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Post by jumper on Aug 18, 2014 22:55:06 GMT -5
My source is a custom built PC soley for playing my music collection, currently converted to FLAC it's a variety of hi rez and redbook. I picked up a pair of XPA-1L's and I'm now looking for a DAC / preamp solution. I like the DC-1 and it has preamp capabilities for my 2 channel setup. My question is about the XSP-1 and what it might offer above and beyond the premap capabilities of the DC-1. I'd like to add a sub or two so I would use the XSP-1's bass management which the DC-1 can't do, but that's about all I can see needing the XSP-1 for. So would the XSP-1 add anything to the sound quality overall vs using the DC-1 as both the DAC and preamp? I'm trying to figure out how you justify using the XSP-1, if it's for people that need the connectivity or can it improve your overall sound quality just by using it with a stand alone DAC vs using and all in one solution like the DC-1?
Thanks!
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Post by novisnick on Aug 18, 2014 23:00:23 GMT -5
So, it's strictly two channel and will never develop into anything more?
Nice pick up on the amps, you're going to love them, the DC-1 as well!
Nick
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Post by jumper on Aug 18, 2014 23:12:31 GMT -5
Hi - yes, 2 channel only for sure - this is my space upstairs over my garage. The 7.1 system is in the living room. XPA-1L to me were no brainers at the closeout price (+10% e-club) so I snatched a couple. The XSP-1 makes a little more sense to me if I add 1 sub or even 2 stereo subs making it 2.1 or 2.2, I'd be able to cross over the subs and the mains correctly. I just don't know if and what it adds sound quality wise compared to using just the DC-1. I see the XSP-1 has HF and LF trim controls which could make a difference over just using the DC-1. Maybe there is just an advantage to the 'separates' configuration of having the DAC stand alone and the preamp in a completely different unit? I've read where some people don't even want volume control inside their DAC.
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Post by novisnick on Aug 18, 2014 23:38:31 GMT -5
My two channel is what your looking at Mac Mini. Oppo 103 ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, >>>>>>DC-1 ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,>>>>>>XSP-1 Rega,,,,,,,>>>>>>XSP-1 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>XPR-1s>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Paradigm Studio 100s>>>>>>>>>> Heaven!!!!!   |
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Post by novisnick on Aug 18, 2014 23:42:39 GMT -5
But seriously, if you don't care for the abilities or the sound you can return the XSP-1, personally, I had the gen 1 and thought I could do without it,,,,,NOT
I was just too spoiled to do without it.
Bass control, volume control, a little bit of tone control if you like.
The volume control is second to none I've ever used. But it's all up to you. I do 80% to 90% two channel just to let you know.
Nick
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Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 18, 2014 23:57:24 GMT -5
You don't need to worry about the DC-1's volume control, it's analog and doesn't truncate bits. You might start off with just the DC-1 and see what kind of sound you can develop, it should be pretty good. If you add subs just try their LP filter and levels as your crossover. Then if it turns out you want more try adding the XSP-1 with full bass management. It also helps appreciate the changes.
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Post by garbulky on Aug 19, 2014 2:20:20 GMT -5
This may be an unpopular opinion because it honestly doesn't make sense. I have the DC-1. I have tried the XDA-2, XDA=1 and oppo 105 and XSP-1 in a separate system. Out of all the DAC pre-amps the DC-1 does a better job of offering control when going DAC direct to amp when compared to other DACs (not pre-amps). Especially with the larger amps. The thing the XSP-1 did a bit better was the DC-1 got bass heavy and not as good (for lack of a better word) at lower volumes. The XSP-1 on the other hand scaled volumes significantly better. Basically there is a better balance. So soft volumes are just as enjoyable as loud volumes - in my system. That doesn't mean DC-1 soft volumes are bad or anything just that there will always be components that do it better. Doesn't make the DC-1 less fantastic Now be warned some people have complained that the XSP-1 appears to soften the highs. When I tried very hard to listen for it, at low volumes I did notice the absolute upper end - where the hiss of the air in the room/microphone noise was slightly muted. But only because I listened very very hard for it and it was only at low volumes. Honestly I may have imagined it. Nevertheless the XSP-1 simply had a better balance - but not by a stunning amount compared to the DC-1 dac direct. Also compared to the USP-1, it basically corrects any "flaws" the USP-1 may have had. The USP-1 was a bit forward and mid-range centric with some loss in fine details on the highs. The XSP-1 corrects all this and has really nice treble resolution - at least for me. Unfortunately I never got to try the DC-1 with the XSP-1. But basically, I think it's worth a shot. No, it is not a $1000 worth of sound quality increase. It's sort of a when you've got everything else good to go, then think about it. Now I did audition the XSP-1 with an Oppo 105, axiom m80 v4 and XPR-2 at a friend's place. Before DAC direct to the huge XPR-2 amp, the sound was good. But having auditioned the XDA-2 and XDA-1 dac direct to a large XPA-2 I noticed the whole dac direct to large amp sound signature. Then when we introduced the XSP-1, honestly....it was the best sound I had ever heard. I still haven't heard better sound to this day. It stomped all over what my system could do. They had a band called little feat where they had some brass playing and drums being hit. It was incredible, the dynamics, the detail and the effortlessness - sensory overload indeed. The soundstage was simply grabbed by the b*lls! Seamless soundstage from left to right. No sound suckouts. Just a dense, smooth powerful sound! Well, it's hard to explain but it was fantastic!  My friend who owned the system was less impressed as he felt the treble was muted and some amount of dynamics were lost. So there you go. Pros and cons. And note: that's just my experience, not necessarily yours. You may not notice any difference whatsoever. |
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Post by andyadler on Aug 19, 2014 8:42:05 GMT -5
I'm going through a similar decision process. My DC-1 is due in today, and initially I'm going to run it direct into my amplifier (either an NAD or Conrad-Johnson) via the RCA outputs, connecting to a Hsu TN-1220 subwoofer (with separate dedicated amp) by way of the XLR-outs and an XLR-to-RCA adapter (since the Hsu doesn't accept a balanced connection). If I'm not satisfied with the outcome, particularly on the bass management side, I may opt for an XSP-1.
