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Post by aswiss on May 15, 2019 14:07:48 GMT -5
Very Funny - Indeed. No - its in 5.1, Atmos or whatsoever (except Stereo) where only the Trim OSD is showing up, moving Up or Down and nothing happens with the Volume. an just in case - I did measure the dB Level - no change of Volume. Not on Center, or Surr.
For me TRIM is used when Center is not loud enough - mostly at night when i cannot turn up the vol. so in normal situation - I'm talking about increasing the Center with +2dB up - Display shows that it's leveling up +2dB - but the sound is not encreasing. So either I misconfigured the RMC somewhere - or the function is really not working. I've opened a ticket, and already sent Grayson a pic of my current FW. It's nothing which really disturbs - as I don't have dropouts or so during watching tv, movies or so - but it's a function, and due the piece is new - I wanna try each function to learn more aubout it.
Let me know, if a Backup of the RMC-1 could help. thx Adrian
If you are increasing the center trim and not getting louder center volume, then most likely you are playing it in stereo mode. Attachments:
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Post by tabbycph on May 16, 2019 3:23:20 GMT -5
Very Funny - Indeed. No - its in 5.1, Atmos or whatsoever (except Stereo) where only the Trim OSD is showing up, moving Up or Down and nothing happens with the Volume. an just in case - I did measure the dB Level - no change of Volume. Not on Center, or Surr.
If you are increasing the center trim and not getting louder center volume, then most likely you are playing it in stereo mode. On my RMC the trim is working, I tried it yesterday.
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Post by AudioHTIT on May 16, 2019 5:34:15 GMT -5
Very Funny - Indeed. No - its in 5.1, Atmos or whatsoever (except Stereo) where only the Trim OSD is showing up, moving Up or Down and nothing happens with the Volume. an just in case - I did measure the dB Level - no change of Volume. Not on Center, or Surr.
If you are increasing the center trim and not getting louder center volume, then most likely you are playing it in stereo mode. So to test or eliminate Keith’s “normalization” theory, are you doing any equalization or boost on the center channel in the speaker preset that is active? If so how much? If you’re doing little or none, that’s probably not the explanation. If you’re doing a lot, that might be it.
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ccm
Minor Hero
Posts: 21
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Post by ccm on May 16, 2019 7:48:37 GMT -5
Very Funny - Indeed. No - its in 5.1, Atmos or whatsoever (except Stereo) where only the Trim OSD is showing up, moving Up or Down and nothing happens with the Volume. an just in case - I did measure the dB Level - no change of Volume. Not on Center, or Surr.
If you are increasing the center trim and not getting louder center volume, then most likely you are playing it in stereo mode. Are you sure you are playing 5.1 content at the time and that there's actually sound coming out of the center or surrounds? In just playing spotify through my HTPC with PC speaker config set to stereo, I can be on "all stereo" or "dolby surround" and all trims work. If I set the PC speaker output config to 5.1 ro 7.1 my RMC-1 display will change to 5.1 or 7.1 respectively from PCM 2.0 but I get no sound from center or surrounds (playing spotify... I do get sound and the trims work if I play 5.1 content) so the trims make no difference on those channels.
Can you check that you actually have sound at those speakers...
Chris...
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Post by deewan on May 17, 2019 10:21:37 GMT -5
A Favor...
I've reported an item to Emotiva and they claim they are unable to duplicate it. After supplying this video as proof of my issue I've heard nothing back from Emotiva. The issue I experience happens when I am listing to a 2-channel source (CD player, CD in Oppo, AppleTV streaming music file) using my 2.1 speakers preset (left, right, subwoofer channels active). If I enter into the speaker preset menu with music playing on the RMC and then exit out using the left arrow or menu button I lose the subwoofer channel. I have a single sub connected to the LFE output on the RMC. I've created the video below to demonstrate my issue. I've turned off the amp to my main speakers so the only audio is what is coming from the powered subwoofer and LFE channel. The only way I get the LFE channel to return is to switch inputs.
If someone else could test and report back I would really appreciate it. Perhaps if this issue only impacts my RMC then maybe I have another unit with hardware issues that can't be fixed with firmware updates.
