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Post by boomzilla on Apr 2, 2020 5:20:10 GMT -5
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Post by Cogito on Apr 2, 2020 6:38:23 GMT -5
Gonna need some big outriggers!
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Post by selind40 on Apr 2, 2020 6:50:59 GMT -5
After a 12 pack of a good IPA.......I'd try it.
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novisnick
EmoPhile
CEO Secret Monoblock Society
Posts: 27,223
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Post by novisnick on Apr 2, 2020 8:57:47 GMT -5
Are those a set of new Atmos speakers? You’re goning to need one heck of a mounting system! 😲😁
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 2, 2020 8:59:24 GMT -5
Gonna need some big outriggers! Mother-In-Law sized! And I even know how I'd stick the top ones to the bottoms without needing external braces! Self-adhesive industrial Velcro! Seriously. You'd NEVER accidentally get the tops off the bottoms, and the bond is enhanced with vibration! Perfect.
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Post by mountain on Apr 2, 2020 9:02:19 GMT -5
Reminds me of my old double stacked Advents. Loved them.
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Post by dsonyay on Apr 2, 2020 9:04:30 GMT -5
I really need to listen to the T2s at some point. Not crazy about the physical look.. the angular look.. but it's not a show stopper.
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 2, 2020 9:04:58 GMT -5
And bi-amp them all using a matched set of EIGHT PA-1s! Wretched excess...
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 2, 2020 9:09:12 GMT -5
I really need to listen to the T2s at some point. Not crazy about the physical look.. the angular look.. but it's not a show stopper. Pretty is as pretty sounds. I'm not fond of Emotive's "all black" aesthetic for amps or speakers, but their performance to cost ratio is not to be denied. Once we're done with "social distancing," I'll invite you over to hear them if you'd care to. They really are a world-class speaker and compete (to my ears) with a lot of stuff I've heard in the 5 to 10 thousand a pair range. Of course, setup and amplification are playing a big part, but the modestly-priced T2s are definitely worth hearing.
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Post by dsonyay on Apr 2, 2020 9:11:46 GMT -5
I really need to listen to the T2s at some point. Not crazy about the physical look.. the angular look.. but it's not a show stopper. Pretty is as pretty sounds. I'm not fond of Emotive's "all black" aesthetic for amps or speakers, but their performance to cost ratio is not to be denied. Once we're done with "social distancing," I'll invite you over to hear them if you'd care to. They really are a world-class speaker and compete (to my ears) with a lot of stuff I've heard in the 5 to 10 thousand a pair range. Of course, setup and amplification are playing a big part, but the modestly-priced T2s are definitely worth hearing. Yes.. that would be great.. and would love to hear them with your Emo class D monos
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Post by tom9933 on Apr 2, 2020 18:13:20 GMT -5
Boomzilla , I'm curious what kind of power are you driving them with?? The latest Emo newsletter about a cheap system got me thinking about a set, but it looks like the T2 could be quite power hungry to get them to really perform. I did hear the emo rig at last years Axpona and I remember the system sounding a bit harsh which actually almost kept me from buying the RMC but thankfully I talked to another owner with my same speakers who seemed very happy. I dont need something as high end as my Revels for my PC setup but I'm considering finally upgrading from my old powered Sony SA-VA15 setup... I suppose the other way to skin the cat is to go with a pair of T0 or T1s and then add a pair of subs... I really wanted to hear the new 13 for the theater, its a pity Axpona didnt happen this year
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Post by jackfish on Apr 2, 2020 18:35:56 GMT -5
Reminds me of the stacked double New Large Advents I had years ago driven by two Phase Linear 400 amplifiers. Lobing is a concern if the configuration does not complete an array. My stack sounded great in the sweet spot, but it was a massive wall of sound that dominated a room.
13.3" MacBook Air, 4GB RAM, 256GB SSD, iTunes/BitPerfect MacBook Air SuperDrive Western Digital My Book Essential 2TB USB HD Schiit Bifrost USB DAC and Audioengine D3 DAC Emotiva USP-1, ERC-1 and two UPA-1s Pro-Ject Xpression III and AT440MLa AKAI AT-2600 and Harman Kardon TD4400 Grado SR80i Wharfedale Diamond 225 Magnestand MMG Rythmik Audio F12
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 2, 2020 20:56:37 GMT -5
Boomzilla , I'm curious what kind of power are you driving them with?? Hi tom9933 - I'm driving my T2 speakers with Emotiva PA-1 mono block amplifiers, and it's a VERY good match up. I've also used the Ashly FTX-2001 "pro" amplifier, the Optoma NuForce DDA-120 integrated, and my Heathkit 12-watt mono tube amps. But the star of the show is definitely the PA-1s.
