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Post by Gary Cook on May 25, 2017 19:57:37 GMT -5
A long time ago a very wise hifi salesman told me that I should spend around twice as much on my speakers as the rest of the gear and in 30+ years I've found that to be pretty good advice. So if in my 5.1 system the speakers consist of 2 x S12's, a pair of T1's, a pair of B1's and a C1 that totals ~$2050. The rest of the system being an MC700 and an A500 totals ~$1100. That's about as close to the rule of thumb as I could get. That said, I see the mistake technically in the reviewed system as not going for the T1's, which coincidentally (or perhaps not) skews the speaker versus the rest of gear cost away from the rule of thumb ratio. In comparison, in order to get the same sound quality from an AVR (as an MC700 and A500) I would have to spend around half the total budget, which would leave my speakers grossly under done. I think I went the inverse way about it. My electronics are a good bit more than my speakers. When I get done I will have $6k of electronics supporting $1.3 k speakers and maybe $1 to $2k subs! If I were to go twice I'd have to spend $12 k on speakers! Not that I wouldn't want to...he he he. Keeping in mind that back then we weren't looking at multiple sources, bluray payers, streamers, AVR/Processors, big screen TV's etc that add substantially to proportion of electronics. It was a simple formula Turn Table + Pre Amp + Power Amp = 50% of the speakers cost. Amazingly (or perhaps not) my UMC-200 + XSP-1 + XPA-1Ls + XPA-5 + XPA-100 has cost me only slightly more than half what the 5.1 Adelaide Speakers set up has cost. It was helped by scoring a used XSP-1 and reboxed XPA-1L's plus a favourable $A exchange rate at the time. Cheers Gary |
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Post by teaman on May 25, 2017 21:09:41 GMT -5
Nice review gar. In agreement with previous posts I never understand when a company is designing speakers that they don't push to be sensitive and efficient. I mean, why wouldn't you want your speakers to play louder and clearer with less power? If your selling amps as well wouldn't you want to sell more powerful amps at a better margin?  If you somehow think the new amps are more powerful or efficient than the first two generations....at a better price point, well that is up to you. But maybe you prefer the Gen 3...so here feel free to compare the Gen 3 XPA series previously on sale with the Gen 3 XPA series...which will no longer be put on sale. Dollar for dollar which would you rather have? Here are prices copied and pasted from the "January Holiday Sale" at Emotiva via email: The Holiday Sale is going strong, and some products are selling out fast. If there’s a certain Emotiva product on your Christmas or Holiday list, don’t hesitate to order. The elves may not make more until after the sale period ends on January 13, 2017! Emotiva Favorites on Sale: X Series: The Best of the Best. XPA-1 600 watt balanced mono-block power amplifier. Was $1199, now $1019. Save $180!... Now listed for $1199
X Series Gen 3 amplifiers: XPA-2 Gen 3: 2x300 WPC power amplifier. Was $899, now $764. Save $135!......... Now listed for $999
XPA-3 Gen 3: 3x275 WPC power amplifier. Was $1099, now $934. Save $165!........ Now listed for $1199
XPA-4 Gen 3 4x260 WPC power amplifier. Was $1299, now $1104. Save $195!........ Now listed for $1399
XPA-5 Gen 3: 5x250 WPC power amplifier. Was $1499, now $1274. Save $225!....... Now listed for $1599
XPA-6 Gen 3: 6x225 WPC power amplifier. Was $1699, now $1444. Save $255!....... Now listed for $1799
XPA-7 Gen 3: 7x200 WPC power amplifier. Was $1899, now $1644. Save 255!........ Now listed for $1999
....or how about the XSP-1 Gen 2? XSP-1 Differential Reference stereo preamp. Was $999, now $849. Save $150! ....or buy now at $1199 Same models, same gear........Hmm, I know the equipment I would rather spend my money on, but maybe I am missing something... Tim |
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Post by novisnick on May 25, 2017 21:17:48 GMT -5
If your selling amps as well wouldn't you want to sell more powerful amps at a better margin? If you somehow think the new amps are more powerful or efficient than the first two generations....at a better price point, well that is up to you. But maybe you prefer the Gen 3...so here feel free to compare the Gen 3 XPA series previously on sale with the Gen 3 XPA series...which will no longer be put on sale. Dollar for dollar which would you rather have? Here are prices copied and pasted from the "January Holiday Sale" at Emotiva via email: The Holiday Sale is going strong, and some products are selling out fast. If there’s a certain Emotiva product on your Christmas or Holiday list, don’t hesitate to order. The elves may not make more until after the sale period ends on January 13, 2017! Emotiva Favorites on Sale: X Series: The Best of the Best. XPA-1 600 watt balanced mono-block power amplifier. Was $1199, now $1019. Save $180!... Now listed for $1199
X Series Gen 3 amplifiers: XPA-2 Gen 3: 2x300 WPC power amplifier. Was $899, now $764. Save $135!......... Now listed for $999
XPA-3 Gen 3: 3x275 WPC power amplifier. Was $1099, now $934. Save $165!........ Now listed for $1199
XPA-4 Gen 3 4x260 WPC power amplifier. Was $1299, now $1104. Save $195!........ Now listed for $1399
XPA-5 Gen 3: 5x250 WPC power amplifier. Was $1499, now $1274. Save $225!....... Now listed for $1599
XPA-6 Gen 3: 6x225 WPC power amplifier. Was $1699, now $1444. Save $255!....... Now listed for $1799
XPA-7 Gen 3: 7x200 WPC power amplifier. Was $1899, now $1644. Save 255!........ Now listed for $1999
....or how about the XSP-1 Gen 2? XSP-1 Differential Reference stereo preamp. Was $999, now $849. Save $150! ....or buy now at $1199 Same models, same gear........Hmm, I know the equipment I would rather spend my money on, but maybe I am missing something... Tim Yes myriend, you missed MY point. I was not referring to us old heads that have the "good stuff" IMHO, I was referring to those that are new and will be future costumers of Emotiva. I Am a Big Monoblock heavy weight amp kind of guy! To be fair, I haven't heard the new Emotiva D class amps and most likely never will? Pound for pound and sound for sound I'll take an old class A/B amp and its more modestly priced tonnage all day long. XPR-1 @ 98 lbs IS a set it and forget it amp. (I ain't movin them mothas,,,,)!!!  |