(Subwoofer audio only heard if you are listening using a pair of headphones are a halfway good pair of computer speakers.)
0:00 playing 2-channel audio from AppleTV. Main amps are turned off so only the powered subwoofer is playing. 0:10 Preset 2 is selected which is a 2.1 setup. Main fronts and sub channel 0:23 I enter into Speaker preset and select Preset 2. Silence from right front channel since my main channels are turned off. This is to be expected. 0:39 When I select the sub channel I hear the test tone, as I should to prove the sub is still active. 0:42 I exit out of speaker preset. Silence 1:00 "Please Wait" message disappears. Music is still playing but not audible since front mains are not powered. No sub channel. 1:10 I switch to a different hdmi input with no source device powered on. 1:34 I switch back to the AppleTV hdmi input. 1:48 AppleTV hdmi syncs and bass begins to play. 1:54 I enter back into speaker preset menu 2:14 I exit out of speaker preset again after a quick test tone coming from subwoofer 2:25 AppleTV is synced and again I have no subwoofer signal. 2:27 I do a quick hdmi input switch 2:33 Sub channel becomes active again.
thank you in advance for anyone willing to help!!!!
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 10,002
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Post by KeithL on May 17, 2019 13:53:37 GMT -5
That would indeed be helpful...
It's also worth pointing out that it can sometimes be very difficult to locate the cause of certain problems for various reasons. For example, a problem like this could be caused by a specific sort of hardware problem. It could also be caused by some very specific interaction between certain settings and parameters. And, in fact, it could even be caused by an interaction with your source or your monitor.
The information we collect from your monitor determines how we react to certain things. It is also combined with information about the RMC-1, and that combined information is passed on to your source, which may act differently depending on what it contains. As a result, we often see problems that only occur with very specific combinations of equipment connected, and only when certain options or settings are chosen. And it can be very tricky to track them down unless you have access to all of the exact same equipment when troubleshooting them. And, yes, that includes things like the firmware installed on each unit, and even the chip-set inside each (not all items of "the same model" are internally identical).
The more information we can collect about a problem that occurs under more than one set of conditions... The more we are able to use the information to track down the actual cause of the problem - and solve it.
A Favor...
I've reported an item to Emotiva and they claim they are unable to duplicate it. After supplying this video as proof of my issue I've heard nothing back from Emotiva. The issue I experience happens when I am listing to a 2-channel source (CD player, CD in Oppo, AppleTV streaming music file) using my 2.1 speakers preset (left, right, subwoofer channels active). If I enter into the speaker preset menu with music playing on the RMC and then exit out using the left arrow or menu button I lose the subwoofer channel. I have a single sub connected to the LFE output on the RMC. I've created the video below to demonstrate my issue. I've turned off the amp to my main speakers so the only audio is what is coming from the powered subwoofer and LFE channel. The only way I get the LFE channel to return is to switch inputs. If someone else could test and report back I would really appreciate it. Perhaps if this issue only impacts my RMC then maybe I have another unit with hardware issues that can't be fixed with firmware updates. (Subwoofer audio only heard if you are listening using a pair of headphones are a halfway good pair of computer speakers.)0:00 playing 2-channel audio from AppleTV. Main amps are turned off so only the powered subwoofer is playing. 0:10 Preset 2 is selected which is a 2.1 setup. Main fronts and sub channel 0:23 I enter into Speaker preset and select Preset 2. Silence from right front channel since my main channels are turned off. This is to be expected. 0:39 When I select the sub channel I hear the test tone, as I should to prove the sub is still active. 0:42 I exit out of speaker preset. Silence 1:00 "Please Wait" message disappears. Music is still playing but not audible since front mains are not powered. No sub channel. 1:10 I switch to a different hdmi input with no source device powered on. 1:34 I switch back to the AppleTV hdmi input. 1:48 AppleTV hdmi syncs and bass begins to play. 1:54 I enter back into speaker preset menu 2:14 I exit out of speaker preset again after a quick test tone coming from subwoofer 2:25 AppleTV is synced and again I have no subwoofer signal. 2:27 I do a quick hdmi input switch 2:33 Sub channel becomes active again. thank you in advance for anyone willing to help!!!!
