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Post by jmilton on Jun 13, 2018 14:18:27 GMT -5
I'm kinda' led to ask if OutLaw owns ANY manufacturing? Or do they get everything built by others 'to spec' ?? I've been to the secret hideout (Newton MA)and had a pizza with Peter Tribeman. The units are designed and developed there, but manufactured elsewhere. I reviewed their RR2160 a while back and really like their products and philosophy. Their designs are 100% their own, and not rebranded stuff. Peter reminded me of a cross between Big Dan and Paul McGowan of PS Audio...old school, but practical and down to earth.
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Post by leonski on Jun 13, 2018 14:30:56 GMT -5
Met Paul M at a show a few years back when they intro'd a new amp line. awesome amp and a neat guy.
RR2150 was a mainstay and got universally good reviews. The update in the form of the RR2160 should continue to winning streak. Too bad people 'look down their noses' at old-school stereo receivers.
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Post by Casey Leedom on Jun 13, 2018 15:38:45 GMT -5
Hey jmilton, are you sure they're 100% internally designed? I had heard that at least some of them ore manufactured by ATI ... Or maybe you're saying that ATi is just one of their manufacturers for their own designs? Casey
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Post by lynnmass603 on Jun 13, 2018 16:39:19 GMT -5
to be fair i worked for some one who did design work for outlaw and he was not a outlaw employee
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Post by leonski on Jun 13, 2018 17:57:52 GMT -5
What it sounds like is they will Subcontract out a specific project. ?? This is after some process to determine need. And marketability.
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Post by jmilton on Jun 13, 2018 18:55:22 GMT -5
Ben Brewster is Outlaw's head engineer (ie. Lonnie). Outlaw amps use Toshiba bi-polar output transistors and the layouts don't mimic anything by ATI, however, I know they are not manufactured in MA. (I think the Monoprice Monoliths might actually be made by ATI.)
From their website:
"Factory? We're Outlaws! We don't need no stinkin' factory!!"
It's true, we have no factory, and we never will. If you are not building huge quantities of products, factories are very inefficient and add unnecessary overhead to the final manufacturing cost. We are designers and engineers. First we spec and design our products, and then we locate the best possible venue for their manufacture.
We are convinced that by matching a specific product to its ideal manufacturing venue, we will always deliver the best and most cost-effective A/V components. This development and manufacturing model, combined with a direct sales channel exclusive to the Internet, allows us to offer the best possible values to our customers.
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Post by Casey Leedom on Oct 27, 2019 20:52:21 GMT -5
Reviving this thread because it looks like my old MPS-1 has finally given up. Unfortunately, this caught me in a Fiscally Prudent Mode of trying to save up for Retirement and possibly a House, so my Evil Old Ways of simply spending large (to me) sums of cash on new amplifier(s) are no longer running the decision making process. Probably for the best. The cheapest options I've found for a 7-channel amplifier to replace the MPS-1 include an Emotiva BasX A-700 at $629 and an Outlaw Audio 7000x at $949. The A-700 doesn't have XLR inputs and is a little less powerful at 110WpC versus 130WpC for the Outlaw. Anything else I should consider? Casey
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Post by tchaik on Oct 27, 2019 21:03:45 GMT -5
Reviving this thread because it looks like my old MPS-1 has finally given up. Unfortunately, this caught me in a Fiscally Prudent Mode of trying to save up for Retirement and possibly a House, so my Evil Old Ways of simply spending large (to me) sums of cash on new amplifier(s) are no longer running the decision making process. Probably for the best. The cheapest options I've found for a 7-channel amplifier to replace the MPS-1 include an Emotiva BasX A-700 at $629 and an Outlaw Audio 7000x at $949. The A-700 doesn't have XLR inputs and is a little less powerful at 110WpC versus 130WpC for the Outlaw. Anything else I should consider? Casey if you don't need the xlr inputs I would save money and go with the Emotiva. that said.... the outlaw looks like a really good amp for just under 1,000 dollars. does outlaw cover shipping? that would be a diff of over 320 dollars....