Regards from New Orleans...A.
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Post by jumper on Aug 22, 2014 13:10:59 GMT -5
Ok - so here is a small twist to my original question, I've found a pair of full range speakers that I feel would be good enough to stand alone without any powered subs. So now the XSP-1 sub out features are moot, as well as needing its crossover capability. How much improvement do you think the XSP-1 would add when used with the DC-1 in a true 2 speaker / 2 channel rig? This would be vs. going straight from the DC-1 to the two XPA-1L's. I think as far as features go the only thing I give up not using the XSP-1 is its HF and LF trim controls, which admittedly might be nice so I have at least some kind of EQ capability vs none with the DC-1 alone. But at $1K for the XSP-1 that seems a bit much for the trim feature, is there any other technical reason it could improve SQ vs the DC-1 alone? I know I could buy and then return the XSP-1 but I'm just enjoying the conversation about it beforehand.
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Post by garbulky on Aug 22, 2014 13:16:35 GMT -5
FWIW, if I purchased the XSP-1 it would not be for the sub capabilities but for its sq. At this point I think the only way to tell is to audition it in your system and eat the shipping. It's not a $1000 difference if that's what you are asking. But very little is when you already have decent electronics. I listened to the DC-1 direct for some jazz the other day and it sounded great. But I also recall how nicely balanced the sound on the XSP-1 was. Wish I was able to compare the two directly.
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Post by jumper on Aug 22, 2014 15:14:14 GMT -5
FWIW, if I purchased the XSP-1 it would not be for the sub capabilities but for its sq. At this point I think the only way to tell is to audition it in your system and eat the shipping. It's not a $1000 difference if that's what you are asking. But very little is when you already have decent electronics. I listened to the DC-1 direct for some jazz the other day and it sounded great. But I also recall how nicely balanced the sound on the XSP-1 was. Wish I was able to compare the two directly. I hope that is what the outcome would be, I could add the XSP-1 down the road. I would think however the the more direct routing of the signal would yield the better result (DC-1 straight to XPA-1L). I wonder what it is technically about the XSP-1 that it adds to give that perceived improvement. |
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Post by garbulky on Aug 22, 2014 16:24:08 GMT -5
FWIW, if I purchased the XSP-1 it would not be for the sub capabilities but for its sq. At this point I think the only way to tell is to audition it in your system and eat the shipping. It's not a $1000 difference if that's what you are asking. But very little is when you already have decent electronics. I listened to the DC-1 direct for some jazz the other day and it sounded great. But I also recall how nicely balanced the sound on the XSP-1 was. Wish I was able to compare the two directly. I hope that is what the outcome would be, I could add the XSP-1 down the road. Good idea. I thought so too for the a very long time until I heard Emotiva pre-amps. I thought why introduce another distortion inducing box into the signal path. One can't possibly make the sound better?! But for me, the experience made me a believer in it. I'll come straight out and tell you I don't know. But....if I had to guess. It would have to do with output impedance and maintaining a steady power to a load (amp) that may change (?) Also another guess: For near a $1000 your money goes to surface mounted analog stage and a phono pre-amp in the XSP-1 vs for $500 device your money has to buy with it a dual DAC chip, dual headphone amplifier (and volume control), low jitter input, ASRC circuitry, and an (admittedly very nice) analog stage and analog volume control, PLUS analog input pre-amp functionality. That is not me downing either device. They are both excellent imo. Just telling you that one device has less money going into it and has to do a whole lotta stuff! |
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Post by Gary Cook on Aug 22, 2014 16:38:11 GMT -5
To me the process is pretty simple, get the DC-1 and listen to it in your system for a fair time, more than week less than month I'd say, with all sorts of music from you collection. Enough so that you are totally familiar with its sound. Then get an XSP-1 and compare it for the full 30 days, minus a couple of days for shipping of course. Listen, your ears, your set up, your speakers, your room, your music, if you like it in the circuit keep it, if not return it. Like garbulky I most definitely prefer the sound of a pre amp in the system.
