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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2015 14:16:41 GMT -5
I for one am pleased with Emotiva's decision not to bastardize the XMC-1 into something it's not meant to be. I do not own and XMC-1 or have ever had one or heard one. I can surmise based on past experience with the UMC-1 and people's very favorable opinions of the XMC-1 that it is a very worthy processor. That said, having gone Atmos in my home theater I could never go back to a standard 7.2 arrangement. Atmos and Dolby Surround have changed the experience of my system to such a point that I can't imagine not having it. I was on the preorder list for years for the XMC-1 and when my name came up I declined it. I had moved on. Then the whispers about Atmos coming to the XMC-1 started and I began to question if I had made an error in judgement, but after having set up and used a 7.2.4 Atmos arrangement in my home I can't imagine how Emotiva would have ever done it justice given the XMC-1 output limitations. The news of the XMR has me excited, but after the extremely long wait for the XMC I am tempering said excitement. If Emotiva can come out with the XMR within the next year then I see it as my next processor. As for the XMC-1, it is a solid 7.2 experience and nothing more. That is the way it was meant to be and I am glad Emotiva isn't going to muck that up. I am also pleased to see Emotiva's continued commitment to providing enhancements for the XMC-1. That is extremely important to rebuild customer confidence after the UMC-1/200. Keep up the good work guys and I look forward to the XMR-1... someday soon I hope... I'm interested that you could never go back to 7.2 after Atmos. Just what exactly are you listening to in Atmos? I would prefer quality over multi-speaker gimmickry, just as I don't upscale my stereo sources such as regular TV to surround.
If you have an Atmos setup, you are almost certainly just upscaling standard 2.0 and 5.1 (plus the relatively few tru 7.1 Blu-Rays that exist) using the Atmos processor, as there is almost no Atmos source material.
This means that gimmick is over-riding purity and quality.
Upscaling stereo to 5.1 or 7.1 is "frowned upon" from a quality point of view but that is the same thing that is occurring with all Atmos setups (including both home theatre and the cinemas, who similarly don't have Atmos encoded source material)
I feel that your outlook on upconversion may be a bit short-sighted. Converting two channel material to 5.1/7.1 is certainly stretching the bounds of what can be done well through signal processing. Dolby Pro Logic is an admirable effort, but far from state of the art and, frankly, can do more harm than good. However, I do believe taking 5.1/7.1 material and stretching it vertically with Dolby Surround is considerably less harmful. With two channel you quite simply only have two channels of information and you are attempting to fill six to eight discrete channels. Whereas with 5.1/7.1 you have considerably more discrete data to work with. I own every Atmos title available on BD at this moment. The titles vary in general quality, but none are bad and most are better, in my opinion, than their 7.1 channel counterpart. For me, the real trick is less Atmos and more Dolby Surround. Yes, it is upmixing, but it does an incredible job. I use it by default with all 5.1 and up material. For me the difference between a DS upmix and true Atmos is fairly difficult to tell apart. All of the Atmos titles I own I also have their digital download equivalent. When doing a comparative listen it really is hard to differentiate which is better. The one thing I know for sure is that everyone who has been in my home theater says without hesitation the Atmos/Dolby Surround playback is superior. I agree completely and that is why I made the statement that I could not go back. |
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Post by flamingeye on Feb 28, 2015 14:19:54 GMT -5
