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Post by brubacca on Jul 17, 2015 6:30:12 GMT -5
"That said, the price point of the RP-6 with the Exact cartridge will get you the best sound you could want, IMHO in that $$$ category, I wouldn't spend time with a lessor priced TT"
This is kind of where i am. It would seem that to "Do it right" I would need to be in the $1,600-2,000 range. I just can't seem to justify that for where i am with the amount of records i have and the limited time i have to listen to them. I am not financially flush, although maybe it makes sence to save up slowly until i could do something like this.
I have a business colleague who is think about selling his Exact and getting a 2M Black. I could probably get this cartridge (barely used) from him and maybe put it on a RP3, but that seems to be a half measure,
Think i may just muddle through with my system now. Possibly go back again (again,, and again) and try to solve my hum problem while i accumulate more albums.
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Post by mshump on Jul 17, 2015 7:09:54 GMT -5
Do you have a local Audio dealer in your area? Maybe take your TT in and see if it has hum on one of their systems? Maybe they can do some cartridge comparisons for you. I have the project Debut TT, it was the TT before the Carbon Debut. I don't understand nor can wrap my head around how much better a 2k TT would be. I do understand a bigger Plinth will help isolate better. The music is played through the stylus, Cartridge, then wires to the preamp. I think the best money spent is cartridge and preamp. Other than isolation I would love to know what more you get spending more money on a TT.
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novisnick
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CEO Secret Monoblock Society
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Post by novisnick on Jul 17, 2015 7:17:21 GMT -5
Do you have a local Audio dealer in your area? Maybe take your TT in and see if it has hum on one of their systems? Maybe they can do some cartridge comparisons for you. I have the project Debut TT, it was the TT before the Carbon Debut. I don't understand nor can wrap my head around how much better a 2k TT would be. I do understand a bigger Plinth will help isolate better. The music is played through the stylus, Cartridge, then wires to the preamp. I think the best money spent is cartridge and preamp. Other than isolation I would love to know what more you get spending more money on a TT. Good morning my friend. if this question is directed to me let me explain. The $2000.00 price point that I mentioned is inclusive of stylus, cartridge and wires as well as speed box and table. Sorry if I wasn't more specific.
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Post by mshump on Jul 17, 2015 7:31:48 GMT -5
Do you have a local Audio dealer in your area? Maybe take your TT in and see if it has hum on one of their systems? Maybe they can do some cartridge comparisons for you. I have the project Debut TT, it was the TT before the Carbon Debut. I don't understand nor can wrap my head around how much better a 2k TT would be. I do understand a bigger Plinth will help isolate better. The music is played through the stylus, Cartridge, then wires to the preamp. I think the best money spent is cartridge and preamp. Other than isolation I would love to know what more you get spending more money on a TT. Good morning my friend. if this question is directed to me let me explain. The $2000.00 price point that I mentioned is inclusive of stylus, cartridge and wires as well as speed box and table. Sorry if I wasn't more specific. Nick by no means was I trying to put you on the spot or anything. I seriously don't understand what the sound quality difference would be between a 3-400 dollar TT and a 2k TT. If I was to add the same cartridge and pieces you have on yours and added them to mine would there be a big SQ difference between them? I can't wrap my mind around that there would be. Don't get me wrong, people spend what they want and like what they have (Hopefully lol). I have a dr apt in a couple weeks where a really good dealer is. I am thinking of taking my TT with me and see if they can demonstrate for me.
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Post by vcautokid on Jul 17, 2015 8:25:12 GMT -5
One of the budget Music Halls or Projekt tables are great for short money. Easy to setup, and sound very good. A used table is fine as long as it is in proper working order. You want to spin vinyl, not become an audio tech.
Direct drive Denons, technics, are pretty bullet proof. They'll get the job done.
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Post by brubacca on Jul 17, 2015 9:06:21 GMT -5
I have enough other stuff to setup the TT in another portion of the house as a test (how sad it that). I just need the time to do it. Maybe it is some interaction with another component. The main system is being all fed from a CMX-2 btw... I have a regular power strip plugged into the CMX-2 and all components are into that.
I'll setup a PA2-50, with Lounge Audio LCR, TT and ERA Design D4 speakers. We'll see what that sounds like...
