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Post by audiobill on Dec 14, 2013 15:21:43 GMT -5
That's awesome Boom!  Glad to hear that your new amp is making you smile. I don't think I have read anyone have even the slightest negative to say about them. That's a pretty ringing endorsement IMO. Having come from the A series to the R series, do you feel that the extra power makes the biggest difference, or do you find the overall sound is improved? In my mind, I imagine that the R series would sound more refined all the way around. IMO, the XSP sound more refined than the USP, and I find the DC-1 is also very refined sounding, with an emphasis on detail, accuracy, and clinical precision, without the cold and analytical sterility one might generally associate with a piece that has such clinical precision. I think (but don't know) that the R amps would be in the same vein. What say you? Hi Klown - time to update your profile; I sense the DC-1 is a keeper! |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 14, 2013 16:17:14 GMT -5
Hi Paintedklown -
I don't think that the extra power is any difference. I'm not running my speakers at all loudly. Probably from less than one to about two watts. Maybe 10 on peaks. The best way I can describe differences between the XPA-2 (A) & the XPR-2 (R) is to exaggerate:
If the A was a rowdy boxer, the R is a gentleman in a tux.
If the A was drunk and slurring words, the R is articulate and precise.
If the A was an emotional wreck, then the R is tightly in command.
These are GROSS exaggerations, so don't take them at all literally. The sound of the R is slightly more detailed, controlled, and refined than that of the A. The bass control and imaging of the R is slightly better than the A. In fact, the sound of the R may be slightly (but only slightly) more "relaxed" than that of the A.
Some of this may be my speakers. Neither the Paradigm Eclipse BP speakers nor the Definitive Technology SM65 speakers are the least bit forward, so the fact that the R sounds laid-back with them may be totally an artifact of the speakers, not the amp. In the future, I'll have some other speakers wander through, and I'll be able to tell more then. I've never heard the A with the Paradigms, but I'm VERY familiar with the A & the DefTechs. The R sounds more like the A on the DefTechs than the Crown PS-400 amp sounds like either. The Crown is slightly more forward and has slightly better bass control (with the DefTechs - not with the Paradigms).
I'd not call the R a "cold" or "sterile" amp at all. It is warm & detailed to my ears. Not the be-all, end-all of dynamics (unless I turn it up a hair), but that could just be because of my Oppo BDP-105. I can't say...
Since I still have the Jolida DAC laying around, I may toss it back on the pile & see what it does to the sound. If I suddenly get jump & jive dynamics, then I'll know that it was the Oppo, not the R making that difference. I did try both the Oppo & the Jolida with the Crown driving the Paradigms - not much dynamic difference. That doesn't mean that the R will react the same.
Again, I'm picking nits (as I'm prone to do) here - There is NOTHING in the current setup to strongly criticize. My sound is excellent (better than it's been in 20 years), and I'm NOT complaining. This isn't a "sell yourself on the R" job, either - I meant the past two sentences. I'm definitely keeping the XPR-2 and whatever speakers may come & go, I have confidence that the R is up to the job.
Now I've got to put in my earplugs & go DJ a dance tonight. Cheers - Boom
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 12:14:19 GMT -5
Boom...understand your frustration. But...as much as you are around here... Hi Mark - I'm nothing around here but just another guy who posts on the Emotiva Lounge. I never claimed to be anything more or less. As I've said numerous times: My opinion and a buck will buy you a cup of McCoffee. I don't believe you're a snarky guy, based on your intelligent and reasoned posts on a number of topics. So just to clear the air - I don't think of myself as anything special, so let's not pretend that I am. Merry Christmas to you & yours & don't be a stranger! Boomzilla |
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Erwin.BE
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It's the room, stupid!
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Post by Erwin.BE on Dec 15, 2013 12:59:47 GMT -5
Why not try the Pendragon you might like it, I have auditioned a number of speakers and this is the one that impresses me. Like you i listen mostly on classical jazz and a lot of easy listening music. The pendragon is an in your face speakers, once you hear it you will want to listen more. I have had this for almost two months now and really enjoying it. I'd really like to audition these myself. One of the few passive designs that interest me. I only read good things about them. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 13:09:23 GMT -5
I see that in Philadelphia, where I'm going in January on business, there's a few dealers that carry stuff not available in my burg. I'll try to cut loose for a shop while I'm there.