Let me answer a couple of questions... 1. The HDMI upgrade can be done in your home. It involves removing the top cover and unscrewing the HDMI board and unplugging a couple of connectors. The new board fits in the exact same way as the old board. You'll screw in the new board, plug in the connectors (which can only go in one way!) and re-flash the unit with the new firmware that will be included with the board on a USB drive or as a download. You're done. Then you can wait for someone to make a real 4k player! Ha!! 2. The are several new processors in development right now. I'd spoken about this at CES, so its not a secret. We have a 16 channel Atmos enabled unit in development and it will be the new XMR-1. It will have a new T.I. 800 Series six core processing engine with enough power to handle Atmos, DTS-X, and whatever else is thrown at us. It is completely balanced on ALL channels and will go head to head with ANY processor on the market today, or tomorrow. It goes without saying it will ship with Dirac Live for Emotiva on all channels, and soon after release, we will be able to offer Dirac Unison. If you haven't heard of it yet, search it on Dirac's site. The new XMR-1 is going to be a monster. Made in Franklin, TN USA 3. There is a "baby" 7.1 processor in final development. It has some very cool features that I'm not ready to speak about just now, but it'll be a sweetheart. I predict this one will be a huge success. As a teaser though, it uses a smaller version of the OLED used in the XMC-1 and you have to see it to believe it. Same exact look and resolution, but smaller. It's going to have some very unique and useful features. We have fully functional hardware running on this unit, so its launch is not that far off. Made in Franklin, TN USA 3. Speakers are well into development. I'll admit we've had some false starts and stops on this program. However, we are on track now with a new line that is going to be really special and reflect the values and thinking of our company. We've got a great new look that says "Emotiva" and the quality of the European made drive units is stunning. And yes, they will be very affordable. 4. You're going to be seeing a lot of new things on the site very soon along with some exciting announcements in the next 30 to 60 days. This is going to be great year for all of you, and the company. Cheers, Big Dan Thanks' Dan I'm looking forward to the XMR-1 that's the one I've been waiting for and been saving for , now I'm getting excited again |
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Post by junchoon on Feb 28, 2015 15:08:08 GMT -5
]Where are you getting that Unison (or any other room correction software) REQUIRES 96k? You do know that ALL current bluray movies are mastered in 48k right? Likely u have not seen or heard Akira Actually my copy isn't the 25th anniversary edition and its 48k.  This Akira is getting kinda OT here but I was rather surprised that there is a Blu Ray version of Akira that does not contains a 192k Japanese soundtrack. Anyway IMHO, at least for Akira, the jap 192k sounds like "all-hell-breaks-freaking-loose" while the eng 48k is "zzzzzzzz" in comparison. It will be great if Unison can handle multi channels 192k. |
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Post by Gary Cook on Feb 28, 2015 15:21:13 GMT -5
Actually my copy isn't the 25th anniversary edition and its 48k. This Akira is getting kinda OT here but I was rather surprised that there is a Blu Ray version of Akira that does not contains a 192k Japanese soundtrack. Anyway IMHO, at least for Akira, the jap 192k sounds like "all-hell-breaks-freaking-loose" while the eng 48k is "zzzzzzzz" in comparison. It will be great if Unison can handle multi channels 192k. That's almost certainly going to be a mixing/mastering difference, typical Japanese, nothing whatsoever to do with frequencies. Cheers Gary |
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bootman
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Post by bootman on Feb 28, 2015 16:47:20 GMT -5
Actually my copy isn't the 25th anniversary edition and its 48k. This Akira is getting kinda OT here but I was rather surprised that there is a Blu Ray version of Akira that does not contains a 192k Japanese soundtrack. Anyway IMHO, at least for Akira, the jap 192k sounds like "all-hell-breaks-freaking-loose" while the eng 48k is "zzzzzzzz" in comparison. It will be great if Unison can handle multi channels 192k. ...and the 25th edition (which i don't have) is 96k 5.1 not 192. Nothing that I have heard of handles 192 multichannel with processing. Of course straight playback of 192 is OK. It is part of the bluray audio spec up to 6 ch, just the over the top processing of that signal without downconverting to at least 96k with very nice units like the Datasat to add room correction. 192k processing would be way over the top of anything out there. (and really not needed but hey its your money.  ) |
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Post by skippy1977 on Feb 28, 2015 16:56:33 GMT -5
Will Emotiva offer an upgrade to Dirac Unison in the future? If so I'll wait to order the XMC-1 till then.