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KeithL
Administrator 
Posts: 10,261
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Post by KeithL on May 26, 2017 9:19:33 GMT -5
Just to clarify one thing.... Nobody has heard "the new Emotiva D class amps" amps yet..... The XPA Gen3 amps are NOT Class D amps..... they are Class H - which is just Class A/B with dual power supply rails. The POWER SUPPLY in the new XPA Gen3 amps is a SMPS supply, which means that it's a switcher, but that has very little to do with how they sound... the audio sections are still analog Class A/B. (The fact that the power supply is regulated does have a slight effect on the sound... for the better... but that's not specifically because it's a switcher.) Note that we do use Class D amps in some of our subs, and we do have some Class D audio amps in the works... including the Emersa amps and a few others... (And Class D amps can sound really good when done properly.) However, none of our current amps is Class D. Yes myriend, you missed MY point. I was not referring to us old heads that have the "good stuff" IMHO, I was referring to those that are new and will be future costumers of Emotiva. I Am a Big Monoblock heavy weight amp kind of guy! To be fair, I haven't heard the new Emotiva D class amps and most likely never will? Pound for pound and sound for sound I'll take an old class A/B amp and its more modestly priced tonnage all day long. XPR-1 @ 98 lbs IS a set it and forget it amp. (I ain't movin them mothas,,,,)!!! |
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 10,261
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Post by KeithL on May 26, 2017 9:25:45 GMT -5
The reason is that there are design tradeoffs between efficiency and other characteristics - like frequency response, distortion, size, and cost. I don't think anyone specifically chooses to make a less efficient speaker... it's just a matter of what you'd have to trade away in return for increasing the efficiency. (And, since amplifier power is relatively cheap these days, it simply isn't a major factor for most people.) Do you really want your speaker to play louder with less power if it isn't going to sound as good? If it will end up sounding the same, would you really rather pay a lot more to get a more efficient speaker, instead of a little more to get a more powerful amplifier? Nice review gar. In agreement with previous posts I never understand when a company is designing speakers that they don't push to be sensitive and efficient. I mean, why wouldn't you want your speakers to play louder and clearer with less power? |
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 10,261
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Post by KeithL on May 26, 2017 9:29:43 GMT -5
Why are you assuming that more powerful amps would be at a better margin? Nice review gar. In agreement with previous posts I never understand when a company is designing speakers that they don't push to be sensitive and efficient. I mean, why wouldn't you want your speakers to play louder and clearer with less power? If your selling amps as well wouldn't you want to sell more powerful amps at a better margin? |
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Post by brubacca on May 26, 2017 9:38:10 GMT -5
Just to clarify one thing.... Nobody has heard "the new Emotiva D class amps" amps yet..... The XPA Gen3 amps are NOT Class D amps..... they are Class H - which is just Class A/B with dual power supply rails. The POWER SUPPLY in the new XPA Gen3 amps is a SMPS supply, which means that it's a switcher, but that has very little to do with how they sound... the audio sections are still analog Class A/B. (The fact that the power supply is regulated does have a slight effect on the sound... for the better... but that's not specifically because it's a switcher.) Note that we do use Class D amps in some of our subs, and we do have some Class D audio amps in the works... including the Emersa amps and a few others... (And Class D amps can sound really good when done properly.) However, none of our current amps is Class D. Yes myriend, you missed MY point. I was not referring to us old heads that have the "good stuff" IMHO, I was referring to those that are new and will be future costumers of Emotiva. I Am a Big Monoblock heavy weight amp kind of guy! To be fair, I haven't heard the new Emotiva D class amps and most likely never will? Pound for pound and sound for sound I'll take an old class A/B amp and its more modestly priced tonnage all day long. XPR-1 @ 98 lbs IS a set it and forget it amp. (I ain't movin them mothas,,,,)!!! Thats not our fault. I'd like to hear me some Emersa 2ch gear, including the amps. |
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Post by novisnick on May 26, 2017 9:44:06 GMT -5
Why are you assuming that more powerful amps would be at a better margin? If your selling amps as well wouldn't you want to sell more powerful amps at a better margin? Easy, Ive made a miss informed statement and Ass/U/Me ( mostly me ) they have a higher margin! also, I assume that D class is the future for mass marketing and A/B will fade into only those that want/afford them. All speculation on my part. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2017 14:17:13 GMT -5
With the BasX speakers, we wanted to create an entry level to our line of speaker products that would allow customers to explore the performance potential of their BasX-series electronics. The SAT ("Satellite") was intended to be a very compact, shelf/stand/wall mounted satellite speaker, and the LCR was originally conceived as a center-channel speaker to be a companion to the SAT, with the ability to be used left and right as well (hence LCR for Left/Center/Right), and both were intended to be priced such that we could easily package them together at an attractive price for the group. Both LCR and SAT speakers were intended to be used WITH subwoofers, not without, so their bass capability is naturally limited, but in that tradeoff we do maintain higher sensitivity and better maximum output.
Since the SAT and LCR speakers are the smallest speakers we sell, they are also by necessity the most limited. Depending on what type of listener you are, they might be for you, or you might be looking for more. We do sell a broad line of much more capable speakers in our Airmotiv model range.
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