Having auditioned the DefTech SM65 speakers in my "new" system, I've unplugged them & am going back to the Paradigms. The low bass is too good to be without.
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Post by GreenKiwi on Dec 15, 2013 13:18:01 GMT -5
Boom...understand your frustration. But...as much as you are around here... Hi Mark - I'm nothing around here but just another guy who posts on the Emotiva Lounge. I never claimed to be anything more or less. As I've said numerous times: My opinion and a buck will buy you a cup of McCoffee. I don't believe you're a snarky guy, based on your intelligent and reasoned posts on a number of topics. So just to clear the air - I don't think of myself as anything special, so let's not pretend that I am. Merry Christmas to you & yours & don't be a stranger! Boomzilla I didn't think that he was inferring that in any way... But was just surprised that you didn't already have a 20A outlet waiting for the XPR amp. Given how knowledgeable and detail oriented you are. I am guessing you just hadn't had a 20A iec before and had figured other cables would plug into it. I know I though that the first time I had a 20A IEC outlet on the back of a device. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 13:33:53 GMT -5
Other than the washing machine and dryer, I've not had another 110 Volt appliance that required such high amperage. If I were driving 82dB-efficient speakers, then I might need to upgrade the circuit. As is, the "output LEDs" on the front of my amp barely flicker before my wife gives me "the look" and I know it's time to turn it down. LOL
Yes, I said in my first post of this thread that I SHOULD have read the owners manual online before receiving the amp. That would have clued me that a different plug would be needed. I also assumed that the X-series Emotiva power cords would work with all their amps. Nevertheless, live and learn.
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klinemj
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Official Emofest Scribe
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Post by klinemj on Dec 15, 2013 14:30:25 GMT -5
Boom...sorry if you took my remark as snarky. It was not intended to be. I was genuinely surprised you didn't know about the plug requirements for the R-series...it was topic of much Q&A at the R's launch and is even mentioned on the product page. As garbulky notes...you are pretty detail oriented.
At least you know now and you are up and running and enjoying it.
Mark
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Dec 15, 2013 14:46:40 GMT -5
Boom...sorry if you took my remark as snarky. It was not intended to be. I was genuinely surprised you didn't know about the plug requirements for the R-series...it was topic of much Q&A at the R's launch and is even mentioned on the product page. As garbulky notes...you are pretty detail oriented. At least you know now and you are up and running and enjoying it. Mark Yes I agree. It's common knowledge but no biggie. I just changed the wall outlet w the 20 amp version and I'm good. Others get the 20 to 15 amp converter. It's probably a good idea running the 20 amp line but with my 10 amp breaker, there is no fire risk and I can run at reference level with no problems. If I ever get my pipe dream, 2 XPR-1s...then running the lines make sense. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 16:39:59 GMT -5
I didn't get to read everything... Hi Garbulky - To toss the thread in a slightly different direction - I realize it isn't likely unless you happen to win the Lottery soon, BUT - If you ever get a chance, BUY AN XPR-2 AMPLIFIER! This amp has "Compatible With Axiom Audio Products" written all over it! You know how your UPA-2 sounds so delicate with your Axiom M-80 speakers? Well now imagine the same delicate sound but with an order of magnitude better imaging and an extra octave of bass extension! THAT'S what an XPR would sound like. Every "weakness" that the Axioms displayed in my room (not very deep bass, not very great imaging) is a specific strength of my new XPR-2. When you borrowed my XPA-2, I can understand how it might have sounded "faster but less delicate" with your Axioms, but the XPR-2 would definitely avoid that issue. In fact, I've never heard another better potentially matched combination than the Axiom M80s and the XPR-2. Unfortunately, this will remain conjecture - The XPR-2 is not an amp that we can just toss in the back seat & bring over for an audition. Also, I'm reluctant to ask that you move your Axioms again - they are best left in situ. Nevertheless, this is "THE synergistic system that may never be." I'm tempted to scoop up a pair of M100s just to try... If I ever see a used pair... With the Paradigms, when a low, low note comes along (think of the gigantic drum in Herbie Hancock's "Dis is da Drum"), the sound just blossoms from a point midway between the speakers and then expands to shake the entire room. There's no mush or hangover either - when the note decays, it does so naturally and the silence between the notes is stark. You don't want to come by & listen to the XPR-2 unless you're prepared to resist the temptation of robbing a bank to afford one. The more I think about it, Axiom Audio speakers are tentatively on my radar screen again. I believe that with the XPR-2 amp, that M-100s or even the M-80s could produce "Paradigm levels" of bass in my room but with better midrange clarity and treble extension. Just my two cents... Boomzilla |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 16:43:00 GMT -5
