Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Oct 11, 2019 11:38:38 GMT -5
Watching Hustle and Flow on Netflix, the XMC2 didn’t handle going from one episode to the next well. On the first 2 occasions, I lost my center channel sound, but on the 3rd occasion it worked fine. My workaround was I went out of Netflix on my ATV4K, brought up YouTubeTV, got sound then went back into Netflix and it worked fine. This is no big deal for me but if my wife was using the XMC2, she probably would call her “tech support”. Next question, is it related to the atv or would this happen on different platforms... Like an Nvidia shield for example. I think the Netflix app on ATV4K could be faulty as it works fine with the YouTubeTV app. I don’t know what you mean by Nvidia shield
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Post by emofrmcgy on Oct 11, 2019 12:12:57 GMT -5
Next question, is it related to the atv or would this happen on different platforms... Like an Nvidia shield for example. I think the Netflix app on ATV4K could be faulty as it works fine with the YouTubeTV app. I don’t know what you mean by Nvidia shield It's an android tv box. I use it for Plex, YouTube and Netflix.
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Oct 11, 2019 17:31:41 GMT -5
I think the Netflix app on ATV4K could be faulty as it works fine with the YouTubeTV app. I don’t know what you mean by Nvidia shield It's an android tv box. I use it for Plex, YouTube and Netflix. Thanks. I just have ATV4K. Not sure about any other devices.
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Post by madaeel on Oct 11, 2019 19:07:21 GMT -5
Remember I mentioned my PS4 did this on the Netflix app. It doesn't do it with my Denon though. I highly doubt it's the app or device. It *seems* like an audio sync issue with the XMC-2. It did it on my PC a couple times too when switching tabs.
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Post by yellowbalt on Oct 12, 2019 4:03:30 GMT -5
Remember I mentioned my PS4 did this on the Netflix app. It doesn't do it with my Denon though. I highly doubt it's the app or device. It *seems* like an audio sync issue with the XMC-2. It did it on my PC a couple times too when switching tabs. Same experience with my marantz here. Still keeping it due to customer service and most of all, SQ snd PQ Danny
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Oct 12, 2019 4:55:40 GMT -5
Remember I mentioned my PS4 did this on the Netflix app. It doesn't do it with my Denon though. I highly doubt it's the app or device. It *seems* like an audio sync issue with the XMC-2. It did it on my PC a couple times too when switching tabs. It could be the XMC2 but I don’t know why it only happens with Netflix and not YouTubeTV or YouTube all on ATV4K. You could be right in that the main difference is that YouTube and YouTubeTV is 2.0 material while Netflix is 5.1. So it could be a syncing issue with 5.1 material.
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Post by thrillcat on Oct 12, 2019 9:33:03 GMT -5
Remember I mentioned my PS4 did this on the Netflix app. It doesn't do it with my Denon though. I highly doubt it's the app or device. It *seems* like an audio sync issue with the XMC-2. It did it on my PC a couple times too when switching tabs. It could be the XMC2 but I don’t know why it only happens with Netflix and not YouTubeTV or YouTube all on ATV4K. You could be right in that the main difference is that YouTube and YouTubeTV is 2.0 material while Netflix is 5.1. So it could be a syncing issue with 5.1 material. It’s due to two things: 1. How the app/device handles the break between episodes. Switching from one file to the next will cause a brief break in the audio stream, some apps seem to be able to bridge that gap, others drop to 0.0 or 2.0 or whatever between episodes. This leads to the other factor; 2. How quickly the processor can sense the first audio format change, identify and lock on, and then sense the next change. I believe it’s a combo of both of these, and that the Emo processors are slow to “latch on” to the first change and they completely miss when it changes back to 5.1, remaining in 2.0, and you have to do something that will tell it that the audio format has changed. I had this problem repeatedly on my XMC-1 and ATV during every season of GoT (going from previous episode recap in 2.0 to new episode in 5.1) and was told they couldn’t replicate it, which I interpret that they were tired of trying. It is incredibly easy to replicate, I’ve had friends replicate it, and there are plenty of people here who have reported the same problem. I have accepted their response as an inability to fix it. I’ve not noticed the issue on the Shield, however I’ve primarily used that for PLEX, not for Netflix. Personally I hate the Shield, except for the fact that it is the only device that will play the uncompressed audio streams from my PLEX database, and since I have a projector, the lack of Dolby Vision is acceptable.
