are people like my brothers, who despite growing up in an age of discs, have almost zero collections because they've ripped 'em all to hard drives and have since sold the originals to 2nd hand stores/services. My brother, who is 22, lives for music, but I don't believe he has a single CD. He might have a handful of DVDs and two or three Blu-rays, but that doesn't mean he doesn't watch movies like a fiend -he does. My 3rd brother, 17, even worse. While we're all likely to buy another disc player or nine, we're not the ones business are focusing on long term, more over our numbers are dwindling -not growing. This is why I put such an emphasis on streaming. Not because I hold some sort of personal vendetta against discs -they've been nothing but good to me -but because in order to stay relevant you must be thinking three if not five steps ahead. It sounds like you're justifying the demographic of pirates, which is what someone who rips music and then sells the licensed copy is. I understand that many do this and see no problem with it, but that doesn't make it legal or right. As for physical vs. streaming, until everyone's Internet connections are fast and reliable we'll still need physical formats and at the moment BRD is the best, I'm glad to see it's numbers increasing.
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Post by Andrew Robinson on Aug 8, 2013 12:03:54 GMT -5
As for physical vs. streaming, until everyone's Internet connections are fast and reliable we'll still need physical formats and at the moment BRD is the best, I'm glad to see it's numbers increasing. If I may, and I'm not picking fights, but the issue of connection speed is what many throw back at me or others who are in favor of streaming as a reason why not to back it (streaming). What are y'all's speeds? For audio streaming it takes next to nothing, and with video, I feel that a lot of folks think they need more than they do. If you're in a rural area and have access to only bandwidth limited satellite then yes, you NEED physical media (I was once one of those people BTW), but near as I can tell, if you have access to cable, broadband or the like, you're better off than you give yourself credit for. Just a question?
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 12:18:42 GMT -5
It's not just speed, Andrew, it's both availability and cost. According to the Wall Street Journal, broadband penetration in the US is approx. 33%. That means any sort of broadband (any internet access that is not dial-up.) Of that 33% of households, perhaps only 40% have high speed access that regularly exceeds 10 Mb/sec. Netflix and Hulu recommend >2Mb/sec for streaming, but anything less than 10 will mean plenty of time spent watching the "buffering" icon on your screen if you're trying to watch HD content.
When making these arguements, you must always remember that you and I and most people who frequent forum sites like this one are enthusiasts and we really do not represent the majority of the country.
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Post by Andrew Robinson on Aug 8, 2013 12:35:48 GMT -5
When making these arguements, you must always remember that you and I and most people who frequent forum sites like this one are enthusiasts and we really do not represent the majority of the country. Believe me I get that. I was merely asking a question. Among us enthusiasts, what Internet speeds do you all enjoy?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2013 12:42:55 GMT -5
I have a consistent 28 Mb/sec. connection and still get "buffering" interruptions when watching Vudu HDX 1080P 7.1 movies on Vudu. So if you're trundling along at 10 Mb/sec. I have to think that the buffering interruptions would be intolerable. Until we have nationwide distribution of 100 Mb/sec. speed, streaming will only be for those who are tolerant of buffering interruptions.
And for the cost of those Vudu films - the same price as a physical disc - I cannot see why anyone would be okay with it.
-RW-
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hemster
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Post by hemster on Aug 8, 2013 12:44:11 GMT -5
When making these arguements, you must always remember that you and I and most people who frequent forum sites like this one are enthusiasts and we really do not represent the majority of the country. Believe me I get that. I was merely asking a question. Among us enthusiasts, what Internet speeds do you all enjoy? I currently get 50 download /25 upload from Verizon FiOS.
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Post by dust770 on Aug 8, 2013 12:53:59 GMT -5
Sadly I get 10 down 2 up max! And the awful part of that is my neighborhood is less than 10 yrs old, but the developers never ran cable into the area, so about 30 houses around ours have to use a line of sight internet company. Our roof dish points to a tower about 12 miles away). The rest of the area outside of our 30 or so houses all have access to comcast
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 13:04:50 GMT -5
40 down and 5 up via DSL - unless the service is down.