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bootman
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Post by bootman on Feb 28, 2015 16:59:46 GMT -5
Will Emotiva offer an upgrade to Dirac Unison in the future? If so I'll wait to order the XMC-1 till then. RE-the future of the XMC-1... The XMC-1 is a 7.2 processor. The system architecture is set. However, we are far from done with the XMC-1. Will it have an Atmos upgrade? Probably not. It's not that it technically could not, it's just that the system channel architecture does not seem to be appropriate for 3D sound field support. We've listened to Atmos quite a bit and in our opinion, you need at least 11 channels to make it worth the cost and expense. More is better with Atmos. The XMC-1 is all about delivering the the highest quality Surround Sound experience possible from its existing channel configuration. This is much more important to me than a "half baked" Atmos implementation. We are seriously looking at a Unison upgrade in the future; this has way more upside than adding basic, bare bones Atmos... checking off the option box does not seem to be justification for adding it. Bolting on Atmos, DTSx, and other 3D sound field processing schemes is like trying to add AWD to a RWD car after the fact. It's better if you have planned for it! We needed least 12 channels from the start to do it right, or why bother? We're just getting started with the feature enhancements of the XMC-1. These different platforms all serve legitimate needs in the market and they do not necessarily obsolete one another. Atmos is a nice feature and it can add to the experience where implemented correctly. But, it is no magic bullet. At the end of the day, it is all about sound quality and base line audio performance, not more stuff in the room. You'll notice two channel audio is on a roll; headphone listening is on a huge upswing... why? Quality, not quantity. Connecting yourself viscerally with the music and the emotion of the performance. Not ping-pong effects. That's fun at first, but it does not take the place of quality. I've got a conventional 7.2 system in my home theater and it sounds very "three dimensional" to me. I won't be cutting holes in my sweet little room any time soon... Eventually I'll probably think about moving to a 3D implementation, but a lot of water needs to flow under the bridge before I jump into that stream. Too many unknowns at the moment; my hole saw shall remain holstered! Let the "spirited but polite" conversation begin! Cheers, Big Dan |
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Post by sandiway on Feb 28, 2015 17:44:55 GMT -5
Will Emotiva offer an upgrade to Dirac Unison in the future? If so I'll wait to order the XMC-1 till then. Three possibilities: 1. Emotiva is looking at it but it's not promised. Maybe it won't happen. Perhaps the CPU is not powerful enough?
2. It will happen. Is it just a software update for more money (how much?) Like the Dirac Live costs additional.
3. It will happen but requires a new motherboard. Hardware + software. How much?
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Erwin.BE
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Post by Erwin.BE on Feb 28, 2015 20:50:57 GMT -5
Dear Dan & Keith,
Thank you for finally announcing the big multichannel processor! You skipped 12 channels and went straight to 16! That's a very smart move. There might be a few people for who this still won't be enough, but let them buy elsewhere. For me, 16 channels is perfect!
PS: try to figure out a way to ship the big amps oversees...
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Post by wilburthegoose on Feb 28, 2015 20:56:49 GMT -5
 16 channels. Crap - I'm old enough to remember when 2 channels was considered amazing |
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Post by novisnick on Feb 28, 2015 21:15:29 GMT -5
Dear Dan & Keith, Thank you for finally announcing the big multichannel processor! You skipped 12 channels and went straight to 16! That's a very smart move. There might be a few people for who this still won't be enough, but let them buy elsewhere. For me, 16 channels is perfect! PS: try to figure out a way to ship the big amps oversees... Hope it can be down mixed to fewer channels. |
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Post by ÈlTwo on Feb 28, 2015 21:56:08 GMT -5
View Attachment16 channels. Crap - I'm old enough to remember when 2 channels was considered amazing At least you were born in the '60s. |
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Post by Mike Ronesia on Feb 28, 2015 21:56:48 GMT -5
View Attachment16 channels. Crap - I'm old enough to remember when 2 channels was considered amazing I have the Beatles first album and on it it says "Also available in stereo". Cheers Mark |
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Feb 28, 2015 21:57:07 GMT -5