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Post by moovtune on May 17, 2019 14:01:21 GMT -5
Full disclosure, I don't have an RMC - but stereo music doesn't have an LFE channel as I'm sure you know, so whether there is a bass output would be determined by how your crossovers are set for your main speakers and/or whether you've turned on any "bass enhancement" option (which I don't know if the RMC has). Double check your crossover setting and other settings for your Preset 2 to make sure it's set up so that you really should be getting bass from the sub.
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Post by Geronimo on May 17, 2019 14:06:03 GMT -5
Full disclosure, I don't have an RMC - but stereo music doesn't have an LFE channel as I'm sure you know, so whether there is a bass output would be determined by how your crossovers are set for your main speakers and/or whether you've turned on any "bass enhancement" option (which I don't know if the RMC has). Double check your crossover setting and other settings for your Preset 2 to make sure it's set up so that you really should be getting bass from the sub. THE RMC-1 DOES have "BASS ENHANCEMENT" I'll try to replicate/confirm the problem with my hardware when I get home.
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Post by deewan on May 17, 2019 15:47:07 GMT -5
Full disclosure, I don't have an RMC - but stereo music doesn't have an LFE channel as I'm sure you know, so whether there is a bass output would be determined by how your crossovers are set for your main speakers and/or whether you've turned on any "bass enhancement" option (which I don't know if the RMC has). Double check your crossover setting and other settings for your Preset 2 to make sure it's set up so that you really should be getting bass from the sub. I understand what you are saying and I should be getting bass while listening to content without a LFE signal. For Speaker Preset 2 (2.1) I have enhanced bass turned on and my speakers are set to small with a crossover set. This does force the LFE channel to receive a signal when listening to content without a dedicated LFE signal and can be heard in the video. My issue is that when I enter the speaker preset menu and exit out, any signal being sent to the LFE channel (using enhanced bass and my crossover settings) stops. Nothing I can do makes the signal return other than switching inputs or power cycling the RMC.
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Post by Geronimo on May 17, 2019 21:55:28 GMT -5
I just tested this. I cannot replicate that problem. I still have bass exiting the Presets.
I have one sub currently connected to "Center Sub" as "Mono", Front L/R to small, so no "Bass Enhancement", Crossover 80Hz, Crossover Slope 12dB/Octave.
Just to be clear, there is a subwoofer bug, but it is different than this.
The bug currently being worked on:
Setting Left/ Right sub to mono, and going into test "levels", sub-woofer plays in left rear height (or last played), NOT sub.
Workaround for that bug is to use Center sub out when only using one sub, until fixed.
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Post by Geronimo on May 17, 2019 22:41:00 GMT -5
I see now why you get no SUB bass output exiting PRESET.
If you set;
SPEAKERS LARGE BASS ENHANCEMENT ON SUBWOOFER LFE
You will get no bass
If you set SUBWOOFER to MONO, instead of LFE, you will get the SUB working......
You cannot have Speakers SMALL, and bass enhancement ON.
ONE SET OF SPEAKERS MUST BE SET TO "LARGE" TO EVEN GET THAT OPTION.
MAKE SURE ALL SPEAKERS ARE SET TO "SMALL", or FRONT L/R LARGE + BASS ENHANCEMENT, SUB MONO
Those are my findings.......
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Post by deewan on May 18, 2019 8:30:09 GMT -5
While attempting to capture more videos, I found some other really strange behavior from my RMC. Again, if there is anyone able to attempt to recreate this I would appreciate it.
While grabbing another video I noticed that if I hit the Speaker Preset button once to check the status (not change the selection) and then hit the "Mode" button to check I'm using "Stereo", the Speaker Preset changes.
