PA-1

[creimes]

Sept 22, 2019 19:17:45 GMT -5 woofy98102 said:

I plan to pick up a pair, though I would have hoped they'd have had offered a more powerful version model with the 700AS1 amp board in it by now.

No complaints as of yet driving my T1 towers and even while cranking some deadmau5 haha

Give the track fn pig(ov)(Spencer Brown Remix) by deadmau5 a listen off Tidal, it's on the new tracks the bass hits at 1:03 and wow does it have a bass line to test out your low end haha, even the T1 do a good job of reproducing the lows

Chad

[hankp]

Hello, I've been lurking on this and other forums about the PA-1s and finally picked up a pair of PA-1s, my first Emotiva product ever and wanted to share my impressions. First off, they sound great to me, much more clean power than the Paradigm PW Amp they replaced. They're driving a pair of Gallo A'diva SE's crossover-ed with two powered subs. I was worried they'd be too much power for the small A'divas but I've turned up my preamp to -12 DB watching movies without blowing my ears off. On the PW-Amp I'd have to turn it up to almost 0 DB for similar volume. So I think the saying that erring on the side of more power is right. I'm using the MiniDSP 2x4 HD as a preamp.

I do have a few issues though. The blue LED for one of them apparently is not working, which is a minor issue for me, as they're inside a console anyway. Also, the auto shut off seems to be very aggressive or slow to activate, requiring me to wait and turn up the volume on my MiniDSP to turn the amps on. I had this issue with the PW Amp as well which is partly why I wanted an amplifier where I could turn off the auto-off feature. I measured about 5.4 watts per amp if I just keep them on, which works out to about $20/year for the pair. Not horrible. I'm going to just leave them on and may consider putting them on a smart plug that turns them off when we're away from the house. Makes me wonder though if everyone ends up turning off the auto-off feature?

I do get a faint hiss from my speakers when nothing is playing, but I think it just may be my speakers. It happens even if I completely turn the volume off and nothing is plugged into the RCAs. I recall it was actually worse with the PW Amp especially at higher gain settings. From a tip in a review, I even tried using a pair of two prong converters but that didn't help.

Right now none of these issues are show stoppers and I don't plan on returning them. It's not easy to find good efficient power in a small relatively inexpensive package and these Emotiva's really deliver despite these issues. I had thought about the NAD M10 for the power and Dirac room correction. I think it has similar power specs to a pair of PA-1s. But I saved about $1500 going with the MiniDSP (with the Dirac upgrade) and a pair of PA-1s. Of course the M10 looks much better and streamlined and has music streaming features.

[KeithL]

We're glad you're enjoying them.

They're really great little amps.

1)

We have had some failures of the LEDs...

If you want to send that amp in under your 30 day return period we'll be glad to do an advance-ship replacement for you.

Or, if you decide you want to have it taken care of later, we'll be glad to replace the LED under warranty.

(It won't affect anything else - some of the LEDs themselves just plain die.)

(Unfortunately, it's really not something you can replace yourself, so we can't just send you a new LED.)

2)

As with many devices that have an auto-on feature they can be a bit fussy.

Because they draw such little power, and run cold, especially when idling, most people just leave them on.

(Or they should work just fine with a smart plug.)

3)

All amplifiers amplifiers generate some small amount of background hiss... although, obviously, some do more than others.

The PA-1's are pretty quiet, especially for amps in their power range, but, if your speakers are especially efficient, it may still be slightly audible close-up.

This is normal.

Oct 7, 2019 13:14:00 GMT -5 hankp said:

Hello, I've been lurking on this and other forums about the PA-1s and finally picked up a pair of PA-1s, my first Emotiva product ever and wanted to share my impressions. First off, they sound great to me, much more clean power than the Paradigm PW Amp they replaced. They're driving a pair of Gallo A'diva SE's crossover-ed with two powered subs. I was worried they'd be too much power for the small A'divas but I've turned up my preamp to -12 DB watching movies without blowing my ears off. On the PW-Amp I'd have to turn it up to almost 0 DB for similar volume. So I think the saying that erring on the side of more power is right. I'm using the MiniDSP 2x4 HD as a preamp.

