Inexpensive HT Bypass - SOLVED!!!

[klinemj]

The question below has been solved. See my post on Page 2 for how! For everyone (like me) who thought that they could NOT have a sub in reference stereo on the XMC-1, there is an easy, low cost solution...jump ahead to see how. Thanks to mshump for the initial idea and others for their builds.
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I am looking for an home theater bypass option. I am not interested in a full function preamp, like Emotiva's XSP/USP or any of the Parasound's.

Technically, I don't even need volume control. What I want is to be able to feed my 2 channel DAC to it and play fr/fl/sub to the relevant speakers, but switch over and have my XMC run multichannel using the same fr/fl/sub. I do not even want/need crossovers for the 2.1 setup as I will run the fr/fl full range and use my sub to fill in.

I see that good point makes some basic passive preamps and switches (per link below) but none handle the sub AND they are PRICEY!!!

Like this, but....

Any thoughts? Maybe a DIY...? Also, must be xlr...not RCA!

Note:. My goal here is to have pure 2-channel with sub AND not have a full preamp unless I have to. I know I can run reference stereo via my xmc and have the fr/fl pass through directly. But, if I want the sub playing I have to use some processing and would prefer to avoid that.

Mark

[novisnick]

And it does change the sound of the two channel.
I think I know what your talking about! That was my quandary not too long ago, still no real solution.

I want to run my two channel and sub seperate from my XMC-1 but be able to utilize the towers and amps seperately.
Ive not found a balanced solution, only a partial RCA one. But still without the pre amp triggering the amps.

Ultimately Id love to share amps, towers and subs without running a signal through the XMC-1.
This what your trying to do Mark?

[klinemj]

Jun 17, 2016 20:20:58 GMT -5 novisnick said:

And it does change the sound of the two channel.
I think I know what your talking about! That was my quandary not too long ago, still no real solution.

I want to run my two channel and sub seperate from my XMC-1 but be able to utilize the towers and amps seperately.
Ive not found a balanced solution, only a partial RCA one. But still without the pre amp triggering the amps.

Ultimately Id love to share amps, towers and subs without running a signal through the XMC-1.
This what your trying to do Mark?

That is what I want to do... I have searched the web, and I find expensive solutions that include more than I want (like the xsp-1) or...expensive solutions that don't do what I want, or ...nothing!

Mark

[novisnick]

And now we know that on this forum, there are two of us!

Anybody else?

[bluemeanies]

I had the same issue after I purchased my B&W's. I have a HT and a tube 2channel system wanting to use my mains for my HT and 2channel.
I thought of a switch box that would enable me to switch between my tube mono-blocks and my Outlaw 7700 amplifier.
It has worked out well. With a flip of a switch I can go to 2channel operation or HT with no compromise in quality of sound.
It's safe an convient.
Below is a picture.
It was made from a fellow forum member.

imgur.com/a/RigWT

[yeeeha17]

I thought the XMC-1 is a great 2 channel preamp also. Am I missing something here.

[klinemj]

Jun 17, 2016 23:45:05 GMT -5 yeeeha17 said:

I thought the XMC-1 is a great 2 channel preamp also. Am I missing something here.

It is, but if you want to have two channel with sub, you have to use a mode in which some processing is done. I got a new DAC and it sounds even better than running digital in to the XMC. While I can run the xmc reference stereo and here it's purity, I give up my sub.

Mark

[klinemj]

Jun 17, 2016 22:07:59 GMT -5 bluemeanies said:

I had the same issue after I purchased my B&W's. I have a HT and a tube 2channel system wanting to use my mains for my HT and 2channel.
I thought of a switch box that would enable me to switch between my tube mono-blocks and my Outlaw 7700 amplifier.
It has worked out well. With a flip of a switch I can go to 2channel operation or HT with no compromise in quality of sound.
It's safe an convient.
Below is a picture.
It was made from a fellow forum member.

imgur.com/a/RigWT

I recall that, and that's what I am thinking of. But, I don't see how that unless the sub...which is the key thing I am trying to figure out. As is, I can get everything I need by using my 2-channel DAC analog out to the xmc in reference stereo but then I have no sub. Of course, when I switch to one of my xmc's multichannel inputs or any other analog in that's not set to reference stereo I can use the sub.

Mark

[bluemeanies]

I see mark by your signature that you have the XMC1...as the command center as I call it....no other monitoring system
I hadn't read your sig before today.
I am using the Outlaw990 processor for HT and the Grace design M920/pre/dac/headphone for the 2channel using the same mains. I just flip the switch on the Gratrix switch box according to what function I want to use....HT or 2channel. My Fathom is connected to both the 990 and the GRACE...however I found the bass a little to much in 2channel mode with my B&W803diamonds. While I have it connected I am not using it. I can adjust the GRACE on or off for bass in settings.
A HT bypass with is what I have (in very raw form) could be used if you had something like the XSP-1 or another monitoring system.
Any speaker switch device I had seen on line looks cheap and not well made. While I did not build my switch Boxes I had a say into what went in them...they are solid and have quality parts...which if you dissected them is nothing more than a good wire and made to last toggles.

Maybe this helped you to think about another direction.