0:03 I click the Speaker Preset button once. Speaker Preset 2.1 (Preset 2) displays on the OLED. 0:06 I click the Mode up button once to ensure I have "Stereo" selected. Stereo displays and when I click the Speaker Preset button once again, the RMC changes to 7.1.6 (Preset 1) 0:08 RMC goes into "Please Wait" mode. 0:15 RMC exit "Please Wait mode and the subwoofer channel no longer outputs bass. I'm guessing because preset 7.1.6 is setup without "Enhanced bass". 0:19 I click Speaker Preset once again, I see the RMC has Preset 1 selected. Selecting "Mode" and "Preset" again moves the Speaker Preset back to Preset 2 and my 2.1 speaker preset. 0:25 RMC enter "Please Wait" mode. 0:28 Bass returns from powered subwoofer 0:32 RMC exits "Please Wait" mode and I'm back to the setup I began the process with. 0:34 I basically retrace the same steps I just described above. With same results 0:47 Without bass coming from powered subwoofer I use the Speaker Preset button to change back to Preset 2 (2.1 setup) and bass returns.
Now seeing this, I am curious in my previous video if when entering test tones on the Speaker Preset menu, it always throws the RMC into Preset 1 or a 7.1.X setup. It does trigger my 12v amp triggers.
I have another strange video to post but I need to run some errands which is why this post may be short
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Post by aswiss on May 18, 2019 10:16:12 GMT -5
I was in touch with Emo Support - and they could replicate the issue with my settings. It's a Bug that TRIM is not working, when operating RMC-1 with No Subwoofer!
So, problem is identified and on the list of solvings for a future FW Update.
It would be on all RMC-1 when you just have a 5.0.4 Setup.
Very Funny - Indeed. No - its in 5.1, Atmos or whatsoever (except Stereo) where only the Trim OSD is showing up, moving Up or Down and nothing happens with the Volume. an just in case - I did measure the dB Level - no change of Volume. Not on Center, or Surr.
So to test or eliminate Keith’s “normalization” theory, are you doing any equalization or boost on the center channel in the speaker preset that is active? If so how much? If you’re doing little or none, that’s probably not the explanation. If you’re doing a lot, that might be it.
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Post by Geronimo on May 18, 2019 13:12:40 GMT -5
While attempting to capture more videos, I found some other really strange behavior from my RMC. Again, if there is anyone able to attempt to recreate this I would appreciate it. While grabbing another video I noticed that if I hit the Speaker Preset button once to check the status (not change the selection) and then hit the "Mode" button to check I'm using "Stereo", the Speaker Preset changes. 0:03 I click the Speaker Preset button once. Speaker Preset 2.1 (Preset 2) displays on the OLED. 0:06 I click the Mode up button once to ensure I have "Stereo" selected. Stereo displays and when I click the Speaker Preset button once again, the RMC changes to 7.1.6 (Preset 1) 0:08 RMC goes into "Please Wait" mode. 0:15 RMC exit "Please Wait mode and the subwoofer channel no longer outputs bass. I'm guessing because preset 7.1.6 is setup without "Enhanced bass". 0:19 I click Speaker Preset once again, I see the RMC has Preset 1 selected. Selecting "Mode" and "Preset" again moves the Speaker Preset back to Preset 2 and my 2.1 speaker preset. 0:25 RMC enter "Please Wait" mode. 0:28 Bass returns from powered subwoofer 0:32 RMC exits "Please Wait" mode and I'm back to the setup I began the process with. 0:34 I basically retrace the same steps I just described above. With same results 0:47 Without bass coming from powered subwoofer I use the Speaker Preset button to change back to Preset 2 (2.1 setup) and bass returns. Now seeing this, I am curious in my previous video if when entering test tones on the Speaker Preset menu, it always throws the RMC into Preset 1 or a 7.1.X setup. It does trigger my 12v amp triggers. I have another strange video to post but I need to run some errands which is why this post may be short That DOESN'T happen here. "PRESET" DOESN'T change. "MODE" DOES cycle though, but why not use the " INFO/STATUS" button instead?.....
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hi
Minor Hero
Posts: 48
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Post by hi on May 18, 2019 17:01:11 GMT -5
I have discovered a new bug:
Today i installed new top middle speakers. (more tops are following)
In all playback modes except stereo and all ch stereo, the subs received no signal.