I do have a few issues though. The blue LED for one of them apparently is not working, which is a minor issue for me, as they're inside a console anyway. Also, the auto shut off seems to be very aggressive or slow to activate, requiring me to wait and turn up the volume on my MiniDSP to turn the amps on. I had this issue with the PW Amp as well which is partly why I wanted an amplifier where I could turn off the auto-off feature. I measured about 5.4 watts per amp if I just keep them on, which works out to about $20/year for the pair. Not horrible. I'm going to just leave them on and may consider putting them on a smart plug that turns them off when we're away from the house. Makes me wonder though if everyone ends up turning off the auto-off feature?

I do get a faint hiss from my speakers when nothing is playing, but I think it just may be my speakers. It happens even if I completely turn the volume off and nothing is plugged into the RCAs. I recall it was actually worse with the PW Amp especially at higher gain settings. From a tip in a review, I even tried using a pair of two prong converters but that didn't help.

Right now none of these issues are show stoppers and I don't plan on returning them. It's not easy to find good efficient power in a small relatively inexpensive package and these Emotiva's really deliver despite these issues. I had thought about the NAD M10 for the power and Dirac room correction. I think it has similar power specs to a pair of PA-1s. But I saved about $1500 going with the MiniDSP (with the Dirac upgrade) and a pair of PA-1s. Of course the M10 looks much better and streamlined and has music streaming features.

[hankp]

Thanks for the response KiethL. Your support and the quality of the amps are turning me into an Emotiva fan. I appreciate the offer of support to fix the LEDs and will consider it. Regarding the hiss I should clarify I can only really hear it if I put my ear right up to the speaker which is why I'm not too concerned. I already ordered the smart plug. Lastly my appreciation of the PA-1s were affirmed by a very positive review of a PS Audio amp that uses the same Icepower chip as the PA-1 at almost double the price: www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-ps-audio-s300-pwr-amp.9302/
But I think everyone on this thread already knows this.

[daveczski65]

Oct 7, 2019 13:34:01 GMT -5 KeithL said:

We're glad you're enjoying them.

They're really great little amps.

1)

We have had some failures of the LEDs...

If you want to send that amp in under your 30 day return period we'll be glad to do an advance-ship replacement for you.

Or, if you decide you want to have it taken care of later, we'll be glad to replace the LED under warranty.

(It won't affect anything else - some of the LEDs themselves just plain die.)

(Unfortunately, it's really not something you can replace yourself, so we can't just send you a new LED.)

2)

As with many devices that have an auto-on feature they can be a bit fussy.

Because they draw such little power, and run cold, especially when idling, most people just leave them on.

(Or they should work just fine with a smart plug.)

3)

All amplifiers amplifiers generate some small amount of background hiss... although, obviously, some do more than others.

The PA-1's are pretty quiet, especially for amps in their power range, but, if your speakers are especially efficient, it may still be slightly audible close-up.

This is normal.

Oct 7, 2019 13:14:00 GMT -5 hankp said:

Hello, I've been lurking on this and other forums about the PA-1s and finally picked up a pair of PA-1s, my first Emotiva product ever and wanted to share my impressions. First off, they sound great to me, much more clean power than the Paradigm PW Amp they replaced. They're driving a pair of Gallo A'diva SE's crossover-ed with two powered subs. I was worried they'd be too much power for the small A'divas but I've turned up my preamp to -12 DB watching movies without blowing my ears off. On the PW-Amp I'd have to turn it up to almost 0 DB for similar volume. So I think the saying that erring on the side of more power is right. I'm using the MiniDSP 2x4 HD as a preamp.

I do have a few issues though. The blue LED for one of them apparently is not working, which is a minor issue for me, as they're inside a console anyway. Also, the auto shut off seems to be very aggressive or slow to activate, requiring me to wait and turn up the volume on my MiniDSP to turn the amps on. I had this issue with the PW Amp as well which is partly why I wanted an amplifier where I could turn off the auto-off feature. I measured about 5.4 watts per amp if I just keep them on, which works out to about $20/year for the pair. Not horrible. I'm going to just leave them on and may consider putting them on a smart plug that turns them off when we're away from the house. Makes me wonder though if everyone ends up turning off the auto-off feature?