Boom...sorry if you took my remark as snarky. It was not intended to be. Thanks, Mark - I value your opinion of me, which is why I worried. Thanks for the feedback...and you are right - I took it for granted that the amp would work with my existing electrical supply. I didn't read the threads on the amp, nor did I read the owners' manual in advance - and I should have. Boom |
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Post by novisnick on Dec 15, 2013 16:53:29 GMT -5
I didn't get to read everything... Hi Garbulky - To toss the thread in a slightly different direction - I realize it isn't likely unless you happen to win the Lottery soon, BUT - If you ever get a chance, BUY AN XPR-2 AMPLIFIER! This amp has "Compatible With Axiom Audio Products" written all over it! You know how your UPA-2 sounds so delicate with your Axiom M-80 speakers? Well now imagine the same delicate sound but with an order of magnitude better imaging and an extra octave of bass extension! THAT'S what an XPR would sound like. Every "weakness" that the Axioms displayed in my room (not very deep bass, not very great imaging) is a specific strength of my new XPR-2. When you borrowed my XPA-2, I can understand how it might have sounded "faster but less delicate" with your Axioms, but the XPR-2 would definitely avoid that issue. In fact, I've never heard another better potentially matched combination than the Axiom M80s and the XPR-2. Unfortunately, this will remain conjecture - The XPR-2 is not an amp that we can just toss in the back seat & bring over for an audition. Also, I'm reluctant to ask that you move your Axioms again - they are best left in situ. Nevertheless, this is "THE synergistic system that may never be." I'm tempted to scoop up a pair of M100s just to try... If I ever see a used pair... With the Paradigms, when a low, low note comes along (think of the gigantic drum in Herbie Hancock's "Dis is da Drum"), the sound just blossoms from a point midway between the speakers and then expands to shake the entire room. There's no mush or hangover either - when the note decays, it does so naturally and the silence between the notes is stark. You don't want to come by & listen to the XPR-2 unless you're prepared to resist the temptation of robbing a bank to afford one. The more I think about it, Axiom Audio speakers are tentatively on my radar screen again. I believe that with the XPR-2 amp, that M-100s or even the M-80s could produce "Paradigm levels" of bass in my room but with better midrange clarity and treble extension. Just my two cents... Boomzilla Gentlemen, I think the R in the XPR line of amps may stand for " RIDICULOUS ". Its like a fully bloomed flower, all speakers have there flaws, the R line erases most of the grunge and replaces it with beauty! I hope that makes sense, Ridiculous, in the ease in which it makes it possible for the speaker to bloom. Just saying. Nick |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 17:05:39 GMT -5
Yes, Nick, but SOME speakers have more "bloom potential" than others.
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Post by paintedklown on Dec 15, 2013 17:17:09 GMT -5
Boom, thank you for the detailed comparison of the X and R series amps. That is what I had expected, but wanted to confirm my hypothesis. You have a good ear, and aren't one to sugar coat reviews, so I knew I could an honest answer from you.  By the way, I can tell by reading your posts that you really do have a genuine love for your new amp. Rarely do I ever see you that fond of another piece of gear (aside from the Jolida DAC), so your enthusiasm (and praise) comes across as sincere. It's always good to see when someones system is coming together in a way they find wholly satisfying. I am sure everyone on the lounge can relate to the endless upgrade cycle that is so easy to fall into. When I finally hit the day I can say that "I'm done" I will rejoice for sure! |
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Post by deltadube on Dec 15, 2013 17:53:33 GMT -5
