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Post by Aspen0220 on Sept 11, 2020 7:55:56 GMT -5
Been debating if I should upgrade to the XMC-2. I'm not planning on adding atmos to my system so I'm not sure what are the benefits of the new processor. Better dirac? Better DAC? Better sound? Just trying to find a reason to upgrade while I have the money  |
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Post by rbk123 on Sept 11, 2020 8:33:14 GMT -5
- Dirac should be better, but I think it's currently a work in progress
- 4K HDMI switching/handling will be better
- you lose some legacy abilities
- you gain 5 years of warranty
- resell value of the XMC-2 will be higher/last longer
- ergonomics are different so depends on your taste
- it's got the "new toy" factor
- DACs are different, but imo this is an over-focused element
Blind testing it would be hard to tell them apart for non-Atmos material, until Dirac gets more optimized. The additional warranty is worth a lot.
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Post by ttocs on Sept 11, 2020 9:19:20 GMT -5
I upgraded from XMC-1 to XMC-2. I hoped the sound would be better. Didn't care much about ATMOS at the time. I stopped using Dirac Live Full because it didnt' work well with my speakers so I wasn't expecting much from a new version.
After using the XMC-2.
I was blown away by the much better sound!
I decided to try ATMOS and now love it!
Dirac works very well for multi-channel, still don't use it for 2 channel but might once the Bass Control is available.
Knowing what I know now, I would've upgraded based soley on the better sound. It was difficult to wrap my brain around how the sound could improve as much as it did.
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cawgijoe
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"We made too many of the wrong mistakes." - Yogi Berra
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Post by cawgijoe on Sept 11, 2020 9:27:01 GMT -5
I upgraded from XMC-1 to XMC-2. I hoped the sound would be better. Didn't care much about ATMOS at the time. I stopped using Dirac Live Full because it didnt' work well with my speakers so I wasn't expecting much from a new version. After using the XMC-2. I was blown away by the much better sound! I decided to try ATMOS and now love it! Dirac works very well for multi-channel, still don't use it for 2 channel but might once the Bass Control is available. Knowing what I know now, I would've upgraded based soley on the better sound. It was difficult to wrap my brain around how the sound could improve as much as it did. +1 Wish I could do Atmos in my current family room....too much effort for ceiling speakers and also the WAF. Will do so in the next house in a couple years, hopefully. Any good, inexpensive, "bounce" speakers? |
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Post by Aspen0220 on Sept 11, 2020 9:51:38 GMT -5
Not really sure I would upgrade mainly for resell value and extended warranty. I mean, 1k+ for those alone is pretty high . I am really hoping for better sound, movies and 2 channel music. Maybe better dirac implementation. - Dirac should be better, but I think it's currently a work in progress - 4K HDMI switching/handling will be better - you lose some legacy abilities - you gain 5 years of warranty - resell value of the XMC-2 will be higher/last longer - ergonomics are different so depends on your taste - it's got the "new toy" factor - DACs are different, but imo this is an over-focused element Blind testing it would be hard to tell them apart for non-Atmos material, until Dirac gets more optimized. The additional warranty is worth a lot. |
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Post by Aspen0220 on Sept 11, 2020 9:53:06 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback. It's nice to hear the sound is much better. I wonder if the processor is the reason for the better sound or just better dirac implementation in general. I upgraded from XMC-1 to XMC-2. I hoped the sound would be better. Didn't care much about ATMOS at the time. I stopped using Dirac Live Full because it didnt' work well with my speakers so I wasn't expecting much from a new version. After using the XMC-2. I was blown away by the much better sound! I decided to try ATMOS and now love it! Dirac works very well for multi-channel, still don't use it for 2 channel but might once the Bass Control is available. Knowing what I know now, I would've upgraded based soley on the better sound. It was difficult to wrap my brain around how the sound could improve as much as it did. |
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Post by ttocs on Sept 11, 2020 10:21:14 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback. It's nice to hear the sound is much better. I wonder if the processor is the reason for the better sound or just better dirac implementation in general. I upgraded from XMC-1 to XMC-2. I hoped the sound would be better. Didn't care much about ATMOS at the time. I stopped using Dirac Live Full because it didnt' work well with my speakers so I wasn't expecting much from a new version. After using the XMC-2. I was blown away by the much better sound! I decided to try ATMOS and now love it! Dirac works very well for multi-channel, still don't use it for 2 channel but might once the Bass Control is available. Knowing what I know now, I would've upgraded based soley on the better sound. It was difficult to wrap my brain around how the sound could improve as much as it did. The sound is better period. Without Dirac. I'm certain it's due to the DACs and their implementation. This is what I posted the day after receiving the unit and connecting it: In fact, the entire frequency spectrum is more cohesive, articulate, and dynamic. It's way more improvement than I thought possible. This is just for two channel Reference Stereo listening.It's not just that the DACs are different, but also that they are running in Differential Mono Mode. |
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Post by garbulky on Sept 11, 2020 11:00:46 GMT -5
ttocs That's good to know that it sounds better! Without hearing it, I would say the important incentive for the upgrade is to keep the upgradability intact. We don't know how long they will allow the XMC-1 discount program for. Once they stop with it, then you stop being able to upgrade. It's sad because the XMC-1 was supposed to be a stable platform meant for upgrades many years in to the future. But with the XMC-2, it forces you to buy a new system. Still I think it's the best outcome. State of the art procerssors are very expensive, so keeping the upgrade chain going is probably worth it. I just hope that the XMC-2 will have seveeral upgrades past HDMI 2.1 - or even be able to be upgraded to 2.1.