I do get a faint hiss from my speakers when nothing is playing, but I think it just may be my speakers. It happens even if I completely turn the volume off and nothing is plugged into the RCAs. I recall it was actually worse with the PW Amp especially at higher gain settings. From a tip in a review, I even tried using a pair of two prong converters but that didn't help.

Right now none of these issues are show stoppers and I don't plan on returning them. It's not easy to find good efficient power in a small relatively inexpensive package and these Emotiva's really deliver despite these issues. I had thought about the NAD M10 for the power and Dirac room correction. I think it has similar power specs to a pair of PA-1s. But I saved about $1500 going with the MiniDSP (with the Dirac upgrade) and a pair of PA-1s. Of course the M10 looks much better and streamlined and has music streaming features.

KeithL

Just installed 3 Pa-1s for my L/C/R channels,,but cant seem to get the auto on feature to wrk?  I read in this last post that they are fussy..anything i can do to get them to come on as does the rest of my channels?

Thanks

[Boomzilla]

I have completed my review of the Magnepan LRS speakers, and although I tried four different amps with the Maggies, the PA-1 amps were the clear winners. They had the current to make the LRS speakers sound dynamic, and still ran cool. The preview of the Magnepan LRS review is currently posted here. As soon as the review itself posts, I'll leave a link on the Lounge.

Boomzilla

[daveczski65]

May 5, 2020 16:51:37 GMT -5 Boomzilla said:

I have completed my review of the Magnepan LRS speakers, and although I tried four different amps with the Maggies, the PA-1 amps were the clear winners. They had the current to make the LRS speakers sound dynamic, and still ran cool. The preview of the Magnepan LRS review is currently posted here. As soon as the review itself posts, I'll leave a link on the Lounge.

Boomzilla

Nice too hear good things about the PA-1s.Just installed my PA-1s for my L/C/R today.gonna give them some breakin time before my tektons arrive in a few weeks..Them maybe a XMC-2 to make it sound great.Thanks for all the great stuff that comes from BOOM,,..When BOOM speaks!!People Listen!!!  LOL

[Boomzilla]

May 5, 2020 17:01:10 GMT -5 daveczski65 said:

...When BOOM speaks!!People Listen!!!  LOL

Scary...

Boom has learned that listening is more valuable than speaking. The expertise I’ve gained from others on this Lounge is invaluable. The ONLY things that I seem to be above average at are grammar and spelling (and I have lots of electronic help with those...).

[AudioHTIT]

May 5, 2020 13:59:49 GMT -5 daveczski65 said:

Oct 7, 2019 13:34:01 GMT -5 KeithL said:

We're glad you're enjoying them.

They're really great little amps.

1)

We have had some failures of the LEDs...

If you want to send that amp in under your 30 day return period we'll be glad to do an advance-ship replacement for you.

Or, if you decide you want to have it taken care of later, we'll be glad to replace the LED under warranty.

(It won't affect anything else - some of the LEDs themselves just plain die.)

(Unfortunately, it's really not something you can replace yourself, so we can't just send you a new LED.)

2)

As with many devices that have an auto-on feature they can be a bit fussy.

Because they draw such little power, and run cold, especially when idling, most people just leave them on.

(Or they should work just fine with a smart plug.)

3)

All amplifiers amplifiers generate some small amount of background hiss... although, obviously, some do more than others.

The PA-1's are pretty quiet, especially for amps in their power range, but, if your speakers are especially efficient, it may still be slightly audible close-up.

This is normal.

KeithL

Just installed 3 Pa-1s for my L/C/R channels,,but cant seem to get the auto on feature to wrk?  I read in this last post that they are fussy..anything i can do to get them to come on as does the rest of my channels?

Thanks

I also found the auto on sensitivity too low (they don’t come on). Keith will tell you to leave them on. I purchased one of these which can be triggered and switches up to 12 amps.

www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00WV7GMA2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[LCSeminole]

May 5, 2020 19:37:02 GMT -5 AudioHTIT said:

May 5, 2020 13:59:49 GMT -5 daveczski65 said:

KeithL

Just installed 3 Pa-1s for my L/C/R channels,,but cant seem to get the auto on feature to wrk?  I read in this last post that they are fussy..anything i can do to get them to come on as does the rest of my channels?

