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Post by 405x5 on Nov 22, 2024 8:21:34 GMT -5
“The competition for a good reproduction sound system is a table radio. In 2024, the table radio is still winning.” I don’t know, but you did inspire me (and I thank you for that) to whip out my beloved fisher 100 for a photo op! …… given to me by my beloved parents as a Christmas gift, this is an acoustic suspension table radio and the year was 1971.  no information overload back in those days… I’d get home after work at the ripe old age of 16 and scan the FM waves for jazz that was to my liking. Besides getting out to the clubs, this was the only way to do it. |
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klinemj
Emo VIPs 
Official Emofest Scribe
Posts: 15,100
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Post by klinemj on Nov 22, 2024 8:24:07 GMT -5
That's a great story ... must have been a lot of fun to do that! It was a blast. At one point, we ordered pizza for delivery, and we told them to just come into the dorm and walk toward the music. (The room was a large private dining room in our dorm, and there was no room number to give them. We found they'd moved all the tables and chairs out, and we asked and got access to it over Christmas break) Also, one thing we listened to was U2's Boy album. On that, Larry Mullen Jr., the drummer for U2, recorded drums for the album in a stairwell at Windmill Lane Studios in Dublin. Sounded awesome! Mark |
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Post by PaulBe on Nov 22, 2024 8:25:56 GMT -5
The "large room/remove the back wall" comments remind of a time in college my friend and I got access to a very large room. It was ~20' wide and over 50' long. We set our stereo up in it and played around for a full 2 days. We tried my speakers and his, my amp and his, combinations of them, and sourced it all with my Thorens TT with a Dynavector high output moving coil (this was pre-CD days). The sound was so different (and much better) than in our tiny dorm rooms (which had tile floors and hard, reflective walls). Fun times... Mark Decades ago, in a previous home, I ran my system in the unfinished basement. The space was 28' x 52'. The only obstacles in the room were the furnace and water heater. The system was bi-amped Audire full range dipole ribbon speakers and stereo 24" Hartley Subwoofers in transmission lines. It was just about perfect. |
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Post by PaulBe on Nov 22, 2024 8:38:53 GMT -5
“The competition for a good reproduction sound system is a table radio. In 2024, the table radio is still winning.” I don’t know, but you did inspire me (and I thank you for that) to whip out my beloved fisher 100 for a photo op! …… given to me by my beloved parents as a Christmas gift, this is an acoustic suspension table radio and the year was 1971. View Attachmentno information overload back in those days… I’d get home after work at the ripe old age of 16 and scan the FM waves for jazz that was to my liking. Besides getting out to the clubs, this was the only way to do it. I received a similar AM Phillips tube radio when I was about 13. I don't recall if it was Christmas or Birthday. It sat in the library headboard of my bed. Beautiful old AM tube sound floating around my head when I laid down... I lived in the Missouri Ozarks then. Country, Blue Grass, Some early Pop and Rock. A favorite song was 'Ferry Cross the Mersey" by Gerry and the Pacemakers. |
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Post by 405x5 on Nov 22, 2024 9:02:36 GMT -5
I received a similar AM Phillips tube radio when I was about 13. I don't recall if it was Christmas or Birthday. It sat in the library headboard of my bed. Beautiful old AM tube sound floating around my head when I laid down... I lived in the Missouri Ozarks then. Country, Blue Grass, Some early Pop and Rock. A favorite song was 'Ferry Cross the Mersey" by Gerry and the Pacemakers. I think a few more pop songs back in the day got more airtime than that one for sure. |
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Post by PaulBe on Nov 22, 2024 10:03:31 GMT -5
I received a similar AM Phillips tube radio when I was about 13. I don't recall if it was Christmas or Birthday. It sat in the library headboard of my bed. Beautiful old AM tube sound floating around my head when I laid down... I lived in the Missouri Ozarks then. Country, Blue Grass, Some early Pop and Rock. A favorite song was 'Ferry Cross the Mersey" by Gerry and the Pacemakers. I think a few more pop songs back in the day got more airtime than that one for sure. It was a favorite song of mine that came to mind. I still like it. It's not like I had a repeat button on my old radio. Some of the music I like, have, and remember is a reflection of popularity. Some... |
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Post by 405x5 on Nov 22, 2024 11:07:06 GMT -5
I think a few more pop songs back in the day got more airtime than that one for sure. It was a favorite song of mine that came to mind. I still like it. It's not like I had a repeat button on my old radio. Some of the music I like, have, and remember is a reflection of popularity. Some... oh sorry, my bad on a typo… And very interesting how one letter can change everything!
It was supposed to read.
I Think FEW more pop songs( not a few) back in the day got more airtime lol. |
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Post by PaulBe on Nov 22, 2024 11:24:45 GMT -5
It was a favorite song of mine that came to mind. I still like it. It's not like I had a repeat button on my old radio. Some of the music I like, have, and remember is a reflection of popularity. Some... oh sorry, my bad on a typo… And very interesting how one letter can change everything!
It was supposed to read.