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novisnick
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CEO Secret Monoblock Society
Posts: 27,235
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Post by novisnick on Jul 17, 2015 9:15:55 GMT -5
Good morning my friend. if this question is directed to me let me explain. The $2000.00 price point that I mentioned is inclusive of stylus, cartridge and wires as well as speed box and table. Sorry if I wasn't more specific. Nick by no means was I trying to put you on the spot or anything. I seriously don't understand what the sound quality difference would be between a 3-400 dollar TT and a 2k TT. If I was to add the same cartridge and pieces you have on yours and added them to mine would there be a big SQ difference between them? I can't wrap my mind around that there would be. Don't get me wrong, people spend what they want and like what they have (Hopefully lol). I have a dr apt in a couple weeks where a really good dealer is. I am thinking of taking my TT with me and see if they can demonstrate for me. No problems here my friend. i can hear the difference. I see that you enjoy having good audio gear, XSP-1, XMC-1, etc., can you hear an improvement over whatever gear that it replaced? If not, why didn't you return it's? if so, then you have your answer! My ears, gear, room,,,,yada,,,,yada,,,,,,,,yada,,,,,,,,, I own a few TT and the difference in pricepoint and SQ is extensive to me. Did you see my example about the headphones? Friends that use them understand what I'm talking about,,,,,,,,,,,,I think. Even an on some of my 40 year old vinyl, they are flawless and sound great, no pop, tick or whatever, and yes some of them do have that age damage to it but all in all ,,,,,to me,,,,,,,, my vinyl is superior to most digital,,,,,,Hi Res sounds great too but I'm a physical kind of guy. also, some music that I have just can't be replaced and much of the Hi Res I've found isn't recorded up to snuff, shoot, a lot of music isn't recorded up to snuff!! And please,,,,,,,don't get me started on some " engineered " that corrupt the artists music. Geeze,,,,,,,,did I get derailed!! Sorry bout that,,,,,,he,,,,he,,,,he,,,,,, I quietly step off my soapbox,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,..
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Post by creimes on Jul 20, 2015 22:21:38 GMT -5
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Post by pedrocols on Jul 20, 2015 22:27:22 GMT -5
Must be in fact the best TT as it even makes bose speakers sound good. If you look closely you can see some bose speakers in one of the pictures....
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Post by creimes on Jul 21, 2015 0:22:26 GMT -5
Must be in fact the best TT as it even makes bose speakers sound good. If you look closely you can see some bose speakers in one of the pictures.... I seen those Bose Cubes as well and almost fell off my chair hahahahahaha
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Post by Boomzilla on Jul 21, 2015 7:54:31 GMT -5
A simple question - a simple answer. If buying used, as little as possible. If buying new, $700 for this:
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Post by monkumonku on Jul 21, 2015 8:51:57 GMT -5
Must be in fact the best TT as it even makes bose speakers sound good. If you look closely you can see some bose speakers in one of the pictures.... He wrote the following in his ad: The table has not moved since Bob Graham installed it, the table looks like new and I can't find a mark on it.Does that mean the platter hasn't turned since it was installed? And given the way this guy looks I wonder if he means Bob Graham put a mark on the TT where the on/off button is.
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Post by Hair Nick on Jul 21, 2015 9:04:09 GMT -5
Maybe look for a used TT on the consignment market? Winner.
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Post by vneal on Jul 21, 2015 9:09:38 GMT -5
NEW PRO-JECT CARBON
• 33/45 & 78rpm out of the box • Built-in precision Speed Box with switch on upper side • 8,6” carbon tonearm • Heavy non resonant acrylic platter • New DC power supply with synchronous AC motor • New TPE motor suspension • Magnetic cartridge 2M red from Ortofon • For 78 playback: remove stylus & exchange to 2M78 (not included, retail price around € 80) • High-gloss black, red or white piano lacquer finish • Dust cover included The most-wanted audiophile design turntable with carbon tonearm, 3 speeds and DC power supply! The first Debut turntable, introduced in the late 1990s, was a revolution for the hi-fi industry. For the first time after the arrival of Compact Disc and the assumed demise of vinyl records, an analogue product re-emerged in the “mass market” – something all music lovers could afford. The new DEBUT CARBON DC ESPRIT SB was designed to set new standards in this category for the coming decade – perfectly timed as analogue today is again a respected source, while the demand for good turntables with all speeds is growing fast! The CARBON TUBE for the tonearm increases stiffness and decreases unwanted resonance. This material normally is extensively used in highend tonearms, but – because of cost reasons – was never used in products at lower price levels. Together with other improvements like an increase in platter size and weight to realize even smoother rotation, the overall sound quality is greatly improved. The approved belt drive design offers low noise AC motor with effective motor decoupling (utilising TPE), ultra precision frequency DC-driven AC generator for ultimate speed stability. Ultimate convenience is achieved, because of electronic speed change („Speed Box“) and the possibility of playing 78rpm. A simple exchange of stylus to 2M78 (not included) and a drive belt turnover to larger diameter of pulley is required, that´s all! Debut Carbon Esprit SB (DC) / 2M red
$599 BEST BANG FOR DA BUCK
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Post by brubacca on Jul 21, 2015 9:50:45 GMT -5
I have a Project Debut Carbon, Speedbox II and arcylic platter. It has a hum and I have tried it in several systems. I will nit buy another Pro-Ject product.