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bootman
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Post by bootman on Aug 8, 2013 13:05:29 GMT -5
Here at work: ...and at home (different provider but using same speed test server)
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 13:08:59 GMT -5
When making these arguements, you must always remember that you and I and most people who frequent forum sites like this one are enthusiasts and we really do not represent the majority of the country. Believe me I get that. I was merely asking a question. Among us enthusiasts, what Internet speeds do you all enjoy? Sure. But are the enthusiasts with sufficient d/l speed to make streaming HD content viable a large enough user base to justify abandoning physical media? Not only no but F no. Hollywood will never give up on the revenue stream of physical media unless and until disc manufacturers and distributors can no longer justify the cost. And that is not likely to happen in my life time, I suspect.
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Post by Andrew Robinson on Aug 8, 2013 13:35:37 GMT -5
Sure. But are the enthusiasts with sufficient d/l speed to make streaming HD content viable a large enough user base to justify abandoning physical media? I know of non-enthusiasts with semi-robust Internet speeds that stream everything. Quality be damned. That last part is the scary factor for us enthusiasts (I guess) in that there is a growing majority that seeks to enjoy content on their terms -i.e. streaming/instant -regardless if its 480, 720 or 1080. They just want to watch. This group is whom everyone panders too. They're the reasons DVDs have become $5 and why Blu-rays have had to become $10-$15. Without them none of this stuff matters. They make Netflix the powerhouse it is, they power RedBox etc. Where they go, we go. So long as they keep buying discs, there will be discs, but if they keep getting their needs met via online services, well, kiss discs goodbye. Our enthusiast fringe needs, not a mass-market make. It didn't for mini Disc, SACD, D-VHS, HD-DVD (arguably better than Blu-ray on many levels). I'm not trying to say you're wrong and I'm right -I honestly don't care for at the end of the day I'm okay with either. If discs are granted a stay of execution for another go-round then fine. Should they die with Blu-ray, oh well. I don't care. What bothers me is enthusiasts' (not necessarily you) often reluctance to be open to possibilities outside of their direct field of view. Again, not saying this is an accusation against you or anyone here on this forum, it's more of a general observation really. Walk the halls of CES, CEDIA etc. and you'll quickly understand what I'm on about. They'll allow for digital music -now (after what 10 years) -but they support it begrudgingly so. Streaming movies? Get the f-out! If it's not Blu-ray it's sh-t! And this simply isn't the case. There is room for all forms and formats to exist for now. Rallying against anything purely because it isn't what you (not you, you, but -you know what I'm saying) yourself need/want/ like is silly. I try and keep the discussion open and honest and all possibilities on the table. So when I read/hear people saying those who prefer option A over option B are what's killing (name your hobby) I say to myself, no attitudes like that are what's killing said hobby. All in good fun.
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Post by jdskycaster on Aug 8, 2013 13:46:32 GMT -5
I am rural but am lucky enough to have ADSL. Quality does vary but I normally get 10Mb down and 750Kb up. The real issue is my kids are usually home and online when I want to stream a video. My son is the biggest bandwidth hog and also happens to use it a lot late into the evenings. I can get HD quality streaming but usually not without some interruption. Not so bad for a TV series or even documentaries but for any movie I am really interested in I either purchase the disk or rent it from Redbox.
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 13:47:44 GMT -5
Understood, and largely agree with your position Andrew. But I look at this from a slightly different angle. IMO it's never really been a consumer-driven industry at all, even though we like to think that it is. Video content (and to a lesser degree music) is driven from the top down. We get what the content owners deem we can have, not necessarily what we want. It's all about very large dollars and how they flow to the producers, the studios, the distributors and the manufacturers... and to a much lesser degree to the talent who create the content. The film industry is just that: an industry, and a very big dollar one. So I maintain that unless and until the industry decides that the revenue source from streaming makes more sense than the revenue source from physical media, thinking physical media will go away is just plain silly.
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Post by jdskycaster on Aug 8, 2013 13:51:11 GMT -5
Why can't we continue to have both?
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 8, 2013 13:56:30 GMT -5
Why can't we continue to have both? I believe we will for the foreseeable future.
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Post by jmilton on Aug 8, 2013 13:57:33 GMT -5
Wow man, I've been into streaming consciousness for years. Too bad I have such limited bandwidth.
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SuperComplex
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Post by SuperComplex on Aug 8, 2013 15:20:41 GMT -5
I think Blu Ray is the best way to watch a movie. The problem with our generation is everyone wants everything so fast that they will sacrifice quality! For what? The ability to quickly download something! Hello music industry!
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