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Post by emofrmcgy on Oct 12, 2019 9:57:05 GMT -5
It could be the XMC2 but I don’t know why it only happens with Netflix and not YouTubeTV or YouTube all on ATV4K. You could be right in that the main difference is that YouTube and YouTubeTV is 2.0 material while Netflix is 5.1. So it could be a syncing issue with 5.1 material. It’s due to two things: 1. How the app/device handles the break between episodes. Switching from one file to the next will cause a brief break in the audio stream, some apps seem to be able to bridge that gap, others drop to 0.0 or 2.0 or whatever between episodes. This leads to the other factor; 2. How quickly the processor can sense the first audio format change, identify and lock on, and then sense the next change. I believe it’s a combo of both of these, and that the Emo processors are slow to “latch on” to the first change and they completely miss when it changes back to 5.1, remaining in 2.0, and you have to do something that will tell it that the audio format has changed. I had this problem repeatedly on my XMC-1 and ATV during every season of GoT (going from previous episode recap in 2.0 to new episode in 5.1) and was told they couldn’t replicate it, which I interpret that they were tired of trying. It is incredibly easy to replicate, I’ve had friends replicate it, and there are plenty of people here who have reported the same problem. I have accepted their response as an inability to fix it. I’ve not noticed the issue on the Shield, however I’ve primarily used that for PLEX, not for Netflix. Personally I hate the Shield, except for the fact that it is the only device that will play the uncompressed audio streams from my PLEX database, and since I have a projector, the lack of Dolby Vision is acceptable. Odroid c2 will also play uncompressed lossless audio, but has its quirks as well. Personally I much preferred the odroid running Kodi and plexkodiconnect to the shield running Plex but convenience of all apps on one device won out..
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Oct 12, 2019 14:58:22 GMT -5
It could be the XMC2 but I don’t know why it only happens with Netflix and not YouTubeTV or YouTube all on ATV4K. You could be right in that the main difference is that YouTube and YouTubeTV is 2.0 material while Netflix is 5.1. So it could be a syncing issue with 5.1 material. It’s due to two things: 1. How the app/device handles the break between episodes. Switching from one file to the next will cause a brief break in the audio stream, some apps seem to be able to bridge that gap, others drop to 0.0 or 2.0 or whatever between episodes. This leads to the other factor; 2. How quickly the processor can sense the first audio format change, identify and lock on, and then sense the next change. I believe it’s a combo of both of these, and that the Emo processors are slow to “latch on” to the first change and they completely miss when it changes back to 5.1, remaining in 2.0, and you have to do something that will tell it that the audio format has changed. I had this problem repeatedly on my XMC-1 and ATV during every season of GoT (going from previous episode recap in 2.0 to new episode in 5.1) and was told they couldn’t replicate it, which I interpret that they were tired of trying. It is incredibly easy to replicate, I’ve had friends replicate it, and there are plenty of people here who have reported the same problem. I have accepted their response as an inability to fix it. I’ve not noticed the issue on the Shield, however I’ve primarily used that for PLEX, not for Netflix. Personally I hate the Shield, except for the fact that it is the only device that will play the uncompressed audio streams from my PLEX database, and since I have a projector, the lack of Dolby Vision is acceptable. I guess the bottom line is what is acceptable? Perhaps if Emotiva had an audio “refresh” button that could resolve the issue vs. the user having to change to a different app within ATV or change input and back, I think would be an acceptable solution for me. Just admit that these changes can’t be handled automatically and give us a refresh button (if this is a possible solution).
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Post by thrillcat on Oct 12, 2019 15:25:59 GMT -5
It’s due to two things: 1. How the app/device handles the break between episodes. Switching from one file to the next will cause a brief break in the audio stream, some apps seem to be able to bridge that gap, others drop to 0.0 or 2.0 or whatever between episodes. This leads to the other factor; 2. How quickly the processor can sense the first audio format change, identify and lock on, and then sense the next change. I believe it’s a combo of both of these, and that the Emo processors are slow to “latch on” to the first change and they completely miss when it changes back to 5.1, remaining in 2.0, and you have to do something that will tell it that the audio format has changed. I had this problem repeatedly on my XMC-1 and ATV during every season of GoT (going from previous episode recap in 2.0 to new episode in 5.1) and was told they couldn’t replicate it, which I interpret that they were tired of trying. It is incredibly easy to replicate, I’ve had friends replicate it, and there are plenty of people here who have reported the same problem. I have accepted their response as an inability to fix it. I’ve not noticed the issue on the Shield, however I’ve primarily used that for PLEX, not for Netflix. Personally I hate the Shield, except for the fact that it is the only device that will play the uncompressed audio streams from my PLEX database, and since I have a projector, the lack of Dolby Vision is acceptable. I guess the bottom line is what is acceptable? Perhaps if Emotiva had an audio “refresh” button that could resolve the issue vs. the user having to change to a different app within ATV or change input and back, I think would be an acceptable solution for me. Just admit that these changes can’t be handled automatically and give us a refresh button (if this is a possible solution). By “accepting” I didn’t mean that it’s a solution. I just grew tired of bringing it up and being told that they couldn’t reproduce it. Either they don’t want to fix it, don’t know to fix it, or the hardware just doesn’t work fast enough. I’ve been told that they “never give up”, but it sure seems like they’ve given up on that one, since it’s still happening in the new line of processors.
