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Post by creimes on Dec 3, 2018 22:13:36 GMT -5
No need to make this political. Don't you know Donald by now he sticks his nose everywhere hahaha
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Post by creimes on Dec 3, 2018 22:24:02 GMT -5
I just got a 4K TV and I'm trying to decide if I should save some more for a XMC-1 or grab a Marantz SR7012 for half the price of the XMC-1. Marantz-SR7012 on saleThe price gap widens when I add my 13% contribution to my provincial and federal governments. Third option is to wait for creimes to sell his XMC-1 as he'll price it in C$. There's a Marantz AV7702MKII on CAM for $900
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Post by jcz06 on Dec 3, 2018 23:52:26 GMT -5
8805 for sale here....
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Post by ottaone on Dec 4, 2018 0:37:50 GMT -5
There's a Marantz AV7702MKII on CAM for $900 Are you saying that the AV7702MKII is better than the SR7012? I'm checking with the poster if he upgraded the firmware for Dolby Vision as per Marantz's info. Btw, the AVM60 on CAM went quickly. Maybe he was the buyer. For me, "modularity", writ large, is a good idea but it's not easy to implement especially if you don't control the roadmap of the components. For Elon Musk, I think it's working well on the SpaceX front where he's got quite a bit of control but not working out as well in Tesla, though the car's computer can be swapped out for a higher level of autonomy. On the AV side, I think Bryston has done well on modulars/separates but the speed of change and uncertainty in product and standard roadmaps is simply too much for some companies. That being said, I'm making the call that 4K, HDR, HLG, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos is here to stay for at least 10 years that I'm willing to upgrade TVs and pre-pro NOW to these standards.
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 4, 2018 0:42:10 GMT -5
I’m sitting here watching Monday Night football through my XMC-1 with new board and wondering why I’m reading here that I should not be enjoying it because of its bugs. I’ve got news for you. With the latest firmware, It’s rock solid. Sounds great. Working well. I have no regrets buying the XMC-1. I do agree that there needs to be a product in the $1500 - $2000 range from Emotiva for those who don’t want to spend $3000 and up. The higher priced processors are a big investment. I'm at work right now, but in a couple of hours I'll be home and watching Netflix in 4K via my XMC-1 and it'll sound great. BTW I'm still on the original software version, which works just fine for me and has since I got it. I agree (and have posted about it for more than couple of years) that the gap between the MC-700 at $700 and the XMC-1 at $2,500 is far too great. Something in the middle, both spec and price wise, would be a great addition to the range. Plus give buyers some alternative when faced with being forced into buying a low level (sound quality wise) AVR due to budget constraints. Cheers Gary
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Post by creimes on Dec 4, 2018 1:19:29 GMT -5
There's a Marantz AV7702MKII on CAM for $900 Are you saying that the AV7702MKII is better than the SR7012? I'm checking with the poster if he upgraded the firmware for Dolby Vision as per Marantz's info. Btw, the AVM60 on CAM went quickly. Maybe he was the buyer. For me, "modularity", writ large, is a good idea but it's not easy to implement especially if you don't control the roadmap of the components. For Elon Musk, I think it's working well on the SpaceX front where he's got quite a bit of control but not working out as well in Tesla, though the car's computer can be swapped out for a higher level of autonomy. On the AV side, I think Bryston has done well on modulars/separates but the speed of change and uncertainty in product and standard roadmaps is simply too much for some companies. That being said, I'm making the call that 4K, HDR, HLG, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos is here to stay for at least 10 years that I'm willing to upgrade TVs and pre-pro NOW to these standards. If your not going to use the amps of the receiver the 7702 would fit the bill and seems to be cheaper to boot. Chad
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Post by musicfan on Dec 4, 2018 11:03:06 GMT -5
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Post by emofrmcgy on Dec 4, 2018 11:33:58 GMT -5
What a useless pile. Now what’s REALLY newsworthy is the value subwoofer award. Lol. But seriously. If the nad had 6-8 HDMI I’d be all over it.