[klinemj]

Jun 18, 2016 7:04:35 GMT -5 bluemeanies said:

I see mark by your signature that you have the XMC1...as the command center as I call it....no other monitoring system
I hadn't read your sig before today.
I am using the Outlaw990 processor for HT and the Grace design M920/pre/dac/headphone for the 2channel using the same mains. I just flip the switch on the Gratrix switch box according to what function I want to use....HT or 2channel. My Fathom is connected to both the 990 and the GRACE...however I found the bass a little to much in 2channel mode with my B&W803diamonds. While I have it connected I am not using it. I can adjust the GRACE on or off for bass in settings.
A HT bypass with is what I have (in very raw form) could be used if you had something like the XSP-1 or another monitoring system.
Any speaker switch device I had seen on line looks cheap and not well made. While I did not build my switch Boxes I had a say into what went in them...they are solid and have quality parts...which if you dissected them is nothing more than a good wire and made to last toggles.

Maybe this helped you to think about another direction.

This is the basic direction I have been thinking but for it to be worth it for me, I need to figure out a way to do the bass (otherwise, reference stereo on the xmc is good enough). And I agree that many basic switches look cheap. The Good point seems high quality but very pricey.

It makes me wish Emotiva would build a simple HT bypass box that included the sub without all the bells and whistles of the XSP-1 and very few analog inputs. Or, build that option into their premium processor to come!

Mark

[mshump]

I put a REL T-9 sub in my system and run the XMC-1 in reference mode, using the neutrik High level connection for the bass below the 1.7's limits.

Mark

[DYohn]

An inexpensive analog preamp with subwoofer output and HT bypass? Uf you want to go for the low-price solution something like a stereo crossover with level control would work, like this, coupled with an upstream A/B selector switch, like this.

Those are decent quality for the price. Of course there are better units...

[klinemj]

Jun 18, 2016 9:43:27 GMT -5 mshump said:

I put a REL T-9 sub in my system and run the XMC-1 in reference mode, using the neutrik High level connection for the bass below the 1.7's limits.

Mark

Say more...not quite following...

thanks, Mark

[mshump]

Jun 18, 2016 10:23:54 GMT -5 klinemj said:

Jun 18, 2016 9:43:27 GMT -5 mshump said:

I put a REL T-9 sub in my system and run the XMC-1 in reference mode, using the neutrik High level connection for the bass below the 1.7's limits.

Mark

Say more...not quite following...

thanks, Mark

REL subs have a regular LFE input and a High level input. The high level input (neutrik) runs off your amp outputs. the sub then will work in reference mode and when you are using HT mode the LFE input overrides it. When I am using the REL with music it is like a bass extension for the 1.7's, when in HT mode I get the deep bass slam for movies. I read and was told by my Maggie dealer that REl was a great fast sub for the Maggies, so I gave it a try and am very happy with it. link




Mark

[knucklehead]

Why not get speakers that do not need a sub?

[klinemj]

Jun 18, 2016 11:40:42 GMT -5 knucklehead said:

Why not get speakers that do not need a sub?

Because my Maggie are "oh so good at what they do" and I have never heard any other speakers this good for the range they do cover. And, frankly, I have been surprised how good they are without a sub. Adding a sub would be just "EXTRA icing on the cake"

Mark

[klinemj]

Jun 18, 2016 11:04:20 GMT -5 mshump said:

Jun 18, 2016 10:23:54 GMT -5 klinemj said:

Say more...not quite following...

thanks, Mark

REL subs have a regular LFE input and a High level input. The high level input (neutrik) runs off your amp outputs. the sub then will work in reference mode and when you are using HT mode the LFE input overrides it. When I am using the REL with music it is like a bass extension for the 1.7's, when in HT mode I get the deep bass slam for movies. I read and was told by my Maggie dealer that REl was a great fast sub for the Maggies, so I gave it a try and am very happy with it. link




Mark

Thanks...I do love the sub I have, so I want to keep it. But, if I am reading the documentation on mine right, I may be able to do something similar. Unfortunately, Rythmik's documentation is not very clear, and I always have challenges getting an understandable answer from them. But...you have given me a lead and something to think about and ask more about.

The specific thing that has me wondering about mine is the "dual" vs. "normal" mode for the xlr inputs. It appears it may do what you are talking about.

Mark

[klinemj]

Check out the attached link for the H600xlr3 "quick guide"....look at the top left about the dual mode. It makes it sound like I could run an XLR from my xmc-1 to use in HT Mode and split an xlr off one of my 2 channel DAC outputs and run it to the other xlr sub inputs and use dual mode. Then, it would behave as the REL noted above by mshump (even though mine is line level in, not a high level...)

See the link in the attached

Anyone else see a different explanation? Anyone have a Rhythmik with the same amp and know? (I will ask Rythmik, of course...but as noted, they give convoluted answers from what I have experienced!)

Mark

[DYohn]

Looks like it will use whichever input is active in "dual" mode. Unclear what happens if both inputs have active signal at the same time.

[klinemj]

Just heard back from Enrico at Rhythmik...quick answer and to the point! Answer is..YES! I can do what I would like!

So, here is a dumb question...now that I know my sub can do what I want...I suppose what I need to do is use a splitter off a line level connection and run an XLR off that splitter. I recall reading of folks doing this, and if I recall correctly, folks split the left channel. Is that right?

And assuming I am right, would it matter if I split the signal coming off my DAC or the one coming out of my XMC-1?

Thanks!

Mark