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Post by rbk123 on Sept 11, 2020 11:04:08 GMT -5
Not really sure I would upgrade mainly for resell value and extended warranty. I mean, 1k+ for those alone is pretty high . I am really hoping for better sound, movies and 2 channel music. Maybe better dirac implementation. I would definitely agree with your logic, with the caveat that 1 or 2 repairs on an out of warranty XMC-1 will negate the $1k pretty quickly. Chad upgraded recently from the -1 to -2 so I'm curious his thoughts; not to mention a slew of others. 2 things to consider: - beware apples to oranges source comparison - ie. 4K non-Atmos (i.e. DTS-HD)soundtracks are different masterings than Bluray no-Atmos (i.e. DTS-HD); but this won't pertain to music - the main 2 channels on the XMC-1 are also dual differential I would definitely raise an eyebrow on any "night and day" improvement claims; there just isn't a lot of upward improvement range available since the XMC-1 is such a great product. Lots of expectation bias/new toy bias/upgraditis bias, etc... |
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Post by ttocs on Sept 11, 2020 11:18:27 GMT -5
ttocs That's good to know that it sounds better! Without hearing it, I would say the important incentive for the upgrade is to keep the upgradability intact. We don't know how long they will allow the XMC-1 discount program for. Once they stop with it, then you stop being able to upgrade. It's sad because the XMC-1 was supposed to be a stable platform meant for upgrades many years in to the future. But with the XMC-2, it forces you to buy a new system. Still I think it's the best outcome. State of the art procerssors are very expensive, so keeping the upgrade chain going is probably worth it. I just hope that the XMC-2 will have seveeral upgrades past HDMI 2.1 - or even be able to be upgraded to 2.1. If you'll recall, the future ATMOS Upgrade Board for the XMC-1 was supposed to be about $600 and required the V3 HDMI Upgrade Board at $400, so that's why the XMC-2 is the upgrade price that it is. Plus improved audio parts for LCR channels. |
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Post by ttocs on Sept 11, 2020 11:35:08 GMT -5
- the main 2 channels on the XMC-1 are also dual differential I would definitely raise an eyebrow on any "night and day" improvement claims; there just isn't a lot of upward improvement range available since the XMC-1 is such a great product. Lots of expectation bias/new toy bias/upgraditis bias, etc... The L/R channels on the XMC-1 are not the same as XMC-2. The LCR DACs on the XMC-2 being in Differential Mono Mode is a big deal. This is not the same as all the channels on both processors being Fully Balanced, it's in addition to. I raised my eyebrows when I heard the improvement in Reference Stereo music listening! It's not a small difference. Emotiva really should allow folks to keep the XMC-1 for a couple days before returning it so the comparison can be even more evident. |
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Post by garbulky on Sept 11, 2020 11:48:19 GMT -5
ttocs That's good to know that it sounds better! Without hearing it, I would say the important incentive for the upgrade is to keep the upgradability intact. We don't know how long they will allow the XMC-1 discount program for. Once they stop with it, then you stop being able to upgrade. It's sad because the XMC-1 was supposed to be a stable platform meant for upgrades many years in to the future. But with the XMC-2, it forces you to buy a new system. Still I think it's the best outcome. State of the art procerssors are very expensive, so keeping the upgrade chain going is probably worth it. I just hope that the XMC-2 will have seveeral upgrades past HDMI 2.1 - or even be able to be upgraded to 2.1. If you'll recall, the future ATMOS Upgrade Board for the XMC-1 was supposed to be about $600 and required the V3 HDMI Upgrade Board at $400, so that's why the XMC-2 is the upgrade price that it is. Plus improved audio parts for LCR channels. I think the upgrade price for a new unit is MORE than fair. A real deal imo. If I owned the XMC-1, I would buy the XMC-2 deal. It's