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Post by Golden Ear on Sept 14, 2013 15:25:31 GMT -5
Whether you believe that or not it's up to you. For those people who have seen him during that time, they claim it was true based on "eye witness" by seeing him performing miracle right infront of their eyes. If only one person claiming that, it will be questionable but if there were many people claiming that then it maybe valid reason to believe. There were no pictures or video to prove because they haven't been invented yet. If you tell me you're superman, I will only believe you if you can fly and lift building and mountain.  Also, Superman would be able to hear even the most minute differences between DAC's and would be an excellent subject for a blind test.  LOL, even my golden ear has no match with him.  |
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Post by brubacca on Sept 14, 2013 15:28:34 GMT -5
I don't think that the OP wanted to discuss warn-up/break in. This part of the discussion is really pointless.
To the OP, how are you liking the Gen 2 XPA-2 ? Is it an upgrade over Gen 1 for you? I have been contemplating this amp with a DC-1 as the controller.
How would you describe the sound of your XDA-2 and XPA-2 gen 2?
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Post by monkumonku on Sept 14, 2013 16:00:21 GMT -5
I don't think that the OP wanted to discuss warn-up/break in. This part of the discussion is really pointless. True... sorry 'bout that! |
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Post by Golden Ear on Sept 14, 2013 16:49:36 GMT -5
Gen II may have some improvement under the hood that were upgraded from previous generation. An improvement here and there is welcome to us hardcore audiophile. I like an amp that has strong bass, mid, sweet high and able to project monumental soundstage.
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Post by frenchyfranky on Sept 14, 2013 18:31:27 GMT -5
I know, for a lot of peoples it sounds like that, but for me and many other peoples it's different, so it's an old debate, who have the right answer? Maybe some technical measurements have been made between cold and warm up condition on differents audio gears and some one can show us the results to definitely demistify this clue ( This bait is for you Keith. Also, maybe a suggestion for an article ; "The truth about the warm up and the break in" ). Well, warm up could be real or not, plus it depends on the electronics, but one point I'd like to make is that in a case in which someone feels that their equipment sounds better because it has "warmed up," then they are relying on their memory for this statement. Let's say that you wake up in the morning and get out of bed. It's a bit chilly because you've been under the blanket all night and then you walk to the bathroom to get ready for the day and so you feel chilly. You shower, brush your teeth, etc., and then an hour later, let's say the temperature in the house is still the same as it was when you woke up. Are you going to be able to say that the temp is the same or would you think it had changed? Or, what if you go out jogging/running for a few miles but the temperature doesn't change. Would you be able to make a correct statement about the temperature as it was before you ran versus after? Another thing.. why would warm up necessarily make equipment sound better rather than making it sound worse? Because I heard it and also I like this idea and also my head is so full of placebo effect... OK Ok,I surrender...  I'm so tired of this debate. I think I will take an appointment with my psycho, I heard too many things that doesn't exist...  |
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Post by Golden Ear on Sept 14, 2013 19:04:34 GMT -5
Well, warm up could be real or not, plus it depends on the electronics, but one point I'd like to make is that in a case in which someone feels that their equipment sounds better because it has "warmed up," then they are relying on their memory for this statement. Let's say that you wake up in the morning and get out of bed. It's a bit chilly because you've been under the blanket all night and then you walk to the bathroom to get ready for the day and so you feel chilly. You shower, brush your teeth, etc., and then an hour later, let's say the temperature in the house is still the same as it was when you woke up. Are you going to be able to say that the temp is the same or would you think it had changed? Or, what if you go out jogging/running for a few miles but the temperature doesn't change. Would you be able to make a correct statement about the temperature as it was before you ran versus after? Another thing.. why would warm up necessarily make equipment sound better rather than making it sound worse? Because I heard it and also I like this idea and also my head is so full of placebo effect... OK Ok,I surrender... I'm so tired of this debate. I think I will take an appointment with my psycho, I heard too many things that doesn't exist... Before I take your claim of warming up a gear its sound would change, I would want to see before (cold) and after (warm up)a real world test to verify if there were changes in frequency response, SNR, THD+N, etc. Using a memory or ear then translate it by your brain which become subjective is not an accurate way to present your opinion and its not valid till you can backed up your opinion with proof. |
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Post by garbulky on Sept 14, 2013 21:07:44 GMT -5
I know, for a lot of peoples it sounds like that, but for me and many other peoples it's different, so it's an old debate, who have the right answer? Maybe some technical measurements have been made between cold and warm up condition on differents audio gears and some one can show us the results to definitely demistify this clue ( This bait is for you Keith. Also, maybe a suggestion for an article ; "The truth about the warm up and the break in" ). Another thing.. why would warm up necessarily make equipment sound better rather than making it sound worse? I have NO idea. Just that it does So I guess we are in the guessing game and likely misinformation from me. If I had to guess it has something to do with capacitors/operating temperature. Most of the time it's subtle. With the DAC/amp - can't tell which one it was, it took like a day or two to reach the optimum sound from a cold start. The sound difference I hear is the ambience/enveloping effect where the sound goes from being cold to a more full/warm or pleasingly saaturated sound which has more impact on bass and a that immersiveness in the soundstage. With the USP-1 it's a lot more obvious from a cold start. The mid's are lot more prominent and it doesn't sound as natural on a cold start. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2013 8:41:15 GMT -5
Actually, the capacitators are mostly concerned with being fully charged and not temperature sensitive per say, unlike the transistors which do thermally stabilize once heated.