Thanks

I also found the auto on sensitivity too low (they don’t come on). Keith will tell you to leave them on. I purchased one of these which can be triggered and switches up to 12 amps.

www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00WV7GMA2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I have my four PA-1's powering my front & rear height channels, and they turn-on mainly during the scenes where the Dolby Atmos/DTS:X tracks are most dynamic. They also immediately come on when I'm playing a CD and using the Dolby Surround Upmixer. Interesting that you two find the sensitivity too low.

[daveczski65]

May 5, 2020 21:22:59 GMT -5 LCSeminole said:

May 5, 2020 19:37:02 GMT -5 AudioHTIT said:

I also found the auto on sensitivity too low (they don’t come on). Keith will tell you to leave them on. I purchased one of these which can be triggered and switches up to 12 amps.

www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00WV7GMA2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I have my four PA-1's powering my front & rear height channels, and they turn-on mainly during the scenes where the Dolby Atmos/DTS:X tracks are most dynamic. They also immediately come on when I'm playing a CD and using the Dolby Surround Upmixer. Interesting that you two find the sensitivity too low.

I tryed yesterday numerous times,,could nt get them to come on,,even messed with volume control,,No luck.

[Boomzilla]

I wish they'd just left off the "auto turn on" feature of the PA1s. It is quirky (unlike the rest of the amp), and discourages owners from just leaving the amps on all the time. They (the amps) take so little current, that there's really NO reason not to. After living with the amps now, and using them with a wide variety of speakers, the only criticism I can aim their way is that they become slightly less dynamic as the speaker impedance drops. Most of the time, it's unnoticeable, and it doesn't interfere with the "voicing" of the amp, so I still give the PA-1s my unrestrained endorsement. For their price, I've never found any (ANY) other amplifier that sounds as good and is so versatile.

Can more money buy better performance? Yes, it can, but bring a LOT more money. And please note that although almost every other component in my system has changed (most multiple times) since the PA-1s arrived, I've still got my PA-1 amplifiers. If I didn't think them superior, they'd have been long gone.

Can I see that special situations might not be appropriate for the PA-1s? Yes, I can. Those situations would be for VERY large spaces, VERY inefficient speakers, and VERY loud volumes. The amps do have limits, after all. But 99.9% of more of the applications where PA-1 amps will be used lack those limitations. I think Big Dan hit a home run with these amplifiers, and now have a BUNCH of friends who (having heard the PA-1s) now agree.

Enjoy!

[quattroll]

May 6, 2020 16:27:41 GMT -5 Boomzilla said:

I wish they'd just left off the "auto turn on" feature of the PA1s. It is quirky (unlike the rest of the amp), and discourages owners from just leaving the amps on all the time. They (the amps) take so little current, that there's really NO reason not to. After living with the amps now, and using them with a wide variety of speakers, the only criticism I can aim their way is that they become slightly less dynamic as the speaker impedance drops. Most of the time, it's unnoticeable, and it doesn't interfere with the "voicing" of the amp, so I still give the PA-1s my unrestrained endorsement. For their price, I've never found any (ANY) other amplifier that sounds as good and is so versatile.

Can more money buy better performance? Yes, it can, but bring a LOT more money. And please note that although almost every other component in my system has changed (most multiple times) since the PA-1s arrived, I've still got my PA-1 amplifiers. If I didn't think them superior, they'd have been long gone.

Can I see that special situations might not be appropriate for the PA-1s? Yes, I can. Those situations would be for VERY large spaces, VERY inefficient speakers, and VERY loud volumes. The amps do have limits, after all. But 99.9% of more of the applications where PA-1 amps will be used lack those limitations. I think Big Dan hit a home run with these amplifiers, and now have a BUNCH of friends who (having heard the PA-1s) now agree.

Enjoy!

I agree with just leaving them on, wasn’t my first inclination, but these amps are totally different in every way. So small and light, super convenient. I’m used to a trigger on all my other amps, but with so little idle power and the fact that they play a bit smoother when warm, it’s a fine trade. I just replaced an XPA-200 with a pair, bringing my collection to five. Mostly I did that to have a stereo pair available for the future, but I can use them now in a 5xPA-1 set up. Also, I suspect that these will be gone before long, and I’m not sure if a similar product will come along, that kind of thing has happened before in EmotivaLand.

