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Post by Bonzo on Apr 20, 2017 13:41:05 GMT -5
With recent discussions in previous threads discussing the actual new Oppo 205 emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/48994/oppo-udp-205-thread, the hypothetical possible ideas for a new future Emotiva Stealth DC-1 emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/48061/any-info-new-stealth-emotiva, and another thread regarding the XDA-3, which was “on,” then called dead by Emotiva, then hinted as alive again by Emotiva here emotivalounge.proboards.com/post/846369/thread, I got to wondering something I hadn’t personally thought of before. Everyone RAVES about the ERC-3 as a CD player, and most rave about the DC-1 as a DAC. From what I understand, the ERC-3 basically contains the same “stuff” inside that the DC-1 has, which helps makes it sound so great. Switching gears, I also think whether some of us want to admit it or not, the days of reasonably priced high quality standalone CD players are numbered (or at least having lots of options to choose from are numbered – if not totally gone already). Switching gears again, Emotiva decided long ago that they didn’t want to compete directly with Oppo, so SACD / DVD-A and any video processing is out. Which all lead me to a new thought for me (I’m sure someone else has brought it up before and it’s possibly been discussed). What if Emotiva simply took a page out of Oppo’s book and upped the ante with an ERC-4 by just simply adding some digital inputs to the ERC-3? How much could just adding those inputs cost? They already exist to some extent in the DC-1. Could not a sharing of physical parts and some slight redesigning take an ERC-4 to the next level without adding a ton of cost? I was just thinking that since one of the Oppo-205’s greatest assets is the ability to DAC external sources, why not bring this great feature to an ERC-4? Does it not make sense? Are there not other CD players that can do this? Am I on crack and don’t even know it? For the right price, people could buy an Oppo-203 AND an ERC-4. People could get the great features of the Oppo for video, and the occasional SACD / DVD-A listening, use the great sounding ERC-4 for CD’s, and use it (like a DC-1) for other digital sources, and under cut the price of a single Oppo 205. Just thinking out loud. (Note: And do not get carried away with adding a headphone amp and phone plug, which IMO is better suited somewhere else in a home stereo rack).Oh, and make it right handed this time out.  Please.  |
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Post by garbulky on Apr 20, 2017 14:15:48 GMT -5
If you add digital inputs to the ERC, then do you think they should add a volume control to it too?
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Post by Bonzo on Apr 20, 2017 15:06:50 GMT -5
If you add digital inputs to the ERC, then do you think they should add a volume control to it too? Nope. It would be a CD player and a 2 channel DAC for external digital sources that, just like a CD player, would be hooked to a pre-amp of some sort for volume functions. Imagine an ERC-3 with digital inputs added, OR, an XDA-2 with CD Player added and volume control and headphone amp left off. I personally think the volume control and head phone amp in the rack size DAC (like say the XDA-2) is totally useless, for a rack unit. Or at the very least, should be considered as more a niche item, something people who want it buy a separate component for. Most rack systems are made first and foremost for cranking it up in a room with speakers. Any headphone use is typically secondary at best (at least initially). It makes sense in say, the DC-1, which for it's size "can" be used as a rack unit (and could be almost portable), but is really made more for a desk top computer DAC for use with headphones and volume control right at hand. |
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Post by brutiarti on Apr 20, 2017 15:34:41 GMT -5
I think it's a good idea to keep selling more units. Several manufactures are doing it.
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Post by Bonzo on Apr 20, 2017 15:46:06 GMT -5
I think it's a good idea to keep selling more units. Several manufactures are doing it. Glad to know I'm not on crack.  |
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Post by brubacca on Apr 20, 2017 16:04:55 GMT -5
Yes do it. My understanding is that DC-1 uses dual dac while ERC-3 uses one. Raise the price to $700 and give us dual dac plus digital inputs please!
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Post by Axis on Apr 20, 2017 16:23:55 GMT -5
I wonder if the DC-1 design will survive new tech. The balanced analog and dual DAC architecture is awesome and can for sure be applied to any new DAC chips. Emotiva keeps changing there parts and design to improve there products and keep price down. The BasX CD player will be very good for the price. Up the ERC-3 and make a even better CD player Emotiva ! Bonzo is spot on ! I would love to have digital input to take use of the DAC's and analog output of the CD players that Emotiva make. Dual duty Emotiva !  Don't tell us you cant do it ! |
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LCSeminole
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Post by LCSeminole on Apr 20, 2017 16:46:56 GMT -5
I'd really like to see a USB and/or SD/SDHC memory card playback. If this had been included in the ERC-3, I wouldn't have the Tascam SD/USB/CD player I have now.
