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Post by pynchon on Feb 24, 2010 17:50:07 GMT -5
Yes, it´s easily a deal breaker for those of us having better video processors in the chain, but still want to upgrade our sound processor. I have no idea what Emotiva´s product/market strategy for their processors is, but I simply want to give my honest opinion of their current design as I see it. I don´t have to buy an Emotiva processor if I don´t feel it´s right for me, but being a happy owner of other Emotiva products I´d be seriously considering the XMC if it does not have the same video limitation as the UMC. Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv I personally wouldn't classify the 480i "issue" as a major one, but for you it clearly is. So therefore it is important. But isn't there an easy workaround for this - move your VP ahead of the UMC-1 and use pass-thru mode. This assumes, of course, that in pass-through mode that the signal is, in fact, not altered in any way. You shouldn't even have to do that if your VP has an hdmi audio only like the dvdo edge does - that is specifically designed to connect to an audio processor to allow your VP to do any and all video processing. Absolutely no video goes through the umc-1 that way. |
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Post by pmd918 on Feb 24, 2010 18:00:28 GMT -5
I personally wouldn't classify the 480i "issue" as a major one, but for you it clearly is. So therefore it is important. But isn't there an easy workaround for this - move your VP ahead of the UMC-1 and use pass-thru mode. This assumes, of course, that in pass-through mode that the signal is, in fact, not altered in any way. You shouldn't even have to do that if your VP has an hdmi audio only like the dvdo edge does - that is specifically designed to connect to an audio processor to allow your VP to do any and all video processing. Absolutely no video goes through the umc-1 that way. Very good point. |
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Post by 0pter0n on Feb 24, 2010 18:31:30 GMT -5
At the risk of incurring the wrath and contempt of the participants:
As I understand it, the forced upconvert of 480i to 480p means that CRT users cannot use the UMC-1 for standard broadcasting.
I base this assumption on the fact that my Sony cannot handle 480p from DirectTV and must have the 480i setting.
Why haven't I moved up to an LCD or Plasma? Well, I have perfect blacks and no smearing of action and sufficient resolution for my eyes with this setup.
What annoys me about this issue is that there was no compelling need for the UMC-1 to fail to pass through 480i. Pure and simple, this is a design chopice that didn;t have to be made. No amount of Lonnie's assertions that this is "by design" changes the fact that he made a choice he didn't have to make and needlessly ruled out my current setup. This is the same as deciding to eliminate multi-channel from stereo input - as far as I can tell, there was no compelling reason to do this either. If my several years'old NAD T-163 can offer multi-channel processing from a 2- channel source, while providing excellent 2 channel sound when asked to do so, so could the UMC-1.
Look, every product carries with it certain assumptions about the users. What I find disappointing here is that needless exclusions were decided upon.
I expected better from Emotiva.
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Post by loopinfool on Feb 24, 2010 18:45:01 GMT -5
As I understand it, the forced upconvert of 480i to 480p means that CRT users cannot use the UMC-1 for standard broadcasting. I base this assumption on the fact that my Sony cannot handle 480p from DirectTV and must have the 480i setting. I'm quite sure this "forced upconvert" only applies to the HDMI output. The manual states that Component inputs will be passed through unchanged. I don't know the limitations of the HDMI->Component cross-conversion. It could be limited to 480p minimum, but I suspect it can handle 480i. The manual states it goes "up to 1080i" for non copy-protected sources, but doesn't specify the minimum resolution. If it matters to you, you should call Emotiva and find out if the UMC-1 will do what you need. - LoopinFool |
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Post by 0pter0n on Feb 25, 2010 11:21:02 GMT -5
That's a good point, Loopin (if I may be informal) and I thank you for pointing this out. It would make sense and I'll have to look into this more closely, instead of assuming that my reading of the manual was accurate.
Actually, so many problems have been reported with HDMI that I am not anxious to use it even after I get an HD screen.
I just took delivery of a BDP-80, which is most impressive and, so long as I can get Dolby (via the digital output), not being able to get enhanced DTS or other HDMI-only audio is no big deal for me...