Could the dip in impedance be a reason I didn’t like them when I used them in my Magnepan .7s? I think they are supposed to be a relatively stable 4ohm load. Are you talking about down even further? Just curious, as I think these amps are awesome overall, save the limitations you mention.

[AudioHTIT]

May 5, 2020 21:22:59 GMT -5 LCSeminole said:

May 5, 2020 19:37:02 GMT -5 AudioHTIT said:

I also found the auto on sensitivity too low (they don’t come on). Keith will tell you to leave them on. I purchased one of these which can be triggered and switches up to 12 amps.

www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00WV7GMA2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I have my four PA-1's powering my front & rear height channels, and they turn-on mainly during the scenes where the Dolby Atmos/DTS:X tracks are most dynamic. They also immediately come on when I'm playing a CD and using the Dolby Surround Upmixer. Interesting that you two find the sensitivity too low.

I’m also now using them for heights, when I first tried them a couple years ago and they didn’t come on, I bought the triggered outlet. It’s possible they might work now, but at this point I like that they just trigger on and off with the rest of the system. I’d trade the auto feature for some trigger inputs though, or maybe a user adjustable sensitivity control.

[brutiarti]

I hated the auto-on feature. Always lost several seconds of the first track. Good sound though

[leonski]

May 6, 2020 18:13:28 GMT -5 brutiarti said:

I hated the auto-on feature. Always lost several seconds of the first track. Good sound though

A PAIR of these draw less than 1 watt just sitting....Leave 'em on if the auto on is disturbing.

1 watt?    I'll bet its not even THAT.      You will never see it on your electric bill and in winter you'll never see the

extra heat kicked out as a reduction! 

[KeithL]

Just FYI ....

1)

Contrary to what many people seem to believe Magenplanars are not an especially difficult load to drive.

They are 4 Ohms, and do like a lot of power, but they are an almost purely resistive load.

2)

The PA-1's actually work very well into real low impedance loads.

Output power: 

140 watts RMS into 8 Ohms at 1 kHz at 1% THD;
135 watts RMS into 8 Ohms at 0.1% THD.

300 watts RMS into 4 Ohms at 1 kHz at 1% THD;
270 watts RMS into 4 Ohms at 0.1% THD. 

450 watts RMS into 2.7 Ohms at 1 kHz at 1% THD

THD+N: 0.005% at 1 kHz at 1 watt into 4 Ohms.

May 6, 2020 17:01:32 GMT -5 quattroll said:

May 6, 2020 16:27:41 GMT -5 Boomzilla said:

I wish they'd just left off the "auto turn on" feature of the PA1s. It is quirky (unlike the rest of the amp), and discourages owners from just leaving the amps on all the time. They (the amps) take so little current, that there's really NO reason not to. After living with the amps now, and using them with a wide variety of speakers, the only criticism I can aim their way is that they become slightly less dynamic as the speaker impedance drops. Most of the time, it's unnoticeable, and it doesn't interfere with the "voicing" of the amp, so I still give the PA-1s my unrestrained endorsement. For their price, I've never found any (ANY) other amplifier that sounds as good and is so versatile.

Can more money buy better performance? Yes, it can, but bring a LOT more money. And please note that although almost every other component in my system has changed (most multiple times) since the PA-1s arrived, I've still got my PA-1 amplifiers. If I didn't think them superior, they'd have been long gone.

Can I see that special situations might not be appropriate for the PA-1s? Yes, I can. Those situations would be for VERY large spaces, VERY inefficient speakers, and VERY loud volumes. The amps do have limits, after all. But 99.9% of more of the applications where PA-1 amps will be used lack those limitations. I think Big Dan hit a home run with these amplifiers, and now have a BUNCH of friends who (having heard the PA-1s) now agree.

Enjoy!