PS. I stayed at a Holiday Inn last night.
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Post by frenchyfranky on Sept 15, 2013 10:56:41 GMT -5
Because I heard it and also I like this idea and also my head is so full of placebo effect... OK Ok,I surrender... I'm so tired of this debate. I think I will take an appointment with my psycho, I heard too many things that doesn't exist... Before I take your claim of warming up a gear its sound would change, I would want to see before (cold) and after (warm up)a real world test to verify if there were changes in frequency response, SNR, THD+N, etc. Using a memory or ear then translate it by your brain which become subjective is not an accurate way to present your opinion and its not valid till you can backed up your opinion with proof. Yes, you are right, I just asked to KeithL if they have some technical studies and measurements on this. |
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Post by teaman on Sept 16, 2013 13:00:40 GMT -5
Brubacca, to answer your questions the Gen 2 seems a little richer in the low end. Both amps run ultra clean and clear. Once again....(and not trying to stir up more controversy than I already to seem to have done)....the second gen sounds like there is a little more emphasis on the bass. I am not knocking the first gen amp by any means, I just think that the second gen amp....(again to my ears)...sounds warmer and more well rounded.
Here is the breakdown of what my systems are running and the variables so everyone know the differences in my systems are not limited to the amp itself. Lots of other factors to take into consideration here:
System 1 -
Gen 2 XPA-2
XDA-2 DAC/Preamp via balanced Emo XLR's
Technics SLP-990 CD player via Emo toslink
Pure i20 ipod digital dock via Emo toslink
Infinity SM-155 tower speakers via 12 gauge wire.
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System 2 -
Gen 1 XPA-2
XDA-2 DAC/Preamp via balanced Emo XLR's
ERC-2 CD player via Canare AES/EBU
Pure i20 ipod digital dock via Emo toslink
Infinity SM-150 tower speakers via 12 gauge wire.
The newer model of speaker may in fact account for the slight difference although speaker components and specs are pretty darn close. These speakers are great rock n roll speakers with high sensitivity, 15 inch woofers, dual mids and a tweeter. Since one CD player runs through AES/EBU while the other runs through a toslink, there could be differences there as well. One CD player is new and the other is twenty years old but I think it would be weird that the old Technics Cd player would employ better bass.
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Post by novisnick on Sept 16, 2013 13:18:43 GMT -5
I guess no one here has ever had a Crysler ? Start one on a cold day and tell me if it runs better after it warms up.
Thus endeth the lesson,,,,,,, or maybe not,,,, He,,,,He
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Post by teaman on Sept 17, 2013 16:14:55 GMT -5
Agreed!
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Post by brubacca on Sept 17, 2013 16:36:25 GMT -5
Teaman- thanks for the info.
Novisnick- I owned a Dodge , and will never again. No amount of warmup cut put lipstick on that Pig... I ran from it to a Honda and have owned that for 9.5 years...
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Post by novisnick on Sept 17, 2013 16:43:29 GMT -5
Teaman- thanks for the info. Novisnick- I owned a Dodge , and will never again. No amount of warmup cut put lipstick on that Pig... I ran from it to a Honda and have owned that for 9.5 years... My point exactly. LOL An well put! |
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Post by kmcintyre on Sept 17, 2013 17:07:05 GMT -5
I love my new XPA-2. Cool running with no discernible hiss, hum, or undue coloration. Only problem is, I think I'd love a pair of XPA-1 Gen2s even more... :-)
Analog electronics need to warm up. A really crude example being old school CRT televisions. Remember? (And it's not just vacuum tubes that need to come up to operating temperature...)
I'm less sold on the concept of a "break-in" period. I can't think of many (any) component that gets better with age.
I totally believe it takes time for the human brain to adapt to new stimulus and grow to appreciate them. I remember when all people of several races looked the same to me. (It's not just a joke.) I can remember when all wines tasted about the same too. Ever learned a foreign language? What was once gibberish becomes crystal clear with exposure.
It takes time to get to know a new system. Sometimes, with exposure, things sound better. Sometimes not.
YMMV
Cheers
Keith
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I'm so tired of this debate. I think I will take an appointment with my psycho, I heard too many things that doesn't exist... 