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Post by davidl81 on Dec 4, 2018 12:00:40 GMT -5
There's a Marantz AV7702MKII on CAM for $900 Are you saying that the AV7702MKII is better than the SR7012? I'm checking with the poster if he upgraded the firmware for Dolby Vision as per Marantz's info. Btw, the AVM60 on CAM went quickly. Maybe he was the buyer. For me, "modularity", writ large, is a good idea but it's not easy to implement especially if you don't control the roadmap of the components. For Elon Musk, I think it's working well on the SpaceX front where he's got quite a bit of control but not working out as well in Tesla, though the car's computer can be swapped out for a higher level of autonomy. On the AV side, I think Bryston has done well on modulars/separates but the speed of change and uncertainty in product and standard roadmaps is simply too much for some companies. That being said, I'm making the call that 4K, HDR, HLG, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos is here to stay for at least 10 years that I'm willing to upgrade TVs and pre-pro NOW to these standards. Do you already have the external amps needed if the get the AV7702? If you do it may be the better choice over the SR7012. I still think the best bang for your buck is the AV8802A if you already have the amps.
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Post by creimes on Dec 4, 2018 12:12:13 GMT -5
Are you saying that the AV7702MKII is better than the SR7012? I'm checking with the poster if he upgraded the firmware for Dolby Vision as per Marantz's info. Btw, the AVM60 on CAM went quickly. Maybe he was the buyer. For me, "modularity", writ large, is a good idea but it's not easy to implement especially if you don't control the roadmap of the components. For Elon Musk, I think it's working well on the SpaceX front where he's got quite a bit of control but not working out as well in Tesla, though the car's computer can be swapped out for a higher level of autonomy. On the AV side, I think Bryston has done well on modulars/separates but the speed of change and uncertainty in product and standard roadmaps is simply too much for some companies. That being said, I'm making the call that 4K, HDR, HLG, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos is here to stay for at least 10 years that I'm willing to upgrade TVs and pre-pro NOW to these standards. Do you already have the external amps needed if the get the AV7702? If you do it may be the better choice over the SR7012. I still think the best bang for your buck is the AV8802A if you already have the amps. Much more moolah up here though, 8802a on Canuck Audio Mart is $3000 and new from Crutchfield is $4000
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Post by davidl81 on Dec 4, 2018 12:30:52 GMT -5
Do you already have the external amps needed if the get the AV7702? If you do it may be the better choice over the SR7012. I still think the best bang for your buck is the AV8802A if you already have the amps. Much more moolah up here though, 8802a on Canuck Audio Mart is $3000 and new from Crutchfield is $4000 I forget about the extra cost in Canada.
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Post by creimes on Dec 4, 2018 12:47:52 GMT -5
Much more moolah up here though, 8802a on Canuck Audio Mart is $3000 and new from Crutchfield is $4000 I forget about the extra cost in Canada. Yeah good'ol Canadian dollars haha
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Post by Bonzo on Dec 4, 2018 12:53:01 GMT -5
Yeah, but they obviously don't know what they are talking about since they put an Emotiva product in there.
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Post by Bonzo on Dec 4, 2018 12:53:36 GMT -5
I forget about the extra cost in Canada. Yeah good'ol Canadian dollars haha Time to move.
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 9,901
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Post by KeithL on Dec 4, 2018 13:02:23 GMT -5
In that case I agree with you entirely.....
Upgrading a modular device isn't always worth doing in every situation. However, it's simply one more option, which is sometimes the best choice for some people. While some people prefer a whole new product, others simply prefer the one they're familiar with - all else being equal. Likewise, some people have no problem selling their old model on eBay, or our forums, but others find selling used equipment quite unpleasant. (And many customers did in fact find the HDMI 2.0b upgrade to be a worthwhile option.)
Modular construction is also a benefit to us as a manufacturer - and, as such, sometimes benefits the customer that way. For example, when we released the new HDMI board, we were able to switch over and use it in all production XMC-1 units going forward without redesigning the entire unit. This made it easier for us to upgrade the XMC-1 "as a product", reduced the effort required to do so, and so helped shorten the delays and other issues involved.