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Post by owtuv on Feb 25, 2010 15:53:58 GMT -5
I understand this will not work for your particular application, but just for clarification, it was done this way by design and is not a limitation as you would suggest. The UMC was designed from the start to be both a VP and AP. In my opinion, I would dare say the scaler in the UMC will easily compete with even the best stand a lone units out there. The Vixen system is really outstanding but like I said this is jsut my opinion. :) Hi Lonnie, Well, I never actually intended to buy the UMC, but rather wait for the XMC. Since the two processors are basically based upon the same platform, I fear the same limitation might apply to the XMC as well. This is the reason I´ve asked you a number of times now if you could please confirm whether or not this is the case? Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv Well, that´s it - Emotiva has lost a customer. I´ve asked you publicly in this forum 4 or 5 times to confirm whether or not the XMC will have the same design limitation as the UMC in pass-through ability. Since I´ve asked you politely to answer this straight forward question in response to your postings in the Lounge, I find your silence rather strange and a token that you don´t want to give this information in public. Being an ID company relying on internet based marketing and sales, I think you should make a serious effort of reconsidering your information strategy . I´m completely out of considering onother Emotiva product. Ole Willy Tuv Ex Emotiva customer |
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lonnie
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Post by lonnie on Feb 25, 2010 16:11:21 GMT -5
Hi Lonnie, Well, I never actually intended to buy the UMC, but rather wait for the XMC. Since the two processors are basically based upon the same platform, I fear the same limitation might apply to the XMC as well. This is the reason I´ve asked you a number of times now if you could please confirm whether or not this is the case? Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv Well, that´s it - Emotiva has lost a customer. I´ve asked you publicly in this forum 4 or 5 times to confirm whether or not the XMC will have the same design limitation as the UMC in pass-through ability. Since I´ve asked you politely to answer this straight forward question in response to your postings in the Lounge, I find your silence rather strange and a token that you don´t want to give this information in public. Being an ID company relying on internet based marketing and sales, I think you should make a serious effort of reconsidering your information strategy . I´m completely out of considering onother Emotiva product. Ole Willy Tuv Ex Emotiva customer I haven't replied because I don't have an answer for you. First off this is not a limitation, but a design choice and at present teh video hardware for the XMC is still under review and subject to change. So I can't honestly tell you. |
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Post by bootman on Feb 25, 2010 16:15:29 GMT -5
At the risk of incurring the wrath and contempt of the participants: As I understand it, the forced upconvert of 480i to 480p means that CRT users cannot use the UMC-1 for standard broadcasting. I base this assumption on the fact that my Sony cannot handle 480p from DirectTV and must have the 480i setting. Why haven't I moved up to an LCD or Plasma? Well, I have perfect blacks and no smearing of action and sufficient resolution for my eyes with this setup. What annoys me about this issue is that there was no compelling need for the UMC-1 to fail to pass through 480i. Pure and simple, this is a design chopice that didn;t have to be made. No amount of Lonnie's assertions that this is "by design" changes the fact that he made a choice he didn't have to make and needlessly ruled out my current setup. This is the same as deciding to eliminate multi-channel from stereo input - as far as I can tell, there was no compelling reason to do this either. If my several years'old NAD T-163 can offer multi-channel processing from a 2- channel source, while providing excellent 2 channel sound when asked to do so, so could the UMC-1. Look, every product carries with it certain assumptions about the users. What I find disappointing here is that needless exclusions were decided upon. I expected better from Emotiva. Huh? We are discussing HDMI. You have a HDMI port on that old CRT? This unit still has component out for you. Before you make assumptions, please do some more homework. |
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Post by moodyman on Feb 25, 2010 16:15:37 GMT -5
Hi Lonnie, Well, I never actually intended to buy the UMC, but rather wait for the XMC. Since the two processors are basically based upon the same platform, I fear the same limitation might apply to the XMC as well. This is the reason I´ve asked you a number of times now if you could please confirm whether or not this is the case? Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv Well, that´s it - Emotiva has lost a customer. I´ve asked you publicly in this forum 4 or 5 times to confirm whether or not the XMC will have the same design limitation as the UMC in pass-through ability. Since I´ve asked you politely to answer this straight forward question in response to your postings in the Lounge, I find your silence rather strange and a token that you don´t want to give this information in public. Being an ID company relying on internet based marketing and sales, I think you should make a serious effort of reconsidering your information strategy . I´m completely out of considering onother Emotiva product. Ole Willy Tuv Ex Emotiva customer LOL...Bye |
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Post by bootman on Feb 25, 2010 16:19:01 GMT -5
Well, that´s it - Emotiva has lost a customer. I´ve asked you publicly in this forum 4 or 5 times to confirm whether or not the XMC will have the same design limitation as the UMC in pass-through ability. Since I´ve asked you politely to answer this straight forward question in response to your postings in the Lounge, I find your silence rather strange and a token that you don´t want to give this information in public. Being an ID company relying on internet based marketing and sales, I think you should make a serious effort of reconsidering your information strategy . I´m completely out of considering onother Emotiva product. Ole Willy Tuv Ex Emotiva customer LOL..... :'( I always find it funny when some users want high end specific features yet get mad when they don't find it on a budget priced unit. An Athem D2 has everything he wants yet I don't think he wants to pay that much....... This is what you get at this price point. If it works for you, great! If not, there are other more expensive options. |
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Post by mathguy on Feb 25, 2010 16:20:06 GMT -5
owtuv,
So you gave less than 48 hours for a response to you question here on the forum...and when no response was forthcoming you made your decision. Well that is of course, up to you. However, your strategy escapes me. Just because you did not get an answer does not imply that the answer is what you fear it to be ( XMC will have the same design decision as the UMC ).
