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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 17, 2018 14:36:48 GMT -5
The short list =
Odyssey Audio Candela with remote VTA preamp with remote Prima Luna with remote Van Alstine with remote
I've heard not a one of the above. Anyone here familiar with any of them?
Thanks - Boom
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Post by brubacca on Aug 17, 2018 15:29:23 GMT -5
I heard the Pruma Luna Prologue Premium Pre. It’s very nice. I also have heard the Rogue Audio RP-1 & RP-5. Also both really nice.
Many people seem to like both the Schiit Saga and Freya although Saga is just a single tube buffer.
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Post by brutiarti on Aug 17, 2018 15:32:16 GMT -5
The short list = Odyssey Audio Candela with remote VTA preamp with remote Prima Luna with remote Van Alstine with remote I've heard not a one of the above. Anyone here familiar with any of them? Thanks - Boom Primaluna for sure
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Post by audiobill on Aug 17, 2018 15:38:34 GMT -5
Boom, the VTA for lots of reasons....call me.
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Post by dasanto2 on Aug 17, 2018 15:45:58 GMT -5
I’ll be interested in seeing the verdict from this. I’m interested in birh the primaluna and the vta. The rogue rh5 while marketed as a headphone amps has rave reviews as a tube pre.
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 17, 2018 16:33:46 GMT -5
I heard the Pruma Luna Prologue Premium Pre. It’s very nice. I also have heard the Rogue Audio RP-1 & RP-5. Also both really nice. Many people seem to like both the Schiit Saga and Freya although Saga is just a single tube buffer. I bought a Schiit Saga and then found it, although maybe a bargain at the price, not a great preamp on any ultimate metric. As a passive preamp, I felt that it muffled the sound. As a preamp + tube buffer, I felt that it didn't particularly bring any "tube magic" to the table and still muffled the sound. That said, preamplifiers (tube OR solid state) are come of the hardest to properly-design components in audio. What else would account for the plethora of mediocre-sounding preamplifiers, and at ALL price ranges? The worst of the preamps not only muffle the sound bur also add grain and some even hum. The design challenges include: 1. Grounding is tricky. If you have multiple components hooked up to the preamp, then you're just begging for ground loops. Since the preamp is normally "ground central" for everything else, stray voltages are ubiquitous. 2. Signal voltages vary from low (line level inputs) to very low (moving magnet phono cartridges) to very, VERY low (moving coil phono cartridges). At those low signal levels, the slightest bit of hiss, hum, grain, or distortion gets amplified again and again through the signal path. 3. Electrical components matter. Throw in some plus or minus 10% resistors in the RIAA circuit for the phono inputs, and your channel to channel frequency response will NEVER match. Throw in an inexpensive variable rheostat for a volume control, and your channel-to-channel balance will be all over the place. Throw in some cheap non-polarized electrolytic capacitors (or even worse, tantalum capacitors) anywhere and you'll hear edginess and grain. And the lower the signal strength, the more component quality matters. 4. Power supplies need space or shielding. The magnetic fields of the power transformer can easily induce hum unless they're VERY carefully shielded. 5. Microphonics at low signal levels are an issue. This is true more with tubes than with SS, but I've heard even SS gear display microphonics at high levels. I could go on, but you get the idea... Preamps are just plain tough.
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Post by brutiarti on Aug 17, 2018 18:13:03 GMT -5
Boom, the VTA for lots of reasons....call me. I read that the VTA preamps have hum problems
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Post by audiobill on Aug 17, 2018 18:18:07 GMT -5
Interesting, I’ve built many, many with under .2mv ac at outputs on my Fluke 177....
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Post by donh50 on Aug 17, 2018 18:20:33 GMT -5
I've admired Frank van Alstine for longer than anyone would care to admit. Talked to him a number of times back in the 1980's but not really since. I'd probably start there but also consider the PrimaLuna and VTA.