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Post by Boomzilla on Jul 21, 2015 10:13:31 GMT -5
Or, if the Pioneer is too rich for your budget, one of these for about $250:
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Post by qdtjni on Jul 21, 2015 10:26:47 GMT -5
I have a Project Debut Carbon, Speedbox II and arcylic platter. It has a hum and I have tried it in several systems. I will nit buy another Pro-Ject product. Are you sure it's the TT and not a cable or the cartridge?
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Post by Priapulus on Jul 21, 2015 11:18:20 GMT -5
How many times have you used the Debut Carbon? Were you listening to music or just trying out the TT? If you aren't regularly using and enjoying your TT now; you aren't likely to in the future. (i.e. Do you like vinyl, or do you just like the mystique of vinyl?) If you not using your TT now, get rid of it, sell the LPs and invest in what you do use.
If you are regularly enjoying your TT; then it makes sense to invest in worthy gear. Surely you can get a TT that spins the records without hum, for $500-$1,000. Its not rocket science. I have a wonderful vintage TT, eBayed for $300.
Sincerely /blair
ps: Advice from someone who owns about 4,000 vinyl LPs; but no CDs.
p.s.s. TT hum is -invariably- improper grounding. My 30 year old TT is deathly silent; but only after I grounded the motor frame, platter, metal sub chassis, tonearm and preamp together.
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novisnick
EmoPhile
CEO Secret Monoblock Society
Posts: 27,235
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Post by novisnick on Jul 21, 2015 11:48:55 GMT -5
How many times have you used the Debut Carbon? Were you listening to music or just trying out the TT? If you aren't regularly using and enjoying your TT now; you aren't likely to in the future. (i.e. Do you like vinyl, or do you just like the mystique of vinyl?) If you not using your TT now, get rid of it, sell the LPs and invest in what you do use.
If you are regularly enjoying your TT; then it makes sense to invest in worthy gear. Surely you can get a TT that spins the records without hum, for $500-$1,000. Its not rocket science. I have a wonderful vintage TT, eBayed for $300.
Sincerely /blair
ps: Advice from someone who owns about 4,000 vinyl LPs; but no CDs.
p.s.s. TT hum is -invariably- improper grounding. My 30 year old TT is deathly silent; but only after I grounded the motor frame, platter, metal sub chassis, tonearm and preamp together.
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 10,002
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Post by KeithL on Jul 21, 2015 13:26:25 GMT -5
I don't think you're asking all of the necessary questions..... You say "with 25 albums" - but you're not asking the important question: Are these 25 albums that you absolutely, positively, CAN'T get on digital media, or that you are absolutely, positively certain you won't be able to stand listening to on digital media? I was in that position several years ago. Almost all of my music was already digital, but I had a few favorite albums that simply hadn't been issued on CD, and two or three that had come out on CD, but the quality of the digital releases wasn't very good. I personally consider all the "ritual" of cleaning records, and fiddling with the arm, and all that, to be somewhat annoying - so I was planning to convert those few remaining albums - and so I had held onto a turntable and was deciding between settling for the sound quality I could get from a decent sound card and spending the money on a decent A/D converter (then selling it after I'd converted those particular albums). Luckily, while I was trying to make up my mind, the few remaining albums I had that really sounded spectacular were issued in digital form at HDTracks (at 24/96 and 24/192) - which sounded at least as good as the vinyl ever did - and one other real old favorite was reissued on CD (honestly, the sound quality of the CD wasn't very good, but the sound quality of the vinyl version wasn't especially good anyway - so no loss there). The real question is whether you LIKE playing with vinyl or not... If not, then, at worst, you can probably save a lot of money and simply pay someone to convert those last few albums for you if there's simply no other way. If yes, then it's worth buying a decent turntable and the whole rigmarole that goes with it...... Brubacca, I wouldn't suggest any amount of your budget or even a specific model of TT to invest in; too subjective an issue. I will only advise that you spend as much as your budget will allow, and that you get the best TT that you can afford. However, you must ask yourself if you plan on collecting vinyl now or in the future, or do you see yourself going all-digital? There's no right or wrong way, only what suits you best and gives you the most enjoyment. If you can envision your audio future as only digital, I would say spend less on the TT. Conversely, if vinyl is still a strong medium for you, then spend a little more and get something that will exploit all the virtues that vinyl has to offer. William Whether i continue to get Vinyl or go all digital is really the underlying question. Miney is tight, but I usually get one reasonable purchase per year. I've already decidedthe tables I'd listen to, but i am a bit too involved. With 25 albums is it crazy to spend $2k on a table (like RP6)? Would it make more sence to be at $1k? Or just go budget again? Honestly it's not like i have the money sitting around doing nothing. I'd have to sell some stuff I am not using amd save the rest... If I got a new table and really enjoyed it I would get more Vinyl. It just seems like a good place to either cut my loses or go whole hog into it. So you know my preference for tables would be : Rega RP1/3/6 / Clearaudio Concept / Marantz TTS1. I prefer the British sound and these would seem to fit the bill, unless i just dump what i can and put my Vinyl in storage.
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