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Post by frenchyfranky on May 21, 2020 19:18:10 GMT -5
Is somebody has noticed that the sound to tv in standby video always on mode when the XMC-2 is off, making static and crackling noise? Same annoying noise always present by the spdif optical output in standby or even on full powered mode.
I reinstalled back the firmware version 1.9 and nothing of the above noise append. Reinstalled the version 1.10 , and the problem reappear.
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Post by megash0n on May 21, 2020 19:19:07 GMT -5
5) Again. dts Neural:X processing on my XMC-2 sounds bad. I have tried it on stereo & 5.1 PCM and 2.0 dts, 5.1 dts and 7.1 dts. The cause needs to be found and fixed, firstly for the poor sound result and secondly for the forced and unnecessary activation of it. In the meantime I do not want to listen to (and should not have to accept) contamination of the soundfield of my +£20,000 home theatre with this processor's implementation of Neural:X activating incorrectly for 7.1 to 7.1 playback with smearing of the fronts and the same in simple 5.1 to 7.1 upmixing. Simple volume decrease I could deal with by using the volume control. Smeared I cannot. Yesterday another user posted a comparison of volume with "Direct" to "Surround" to "Neural:X" (although this was in a 7.2.4 configuration so may not be comparable, and I am unsure what method was used to toggle and confirm action between these Surround Modes given my findings, above, in 2). No difference in volume noted, so at odds with those of us that get a definite OBVIOUS audible volume drop which I measured on my Radioshack as -4 to -6db (movie soundtrack playing so it's hard to get level sund pressure!) This is the one that really surprised me. 5.1 upmixed to 7.1 shouldn't have any effect on the front soundstage. Yet engaging Neural:X without any height or width speakers somehow killed the dynamics of the front three speakers. I didn't try measuring it, but you'd have to b e very hard of hearing not to notice the smearing marc is mentioning. I'm watching Quantum of Solace right now. DTS MA 5.1. We started in the loud scene, but I switched it back to neural quickly just to check. The wife immediately said that sounds much worse and noticeably lower volume. And, "it has no balls". All the vibrant midrange was gone. Bass response was way down. It just sounded bad all around. I did like to up mixing to the height channels, but everything else was awful. We quickly switched back to Surround mode and have been enjoying that very much. The audio in this movie is very dynamic. |
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on May 21, 2020 19:51:23 GMT -5
Is somebody has noticed that the sound to tv in standby video always on mode when the XMC-2 is off, making static and crackling noise? Same annoying noise always present by the spdif optical output in standby or even on full powered mode. I reinstalled back the firmware version 1.9 and nothing of the above noise append. Reinstalled the version 1.10 , and the problem reappear. Is this noise only on device using Optical? If yes, try changing the audio to HDMI. There is a known issue with Optical. Is the audio mode Dolby? If yes, try changing the audio to PCM. There is an issue with Dolby while in Video Remains On standby. |
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Post by frenchyfranky on May 21, 2020 20:46:47 GMT -5
Is somebody has noticed that the sound to tv in standby video always on mode when the XMC-2 is off, making static and crackling noise? Same annoying noise always present by the spdif optical output in standby or even on full powered mode. I reinstalled back the firmware version 1.9 and nothing of the above noise append. Reinstalled the version 1.10 , and the problem reappear. Is this noise only on device using Optical? If yes, try changing the audio to HDMI. There is a known issue with Optical. Is the audio mode Dolby? If yes, try changing the audio to PCM. There is an issue with Dolby while in Video Remains On standby. 1) No, HDMI- standby- tv speakers or XMC-2 optical output 2) XMC-2 optical output is noisy all the time, standby or full powered on. |
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on May 21, 2020 21:32:09 GMT -5
Is somebody has noticed that the sound to tv in standby video always on mode when the XMC-2 is off, making static and crackling noise? Same annoying noise always present by the spdif optical output in standby or even on full powered mode. I reinstalled back the firmware version 1.9 and nothing of the above noise append. Reinstalled the version 1.10 , and the problem reappear. With my XMC-2 there is staticky noise when in VOS (amp off). No noise with amp on. Using Dolby Digital. Using HDMI. Emotiva is aware. |
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Post by denali on May 21, 2020 22:25:50 GMT -5
I have the same static noise problem with my TV speakers just like Frenchyfranky and Cawgijoe have. My TV is a 2018 LG OLED C8 77” and I am using the XMC-2 HDMI 2 output to the ARC HDMI input on my TV. I get this static on all inputs including HDMI, USB Audio and analog when the XMC-2 is in “Video Remains On” mode. When the XMC-2 is fully on I do not get the static through my main speakers. Firmware 1.9 did not have this problem but 1.9.x and 1.10 does.
