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Post by socketman on Jan 19, 2015 20:35:08 GMT -5
What are the odds of all these various owners of various speakers in various rooms, mine included, that show all of them with dips at 7000 hz and up? The lower frequncy are harder to get a handle on because of room gain, but high frequency should have less interaction with the room and they probably, shouldent all report so low. A benign rolloff beyond 7 kHz is normal in a typical speaker/room. For example, the first set of posted measurements on this thread. An earlier and deeper drop similar to the second set of measurements is not. Withought having full confidence in our measuring tools, however, there is little inference of value that could be skimmed from any set of measurements. In any case, what I learned from my years of experience with Tact room correction is to generally tailor the target curve so it follows the measured rolloff beyond 7 kHz or so. And if you wanna get adventurous, you tilt the entire target curve ever so slightly to boost or cut the tweeter output. A 5-10 dB boost in the range of 7-15 kHz by the lone stock Dirac curve as shown in several cases is just too agressive. The curve isn't the problem , its what the mic thinks its hearing. If we look at the graphs from the EMM with the dirac cal file its thinks its analyzing a speaker with a diminishing high end and in an attempt to make that graph match the house curve its over exaggerating the high end. My speakers have 2 tweeters each and the walls are bare surely there should not be a high end roll off in this situation. When I measure with REW I don't see the same roll off. btw im not mad  |
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Post by solidstate on Jan 19, 2015 20:43:17 GMT -5
A benign rolloff beyond 7 kHz is normal in a typical speaker/room. For example, the first set of posted measurements on this thread. An earlier and deeper drop similar to the second set of measurements is not. Withought having full confidence in our measuring tools, however, there is little inference of value that could be skimmed from any set of measurements. In any case, what I learned from my years of experience with Tact room correction is to generally tailor the target curve so it follows the measured rolloff beyond 7 kHz or so. And if you wanna get adventurous, you tilt the entire target curve ever so slightly to boost or cut the tweeter output. A 5-10 dB boost in the range of 7-15 kHz by the lone stock Dirac curve as shown in several cases is just too agressive. The curve isn't the problem , its what the mic thinks its hearing. If we look at the graphs from the EMM with the dirac cal file its thinks its analyzing a speaker with a diminishing high end and in an attempt to make that graph match the house curve its over exaggerating the high end. My speakers have 2 tweeters each and the walls are bare surely there should not be a high end roll off in this situation. When I measure with REW I don't see the same roll off. btw im not mad Do you have to use the mic's audio device IE the Emotiva EMM with Dirac SE? Will kit work with other mics/ADCs? It would be silly to hard-bake into the exe that it only works with certain Hardware IDs like USB\VID_0D8C&PID_000C&REV_0100&MI_00 !!! |
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Post by tubby on Jan 19, 2015 21:17:07 GMT -5
SS, I was wondering when you were going to join the party.
I am on my mobile right now, I will send you my file in the morning.
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Post by rogersch on Jan 20, 2015 2:00:51 GMT -5
The curve isn't the problem , its what the mic thinks its hearing. If we look at the graphs from the EMM with the dirac cal file its thinks its analyzing a speaker with a diminishing high end and in an attempt to make that graph match the house curve its over exaggerating the high end. My speakers have 2 tweeters each and the walls are bare surely there should not be a high end roll off in this situation. When I measure with REW I don't see the same roll off. btw im not mad Do you have to use the mic's audio device IE the Emotiva EMM with Dirac SE? Will kit work with other mics/ADCs? It would be silly to hard-bake into the exe that it only works with certain Hardware IDs like USB\VID_0D8C&PID_000C&REV_0100&MI_00 !!! No there is also a CAL file for the Emotiva mic. Here is the path: C:\Users\Gebruiker\AppData\Roaming\Dirac\OEM\Emotiva\MicCalFiles\EmotivaMicCalOA.txt So under your user profile in AppData there you can find it. Apparently it must be read-only otherwise it will be overwritten when the program is being started.... |
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Post by rswood on Jan 20, 2015 9:19:48 GMT -5
Has anyone for shtz and giggles run Dirac with 3rd party calibrated mic?
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Post by Priapulus on Jan 20, 2015 9:54:57 GMT -5
Has anyone for shtz and giggles run Dirac with 3rd party calibrated mic? I tried plugging my Neutrik calibrated mike into the EMO supplied ADC/cable; but it didn't work. It probably failed, for lack of phantom power for the microphone.
Sincerely /b
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Post by ansat on Jan 20, 2015 11:04:14 GMT -5
Not a big update. But I am satisfied at where this is at.
Dirac is still looking into this. All of the info that I collected and my suspicions as to the cause have been sent to engineering.
Hopefully I receive another update that i can pass along soon.
Tony
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Post by geebo on Jan 20, 2015 11:52:11 GMT -5
Has anyone for shtz and giggles run Dirac with 3rd party calibrated mic? It won't work. It specifically looks for the Emo mic. |
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Post by Lsc on Jan 20, 2015 12:17:06 GMT -5
Not a big update. But I am satisfied at where this is at. Dirac is still looking into this. All of the info that I collected and my suspicions as to the cause have been sent to engineering. Hopefully I receive another update that i can pass along soon. Tony What's the cause? A poorly calibrated mic? I remember my REW measurements from before didn't have that bump at 40-60 hz and the bottom falling out after 10kHz. I boosted the bass and reduced the treble using tone control but as most of you know, this is not a work-around bc the boost / cut are reset when you turn it unit off. My highs are just a tad high and my bass is just slightly low right now after my 5th calibration. If Emotiva can just give us a version of Dirac the way it was designed, I'll be much happier with Dirac. I'm still happy but not ecstatic. If that costs us $99, it's fine - so my XMC-1 cost $2.1k vs 2k. |
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Post by foggy1956 on Jan 20, 2015 12:42:15 GMT -5
Not a big update. But I am satisfied at where this is at. Dirac is still looking into this. All of the info that I collected and my suspicions as to the cause have been sent to engineering. Hopefully I receive another update that i can pass along soon. Tony Tony, I removed the Emo cal file from the folder prior to running Dirac with your file. This morning the Emo file was back in the folder. Is there any way to tell which file was used last? Paul |
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Post by darkblue on Jan 20, 2015 13:07:08 GMT -5
Dear Ansant,
I also would like to share my measurements and sorry for maybe some newbie thoughts.