I didn't get to read everything... Hi Garbulky - To toss the thread in a slightly different direction - I realize it isn't likely unless you happen to win the Lottery soon, BUT - If you ever get a chance, BUY AN XPR-2 AMPLIFIER! This amp has "Compatible With Axiom Audio Products" written all over it! You know how your UPA-2 sounds so delicate with your Axiom M-80 speakers? Well now imagine the same delicate sound but with an order of magnitude better imaging and an extra octave of bass extension! THAT'S what an XPR would sound like. Every "weakness" that the Axioms displayed in my room (not very deep bass, not very great imaging) is a specific strength of my new XPR-2. When you borrowed my XPA-2, I can understand how it might have sounded "faster but less delicate" with your Axioms, but the XPR-2 would definitely avoid that issue. In fact, I've never heard another better potentially matched combination than the Axiom M80s and the XPR-2. Unfortunately, this will remain conjecture - The XPR-2 is not an amp that we can just toss in the back seat & bring over for an audition. Also, I'm reluctant to ask that you move your Axioms again - they are best left in situ. Nevertheless, this is "THE synergistic system that may never be." I'm tempted to scoop up a pair of M100s just to try... If I ever see a used pair... With the Paradigms, when a low, low note comes along (think of the gigantic drum in Herbie Hancock's "Dis is da Drum"), the sound just blossoms from a point midway between the speakers and then expands to shake the entire room. There's no mush or hangover either - when the note decays, it does so naturally and the silence between the notes is stark. You don't want to come by & listen to the XPR-2 unless you're prepared to resist the temptation of robbing a bank to afford one. The more I think about it, Axiom Audio speakers are tentatively on my radar screen again. I believe that with the XPR-2 amp, that M-100s or even the M-80s could produce "Paradigm levels" of bass in my room but with better midrange clarity and treble extension. Just my two cents... Boomzilla now just think what the xpr mono blocks would do !!!! cheers |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 18:31:46 GMT -5
On a scale of 1 to 10:
A 1970 Technics receiver was a 3 (yes, I'm being generous)
Today, an "average" AVR is a 6
My XPA-2 was a 9
My XPR-2 is a 9.8
Even if the XPR-1s are a 10, the increase is even more marginal...
I'm beyond the point of diminishing returns already. So, thanks, but no thanks on the mono blocks (unless I buy some of those old Apogee ribbon speakers that are 80 dB efficient and 1 ohm impedance).
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 18:37:44 GMT -5
...You have a good ear, and aren't one to sugar coat reviews, so I knew I could an honest answer from you. ... Thank you kindly, paintedklown, but you're far, far too generous. I stumble, ramble, and contradict myself on a regular basis (and irritate a large majority along the way). Nevertheless, I try to mean what I say and to say what I mean. If my opinions were helpful to you, then it's all been worthwhile. Merry Christmas! Boom |
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 15, 2013 18:43:35 GMT -5
Have you ever tried a Class A amp 'zilla? Just reading this review it occurred to me that you might be a Class a candidate. Some of the words you use, like "delicate", "gentleman in a tux", "articulate and precise" etc added to the volume that you appear to be listening at might well put you in the Class A camp.
Cheers
Gary
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 15, 2013 19:04:33 GMT -5
Hi garycook -
At the volumes I listen at, ALL my amps are running in class A. As I said, I can flicker the lights on the bottom of the XPR's meter if I'm playing at (for me) loud (very loud) volumes. Both my Crown and my XPA-2 had a few watts of Class-A in them before their bias went to the AB side of things. Since my speakers are sensitive, I get by in "Class-A land" most all the time. Back in the day, I built a true pair of class-A amps from a Nelson Pass design. My XPR-2 sounds a great deal like those old mono blocks.
If and when I have any dissatisfaction with my XPR-2, I'll look at some class A mono blocks, but until that dissatisfaction hits me, I'm good.
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 15, 2013 20:28:34 GMT -5
Hi garycook - At the volumes I listen at, ALL my amps are running in class A. As I said, I can flicker the lights on the bottom of the XPR's meter if I'm playing at (for me) loud (very loud) volumes. Both my Crown and my XPA-2 had a few watts of Class-A in them before their bias went to the AB side of things. Since my speakers are sensitive, I get by in "Class-A land" most all the time. Back in the day, I built a true pair of class-A amps from a Nelson Pass design. My XPR-2 sounds a great deal like those old mono blocks. If and when I have any dissatisfaction with my XPR-2, I'll look at some class A mono blocks, but until that dissatisfaction hits me, I'm good. Thanks for the response. I asked the question as it occurred to me that maybe you could have tried a pair of XPA-1L's (for less than an XPR-2 cost) or a pair of XPA-1's (for a little more). If I was located in the US I know that I would have taken advantage of the 30 days. My loss that's it's not an option for me. Cheers Gary |
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