I have spoken with Damon about it, he said they are able to reproduce it and are working on a fix. I hope the fix comes soon as I find it very annoying.
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Post by bitzerjdb on May 21, 2020 22:29:19 GMT -5
Quick update, I re-installed all the equipment in the new family room. I had updated the RMC to the latest firmware already. Good news, switching is a lot faster and the Double flash during the Sync was gone! Bad News, my Tivo Bolt is still having issues. At 1080i it syncs fine... with any of the 4K choices the screen is a nice shade of green. The green is an improvement, before I would not get any video at all. I tried a few new cables, same symptom with all of them.
The Bolt works perfectly connected directly to the Sony TV. For giggles I even tried an old non 4K cable (Active) and the Bolt on "Auto" went right to 4K. I could skip ahead/back without any glitches.
Again, this is an improvement, previously, 1080i from the Bolt would only sometimes sync (and usually would require a power down of the RMC (and the Tivo) to get it to work). It now was pretty solid.
Thanks Emotiva for all the work, this new Firmware is a major step forward.
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Post by bluescale on May 22, 2020 0:17:48 GMT -5
This is the one that really surprised me. 5.1 upmixed to 7.1 shouldn't have any effect on the front soundstage. Yet engaging Neural:X without any height or width speakers somehow killed the dynamics of the front three speakers. I didn't try measuring it, but you'd have to b e very hard of hearing not to notice the smearing marc is mentioning. I'm watching Quantum of Solace right now. DTS MA 5.1. We started in the loud scene, but I switched it back to neural quickly just to check. The wife immediately said that sounds much worse and noticeably lower volume. And, "it has no balls". All the vibrant midrange was gone. Bass response was way down. It just sounded bad all around. I did like to up mixing to the height channels, but everything else was awful. We quickly switched back to Surround mode and have been enjoying that very much. The audio in this movie is very dynamic. It's interesting that you've twice now noted that you feel like the bass response is gone with Neural:X, when this wasn't my experience. LFE definitely felt robust as far as I can remember. What is your crossover frequency? I wonder if the upmixer is leaving the sub alone, but killing other speakers. I'm crossing over at 90hz. While there's a lot of good midbass still above 90, if you're crossing over lower, say 40 or even 60, things like gunshots will have a lot more energy emanating from your mains vs. mine. |
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Post by junchoon on May 22, 2020 1:10:36 GMT -5
When we accept a DSD signal directly, and it shows up on the display as "DSD", it is passed directly to the DAC chips. There is no way we could alter the frequency response even if we wanted to (without first converting it to PCM).
Continuing from the old rmc-1 thread The reason why I ask about the high frequencies of DSD is because when I switch from marantz av7005 to Xmc-1 the sparkles of high frequencies are not there. As if xmc-1 has truncated the signals? I don’t use DIRAC In XMC-1 when dealing with dsd as dirac can’t process dsd. No room correction software in the world can deal with dsd anyway. The mode I use is reference stereo. Are the newer prepros from Emotiva retain the high frequencies? Thanks Looks like an issue on the setting then as I see it is showing 24-bit 48khz no matter if I use xlr or hdmi under reference stereo Will report back Thanks. |
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Post by markc on May 22, 2020 5:01:28 GMT -5
Quick update, I re-installed all the equipment in the new family room. I had updated the RMC to the latest firmware already. Good news, switching is a lot faster and the Double flash during the Sync was gone! Bad News, my Tivo Bolt is still having issues. At 1080i it syncs fine... with any of the 4K choices the screen is a nice shade of green. The green is an improvement, before I would not get any video at all. I tried a few new cables, same symptom with all of them. The Bolt works perfectly connected directly to the Sony TV. For giggles I even tried an old non 4K cable (Active) and the Bolt on "Auto" went right to 4K. I could skip ahead/back without any glitches. Again, this is an improvement, previously, 1080i from the Bolt would only sometimes sync (and usually would require a power down of the RMC (and the Tivo) to get it to work). It now was pretty solid. Thanks Emotiva for all the work, this new Firmware is a major step forward. The green screen makes me think it is an RGB vs YPbPr incompatibility, or possibly an Full range colour vs Limited range I get this on my HTPC if the handshake is incorrect. My guess is the RMC screen says it is getting a Component signal (YPbPr) but the Tivo is outputting RGB I have no experience of the Tivo, but check all the settings in the Tivo configuration about colourspace / output format / Component(YPbPr) (GOOD to use)/RGB / Limited Range / Full Range(GOOD to use) and then do a power down of all devices in the chain and restart to initiate an HDMI handshake |
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Post by markc on May 22, 2020 5:04:19 GMT -5
When we accept a DSD signal directly, and it shows up on the display as "DSD", it is passed directly to the DAC chips. There is no way we could alter the frequency response even if we wanted to (without first converting it to PCM).