To understand what Dirac/Emotiva does we might have to compare the Dirac measurement with an non Driac measurement.
I have attached two measurement files:
1. Dirac with XMC-1
2. Another one with Carma and a calibrated microphone, the test tone was pink noise. This measurement was obtained some month ago from a professional room acoustic Person
Maybe I don’t got your point but I can’t see an significant difference between the Dirac measurement and the Carma measurement.
Attachments:
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Post by socketman on Jan 20, 2015 13:08:26 GMT -5
Not a big update. But I am satisfied at where this is at. Dirac is still looking into this. All of the info that I collected and my suspicions as to the cause have been sent to engineering. Hopefully I receive another update that i can pass along soon. Tony Tony, I removed the Emo cal file from the folder prior to running Dirac with your file. This morning the Emo file was back in the folder. Is there any way to tell which file was used last? Paul Just go into the properties for the cal file and mark it as read only. After I downloaded tony's file it was not marked as such for some reason. I checked the Cal file before and after my run and the file remained. All I did was rename the original file by adding a 1 at the end. |
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Post by foggy1956 on Jan 20, 2015 13:18:54 GMT -5
Tony, I removed the Emo cal file from the folder prior to running Dirac with your file. This morning the Emo file was back in the folder. Is there any way to tell which file was used last? Paul Just go into the properties for the cal file and mark it as read only. After I downloaded tony's file it was not marked as such for some reason. I checked the Cal file before and after my run and the file remained. All I did was rename the original file by adding a 1 at the end. Confused easily, label Tony's file as read only? |
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tubby
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Post by tubby on Jan 20, 2015 13:22:45 GMT -5
Just go into the properties for the cal file and mark it as read only. After I downloaded tony's file it was not marked as such for some reason. I checked the Cal file before and after my run and the file remained. All I did was rename the original file by adding a 1 at the end. Confused easily, label Tony's file as read only? Right click on the file and go to Properties. You should see a box that can be checked that says Read Only. |
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Post by foggy1956 on Jan 20, 2015 13:24:59 GMT -5
Confused easily, label Tony's file as read only? Right click on the file and go to Properties. You should see a box that can be checked that says Read Only. Understand that part, question is which file, Tony's or Emo? |
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Post by socketman on Jan 20, 2015 13:26:41 GMT -5
Which ever one you want to stay for dirac to use. |
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tubby
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Post by tubby on Jan 20, 2015 13:30:54 GMT -5
Dear Ansant,
I also would like to share my measurements and sorry for maybe some newbie thoughts.
To understand what Dirac/Emotiva does we might have to compare the Dirac measurement with an non Driac measurement.
I have attached two measurement files:
1. Dirac with XMC-1
2. Another one with Carma and a calibrated microphone, the test tone was pink noise. This measurement was obtained some month ago from a professional room acoustic Person
Maybe I don’t got your point but I can’t see an significant difference between the Dirac measurement and the Carma measurement.
I see a difference. The dip in the high end between 10-20Khz is measuring 3-4 db lower in Dirac than with your other measurement. I can't tell with the low end, is the red or black curve the correct one to compare to? Also it looks like your previous measurements are left and right together and Dirac measures them separately, as well the Dirac you provided is the 9 point average I assume? So hard to do an apples to apples compare. |
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Post by foggy1956 on Jan 20, 2015 13:35:15 GMT -5
Which ever one you want to stay for dirac to use. Thanks for the clarity, slow firing synapses here |
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Post by socketman on Jan 20, 2015 13:39:20 GMT -5
I opened both files after running Dirac and they were exactly the same so that tells me Dirac did not replace it but I have not done a comparison between the original and Tony's to be sure it is actually using it. Tony says it does so I will believe him, simply because im lazy. |
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Post by darkblue on Jan 20, 2015 14:02:21 GMT -5
Dear Ansant,
I also would like to share my measurements and sorry for maybe some newbie thoughts.
To understand what Dirac/Emotiva does we might have to compare the Dirac measurement with an non Driac measurement.
I have attached two measurement files:
1. Dirac with XMC-1
2. Another one with Carma and a calibrated microphone, the test tone was pink noise. This measurement was obtained some month ago from a professional room acoustic Person
Maybe I don’t got your point but I can’t see an significant difference between the Dirac measurement and the Carma measurement.
I see a difference. The dip in the high end between 10-20Khz is measuring 3-4 db lower in Dirac than with your other measurement. I can't tell with the low end, is the red or black curve the correct one to compare to? Also it looks like your previous measurements are left and right together and Dirac measures them separately, as well the Dirac you provided is the 9 point average I assume? So hard to do an apples to apples compare.
Sorry, I forgot to mentioned that the black curve is the right one.
You are absolutly right, the left and right front speaker were measured together and yes, the Dirac measurement is a 9 Point average - shame on me.
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