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Post by emofrmcgy on Oct 27, 2019 21:16:07 GMT -5
Reviving this thread because it looks like my old MPS-1 has finally given up. Unfortunately, this caught me in a Fiscally Prudent Mode of trying to save up for Retirement and possibly a House, so my Evil Old Ways of simply spending large (to me) sums of cash on new amplifier(s) are no longer running the decision making process. Probably for the best. The cheapest options I've found for a 7-channel amplifier to replace the MPS-1 include an Emotiva BasX A-700 at $629 and an Outlaw Audio 7000x at $949. The A-700 doesn't have XLR inputs and is a little less powerful at 110WpC versus 130WpC for the Outlaw. Anything else I should consider? Casey The a700 is actually 80 watts a channel compared to 130. Outlaw always has chassis mounted connectors as well compared to board mounted for emotiva.. If build quality is important the outlaw wins hands down.. If power is important the outlaw wins. If choice of connection is important the outlaw wins.
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Post by Casey Leedom on Oct 27, 2019 22:05:49 GMT -5
Thanks for that input. 80WpC versus 130WpC is a much bigger deal — especially when I'd already be stepping down from the ~200WpC of the MPS-1. I'm actually very surprised that the Emotiva BasX A-700 uses Board-Mounted Connectors. That's not good.
Oh, and of course I left off my other option: open the beast (the Emotiva MPS-1) up and see if there's anything obviously wrong — avoiding all those Big Capacitors of course! I've already checked both of the Rear Panel Fuses.
Casey
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Post by leonski on Oct 27, 2019 22:20:33 GMT -5
130 to 80 is about 2db. Unfortunately, 200 to 80 is nearly 4db and maybe a meaninful difference.
All depends on listening habits, speaker sensitivity, and such. Don't forget that if you have a 200x7 RATED amp, it really won't do that. The transformer alone
would be a monster and weigh a bunch. And your powerline won't sustain such power, either. Maybe a 20 amp circuit would, but that'd be a stretch.
Another All-Monobloc solution? A brace of the PA-1 'D' amps. These are really re-cased B&O ICE amps......135 watts @8ohms with 0.1% distortion.
This is a more expensive choice than the 7-channel EMO, but is far more flexible. You can distribute amps closer to the speakers IF you can use longer
runs of BALANCED cable.
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Post by leonski on Oct 27, 2019 22:31:11 GMT -5
I see the focus SE is over 90db sensitivity. THEY rate it a 2.83v which is 1 watt at 8 ohms.....not 4.
But be that as it may, the speakers are fairly sensitive. 20 watts per speaker with 200 watt peaks, which the PA-1 should do, will get you evicted
from your STATE.
Specs call the PA-1 in at 270 watts, 4ohms @0.1% distortion. Commendible values.
You need to evaluate Needs V Wants, when it comes to amps and power.
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Post by emofrmcgy on Oct 27, 2019 22:38:39 GMT -5
130 to 80 is about 2db. Unfortunately, 200 to 80 is nearly 4db and maybe a meaninful difference. All depends on listening habits, speaker sensitivity, and such. Don't forget that if you have a 200x7 RATED amp, it really won't do that. The transformer alone would be a monster and weigh a bunch. And your powerline won't sustain such power, either. Maybe a 20 amp circuit would, but that'd be a stretch. Another All-Monobloc solution? A brace of the PA-1 'D' amps. These are really re-cased B&O ICE amps......135 watts @8ohms with 0.1% distortion. This is a more expensive choice than the 7-channel EMO, but is far more flexible. You can distribute amps closer to the speakers IF you can use longer runs of BALANCED cable. The Mps amps were a multi monoblock in a single chassis design. Each amp module had its own transformer and power supply built onto the blade.. Assembled weight was 115lbs.
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Post by leonski on Oct 27, 2019 22:47:22 GMT -5
Right. so you get a HERNIA moving it? Or need a couple buddies at the expense of food and beer? You are still feeding it with what I'm guessing is
a 14ga power cord, not even a 12 unless YOU changed it.
I like the multi-monobloc approach for this kind of thing. IF you can take advantage of the balanced feed? You can distribute the amps
which only weigh 6lb IN THE BOX and half that OUT. depending on ability to wire? You could cut a BUNCH of speaker wire out of the chain while
stationing amps closer to each speaker.