Looks like an issue on the setting then as I see it is showing 24-bit 48khz no matter if I use xlr or hdmi under reference stereo Will report back Thanks. You shouldn't be seeing anything but DSD Direct if you truly have a device passing DSD over an HDMI connection If you are seeing any bits or any sample rates, then you are getting PCM |
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Post by markc on May 22, 2020 5:13:58 GMT -5
I'm watching Quantum of Solace right now. DTS MA 5.1. We started in the loud scene, but I switched it back to neural quickly just to check. The wife immediately said that sounds much worse and noticeably lower volume. And, "it has no balls". All the vibrant midrange was gone. Bass response was way down. It just sounded bad all around. I did like to up mixing to the height channels, but everything else was awful. We quickly switched back to Surround mode and have been enjoying that very much. The audio in this movie is very dynamic. It's interesting that you've twice now noted that you feel like the bass response is gone with Neural:X, when this wasn't my experience. LFE definitely felt robust as far as I can remember. What is your crossover frequency? I wonder if the upmixer is leaving the sub alone, but killing other speakers. I'm crossing over at 90hz. While there's a lot of good midbass still above 90, if you're crossing over lower, say 40 or even 60, things like gunshots will have a lot more energy emanating from your mains vs. mine. I doubt this is the case. It is not just over a few Hz bandwidth at the subwoofer crossover that is missing. Vocals are muted, everything is muted. (I don't mean just in volume, I mean localisation, reverb) Just the vocal deficit means that the 300 to 3400 Hz range is affected. Bluescale, can I ask you to experiment with the way you change surround mode while listening, as per point 2 in my post, just to see if you can provoke the Neural:X bad effect. Also, what speaker configuration are you and Megashon running. Mine is 7.2 (I forgot I have the Buttkicker set up as Subwoofer 2) I repeatedly found that the Neural:X wasn't even engaging when selected, depending on how it was selected. |
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Post by junchoon on May 22, 2020 5:23:26 GMT -5
Looks like an issue on the setting then as I see it is showing 24-bit 48khz no matter if I use xlr or hdmi under reference stereo Will report back Thanks. You shouldn't be seeing anything but DSD Direct if you truly have a device passing DSD over an HDMI connection If you are seeing any bits or any sample rates, then you are getting PCM Yeah but I am not sure why it is showing bits even for analog input Thanks |
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Post by megash0n on May 22, 2020 6:28:38 GMT -5
I'm watching Quantum of Solace right now. DTS MA 5.1. We started in the loud scene, but I switched it back to neural quickly just to check. The wife immediately said that sounds much worse and noticeably lower volume. And, "it has no balls". All the vibrant midrange was gone. Bass response was way down. It just sounded bad all around. I did like to up mixing to the height channels, but everything else was awful. We quickly switched back to Surround mode and have been enjoying that very much. The audio in this movie is very dynamic. It's interesting that you've twice now noted that you feel like the bass response is gone with Neural:X, when this wasn't my experience. LFE definitely felt robust as far as I can remember. What is your crossover frequency? I wonder if the upmixer is leaving the sub alone, but killing other speakers. I'm crossing over at 90hz. While there's a lot of good midbass still above 90, if you're crossing over lower, say 40 or even 60, things like gunshots will have a lot more energy emanating from your mains vs. mine. I cross my mains at 70hz. |
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Post by megash0n on May 22, 2020 6:33:34 GMT -5
It's interesting that you've twice now noted that you feel like the bass response is gone with Neural:X, when this wasn't my experience. LFE definitely felt robust as far as I can remember. What is your crossover frequency? I wonder if the upmixer is leaving the sub alone, but killing other speakers. I'm crossing over at 90hz. While there's a lot of good midbass still above 90, if you're crossing over lower, say 40 or even 60, things like gunshots will have a lot more energy emanating from your mains vs. mine. I doubt this is the case. It is not just over a few Hz bandwidth at the subwoofer crossover that is missing. Vocals are muted, everything is muted. (I don't mean just in volume, I mean localisation, reverb) Just the vocal deficit means that the 300 to 3400 Hz range is affected. Bluescale, can I ask you to experiment with the way you change surround mode while listening, as per point 2 in my post, just to see if you can provoke the Neural:X bad effect. Also, what speaker configuration are you and Megashon running. Mine is 7.2 (I forgot I have the Buttkicker set up as Subwoofer 2) I repeatedly found that the Neural:X wasn't even engaging when selected, depending on how it was selected. 5.1.4 All Emotiva gear except for subs. I use center mono sub that outputs to a balanced MiniDSP that controls 2 12 inch subs. I guess technically that is 5.2.4 depending on which angle you view from. 😃 |