Likewise, because our XPA Gen3 amps are modular, the various models are built from a limited number of separate modules. This allows us to stock fewer unique assemblies, avoid stocking a large reserve of many different models, and produce individual units as they're needed with less delay. This streamlined process benefits everyone... including both us and our customers.
And it's probably fair to say that most of our happy customers are also biased (whether they started out that way or not)...But, then, I would suggest that anyone who claims that two pieces of equipment "have similar performance", without actually listening to both of them, is also just a bit biased as well. I agree and my point was NOT about the XMC = "similar products", my point was simply math, so let me try again. Let's assume nothing equals the XMC and I must stay within the Emo family. If the XMC-2 sells for $2.5k, I can sell my XMC-1 + $1k for that. Now I have a brand new product, with whatever improvements it has AND a full warranty. I'm out of pocket the same money had I spent the $1k to upgrade my XMC-1. Let's say the XMC2 or RMC2 come in at $3k, now it'll cost me ~$500+ more over the upgrade - but wait: say I use my 25% off UFL. Now the new processor(s) are actually less expensive AND have full warranty, since I can't use my UFL discount on the XMC-1 upgrade. Ok, what if I am not a UFL member? Well, I won't have to wait long and I'm sure I can get a gently used XMC2/RMC2 for the cost of me selling my XMC-1 + $1k. My point is, modular is great if it's cost effective. That's not the case with the XMC-1 enhancements, or other processors that were also modular.
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Post by creimes on Dec 4, 2018 13:20:21 GMT -5
Yeah good'ol Canadian dollars haha Time to move. I love my American neighbors but I'll stay here in Canada I have a rich uncle in Texas, he doesn't buy me gifts though
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 4, 2018 14:48:20 GMT -5
And it's probably fair to say that most of our happy customers are also biased (whether they started out that way or not)...But, then, I would suggest that anyone who claims that two pieces of equipment "have similar performance", without actually listening to both of them, is also just a bit biased as well. I agree and my point was NOT about the XMC = "similar products", my point was simply math, so let me try again. Let's assume nothing equals the XMC and I must stay within the Emo family. If the XMC-2 sells for $2.5k, I can sell my XMC-1 + $1k for that. Now I have a brand new product, with whatever improvements it has AND a full warranty. I'm out of pocket the same money had I spent the $1k to upgrade my XMC-1. Let's say the XMC2 or RMC2 come in at $3k, now it'll cost me ~$500+ more over the upgrade - but wait: say I use my 25% off UFL. Now the new processor(s) are actually less expensive AND have full warranty, since I can't use my UFL discount on the XMC-1 upgrade. Ok, what if I am not a UFL member? Well, I won't have to wait long and I'm sure I can get a gently used XMC2/RMC2 for the cost of me selling my XMC-1 + $1k. My point is, modular is great if it's cost effective. That's not the case with the XMC-1 enhancements, or other processors that were also modular. I seriously doubt that you would get $1500 for an XMC-1 without the 4K board installed (check out the sold ones). More like $1,000 (net, after paying freight) and maybe less depending on how much warranty it had left. The realistic comparison is then $1k to upgrade our XMC-1’s or $2k (net after selling the XMC-1) for a replacement XMC-2 (if priced at $3,000). That’s the maths that those of us who have done upgrades have employed. UFL’s, buying used, 40% discount cards etc just muddy the water. Each of us employes the maths that is applicable to our own situation and makes the decision accordingly. For me, in Australia it’s a no brainer choice to upgrade, with an XMC-2 costing around $A6,000. Cheers Gary
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Post by rbk123 on Dec 4, 2018 16:50:23 GMT -5
I seriously doubt that you would get $1500 for an XMC-1 without the 4K board installed (check out the sold ones). More like $1,000 (net, after paying freight) and maybe less depending on how much warranty it had left. The realistic comparison is then $1k to upgrade our XMC-1’s or $2k (net after selling the XMC-1) for a replacement XMC-2 (if priced at $3,000). That’s the maths that those of us who have done upgrades have employed. UFL’s, buying used, 40% discount cards etc just muddy the water. Each of us employes the maths that is applicable to our own situation and makes the decision accordingly. For me, in Australia it’s a no brainer choice to upgrade, with an XMC-2 costing around $A6,000. $1k is the low end for an XMC, most are going for ~1.3k range. And if the maths of UFL, used, or 40% off are too complex for some, they are free to to stick to MSRP and upgrades and a simplistic cost model. Manufacturers love those. It's ok if people choose to pay more for upgrades; that's their prerogative. Happy trails.