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Post by thompson12 on Apr 2, 2020 21:36:24 GMT -5
Boom curious how the T2's compare to the Pendragons
Mitch
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 2, 2020 21:57:52 GMT -5
Boom curious how the T2's compare to the Pendragons Mitch Requires a longer reply, Mitch - will respond tomorrow.
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 3, 2020 1:11:41 GMT -5
The Pendragon speakers (PDs from here out to type less) had a BIG advantage in the bass. Their dual 10" drivers lorded it over the two 8s in the T2s. The PDs could also be equalized for slightly lower bass. The T2s just go so low and absolutely no lower. The PDs, being a far higher sensitivity speaker, could play more loudly with a lot less power.
But there the PDs advantages end. And end abruptly. The T2s, being a 3-way speaker have a midrange driver that the PDs lack. That midrange driver makes the transition through the midrange absolutely seamless. I could always hear a slight softening of the PDs where those 10" woofers started to beam before the tweeters kicked in. And that change in definition and dispersion in the PDs critical midrange, once noticed, was impossible to ignore. You could sit directly on-axis with the PDs to reduce some of the crossover issues, but when you did, the tweeters were now too bright. You could sit off-axis to tame the tweeters, but when you did, the PDs crossover-range problems became more prominent.
Since "the music lives in the midrange," I'd have to say that the T2s are the better speaker. But the dynamics and jump factor of the PDs were hard to leave. I've not heard the Tekton Double Impact. It would probably retain the virtues of the PDs and fix the PDs crossover issues, but I haven't heard any (and they cost 50% more than the PDs). A really dynamic front end gives the T2s some of the life and jump factor of the PDs - in fact my Auralic Vega (used as a DAC and digital preamp) seem to match the Emotiva PA-1s up with the T2s really, really well. But the PDs sounded their best with a much wider variety of amps and preamps. "Their best" of course, still being marred by their crossover issues.
If you're a head-banger, the PDs are the speaker for you. If you want a mix of chamber music on up, the T2s are more versatile. Keeping in mind that the T2s are half the price of the PDs, they win the "value for the money" race by a mile. But lots of folks love their PDs.
YMMV
Boomzilla
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Post by ttocs on Apr 3, 2020 6:12:28 GMT -5
Couple things, . . . . First, this tape is EXTREMELY strong. Initially it's not at full strength, but with pressure and a little time the strength builds incredibly. Secondly, why stop at 2 pair? How about 2 quads!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2020 11:50:00 GMT -5
The Pendragon speakers (PDs from here out to type less) had a BIG advantage in the bass. Their dual 10" drivers lorded it over the two 8s in the T2s. The PDs could also be equalized for slightly lower bass. The T2s just go so low and absolutely no lower. The PDs, being a far higher sensitivity speaker, could play more loudly with a lot less power. But there the PDs advantages end. And end abruptly. The T2s, being a 3-way speaker have a midrange driver that the PDs lack. That midrange driver makes the transition through the midrange absolutely seamless. I could always hear a slight softening of the PDs where those 10" woofers started to beam before the tweeters kicked in. And that change in definition and dispersion in the PDs critical midrange, once noticed, was impossible to ignore. You could sit directly on-axis with the PDs to reduce some of the crossover issues, but when you did, the tweeters were now too bright. You could sit off-axis to tame the tweeters, but when you did, the PDs crossover-range problems became more prominent. Since "the music lives in the midrange," I'd have to say that the T2s are the better speaker. But the dynamics and jump factor of the PDs were hard to leave. I've not heard the Tekton Double Impact. It would probably retain the virtues of the PDs and fix the PDs crossover issues, but I haven't heard any (and they cost 50% more than the PDs). A really dynamic front end gives the T2s some of the life and jump factor of the PDs - in fact my Auralic Vega (used as a DAC and digital preamp) seem to match the Emotiva PA-1s up with the T2s really, really well. But the PDs sounded their best with a much wider variety of amps and preamps. "Their best" of course, still being marred by their crossover issues. If you're a head-banger, the PDs are the speaker for you. If you want a mix of chamber music on up, the T2s are more versatile. Keeping in mind that the T2s are half the price of the PDs, they win the "value for the money" race by a mile. But lots of folks love their PDs. YMMV Boomzilla I haven't listened to the Pendragons before but noticed Tekton's Pendragon product description: "Now with a recent voicing and X-over update to further its exacting resolution and detail, the mighty Pendragon is sounding better than ever!" I also read your review here, Glenn [correct me if wrong]: hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/speaker/floor-standing/tekton-design-pendragon-tower-speakers-review/I see that review was written in 2016 and there's no date given