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Apr 20, 2017 17:32:41 GMT -5
Here's an idea...do what Bonzo is saying, add the inputs lcseminole is suggestion, make the DAC parts TOTALLY killer, and sell a version with a CD drive and one without. One is a DC-2, the other is an ERC-4! Saves in design and mfg costs and allows those who want to spin disks a killer option while not making those who don't pay for one.
Mark
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Post by Gary Cook on Apr 20, 2017 17:39:02 GMT -5
It sounded like a good idea, have other inputs on the ERC so it can DAC from other sources. But then I thought about what other sources? The AppleTV4 maybe, it has HDMI output. But that means getting into the ever changing cycle of standards, copywrite protection, cables and connectors. Right now I know that my ERC-3 will never go out of date, it will always play CD's and sound great. I'll leave the regular update cycle to the processor, the one piece of gear that I know I need to budget to replace every 3 years or so.
Cheers
Gary
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Post by Axis on Apr 20, 2017 17:56:59 GMT -5
It sounded like a good idea, have other inputs on the ERC so it can DAC from other sources. But then I thought about what other sources? The AppleTV4 maybe, it has HDMI output. But that means getting into the ever changing cycle of standards, copywrite protection, cables and connectors. Right now I know that my ERC-3 will never go out of date, it will always play CD's and sound great. I'll leave the regular update cycle to the processor, the one piece of gear that I know I need to budget to replace every 3 years or so. Cheers Gary Your portable digital player. |
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Post by brutiarti on Apr 20, 2017 18:19:44 GMT -5
Adding coax and toslink would be enough imo
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Post by Bonzo on Apr 21, 2017 8:31:10 GMT -5
I'd really like to see a USB and/or SD/SDHC memory card playback. If this had been included in the ERC-3, I wouldn't have the Tascam SD/USB/CD player I have now. I very much see the benefits to being able to store and move your music around this way. But, I do have a question on how it works. How does it work without some sort of video interface? I'm imagining a card or USB stick with 5000 songs all sorted out by band and album etc. How do you play what you want without having a way to "see" what you want to play? My wife has a 2010 KIA soul, and while it can play stuff from a USB stick, it's a pain in the ass to get where you want to be due to the lack of large video screen. My new 2017 Sportage with it's 8" screen works much better in this regard. |
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Post by Bonzo on Apr 21, 2017 8:35:38 GMT -5
Here's an idea...do what Bonzo is saying, add the inputs lcseminole is suggestion, make the DAC parts TOTALLY killer, and sell a version with a CD drive and one without. One is a DC-2, the other is an ERC-4! Saves in design and mfg costs and allows those who want to spin disks a killer option while not making those who don't pay for one. Mark I only want to change one thing about your post. I believe they should be the ERC-4 and the XDA-4. Just skip the XDA-3 so the 4's can co-exist and identify the similarities between models). But great idea! Nothing like some good brainstorming on a forum. I think the DC-2 still needs to be a Stealth model aimed more at computer folks. It appears very popular for that segment. |
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Apr 21, 2017 8:50:25 GMT -5
Good point!