There could be a few reasons Lonnie did not answer your question:
1) He is still researching the answer ( software might be able to be changed still etc).
2) The spec's of the XMC are still somewhat fluid at this stage.
3) The might be a No Disclosure on the XMC for some sort of legal/marketing/other reasons.
4) He took a 3 or a 4 day weekend.
5) Involved deeply in the inbound Subwoofers/speakers we heard about on the webcast.
6) He has been secretly recruited to build the next generation holographic media systems using quartz crystals and quantum computer alogrithms.
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Post by owtuv on Feb 25, 2010 17:56:09 GMT -5
Well, that´s it - Emotiva has lost a customer. I´ve asked you publicly in this forum 4 or 5 times to confirm whether or not the XMC will have the same design limitation as the UMC in pass-through ability. Since I´ve asked you politely to answer this straight forward question in response to your postings in the Lounge, I find your silence rather strange and a token that you don´t want to give this information in public. Being an ID company relying on internet based marketing and sales, I think you should make a serious effort of reconsidering your information strategy . I´m completely out of considering onother Emotiva product. Ole Willy Tuv Ex Emotiva customer I haven't replied because I don't have an answer for you. First off this is not a limitation, but a design choice and at present teh video hardware for the XMC is still under review and subject to change. So I can't honestly tell you. Hi Lonnie, OK, this is at least a response to my question. I would never consider a processor with the current design choice (your wording) or design limitation (my wording), but owning the Pioneer VSX-LX70 AVR I´m in no desperate hurry to upgrade. ;) Please give me a notice when you´ve made a final decision on the XMC VP design. All the best, Ole Willy Tuv |
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Post by owtuv on Feb 25, 2010 18:01:52 GMT -5
Well, that´s it - Emotiva has lost a customer. I´ve asked you publicly in this forum 4 or 5 times to confirm whether or not the XMC will have the same design limitation as the UMC in pass-through ability. Since I´ve asked you politely to answer this straight forward question in response to your postings in the Lounge, I find your silence rather strange and a token that you don´t want to give this information in public. Being an ID company relying on internet based marketing and sales, I think you should make a serious effort of reconsidering your information strategy . I´m completely out of considering onother Emotiva product. Ole Willy Tuv Ex Emotiva customer LOL...Bye FYI I´ve communicated this question/request to Lonnie/Emotiva for a long time. Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv |
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Post by owtuv on Feb 25, 2010 18:05:25 GMT -5
I always find it funny when some users want high end specific features yet get mad when they don't find it on a budget priced unit. An Athem D2 has everything he wants yet I don't think he wants to pay that much....... This is what you get at this price point. If it works for you, great! If not, there are other more expensive options. FYI I´ve communicated this question/request to Lonnie/Emotiva for a long time. Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv |
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Post by owtuv on Feb 25, 2010 18:06:21 GMT -5
owtuv, So you gave less than 48 hours for a response to you question here on the forum...and when no response was forthcoming you made your decision. Well that is of course, up to you. However, your strategy escapes me. Just because you did not get an answer does not imply that the answer is what you fear it to be ( XMC will have the same design decision as the UMC ). There could be a few reasons Lonnie did not answer your question: 1) He is still researching the answer ( software might be able to be changed still etc). 2) The spec's of the XMC are still somewhat fluid at this stage. 3) The might be a No Disclosure on the XMC for some sort of legal/marketing/other reasons. 4) He took a 3 or a 4 day weekend. 5) Involved deeply in the inbound Subwoofers/speakers we heard about on the webcast. 6) He has been secretly recruited to build the next generation holographic media systems using quartz crystals and quantum computer alogrithms. FYI I´ve communicated this question/request to Lonnie/Emotiva for a long time. Best regards, Ole Willy Tuv |
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Post by solomente on Feb 25, 2010 21:15:35 GMT -5
Sorry to beat a dead horse here but the comments about almost no video being displayed in 480i anymore, or that the 480i issue only relates to people with CRT's or external video processors... both of those statements are completely wrong.
Have any of you ever watched standard definition TV? The vast majority of Americans still are, and that's 480i. Also, the type of TV has nothing to do with anything. When the UMC-1 is used with the video setting in Pass Through, switching to a 480i signal (i.e. the hundreds of standard def TV channels) changes the GLOBAL video setting to 480p. Now you are watching Blu Rays in 480p too, until you manually change it back. This process resets itself everytime you pass by a standard def TV channel again.
Now this may not be a problem for many of you. It's likely most who don't experience this are using a video setting of 1080p 60. But saying only people with a CRT or external video processor experience this, or that almost nothing is in 480i anymore, is absolutely false. I have a plasma TV and no video processor and experienced this same issue.
Horse let out last gasp, so I'll depart now.
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Post by pynchon on Feb 26, 2010 0:07:03 GMT -5
Ole Willy Tuv,
No matter what they tell you, how do you know 'they' aren't lying to you AGAIN ?
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