For example? My amps are located RIGHT AT each speaker. Each amp is connected with a 2 sets of wire about 3 feet long, tops. And since the amps are also within about 7 or 8
feet of the PRE, I was able to use single ended connection, one per amp and a VERY short single ended jumper between channels. Fairly simple connection.
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Post by brutiarti on Oct 28, 2019 0:47:00 GMT -5
But we are not supposed to be all engineers and make tons of money???
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Post by strindl on Oct 28, 2019 1:51:12 GMT -5
Yeah, I thought that Outlaw used 100% out-sourced manufacturing and design. Not a criticism; it's a completely reasonable Business Model. They specify products and QA processes and create a portfolio of products that their customers want and trust Outlaw to get designed/manufactured/tested in a reasonable manner. Casey I'm fairly sure that Outlaw used to have most of their power amps built by ATI in California. There's an interesting history behind ATI as well.
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Post by geeqner on Oct 28, 2019 9:10:50 GMT -5
I still think that your most cost-effective option would be to:
1. ATTEMPT TO DIAGNOSE THE PROBLEM YOURSELF: Disconnect (1) Amp Module at a time (do they have plug-in connectors, or are they hard-soldered?) and attempt the re-start. If it works with all channels except for (1) CONSISTENTLY 1a. Check into getting a new module 1b. Check into sending that ONE Module back in to EMO (will save A TON on shipping) 1c. See if you can live without one of your channels for a while 1d. Remove the failed module (maybe a local tech can use it for spare parts or diagnose it) and replace the blown channel with an PA-1
2. TAKE IT TO A TRUSTED LOCAL "ELECTRONICS GUY": Most who are worth their salt can probably identify the likely point of failure (at least, if it's something simple, which it USUALLY is...) and repair it for MUCH less than the cost of a new multi-channel Amp. IMO if you like your MPS Amp - it's at least "worth the try"...
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Post by emofrmcgy on Oct 28, 2019 9:12:18 GMT -5
Yeah, I thought that Outlaw used 100% out-sourced manufacturing and design. Not a criticism; it's a completely reasonable Business Model. They specify products and QA processes and create a portfolio of products that their customers want and trust Outlaw to get designed/manufactured/tested in a reasonable manner. Casey I'm fairly sure that Outlaw used to have most of their power amps built by ATI in California. There's an interesting history behind ATI as well. I was under the impression the higher end models that were USA made were ati built. The lower end which to be honest give up nothing in build quality are built overseas.
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Post by leonski on Oct 28, 2019 22:19:42 GMT -5
I still think that your most cost-effective option would be to: 1. ATTEMPT TO DIAGNOSE THE PROBLEM YOURSELF: Disconnect (1) Amp Module at a time (do they have plug-in connectors, or are they hard-soldered?) and attempt the re-start. If it works with all channels except for (1) CONSISTENTLY 1a. Check into getting a new module 1b. Check into sending that ONE Module back in to EMO (will save A TON on shipping) 1c. See if you can live without one of your channels for a while 1d. Remove the failed module (maybe a local tech can use it for spare parts or diagnose it) and replace the blown channel with an PA-1 2. TAKE IT TO A TRUSTED LOCAL "ELECTRONICS GUY": Most who are worth their salt can probably identify the likely point of failure (at least, if it's something simple, which it USUALLY is...) and repair it for MUCH less than the cost of a new multi-channel Amp. IMO if you like your MPS Amp - it's at least "worth the try"... Most Electronic Repair shops will charge for an estimate. BUT If you decide to go ahead with the repair? Estimate cost is deleted. IMO? Start with some kind of Not-To-Exceed cost in mind. Don't tell the shop this number, but rather use it as a way to keep from surprising yourself with a huge cost. Amps are not VooDoo components and there should be NO proprietary parts within. This is EMO we're dealing with here, not some giant manufacturer with huge buying (and customization) power. The exception to this would be Circuit Boards IF one if fried and beyond repair. Go Offline with Lonnie and Co. and see if they'll sell you a board?
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Post by Casey Leedom on Oct 30, 2019 22:39:40 GMT -5
Thanks guys! I'll be looking at this on Saturday when I can get some time on this. Since each of the individual Amplifier Modules slide out, I can easily do that and see if it's one of them in particular that's the problem.
Casey
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