on the Tekton product page as to when the update to the X-overs began. Quick questions, 1) do you currently have the Pendragons for an A B comparison and 2) are the Pendragons you listened or are listening to the updated versions? I enjoyed your write up on the Pendragons. What stuck out to me was when stating"If you choose to sit directly on the horizontal axis of the tweeter array and within its vertical envelope, you’ll hear any treble issues in the recording or in the upstream components. With high quality components and good recordings, this isn’t a problem." I find this very interesting because I've recently made component changes to my system [on my 3rd amp within 4 months now]. I understand 1 speaker may be more detailed thereby exposing any weakness in upstream components. However, perhaps you could take the time if convenient to touch upon why some speakers don't reveal component quality issues? And why do some speakers play pretty bad recordings/formats ok when other speakers expose issues in not only components but musical recording? As a lot of people here probably know I own Tekton speakers, and I've struggled with them for some time until recently. I plan to write another page of my own amateur review on a different Tekton product but the issue of how telling or critical the speakers are is almost like them forcing a conversation and shifting the topic matter to the components upstream. Enjoy, William
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Post by boomzilla on Apr 3, 2020 15:28:00 GMT -5
...Quick questions, 1) do you currently have the Pendragons for an A B comparison and 2) are the Pendragons you listened or are listening to the updated versions? Hi 2shimei - No, I don't have my Pendragons anymore. I let them go to a friend who really wanted them. No, my Pendragons were not the updated versions. ...I enjoyed your write up on the Pendragons. What stuck out to me was when stating"If you choose to sit directly on the horizontal axis of the tweeter array and within its vertical envelope, you’ll hear any treble issues in the recording or in the upstream components. With high quality components and good recordings, this isn’t a problem." I find this very interesting because I've recently made component changes to my system [on my 3rd amp within 4 months now]. I understand 1 speaker may be more detailed thereby exposing any weakness in upstream components. However, perhaps you could take the time if convenient to touch upon why some speakers don't reveal component quality issues? And why do some speakers play pretty bad recordings/formats ok when other speakers expose issues in not only components but musical recording? Excellent questions, I'll give them my best shot, but others may differ... A speaker that I recently had that was very forgiving was a vintage Dynaco A25: The two-way Dynacos do most of their midrange with that woofer, and the lack of quick transient response just relaxes the entire presentation. The speakers image well, and sound sweet and rich, but they just aren't the last word in midrange resolution. If I had to pontificate on why some speakers are so analytical toward upstream components, I'd put my finger on the upper midrange to lower treble response. The "faster" a speaker responds in this particular frequency band (a range that the human ear is HIGHLY sensitive to), the greater the listener can hear "into the recording," but also the more you can hear recording flaws. Now some speakers present a "fast" impression in this critical range by overshooting the waveform and distorting or else by slightly emphasizing this "presence" range. THOSE speakers grate on the ears very quickly. And since it's a very difficult range to get right, lots of money gets spent on design there. It's difficult to get drivers that are both quick and have a wide bandwidth with uniform dispersion. All of those characteristics matter greatly. If you're trying to get a smooth blend between drivers, there are books written about balancing the critical factors - speed, bandwidth, and dispersion. One of the greatest speaker designers that ever lived, IMHO, was the late, great Jim Thiel. As a lot of people here probably know I own Tekton speakers, and I've struggled with them for some time until recently. I plan to write another page of my own amateur review on a different Tekton product but the issue of how telling or critical the speakers are is almost like them forcing a conversation and shifting the topic matter to the components upstream I think that the Tektons are probably getting better since I bought mine. In fact, if I ran across a used pair of Double Impact SE models, I'd be hard-pressed to resist. If I won the lottery, I might even consider some 1812s - But I digress... I'd think (speculating, here) that with a Tekton model using the midrange drivers, you'd get a much smoother frequency response (particularly in the critical midrange) than with the 10-inch, two-way models such as the Pendragon. But since I haven't heard either the newest Pendragons OR the new Tekton designs using the "circular tweeter array," I'm just guessing. Best of luck!
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Post by Hair Nick on Apr 3, 2020 15:35:58 GMT -5
Man...am I going to have to try this at the office?! I'll need an XPA-4.
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