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Post by foggy1956 on Oct 12, 2019 18:20:39 GMT -5
I guess the bottom line is what is acceptable? Perhaps if Emotiva had an audio “refresh” button that could resolve the issue vs. the user having to change to a different app within ATV or change input and back, I think would be an acceptable solution for me. Just admit that these changes can’t be handled automatically and give us a refresh button (if this is a possible solution). By “accepting” I didn’t mean that it’s a solution. I just grew tired of bringing it up and being told that they couldn’t reproduce it. Either they don’t want to fix it, don’t know to fix it, or the hardware just doesn’t work fast enough. I’ve been told that they “never give up”, but it sure seems like they’ve given up on that one, since it’s still happening in the new line of processors. If you set the xmc input to handle 2.0 in a multi-channel format, does that make the problem go away?
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Post by thxultra on Oct 14, 2019 8:54:17 GMT -5
Another thing I noticed when I went to play the 5.1 dsd mix off SACD of Dark Side of the moon is the XMC-2 saw the signal as DSD 5.1 but only played it back in stereo. I wasn't able to change the mode to 5.1 using the mode button also.
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Post by madaeel on Oct 14, 2019 16:29:30 GMT -5
It could be the XMC2 but I don’t know why it only happens with Netflix and not YouTubeTV or YouTube all on ATV4K. You could be right in that the main difference is that YouTube and YouTubeTV is 2.0 material while Netflix is 5.1. So it could be a syncing issue with 5.1 material. It’s due to two things: 1. How the app/device handles the break between episodes. Switching from one file to the next will cause a brief break in the audio stream, some apps seem to be able to bridge that gap, others drop to 0.0 or 2.0 or whatever between episodes. This leads to the other factor; 2. How quickly the processor can sense the first audio format change, identify and lock on, and then sense the next change. I believe it’s a combo of both of these, and that the Emo processors are slow to “latch on” to the first change and they completely miss when it changes back to 5.1, remaining in 2.0, and you have to do something that will tell it that the audio format has changed. I had this problem repeatedly on my XMC-1 and ATV during every season of GoT (going from previous episode recap in 2.0 to new episode in 5.1) and was told they couldn’t replicate it, which I interpret that they were tired of trying. It is incredibly easy to replicate, I’ve had friends replicate it, and there are plenty of people here who have reported the same problem. I have accepted their response as an inability to fix it. I’ve not noticed the issue on the Shield, however I’ve primarily used that for PLEX, not for Netflix. Personally I hate the Shield, except for the fact that it is the only device that will play the uncompressed audio streams from my PLEX database, and since I have a projector, the lack of Dolby Vision is acceptable. Well that definitely makes sense as to the reason why. I know when I switch channels on the cable box with the denon sometimes it'll pop up in the info that it's a stereo source and then switch back to 5.1 once it goes to the next channel. Which is fine of course as long as it locks back on to the signal and I really never gave much thought to it since it always does. I just didn't think the Netlfix app did this. I guess I just assumed it's always in 5.1 even in the menu. Since it never happened with the Denon I never thought to check. If you say it was doing it on the XMC-1 though that would lead me to believe its just an Emotiva issue that, as you mentioned, they either can't fix or just won't devote the time to fix. That's one of the reasons I sent mine back though and I'm sure gives others pause though so I don't understand this. At the end of a long day or week it's little annoyances like that that'll drive you mad. While the Denon definitely falls short of the XMC-2 in sound quality it just works with no glitches. If Emotiva would get their HT processors to run smoother with less quirks I'm sure they'd keep and draw in more customers.
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Post by Gary Cook on Oct 14, 2019 18:25:12 GMT -5
I had this problem repeatedly on my XMC-1 and ATV during every season of GoT (going from previous episode recap in 2.0 to new episode in 5.1) and was told they couldn’t replicate it, which I interpret that they were tired of trying. It is incredibly easy to replicate, I’ve had friends replicate it, and there are plenty of people here who have reported the same problem. I recall that I tested it when you raised it at the time and I couldn't duplicate it either. My gear list is still the same as it was then, logically there must be something different in your set up. For example I have Samsung TV, so no Dolby Vision, or perhaps the settings on the ATV4K? Cheers Gary
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Post by consul on Oct 15, 2019 15:22:51 GMT -5
It doesn't seem all that complicated...