View Attachment16 channels. Crap - I'm old enough to remember when 2 channels was considered amazing 2 channels are still amazing...especially with the XMC-1. . 7 channels too! I just looked at the Yamaha 3040 and was wondering how they got 7.1.4 out of a 9.2 receiver. And all they need is a firmware update for Atmos. They are using zone 2 & 3 outs for the ceiling channels. Unlike my previous suggestion, this appears to be much more economical. The channels are there for the XMC-1. And Atmos doesn't appear to be a resource hog either. That's good that there is a possibility...I heard Big Dan loud and clear but his engineers may propose this to him. 7.1.4 is not a 1/2 baked Atmos and its probably as far as I'll go on this. It's either this or we will see a XMC-1 gen 2. The XMC-1 in its current state won't be sustainable. Folks in Avsforum are holding out for various reasons and they have already called my precious XMC-1 obsolete when I bought it! How rude! Come on emo fans! Why are you guys like little mice in avsforum vs. here? We gotta defend Emotiva where it counts..man they shred us good over there.  |
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Post by junchoon on Feb 28, 2015 22:23:51 GMT -5
This Akira is getting kinda OT here but I was rather surprised that there is a Blu Ray version of Akira that does not contains a 192k Japanese soundtrack. Anyway IMHO, at least for Akira, the jap 192k sounds like "all-hell-breaks-freaking-loose" while the eng 48k is "zzzzzzzz" in comparison. It will be great if Unison can handle multi channels 192k. That's almost certainly going to be a mixing/mastering difference, typical Japanese, nothing whatsoever to do with frequencies. Cheers Gary Gary I am pretty sure the speaker requirement ask for 100khz. Bootman Also I am sure my copy shows 192/24 5.1. If u r talking about how most avr down sample to 96 then I understands. Thanks. |
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Post by Gary Cook on Feb 28, 2015 22:54:03 GMT -5
Folks in Avsforum are holding out for various reasons and they have already called my precious XMC-1 obsolete when I bought it! ( Simple, just pick one item out of their signature and remind them that it's obsolete. Everyone I know has at least one "obsolete" item in their system. Some are even very precious about it, makes the comeback even stronger  Cheers Gary |
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Post by Gary Cook on Feb 28, 2015 22:55:37 GMT -5
That's almost certainly going to be a mixing/mastering difference, typical Japanese, nothing whatsoever to do with frequencies. Gary I am pretty sure the speaker requirement ask for 100khz. I'm not sure what that means, I can't say as I have ever heard a speaker reproducing 100khz. Even the dog next door tops out at 45khz, so he hasn't heard it either. The cat on the other side, the one that always craps right next to the door of my car in the driveway so I tread in it when I get out, she tops out at 80khz. But if we were talking 50 hz or lower, I've got them both covered Cheers Gary |
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Post by junchoon on Feb 28, 2015 23:00:31 GMT -5
Gary I am pretty sure the speaker requirement ask for 100khz. I'm not sure what that means, I can't say as I have ever heard a speaker reproducing 100khz. Cheers Gary Tad cr-1 has that. Sound fab for 2ch in my rich buddy's system. Unfortunately I did not have a chance to try out Akira at his place. It was featured in enjoythemusic: www.enjoythemusic.com/Kuala_Lumpur_2015/ |
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Post by novisnick on Feb 28, 2015 23:01:05 GMT -5
16 channels. Crap - I'm old enough to remember when 2 channels was considered amazing 2 channels are still amazing...especially with the XMC-1. . 7 channels too! I just looked at the Yamaha 3040 and was wondering how they got 7.1.4 out of a 9.2 receiver. And all they need is a firmware update for Atmos. They are using zone 2 & 3 outs for the ceiling channels. Unlike my previous suggestion, this appears to be much more economical. The channels are there for the XMC-1. And Atmos doesn't appear to be a resource hog either. That's good that there is a possibility...I heard Big Dan loud and clear but his engineers may propose this to him. 7.1.4 is not a 1/2 baked Atmos and its probably as far as I'll go on this. It's either this or we will see a XMC-1 gen 2. The XMC-1 in its current state won't be sustainable. Folks in Avsforum are holding out for various reasons and they have already called my precious XMC-1 obsolete when I bought it! How rude! Come on emo fans! Why are you guys like little mice in avsforum vs. here? We gotta defend Emotiva where it counts..man they shred us good over there. I wish Yamaha would upgrade the 3020 to Atmos, it's almost the same identical AVR, |
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Post by ocezam on Feb 28, 2015 23:14:06 GMT -5
I have the Beatles first album and on it it says "Also available in stereo". I've got Steppenwolf's first album and it says Monophonic on the cover. Funny, I can only find the stereophonic art online: :format(jpeg):mode_rgb()/discogs-images/R-587450-1408435433-2175.jpeg.jpg) |
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