Mark
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Post by Bonzo on Apr 21, 2017 9:00:02 GMT -5
It sounded like a good idea, have other inputs on the ERC so it can DAC from other sources. But then I thought about what other sources? The AppleTV4 maybe, it has HDMI output. But that means getting into the ever changing cycle of standards, copywrite protection, cables and connectors. Right now I know that my ERC-3 will never go out of date, it will always play CD's and sound great. I'll leave the regular update cycle to the processor, the one piece of gear that I know I need to budget to replace every 3 years or so. Cheers Gary I think maybe you should be asking this question to the people who own, use, and love their DC-1 in their rack system. Perhaps you don't see a need. I don't have a need at this very moment either, but I am planning to have that need sooner rather than later. I also know from being on this forum that there are plenty of people who do use their DC-1 this way. Part of my original thought was, why have an Oppo Video Player, an ERC-3, and a DC-1? Enter the Oppo 205.  But for people who much prefer what Keith might call the "more neutral" Emotiva DAC solution, if a person still really likes to play CDs, why do they need 2 boxes to achieve the same Emotiva 2 channel sound purpose, when, from what I've read here and conjecture myself, a lot of the same functions in each box are the same. Are they not? Are they totally different? Or is the ERC-3 not just a slightly different variation on the DC-1 with a CD transport and no inputs? It seems to me that PERHAPS combining designs and components could save efforts and money for everyone, and it would be a win win situation. If the ERC-4 could have the Toslink/RCA/USB digital inputs, for say, $600, I know I'd pay the extra $100 just for those inputs and external DAC capability. I'm thinking maybe others would too. |
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Post by Gary Cook on Apr 21, 2017 21:19:06 GMT -5
It sounded like a good idea, have other inputs on the ERC so it can DAC from other sources. But then I thought about what other sources? The AppleTV4 maybe, it has HDMI output. But that means getting into the ever changing cycle of standards, copywrite protection, cables and connectors. Right now I know that my ERC-3 will never go out of date, it will always play CD's and sound great. I'll leave the regular update cycle to the processor, the one piece of gear that I know I need to budget to replace every 3 years or so. I think maybe you should be asking this question to the people who own, use, and love their DC-1 in their rack system. Perhaps you don't see a need. I don't have a need at this very moment either, but I am planning to have that need sooner rather than later. I also know from being on this forum that there are plenty of people who do use their DC-1 this way. Part of my original thought was, why have an Oppo Video Player, an ERC-3, and a DC-1? Enter the Oppo 205. But for people who much prefer what Keith might call the "more neutral" Emotiva DAC solution, if a person still really likes to play CDs, why do they need 2 boxes to achieve the same Emotiva 2 channel sound purpose, when, from what I've read here and conjecture myself, a lot of the same functions in each box are the same. Are they not? Are they totally different? Or is the ERC-3 not just a slightly different variation on the DC-1 with a CD transport and no inputs? It seems to me that PERHAPS combining designs and components could save efforts and money for everyone, and it would be a win win situation. If the ERC-4 could have the Toslink/RCA/USB digital inputs, for say, $600, I know I'd pay the extra $100 just for those inputs and external DAC capability. I'm thinking maybe others would too. Different strokes for different blokes Bonzo. Personally I don't have any USB, Toslink or digital coax gear that I need to connect, all of my digital sources are HDMI and as we all know that involves endless updates. With HDCP, HDMI is gradually becoming the standard for connectivity when it comes to high definition replays and a hifi DAC without HDMI has limited appeal. USB is only marginally better in that regard, after all we have had 9 versions since 1995, which averages a new version every 2.4 years. As a dedicated CD payer I never have to worry about that with my ERC-3. I don't know that I would be very happy if I paid $100 more and then found out 2.4 years later than it won't work with the latest HDMI and/or USB standard. Like processors, that's the problem with DAC's, they go out of date too quickly for my gear cycle rates. Hence why I limit the exposure to just the one super value for money processor that I don't fear replacing regularly. Cheers Gary |
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Post by pedrocols on Apr 21, 2017 22:38:10 GMT -5
What about a streamer...
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Post by Bonzo on May 9, 2017 19:55:53 GMT -5
I lost track of this thread. I'd love to hear comments from others on your thought. I don't stream yet but its in my certain future. Anyone have positive or negative thoughts about this? |
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Post by brubacca on May 9, 2017 20:43:16 GMT -5
Streaming is awesome. It can be better than CD quality. Many will tell you to just get a Rapsberry Pi and it sounds fine. My personal opinion is that if you want excellence you need either a SOTM SMS-200 or a Sonore MicroRendu then partner it with an excellent DAC. Many here like the Stealth DC-1, I'm a big fan of Schiit Multibit Dacs. Lots of info out there.
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Please. 
But for people who much prefer what Keith might call the "more neutral" Emotiva DAC solution, if a person still really likes to play CDs, why do they need 2 boxes to achieve the same Emotiva 2 channel sound purpose, when, from what I've read here and conjecture myself, a lot of the same functions in each box are the same. Are they not? Are they totally different? Or is the ERC-3 not just a slightly different variation on the DC-1 with a CD transport and no inputs? It seems to me that PERHAPS combining designs and components could save efforts and money for everyone, and it would be a win win situation. If the ERC-4 could have the Toslink/RCA/USB digital inputs, for say, $600, I know I'd pay the extra $100 just for those inputs and external DAC capability. I'm thinking maybe others would too. 