I have rebooted the rmc-1 multiple times. I have changed the source (htpc/bluray player)
Config is 6.2.4: 2 fronts small 50hz 2 front high small 80hz 2 surround small 80hz 2 surround back 80hz 2 top middle 80hz
Ps. It would be very nice if the front width channels could be configured as height / top speakers. Because of the front heights and dual subs at the moment is not possible to add top fronts.
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Post by deewan on May 18, 2019 17:04:25 GMT -5
I have discovered a new bug: Today i installed new top middle speakers. (more tops are following) In all playback modes except stereo and all ch stereo, the subs received no signal. I have rebooted the rmc-1 multiple times. I have changed the source (htpc/bluray player) Config is 6.2.4: 2 fronts small 50hz 2 front high small 80hz 2 surround small 80hz 2 surround back 80hz 2 top middle 80hz I believe the overhead middle output is the reassigned Sub Left and Sub Right output. Since you said "the subs receive no signal" you may need to look at your connections. You should have the middle overheads assigned to left sub and right sub, and if you are using more than one subwoofer you'll have to split the center sub output. Unless the speaker setup menus have changes since I did my setup.
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hi
Minor Hero
Posts: 48
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Post by hi on May 18, 2019 17:12:46 GMT -5
I have discovered a new bug: Today i installed new top middle speakers. (more tops are following) In all playback modes except stereo and all ch stereo, the subs received no signal. I have rebooted the rmc-1 multiple times. I have changed the source (htpc/bluray player) Config is 6.2.4: 2 fronts small 50hz 2 front high small 80hz 2 surround small 80hz 2 surround back 80hz 2 top middle 80hz I believe the overhead middle output is the reassigned Sub Left and Sub Right output. Since you said "the subs receive no signal" you may need to look at your connections. You should have the middle overheads assigned to left sub and right sub, and if you are using more than one subwoofer you'll have to split the center sub output. Unless the speaker setup menus have changes since I did my setup. I don't know how to post pictures, but the dual mono sub option is set. The subwoofers received a signal in stereo or all ch stereo mode selected while playback. But in auto mode or anything else no sub signal is present.
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Post by deewan on May 18, 2019 17:37:43 GMT -5
Here is the other interesting thing I discovered this morning.
With enhanced bass turned on, front speakers set to Large and the subwoofer set to mono, the RMC sends bass notes to the powered subwoofer. But switching back and forth between speakers presets also stops or sends a signal to the powered sub.
0:00 Cd player playing 2.0 track. Powered sub can be heard playing a signal. 0:17 Enter into Size Speaker Preset menu. 0:28 Enter into Speaker Preset levels, hear the test tone through the subwoofer, exit out and the bass signal stops. 0:42 Confirm no other setting for devices have changed. 0:50 Use Speaker Preset button on remote to change preset to Setting 1 (Named 7.1.6) 1:00 Use same speaker preset button to return to preset 1 (named 2.1) and the bass notes return.
For the remainder of the video I cycle through the speaker preset to test the same findings. Result is the same.
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Post by deewan on May 18, 2019 17:39:31 GMT -5
I don't know how to post pictures, but the dual mono sub option is set. The subwoofers received a signal in stereo or all ch stereo mode selected while playback. But in auto mode or anything else no sub signal is present. What XLR output do you have your dual subs connected to?
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hi
Minor Hero
Posts: 48
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Post by hi on May 18, 2019 18:06:05 GMT -5
I don't know how to post pictures, but the dual mono sub option is set. The subwoofers received a signal in stereo or all ch stereo mode selected while playback. But in auto mode or anything else no sub signal is present. What XLR output do you have your dual subs connected to? R/L sub - L/R subs RR/LR height - L/R Top Middle Speakers RF/LF height - L/R Front heights L/R Front - L/R front speakers L/R Back - Surround back speakers L/R surr - surround speakers Everything is set according to this list in the setup. But as mentioned: in stereo mode or in the level setup the subs behave normal. Only with surround material nothing is present on the sub L/R outputs.
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