BTW, I've had plenty of so called "full range" speakers in my set ups over the years and I always prefer the sound with a sub in place. So I would never discount the possibility of using the excellent bass management feature of an XSP-1.
Cheers
Gary
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Post by novisnick on Aug 22, 2014 16:44:05 GMT -5
As I sit here I just can't help my huge smile reading your post Gar and,,,,,and,,,,,,
Diana Krall to vinyl input to the Exact 2 cartridge on my Rega RP-6 through the XSP-1 and in to a set of XPR-1s to my new Paradigm Studio 100s,,,,,,,,
Can you hear the angle in my room?? My goodness I'm so blessed!!! Thank you Lord Jesus and also, my life partner and Joy of my life, my lovely wife.
God Bless us, ,,, ,, every one!!!
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Post by Gary Cook on Aug 22, 2014 16:51:37 GMT -5
Diana Krall to vinyl input to the Exact 2 cartridge on my Rega RP-6 through the XSP-1 and in to a set of XPR-1s to my new Paradigm Studio 100s, There you go....................I'm listing to The Look of Love (Hybrid SACD) via the Airmotive 4's while typing this  Yep.....life's pretty good  Cheers Gary |
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Post by roadrunner on Aug 22, 2014 17:52:06 GMT -5
FWIW, if I purchased the XSP-1 it would not be for the sub capabilities but for its sq. At this point I think the only way to tell is to audition it in your system and eat the shipping. It's not a $1000 difference if that's what you are asking. But very little is when you already have decent electronics. I listened to the DC-1 direct for some jazz the other day and it sounded great. But I also recall how nicely balanced the sound on the XSP-1 was. Wish I was able to compare the two directly. I hope that is what the outcome would be, I could add the XSP-1 down the road. I would think however the the more direct routing of the signal would yield the better result (DC-1 straight to XPA-1L). I wonder what it is technically about the XSP-1 that it adds to give that perceived improvement. To better understand what makes the XSP-1 such a technically advanced analog preamp with superior sonic performance you need to know that Lonnie and Ray, two of Emotiva's most talented audio engineers, spent 18 months developing the architecture of the XSP-1. Their goal was to develop the best stereo preamp on the market, with no cost ceiling. The XSP-1 was the fruit of their efforts. I have been an active audio hobbyist for the past 50 years and have owned and/or listened to many audiophile "flagship" stereo preamps. The Emotiva XSP-1 is the best sounding analog preamp I have had the pleasure of listening to. It comes nearly as close to reproducing stereo sound as attending a live performance. Listening to well recorded music through the XSP-1 is mesmerizing. Reward yourself and audition the XSP-1 in your own home. It is an experience you will not forget! |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 22, 2014 18:14:39 GMT -5
Ok - so here is a small twist to my original question, I've found a pair of full range speakers that I feel would be good enough to stand alone without any powered subs. So now the XSP-1 sub out features are moot, as well as needing its crossover capability. How much improvement do you think the XSP-1 would add when used with the DC-1 in a true 2 speaker / 2 channel rig? This would be vs. going straight from the DC-1 to the two XPA-1L's. I think as far as features go the only thing I give up not using the XSP-1 is its HF and LF trim controls, which admittedly might be nice so I have at least some kind of EQ capability vs none with the DC-1 alone. But at $1K for the XSP-1 that seems a bit much for the trim feature, is there any other technical reason it could improve SQ vs the DC-1 alone? I know I could buy and then return the XSP-1 but I'm just enjoying the conversation about it beforehand. I'm a less is more fan and have really enjoyed the XDA-2 as a DAC and preamp, for digital music I haven't wanted anything more (and the DC-1 could only be better). I have on occasion used the tone controls on the XSP-1, but mostly liked it for the phono stage. With your current plans the DC-1 could be all you need. |
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Post by BassThatHz on Aug 29, 2014 18:21:10 GMT -5
I tried by Oppo 105 directly to my amps and then with the XSP-1. I listen REALLY LOUD sometimes and I had the Oppo maxed out at 100 and it still wasn't loud enough for me, once I added the XSP-1 I got it up to +3db which is where my amps max out finally. As far as sound quality goes, I couldn't tell a difference between the two, the XSP-1 is that transparent. But both smoked my UMC-1 hard. I could always tell that the UMC-1 wasn't transparent but I couldn't put my finger on it, it wasn't until the upgrade that I was freed from the prison. LOL emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/32088/review-xsp-preamp-oppo-105I've had it for 1 year now and I'm still happy with this combo, and if you know me, you'd know just how much of a perfectionist I am and what it TAKES to make me happy; even I'm surprised I still like it... LOL! |
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