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Post by bitzerjdb on May 22, 2020 7:02:02 GMT -5
Quick update, I re-installed all the equipment in the new family room. I had updated the RMC to the latest firmware already. Good news, switching is a lot faster and the Double flash during the Sync was gone! Bad News, my Tivo Bolt is still having issues. At 1080i it syncs fine... with any of the 4K choices the screen is a nice shade of green. The green is an improvement, before I would not get any video at all. I tried a few new cables, same symptom with all of them. The Bolt works perfectly connected directly to the Sony TV. For giggles I even tried an old non 4K cable (Active) and the Bolt on "Auto" went right to 4K. I could skip ahead/back without any glitches. Again, this is an improvement, previously, 1080i from the Bolt would only sometimes sync (and usually would require a power down of the RMC (and the Tivo) to get it to work). It now was pretty solid. Thanks Emotiva for all the work, this new Firmware is a major step forward. The green screen makes me think it is an RGB vs YPbPr incompatibility, or possibly an Full range colour vs Limited range I get this on my HTPC if the handshake is incorrect. My guess is the RMC screen says it is getting a Component signal (YPbPr) but the Tivo is outputting RGB I have no experience of the Tivo, but check all the settings in the Tivo configuration about colourspace / output format / Component(YPbPr) (GOOD to use)/RGB / Limited Range / Full Range(GOOD to use) and then do a power down of all devices in the chain and restart to initiate an HDMI handshake Tivo doesn't allow you to change the HDMI settings, it only allows you to set the video resolution. I did see one other setting HDR (set to Auto), will try turning it off. At least the equipment rack is pulled out so it is easy to swap cables. Thanks! |
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Post by geebo on May 22, 2020 7:08:05 GMT -5
You shouldn't be seeing anything but DSD Direct if you truly have a device passing DSD over an HDMI connection If you are seeing any bits or any sample rates, then you are getting PCM Yeah but I am not sure why it is showing bits even for analog input Thanks Are you playing an SACD? Are you sure it's not the redbook layer that may be playing? Are you connected via HDMI? |
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Post by junchoon on May 22, 2020 7:23:33 GMT -5
Yeah but I am not sure why it is showing bits even for analog input Thanks Are you playing an SACD? Are you sure it's not the redbook layer that may be playing? Are you connected via HDMI? Xlr input 7 and hdmi input 1 Both shows 24bits |
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Post by geebo on May 22, 2020 7:28:59 GMT -5
Are you playing an SACD? Are you sure it's not the redbook layer that may be playing? Are you connected via HDMI? Xlr input 7 and hdmi input 1 Both shows 24bits Those are the numbers shown when playing a redbook CD. Is there a setting on your player for which layer to play? |
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ttocs
Global Moderator
I always have a wonderful time, wherever I am, whomever I'm with. (Elwood P Dowd)
Posts: 8,152
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Post by ttocs on May 22, 2020 7:39:16 GMT -5
The green screen makes me think it is an RGB vs YPbPr incompatibility, or possibly an Full range colour vs Limited range I get this on my HTPC if the handshake is incorrect. My guess is the RMC screen says it is getting a Component signal (YPbPr) but the Tivo is outputting RGB I have no experience of the Tivo, but check all the settings in the Tivo configuration about colourspace / output format / Component(YPbPr) (GOOD to use)/RGB / Limited Range / Full Range(GOOD to use) and then do a power down of all devices in the chain and restart to initiate an HDMI handshake Tivo doesn't allow you to change the HDMI settings, it only allows you to set the video resolution. I did see one other setting HDR (set to Auto), will try turning it off. At least the equipment rack is pulled out so it is easy to swap cables. Thanks! Is your Sony tv input set to "Enhanced Format" ? |
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