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Post by manonfire on Dec 4, 2018 22:30:15 GMT -5
I actually did sell my xmc with original board for 1100.00 and purchased sr7012 from accessories for less with extended warranty. Lucky for me its located in same town i live in, so i paid no shipping and didnt have to wait either. Main reasons was im going to 7.2.4 setup soon and the marantz has a few more features like alexa, airplay 2, auro 3d. We forget that the original msrp for 7012 was 2199 so pretty close to xmc. Im going to start of by saying im no audiophile but since my system is mainly for movies ill give slight edge to xmc in audio but its not night and day and honestly in my opinion the room correction is probably why. Either way both products are great it all comes to if additional features are your priority or the audio quality.
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 5, 2018 0:26:04 GMT -5
I seriously doubt that you would get $1500 for an XMC-1 without the 4K board installed (check out the sold ones). More like $1,000 (net, after paying freight) and maybe less depending on how much warranty it had left. The realistic comparison is then $1k to upgrade our XMC-1’s or $2k (net after selling the XMC-1) for a replacement XMC-2 (if priced at $3,000). That’s the maths that those of us who have done upgrades have employed. UFL’s, buying used, 40% discount cards etc just muddy the water. Each of us employes the maths that is applicable to our own situation and makes the decision accordingly. For me, in Australia it’s a no brainer choice to upgrade, with an XMC-2 costing around $A6,000. $1k is the low end for an XMC, most are going for ~1.3k range. And if the maths of UFL, used, or 40% off are too complex for some, they are free to to stick to MSRP and upgrades and a simplistic cost model. Manufacturers love those. It's ok if people choose to pay more for upgrades; that's their prerogative. Happy trails. Possibly I didn't explain "muddy the waters" enough. An example, if someone bought an XMC-1 when they were $1,999 and used their 40% discount card then they paid $1,200 net. If they then pay $300 (4K) + $700 (DTS-X) for the upgrades then it cost them $1,900 all up, and that's way cheaper than buying an XMC-2 (ie; they don't have the 40% discount card anymore, they used it). But they could sell the XMC-1 and maybe get what they paid for it (ie; it cost them nothing) and then buy an XMC-2, net cost $1,300. Which is still more than upgrading the XMC-1. But what if they have a 25% UFL that they obtained when they bought the UMC-200 before they bought the XMC-1 which they can still use on the XMC-2? It can get quite complex hence why each individual person needs to make they own decision, which was my point. Or they bought a 40% discount card? A blanket "pay more for upgrades" is far too simplistic a summary. FWIW I bought my XMC-1 used for $1,100 earlier this year with some warranty left and at the time I had 3 to choose from at similar prices. Early XMC-1's will soon be out of warranty, so I don't believe that $1k is an unrealistically low price for them, considering that they have no 4K or DTS-X. Obviously more recently purchased XMC-1's with ~4 years warranty left and the 4K upgrade will sell for more. Bottom line, I'm exceptionally happy with my XMC-1 with it's 4 K upgrade as I'm sure many other XMC-1 owners are. When it gets its DTS-X upgrade I'll be even happier, as I'm sure many other XMC-1 owners will be. Many of us will have done the maths and worked out the financial benefit as well. Cheers Gary
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