I Think FEW more pop songs( not a few) back in the day got more airtime lol. Ha! Yes it does. I did begin to wonder if the song was more popular where I lived. America isn't monolithic. |
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KeithL
Administrator 
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Post by KeithL on Nov 22, 2024 11:39:37 GMT -5
Agreed entirely... And, these days, MOST recordings were actually made or at least mixed in a recording studio. So, at the very least, that gives us a target to aim for. Although, of course, every studio is different too... (Although, I guess, we can hope that Atmos will lead to a bit of standardization there). But, for a real live acoustic performance, we haven't got a chance... Just try and map the direction that each of the harmonics is radiated by each instrument... Every instrument has different directional characteristics... And, for many of them, multiples... (Even for a simple acoustic guitar, the sound comes off the strings one way, and off the body a different way...) Then map how they all bounce off the floor, walls, and ceiling of a room... And that guy with the violin... If he's holding it horizontally then the sound from the strings is bouncing off the floor and ceiling as well as coming straight at you... But, if he holds it more vertically, less of that sound will be bouncing off the floor and ceiling, but more will be bouncing off the side walls. And our human brains are absurdly good at picking out this sort of stuff... Which is why, if I'm laying in bed, listening through the open door, I can sometimes tell which other room in the house a sound is coming from. There's no way any number of speakers is going to reproduce that exactly... Binaural has a chance... but it's just too fussy... and apparently nobody wants to bother... And, yes, if you go back fifty years, what most people actually listened to was "a table radio"... Or maybe "that big stereo console in the living room"... And now that table radio has largely been replaced by a little white plastic box on the table in the corner (of every room)... Or, for the younger crowd, with a phone and a pair of ear buds. ............................ The answer is Yes. It doesn't matter how the recording is made if a reproduction system, including the room, is the same as the production monitoring system. Hell will freeze over when that happens. All recording techniques are right if they serve the art. Perspective is created by the engineering whether the source is acoustic or electronic. The competition for a good reproduction sound system is a table radio. In 2024, the table radio is still winning. ~~~~~ ...................... |
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KeithL
Administrator
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Post by KeithL on Nov 22, 2024 11:53:20 GMT -5
Thanks... and that was my real point... Everyone is always searching for the Holy Grail... And, every time a new room correction system comes out, everyone thinks that, just maybe, this time.... THIS IS IT ! THIS IS THE ONE THAT WILL WORK PERFECTLY, FOR EVERY SYSTEM, IN EVERY ROOM !And they just have to have it, can't live without it, and just know that life will be perfect once they get it.And, annoyingly... Every manufacturer wants to be the one to sell it to you... And every reviewer wants to be the one who found it and announced it to the world... And every customer wants to be assured that they've finally got the perfect solution... And it gets way too easy to get caught up in that never-ending chase... And sometimes it gets so frenetic that we lose sight entirely of exactly what it is we're chasing... I personally have no interest whatsoever in room correction... I just want my system to sound good (by my standard of what that means)... And, if a certain sort of room correction will get me there, then I'll use it... But it's never going to be the goal... It's just a piece of the puzzle... As you said, and I agree with you – “ALL of these sorts of solutions are compromises, but in different ways, and for different reasons.” I don’t have a compromise solution Dog in this discussion. I have a solution that works for me in my home space. Sound reproduction is Not sound recreation. It is an analogy. .......................................... |
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Post by PaulBe on Nov 22, 2024 12:32:37 GMT -5
Agreed entirely... And, these days, MOST recordings were actually made or at least mixed in a recording studio. So, at the very least, that gives us a target to aim for. Although, of course, every studio is different too... (Although, I guess, we can hope that Atmos will lead to a bit of standardization there). But, for a real live acoustic performance, we haven't got a chance... Just try and map the direction that each of the harmonics is radiated by each instrument... Every instrument has different directional characteristics... And, for many of them, multiples... (Even for a simple acoustic guitar, the sound comes off the strings one way, and off the body a different way...) Then map how they all bounce off the floor, walls, and ceiling of a room... And that guy with the violin... If he's holding it horizontally then the sound from the strings is bouncing off the floor and ceiling as well as coming straight at you... But, if he holds it more vertically, less of that sound will be bouncing off the floor and ceiling, but more will be bouncing off the side walls. And our human brains are absurdly good at picking out this sort of stuff... Which is why, if I'm laying in bed, listening through the open door, I can sometimes tell which other room in the house a sound is coming from. There's no way any number of speakers is going to reproduce that exactly... Binaural has a chance... but it's just too fussy... and apparently nobody wants to bother... And, yes, if you go back fifty years, what most people actually listened to was "a table radio"... Or maybe "that big stereo console in the living room"... And now that table radio has largely been replaced by a little white plastic box on the table in the corner (of every room)... Or, for the younger crowd, with a phone and a pair of ear buds. The answer is Yes. It doesn't matter how the recording is made if a reproduction system, including the room, is the same as the production monitoring system. Hell will freeze over when that happens. All recording techniques are right if they serve the art. Perspective is created by the engineering whether the source is acoustic or electronic. The competition for a good reproduction sound system is a table radio. In 2024, the table radio is still winning. ~~~~~ ...................... We are agreeing again. Scary. The only points in an acoustic recording chain are the microphone input-destinations. As you clearly state, acoustic instruments have variable directional characteristics. The most natural recordings I have are Ambisonic, mic-tree, Stereo PZM, and 5.1 Holophone mic recordings. The 5.1 Holophone recording makes the room disappear. |
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ttocs
Global Moderator
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Post by ttocs on Nov 22, 2024 12:47:45 GMT -5
I just want my system to sound good (by my standard of what that means)... This. |
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