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Post by daveczski65 on Jul 13, 2020 13:40:47 GMT -5
Another dinky TV dwarfed by the speakers. You must be good friends with Shimei. It's crazy. I see 65" tvs on Reddit which look huge with Klipsch book shelf or mini [relatively speaking] towers but when I take pictures the tv doesn't look so big. I'm quite happy with my setup. And I never feel the need for a larger tv when viewing. Ha, sometimes I think others egg me on to purchase a bigger tv to keep up with the Joneses! Anyhoot, I'm at a place of contentment with this current system. Streaming Diana Krall from Tidal as I have learned to appreciate Jazz as of late. I really enjoy Jazz Trios with bass, guitar, piano and any combination with percussion. But please hold the horns! Enjoy Ahh very nice! I see you got your other 4-10 added...looks amazing..Could only imagine the sound out of the Uberlifts!,,I just have dinky Electron SEs ,,lol..Enjoy!!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2020 14:18:37 GMT -5
Try: Russell Malone Ron Carter Geoff Keezer Peter Bernstein Mike LaDonne Brian Blade Grant Green Oscar Peterson Herb Ellis Kenny Burrell John Stein Cassandra Wilson Cyrus Chestnut Brian Bromberg Ray Brown Milt Jackson Mark Whitfield Paul Desmond Patricia Barber Graham Dechter Jeff Hamilton Thanks, and besides Diana Krall: Madeleine Peyroux Melody Gardot Going to Tidal now to add the recommended artist! Thanks a million.
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Post by garbulky on Jul 13, 2020 15:03:55 GMT -5
Try: Russell Malone Ron Carter Geoff Keezer Peter Bernstein Mike LaDonne Brian Blade Grant Green Oscar Peterson Herb Ellis Kenny Burrell John Stein Cassandra Wilson Cyrus Chestnut Brian Bromberg Ray Brown Milt Jackson Mark Whitfield Paul Desmond Patricia Barber Graham Dechter Jeff Hamilton Thanks, and besides Diana Krall: Madeleine Peyroux Melody Gardot Going to Tidal now to add the recommended artist! Thanks a million. Also anything by the holly Cole trio! You like Instrumental jazz? Try the Modern Jazz quartet: the complete last concert
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Post by creimes on Jul 13, 2020 15:08:28 GMT -5
Try: Russell Malone Ron Carter Geoff Keezer Peter Bernstein Mike LaDonne Brian Blade Grant Green Oscar Peterson Herb Ellis Kenny Burrell John Stein Cassandra Wilson Cyrus Chestnut Brian Bromberg Ray Brown Milt Jackson Mark Whitfield Paul Desmond Patricia Barber Graham Dechter Jeff Hamilton Thanks, and besides Diana Krall: Madeleine Peyroux Melody Gardot Going to Tidal now to add the recommended artist! Thanks a million. They don't have much on Tidal but "Heather Blush and The Uppercuts" are really good Chad
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2020 12:23:45 GMT -5
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Post by garbulky on Jul 15, 2020 13:09:09 GMT -5
Pity - despite the measurer claiming so the frequency response is all over the place. he puts it down to room variation, but nevertheless, there are big peaks and dips throughout the Frequency range. The time alignment is also not that great as the tweeter sound arrives 135 ms after the woofer sound. This is an issue because Tekton's new patent is about creating a "time invariant phase coherent" sound. Maybe there's only so much one can do with these larger speakers. Thankfully the man is able to ameliorate this issue with DSP. I'm not sure if DSP is included with these speakers or not... They probably still sound pretty darn good if the Pendragon I heard is any indication.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2020 13:51:41 GMT -5
Pity - despite the measurer claiming so the frequency response is all over the place. he puts it down to room variation, but nevertheless, there are big peaks and dips throughout the Frequency range. The time alignment is also not that great as the tweeter sound arrives 135 ms after the woofer sound. This is an issue because Tekton's new patent is about creating a "time invariant phase coherent" sound. Maybe there's only so much one can do with these larger speakers. Thankfully the man is able to ameliorate this issue with DSP. I'm not sure if DSP is included with these speakers or not... They probably still sound pretty darn good if the Pendragon I heard is any indication. Don't you have that reversed? Quote, "As mentioned above, we see two vertical spikes that are offset in time. First to arrive at our ears are the tweeters and then the woofers." Anyhoot, the frequency response is in room or real world and not in an anechoic chamber. The Ulfs don't come with a DSP. But the R&D stage 21-12 will come with amplification and dsp per tower!
