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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 8, 2016 13:56:29 GMT -5
To the best of my knowledge, my AC power is fairly steady, from a voltage standpoint. The only dips are when a large appliance (central air unit, for example) kicks on / off. I've never heard any artifacts from the momentary dips / peaks.
The local Magnolia store's trying to sell me a Furman power unit that regenerates the input voltage to provide a steady output voltage. In other words, if the line voltage sags or peaks, the Furman unit ensures a steady output voltage via a large capacitor bank that absorbs excess voltage or makes up when needed.
I'm thinking that since my line voltage is relatively steady other than momentary peaks & dips, I'd achieve the same smoothing via a passive 1:1 ballast transformer. Since the inductance of the transformer resists rapid changes in voltage, and since the device is rated for a full 15 amperes, I'm thinking that the $10 garage sale transformer will provide me with 99% the benefits of the $3K+ Furman unit. Additionally, all RF on the AC line will be blocked by the transformer as well.
Are my assumptions technically sound? If so, is there any harm in using BOTH a ballast transformer AND a surge suppression strip? In which order should the devices be wired - Outlet to ballast transformer to surge strip OR outlet to surge strip to ballast transformer? Why?
Thanks - Boomzilla
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Post by cheapthryl on Jan 8, 2016 14:10:18 GMT -5
I really do love the questions you try to get answered Boom. Lots of good information gets tossed around from your inquiring.
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Post by garbulky on Jan 8, 2016 14:13:16 GMT -5
Don't touch that s**t B'zilla!
You want regenerating power go with audio GD's HE series.
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 8, 2016 16:43:03 GMT -5
I really do love the questions you try to get answered Boom. Lots of good information gets tossed around from your inquiring. I like to try and understand things. Often, the greatest impediment to understanding are my own preconceptions. Having read audio magazine tomfoolery for most of my life, I've had lots of questionable ideas take root in my head. Many of them got overturned when I met a neighbor, Mr. Frank Woody, who used to be the station engineer for WRKF radio in Baton Rouge. He taught me electronics and electrical principles over cups of very good coffee. He passed away many years ago, or I'd still be picking his brain for most of these answers. He had forgotten more about electronics than most people ever know. He also instilled two ideas that have served me well. The first is "try it and see." Although this has resulted in some spectacular trips of my circuit breakers, it also has given me a vast repertoire of things NOT to do again... Frank's other polemic was "trust your ears!" Even if it measured worse, if it sounded better, then it was the right option. But I digress - Between the technical knowledge & experience of my fellow Loungers, I usually end up getting good answers. Cheers - Boom |
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Post by routlaw on Jan 8, 2016 17:08:59 GMT -5
Don't know how they compare in prices to the other mentioned considerations, but have you ever considered the PS Audio Power Plants? They aren't cheap by any means but IMHO they do work quite well. Its a very different critter than how the Furman works, but not sure how different it is compared to the product Garbulky recommends. Just a thought.
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 8, 2016 17:25:32 GMT -5
Well, I can tell you that I'll plan to try the "free" option (the ballast transformer) prior to spending Three Large on a power regenerator.
I strongly suspect that the biggest problem in my AC supply isn't voltage variations but rather line noise. Due to the layout of my house, I have to use an "Ethernet over AC" system to stream music from my computer server (in the back of the house) to my audio system (in the front of the house). So all my AC outlets carry RF noise. The Emotiva CMX-6 filters it out, but the ballast transformer would provide "belt and suspenders" filtration.
That leaves the question of whether the ballast transformer or the CMX-6 should be first device from the AC outlet. Any ideas?
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Post by routlaw on Jan 8, 2016 17:34:19 GMT -5
Understood, but just for the record the smallest PP3 is $2500, not 3+ grand still not cheap by any means. Not trying to talk you into it by any means but it is worth spending sometime looking at what these things do if for no other reason to learn a lot about the situation in general. To the best of my knowledge there isn't anything else like them available, and they regenerate AC at 85% efficiency.
As far as I can tell the EMO cmx-6 is very similar to what PSA used to sell as the Ultimate Outlet which is a very large balun capable of reducing noise by some 60 db while lowering the impedance of the AC line. Still this will not fix a fluctuating voltage, but dare I say it the Power Plants will. But if it were me I would use the CMX-6 first then the ballast after, or at least start there.