RMC-1 and RMC-1L:
All channels in "fully balanced MONO mode"
XMC-2: Front three channels in "fully balanced MONO mode" All other channels in "fully balanced STEREO mode"
Keith, would you please confirm, if XMC-2 and RMC-1L use the same power supply design? Is here a huge toroidal transformer inside of a linear power supply (similar to XMC-1) or a switching power supply to provide more output power - e.g. for RMC-1 series, with more components inside? Best, Alexander Hello, any update here? The downside of RMC-1 to XMC-1 seems to be using a switching power supply... Is it the same with XMC-2?..
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Oct 15, 2019 15:23:39 GMT -5
Heads up here.
During our testing we found an issue using the Apple 4K TV, Netflix playing an Atmos movie. The issue is the sound field changing states and speaker assignments moving around. After doing some internal test and research we found this to be a common factor for all brands of AVR/AVPs. From our testing we can play Netflix on a Roku and get proper ATMOS, but if you play the same thing on ATV 4K its messed up. Some of the reports on the web state this has been brought to the attention of Apple. I feel confident that Apple will resolve this.
Just wanted to give everyone a heads up in case you run into it.
Lonnie
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Post by davidl81 on Oct 15, 2019 15:40:33 GMT -5
Keith, would you please confirm, if XMC-2 and RMC-1L use the same power supply design? Is here a huge toroidal transformer inside of a linear power supply (similar to XMC-1) or a switching power supply to provide more output power - e.g. for RMC-1 series, with more components inside? Best, Alexander Hello, any update here? The downside of RMC-1 to XMC-1 seems to be using a switching power supply... Is it the same with XMC-2?.. Why do you consider this to be a downside? FWIW the Monoprioce HTP-1 went from a linear power supply to a switching one because they had less noise.
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Oct 15, 2019 15:56:35 GMT -5
All of the new processors use a switching supply.... (There are also multiple local regulators inside - also switching type regulators.)
I would also concur that using a SMPS is hardly a downside... we switched over to one because it delivered BETTER performance.
Hello, any update here? The downside of RMC-1 to XMC-1 seems to be using a switching power supply... Is it the same with XMC-2?.. Why do you consider this to be a downside? FWIW the Monoprioce HTP-1 went from a linear power supply to a switching one because they had less noise.
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Oct 15, 2019 21:59:18 GMT -5
Heads up here. During our testing we found an issue using the Apple 4K TV, Netflix playing an Atmos movie. The issue is the sound field changing states and speaker assignments moving around. After doing some internal test and research we found this to be a common factor for all brands of AVR/AVPs. From our testing we can play Netflix on a Roku and get proper ATMOS, but if you play the same thing on ATV 4K its messed up. Some of the reports on the web state this has been brought to the attention of Apple. I feel confident that Apple will resolve this. Just wanted to give everyone a heads up in case you run into it. Lonnie I’m glad you guys are figuring things out and identifying the issues as non-XMC2 processor but further upstream. Apple has had lots of problems with their stuff lately.
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Post by artooman on Oct 15, 2019 23:52:20 GMT -5
Hi Folks! I got my XMC-2 today! Here are my first impressions.
I had concerns based on earlier posts, but I have not had any significant problems. I am currently watching 4K HDR with Atmos on my LG Blu-ray player. No HDMI sync issues. I have a 25ft 18gbps copper HDMI run to my TV and a short Emotiva ZHDMI to the blu-Ray.
Edit: I did run into HDMI sync issues on DTS-MA with HDR but solved it by replacing my 25ft HDMI with a 10ft 8K 48gbps cable. I have a longer fiber optic 8k on order and hope that works as well.
My NVIDIA SHIELD TV and Nintendo Switch work as well with full capabilities. Haven’t tried HDR or anything beyond PCM 5.1 there.
I did have some issues at first with 4k HDR + DT-MA at some point, but it turned out to be the settings on my TV and Blu-ray player that seemed to cause it.
Pausing and unpausing on my Blu-ray causes no missed sound due to sync delays. However, Netflix on my shield does exhibit ~1-2 second delay when unpausing. I suspect this is an issue with the device. Maybe a fiber 8k 48gbps cable will help it sync faster. Who knows. Haven’t tested other apps.
Menus are slow but tolerable. Switching inputs is slow. None of this is unexpected based on others’ feedback nor is this a problem for me.
Sound is great paired with and XPA amp, B&W CT7.3 LCR main speakers, and CT7.5 surrounds. Crystal clear with great imaging. I cannot wait for Dirac. My old BasX MC-700 EQ was tuned well, and I definitely don’t have the XMC-2 dialed in yet. In some ways I miss my MC-700. In particular, the LFE is anemic right now. Maybe I will try to upload those settings into my XMC-2 to see if it helps.
Firmware version 1.5.
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