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Post by garbulky on Jul 15, 2020 14:05:24 GMT -5
Pity - despite the measurer claiming so the frequency response is all over the place. he puts it down to room variation, but nevertheless, there are big peaks and dips throughout the Frequency range. The time alignment is also not that great as the tweeter sound arrives 135 ms after the woofer sound. This is an issue because Tekton's new patent is about creating a "time invariant phase coherent" sound. Maybe there's only so much one can do with these larger speakers. Thankfully the man is able to ameliorate this issue with DSP. I'm not sure if DSP is included with these speakers or not... They probably still sound pretty darn good if the Pendragon I heard is any indication. Don't you have that reversed? Quote, "As mentioned above, we see two vertical spikes that are offset in time. First to arrive at our ears are the tweeters and then the woofers." Anyhoot, the frequency response is in room or real world and not in an anechoic chamber. The Ulfs don't come with a DSP. But the R&D stage 21-12 will come with amplification and dsp per tower! You're right. I got that reversed. It's hard to make in room measurements. Usually you are trying to get the measurements closer to the speaker to minimize room effects. Anechoic chambers are very expensive. Axiom Audio uses one. And even then, an anechoic chamber cannot take out all echoes. Amir at Audiosciencereview has a device that simulates an anechoic chamber called Kippell and measures speakers (for free). Only thing is that the speakers have to be sent to him.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2020 14:22:20 GMT -5
Don't you have that reversed? Quote, "As mentioned above, we see two vertical spikes that are offset in time. First to arrive at our ears are the tweeters and then the woofers." Anyhoot, the frequency response is in room or real world and not in an anechoic chamber. The Ulfs don't come with a DSP. But the R&D stage 21-12 will come with amplification and dsp per tower! You're right. I got that reversed. It's hard to make in room measurements. Usually you are trying to get the measurements closer to the speaker to minimize room effects. Anechoic chambers are very expensive. Axiom Audio uses one. And even then, an anechoic chamber cannot take out all echoes. Amir at Audiosciencereview has a device that simulates an anechoic chamber called Kippell and measures speakers (for free). Only thing is that the speakers have to be sent to him. I'm happy to learn that with Tekton's Ulfberhts the other reviewers that raved over these speakers are not being unrealistic. Just a little "real world room correction" and ..... " Here again the target is in grey and John’s loudspeakers do a great job of tracking to the minimum phase target response, with both the natural rise in the low frequencies and roll off at the very top. Virtually ideal, and in the real world, this as good as it gets folks!" Note, I've been a member on the publication that produced this and believe me there aren't many Tekton fan boys there. So coming from them I take this as "awesomality" <--- made up a new word.
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Post by garbulky on Jul 15, 2020 14:41:55 GMT -5
I don't know if I could describe it that way. Using DSP versus stock are two different things. It looks like that's not a "little bit of DSP" but a whole lot of it. Without DSP the stock speaker measures like this in room. First.... 20 db variations are definitely audible so that's not good. Hopefully the person can try treating the room a bit. However, even looking past the bass nodes which are heavily influenced by the room up to about 200 hz, there's still a good amount of variation happening past that. A variation of 6 db across peaks and dips is still audible though not the worst thing out there, but I don't think it could be considered to be that great. The mid rang peaks and dips and even the treble wavers around in the range of 5 db changes. The treble is least likely to be affected by the room, so that's not what one would consider all that good. Though not bad either. On the plus side there is a healthy amount of low frequency power down to 20 hz though it varies tremendously in amplitude. So these speakers can be considered relatively full range units. Should produce a nice full sound imo. I would be very excited to have these speakers. In comparison here is my speaker's measurements. The price has gone up on them to 2k but they used to cost $1300.
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Post by foggy1956 on Jul 15, 2020 15:45:51 GMT -5
I don't know if I could describe it that way. Using DSP versus stock are two different things. It looks like that's not a "little bit of DSP" but a whole lot of it. Without DSP the stock speaker measures like this in room. First.... 20 db variations are definitely audible so that's not good. Hopefully the person can try treating the room a bit. However, even looking past the bass nodes which are heavily influenced by the room up to about 200 hz, there's still a good amount of variation happening past that. A variation of 6 db across peaks and dips is still audible though not the worst thing out there, but I don't think it could be considered to be that great. The mid rang peaks and dips and even the treble wavers around in the range of 5 db changes. The treble is least likely to be affected by the room, so that's not what one would consider all that good. Though not bad either. On the plus side there is a healthy amount of low frequency power down to 20 hz though it varies tremendously in amplitude. So these speakers can be considered relatively full range units. Should produce a nice full sound imo. I would be very excited to have these speakers. In comparison here is my speaker's measurements. The price has gone up on them to 2k but they used to cost $1300. I thought a variation had to span 1/3 of an octave to be audible regardless of depth?