All that aside I feel for you trying to figure this one out with that noise on your line.
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 8, 2016 17:53:06 GMT -5
There are two ways to look at it:
For spikes on the line, it would make sense to have the CMX first. It's surge suppressor MOVs would ground out any high-voltage spike before it got to the transformer.
For noise on the line, it wouldn't seem to matter which device was first - the capacitors on the CMX would filter out any noise, but the inductance of the transformer would do the same.
I don't know whether the transformer has over voltage suppression or not (circuit breaker, fuse, etc), but if it did, then its massive inductance (slowing the rise in voltage) would give the fuse or circuit breaker time to work. If the CMX was first, then the MOVs would short (destructively) and the device would need to be replaced. The MOVs in the CMX, if I understand their function properly, act like a Zener diode, but once they activate, then unlike a Zener, they are destroyed.
Of course, a direct lightning strike would destroy either/both devices but I've never had one of those.
I have a spare ballast transformer - a new CMX I'd have to pay for. So it seems that from an economic standpoint, I'm better off using the ballast transformer before the CMX. If either of my transformers have a circuit breaker, then that's the preferred unit.
Of course, all this is speculation. If we have any electrical engineers on the Lounge, then they'd be the ones to ax!
Boomzilla
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Jan 8, 2016 18:09:08 GMT -5
I think you should design, build, and run your own nuclear reactor to ensure a steady, reliable source of power.
Mark
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Jan 8, 2016 18:11:13 GMT -5
By the way, how did you determine your current supply is pretty steady? Did you measure it or use the tried and true "stick your tongue in the light socket method"?  Mark |
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Post by novisnick on Jan 8, 2016 19:18:43 GMT -5
I think you should design, build, and run your own nuclear reactor to ensure a steady, reliable source of power. Mark I have!! What do you think I run my MONOBLOCKS on??    |
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Jan 8, 2016 20:02:51 GMT -5
I think you should design, build, and run your own nuclear reactor to ensure a steady, reliable source of power. Mark I have!! What do you think I run my MONOBLOCKS on?? View AttachmentMine take a tiny solar charger. You know, Class D rules... LOL! Mark |
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Post by novisnick on Jan 8, 2016 20:38:41 GMT -5
I have!! What do you think I run my MONOBLOCKS on?? Mine take a tiny solar charger. You know, Class D rules... LOL! Mark Yes,,,,,,,,D's rule!!!  |
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Post by monkumonku on Jan 8, 2016 20:39:08 GMT -5
Mine take a tiny solar charger. You know, Class D rules... LOL! Mark I like that... "Class D Rules." Not Monoblocks rule Not Two Channel rules But CLASS D RULES!!! |
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hemster
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Post by hemster on Jan 8, 2016 20:42:49 GMT -5
Mine take a tiny solar charger. You know, Class D rules... LOL! Mark Yes,,,,,,,,D's rule!!! Wait! That's Double-Ds!! |
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Post by novisnick on Jan 8, 2016 21:13:22 GMT -5
Mine take a tiny solar charger. You know, Class D rules... LOL! Mark I like that... "Class D Rules." Not Monoblocks rule Not Two Channel rules But CLASS D RULES!!! Wait! Who makes the RULES!!! |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 8, 2016 21:40:58 GMT -5
Obviously, the one with the DDs!
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Post by monkumonku on Jan 10, 2016 18:51:17 GMT -5
I like that... "Class D Rules." Not Monoblocks rule Not Two Channel rules But CLASS D RULES!!! Wait! Who makes the RULES!!! Hey but I am using three of my Class D amps in bridged mode so those are monoblock, right? So Class D Monoblocks rule!!! |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 10, 2016 19:01:10 GMT -5
I've run my Class D Crowns in bridged mode also. Having that much power on tap made me worry too much about power blips, wife tripping on a wire, etc. A single "pop" at that wattage would launch my speakers harder than a Space-X booster!
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Post by novisnick on Jan 10, 2016 19:20:54 GMT -5
Wait! Who makes the RULES!!! Hey but I am using three of my Class D amps in bridged mode so those are monoblock, right? So Class D Monoblocks rule!!!
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