I agree with just leaving them on, wasn’t my first inclination, but these amps are totally different in every way. So small and light, super convenient. I’m used to a trigger on all my other amps, but with so little idle power and the fact that they play a bit smoother when warm, it’s a fine trade. I just replaced an XPA-200 with a pair, bringing my collection to five. Mostly I did that to have a stereo pair available for the future, but I can use them now in a 5xPA-1 set up. Also, I suspect that these will be gone before long, and I’m not sure if a similar product will come along, that kind of thing has happened before in EmotivaLand.

Could the dip in impedance be a reason I didn’t like them when I used them in my Magnepan .7s? I think they are supposed to be a relatively stable 4ohm load. Are you talking about down even further? Just curious, as I think these amps are awesome overall, save the limitations you mention.

[leonski]

May 6, 2020 21:43:58 GMT -5 KeithL said:

Just FYI ....

1)

Contrary to what many people seem to believe Magenplanars are not an especially difficult load to drive.

They are 4 Ohms, and do like a lot of power, but they are an almost purely resistive load.

2)

The PA-1's actually work very well into real low impedance loads.

Output power: 

140 watts RMS into 8 Ohms at 1 kHz at 1% THD;
135 watts RMS into 8 Ohms at 0.1% THD.

300 watts RMS into 4 Ohms at 1 kHz at 1% THD;
270 watts RMS into 4 Ohms at 0.1% THD. 

450 watts RMS into 2.7 Ohms at 1 kHz at 1% THD

THD+N: 0.005% at 1 kHz at 1 watt into 4 Ohms.

May 6, 2020 17:01:32 GMT -5 quattroll said:

I agree with just leaving them on, wasn’t my first inclination, but these amps are totally different in every way. So small and light, super convenient. I’m used to a trigger on all my other amps, but with so little idle power and the fact that they play a bit smoother when warm, it’s a fine trade. I just replaced an XPA-200 with a pair, bringing my collection to five. Mostly I did that to have a stereo pair available for the future, but I can use them now in a 5xPA-1 set up. Also, I suspect that these will be gone before long, and I’m not sure if a similar product will come along, that kind of thing has happened before in EmotivaLand.

Could the dip in impedance be a reason I didn’t like them when I used them in my Magnepan .7s? I think they are supposed to be a relatively stable 4ohm load. Are you talking about down even further? Just curious, as I think these amps are awesome overall, save the limitations you mention.

It is VERY true that Maggies are very low sensitivity.    And DO require an amp that 'brings the goods'.      In White Bear Lake, they formerly ran the lobby system with 35 watts of TUBE.    So there!      As for purely resistive?   That's what they'd LIKE you to believe.    Take the time to look up the Stereophile measured data on both the 1.6 and 3.6 models.    Both have reactive aspects to their 'curves' and could not be characterized as 'mostly resistive', or whatever.     That was the claim when I bought my MG-1 back in the early 80s.    But still and all, ANY amp which can bring it will work.    I suspect the PA-1 and the new LRS will be a FINE budget system hitting well above the cost.   Use the best source you can afford.   

IMO?   I'd IGNORE the 1% distortion power numbers.   Depending on material, you probably won't like it there, anyway.   But the listed 1% to 0.1% power difference is small.....the curve is getting VERY steep at the 0.1% power level.   

For Quattro?     Your .7s probably don't go below maybe 3 ohms.     And if so, not for long or with high reactance.       Do you have Maggie .7 measured data?    Please post or link

[AudioHTIT]

May 6, 2020 21:15:02 GMT -5 leonski said:

May 6, 2020 18:13:28 GMT -5 brutiarti said:

I hated the auto-on feature. Always lost several seconds of the first track. Good sound though

A PAIR of these draw less than 1 watt just sitting....Leave 'em on if the auto on is disturbing.

1 watt?    I'll bet its not even THAT.      You will never see it on your electric bill and in winter you'll never see the

extra heat kicked out as a reduction! 

You seem to have changed your tune.

Actually they idle at 5.6 Watts, so 2 of them about 11W, I have 6 of them so 33W. When is it ok for me to care?

[quattroll]

Thanks Keith, I’ll take your input every time. I will give a better demo on my new pair when I get them. No rush to put them in 5.1 just yet. I want to know more, fascinating amps . . .

Playing Enigma, Principles of Lust right now, It’s the trailer music for Ridley Scott’s 1492. Not in movie though, so searched for it. Great music wish I could turn it up more right now!