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Post by audiobill on Jul 15, 2020 16:01:49 GMT -5
Gar, have you ever used REW to measure your room?
If so, please post.
Not valid to compare your Axiom's response graph to Shimei's, if measured in different rooms.
Was the Axiom measured in their Anechoic chamber?
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Post by garbulky on Jul 15, 2020 16:29:04 GMT -5
Gar, have you ever used REW to measure your room? If so, please post. Not valid to compare your Axiom's response graph to Shimei's, if measured in different rooms. Was the Axiom measured in their Anechoic chamber? No never measured my room. Axiom is I believe anechoic. Room measurement is always worse especially below 200 h where room effects dominate. However treble information is far less affected by room.
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Post by garbulky on Jul 15, 2020 16:30:03 GMT -5
I don't know if I could describe it that way. Using DSP versus stock are two different things. It looks like that's not a "little bit of DSP" but a whole lot of it. Without DSP the stock speaker measures like this in room. First.... 20 db variations are definitely audible so that's not good. Hopefully the person can try treating the room a bit. However, even looking past the bass nodes which are heavily influenced by the room up to about 200 hz, there's still a good amount of variation happening past that. A variation of 6 db across peaks and dips is still audible though not the worst thing out there, but I don't think it could be considered to be that great. The mid rang peaks and dips and even the treble wavers around in the range of 5 db changes. The treble is least likely to be affected by the room, so that's not what one would consider all that good. Though not bad either. On the plus side there is a healthy amount of low frequency power down to 20 hz though it varies tremendously in amplitude. So these speakers can be considered relatively full range units. Should produce a nice full sound imo. I would be very excited to have these speakers. In comparison here is my speaker's measurements. The price has gone up on them to 2k but they used to cost $1300. I thought a variation had to span 1/3 of an octave to be audible regardless of depth? Interesting. I don’t know the answer to that!
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Post by foggy1956 on Jul 15, 2020 16:30:32 GMT -5
Gar, have you ever used REW to measure your room? If so, please post. Not valid to compare your Axiom's response graph to Shimei's, if measured in different rooms. Was the Axiom measured in their Anechoic chamber? Also curious as to what smoothing was being used in his graph?
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Post by foggy1956 on Jul 15, 2020 16:31:50 GMT -5
I thought a variation had to span 1/3 of an octave to be audible regardless of depth? Interesting. I don’t know the answer to that! Ansat mentioned it while walking me through REW
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Post by audiobill on Jul 15, 2020 16:33:16 GMT -5
Gar, have you ever used REW to measure your room? If so, please post. Not valid to compare your Axiom's response graph to Shimei's, if measured in different rooms. Was the Axiom measured in their Anechoic chamber? No never measured my room. Axiom is I believe anechoic. Room measurement is always worse especially below 200 h where room effects dominate. However treble information is far less affected by room. And that's why you advocate stuffing your room with padding? Hmmmmm....
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Post by foggy1956 on Jul 15, 2020 16:33:36 GMT -5
Gar, have you ever used REW to measure your room? If so, please post. Not valid to compare your Axiom's response graph to Shimei's, if measured in different rooms. Was the Axiom measured in their Anechoic chamber? No never measured my room. Axiom is I believe anechoic. Room measurement is always worse especially below 200 h where room effects dominate. However treble information is far less affected by room. So, the graphs you are posting are completely irrelevant?
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Post by rbk123 on Jul 15, 2020 16:46:52 GMT -5
No never measured my room. Axiom is I believe anechoic. Room measurement is always worse especially below 200 h where room effects dominate. However treble information is far less affected by room. Foggy: So, the graphs you are posting are completely irrelevant? audiobill: And that's why you advocate stuffing your room with padding? Hmmmmm....
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Post by JKCashin on Jul 15, 2020 16:48:09 GMT -5
Thanks, and besides Diana Krall: Madeleine Peyroux Melody Gardot Going to Tidal now to add the recommended artist! Thanks a million. +1 for Melody Gardot... I will have to check out the rest!
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