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Post by brutiarti on Aug 17, 2018 18:39:18 GMT -5
If you built them that can be a problem because you will not say that they hum. From monkumonku that you praised about his built “The only negative thing is unlike what Audiobill said about his SP14 build being absolutely silent, there is a very slight static buzz on mine” And that is what i found. Just google “SP14 hum” and VTA to make it easier
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Post by knucklehead on Aug 17, 2018 20:16:31 GMT -5
Doesn't the SP14 have a warranty?
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Post by brutiarti on Aug 17, 2018 21:19:40 GMT -5
Doesn't the SP14 have a warranty? Probably is audiobill’s warranty “what’s hum?”
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Post by bluemeanies on Aug 17, 2018 21:23:34 GMT -5
SP14 custom dead silent Author...audiobill
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Post by audiobill on Aug 17, 2018 21:38:21 GMT -5
Brutalarti- I can’t speak to what others build.
I think you can know this.
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 18, 2018 0:48:44 GMT -5
I've had $5K preamps that hummed - and $300 ones that didn't. The quietest preamp I've ever had (believe it or not) was a late 1970's Frank VanAlstine-modified Dyna PAS tube preamp. With an Adcom power amp, you could put your ears against the speaker drivers - no hiss - no hum - just complete quiet. My audio teacher, Mr. Frank Woody, was the station technician for the local PBS FM station. His meter could detect NO measurable voltage at all from that VA-PAS preamp with no signal coming through it, and he even commented that it was the quietest preamp that HE'D ever seen. Telefunken tubes, by the way...
If cousin Leroy built a VTA SP14 from a kit, I'd expect some cold solder joints in the mix, and I wouldn't be surprised at some hum. But if Audiobill (or I) built it, I'd bet on a dead-quiet background. Those VTA guys are no slouches at tube designs, IMHO. If they aren't Frank VanAlstines, they're really close.
Boom
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klinemj
Emo VIPs
Honorary Emofest Scribe
Posts: 14,764
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Post by klinemj on Aug 18, 2018 6:07:33 GMT -5
I have not heard the PrimaLuna pre, but the integrated amp is wonderful. And its auto-bias is great.
Mark
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Post by brutiarti on Aug 18, 2018 7:43:38 GMT -5
If audiobill can build one hum-free i will be definitely interested in one.
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Post by audiobill on Aug 18, 2018 11:36:37 GMT -5
Now there's the spirit!!
Seriously, I wish you could hear my Audio Note TUBE dac through the SP14 then on to my TUBE M125 power amps then into my Magneplanar 3.6/R speakers.
With my ear ON the speaker, dead silence.
My wife is my witness!!!
You're welcome on by to hear for yourself - I live near Albany, NY.
I can't do more than that!!
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Post by bluemeanies on Aug 18, 2018 14:05:54 GMT -5
If audiobill can build one hum-free i will be definitely interested in one. Jump on it!! You won't regret it! Don't be a "SLACKER" 😂😂 Also if you can swing it..Shuguang Treasure CV181Z tubes in the Gain and buffer positions...however the stock tubes do very well. I was able to sell a piece of equipment to afford the treasures (not the main reason for selling equipment) but since I had the coin. Expect better soundstage, better bass mods to die for, a very open pre-amp. Last but not lease...look who will be building it! QUALITY CONTROL...audiobill does not need it...he is it!! BTW MY 803diamonds are dead silent...as bill stated ear on top of the speaker quiet. Good luck with your decision.
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Post by monkumonku on Aug 18, 2018 17:05:50 GMT -5
If you built them that can be a problem because you will not say that they hum. From monkumonku that you praised about his built “The only negative thing is unlike what Audiobill said about his SP14 build being absolutely silent, there is a very slight static buzz on mine” And that is what i found. Just google “SP14 hum” and VTA to make it easier Well I am sure that if Audiobill had assembled my SP14 it would be dead silent but I wanted the challenge of building it myself. What I have now is a very slight ground hum/buzz that becomes inaudible less than a foot from the speaker so it doesn't bother me. It only "bothers" me in the sense that it exists, but it doesn't affect the music. I had the same problem with my ST-120 amp (which I also built myself) but after changing the driver tube and perhaps everything breaking in, there is only a very very soft hum from one channel that is a lot softer than the SP14.
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