a no brainer. My issue is that people are going to be forced to make the purchase in the very near future just to keep their future upgrades after that going. So for instance, if they were interested in 8k HDMI 2.1, they will HAVE to purchase the XMC-2 more or less, now. And then reupgrade later to upgrade. Instead of sticking with the XMC-1 till whatever future upgrade they are waiting for comes. Still I see why Emotiva made the decision as the XMC-1 platform was not viable for ugprades. Practically it's the correct one that's most fair to their customers. |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Sept 11, 2020 12:55:24 GMT -5
- Dirac should be better, but I think it's currently a work in progress - 4K HDMI switching/handling will be better - you lose some legacy abilities - you gain 5 years of warranty - resell value of the XMC-2 will be higher/last longer - ergonomics are different so depends on your taste - it's got the "new toy" factor - DACs are different, but imo this is an over-focused element Blind testing it would be hard to tell them apart for non-Atmos material, until Dirac gets more optimized. The additional warranty is worth a lot. This is a good analysis. If you don’t have the 4K board but plan on a 4K TV and sources, that’s a compelling reason. The lost “legacy abilities” include Tape In/Out if that’s important (I miss tape out), also no RCA outs which though with adapters and possibly Ys can be compensated for, may be awkward. I find Dirac much improved and use it for both HT and Stereo (though still use Reference too). I think the upgrade and warranty is certainly worth the price, but also think the XMC-1 is a solid unit and if I hadn’t wanted Atmos might still be happy with. |
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Post by repeetavx on Sept 11, 2020 15:09:32 GMT -5
I don't care about 4k or ATMOS. The only reason I would upgrade is for the improvement in two channel sound. ttocs seems to think that it is a noticeable improvement, which is the only reason I would consider upgrading. I'm looking for more of a consensus before I do.
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Post by foggy1956 on Sept 11, 2020 15:26:55 GMT -5
I don't care about 4k or ATMOS. The only reason I would upgrade is for the improvement in two channel sound. ttocs seems to think that it is a noticeable improvement, which is the only reason I would consider upgrading. I'm looking for more of a consensus before I do. I agree with ttocs |
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Post by JKCashin on Sept 11, 2020 16:04:06 GMT -5
I was convinced the XMC-2 sounded better than my old XMC-1, but it's a totally unscientific assertion. Without the old XMC-1 to compare it to, it might be placebo. That said, better sound is better sound, placebo or not! (I drank the kool-aid)
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Post by autocrat on Sept 13, 2020 18:57:30 GMT -5
I don't care about 4k or ATMOS. The only reason I would upgrade is for the improvement in two channel sound. ttocs seems to think that it is a noticeable improvement, which is the only reason I would consider upgrading. I'm looking for more of a consensus before I do. In your case, instead of a new processor I'd buy a 2-channel preamp with HT bypass. |
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Post by creimes on Sept 14, 2020 10:10:10 GMT -5
Owning a XMC-1 in which you are able to trade up to a XMC-2 is an amazing deal IMO if that matters haha, a new unit with 5 years of warranty, what other company offers that ?
Chad
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Post by frenchyfranky on Sept 14, 2020 11:22:37 GMT -5
I was convinced the XMC-2 sounded better than my old XMC-1, but it's a totally unscientific assertion. Without the old XMC-1 to compare it to, it might be placebo. That said, better sound is better sound, placebo or not! (I drank the kool-aid) I have the same reflection but I'm pretty sure that it sounds better. 😂 |
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Post by Aspen0220 on Sept 15, 2020 18:05:23 GMT -5
Well, thanks for feedback guys and gals. I went ahead and upgraded to the XMC-2. Now I just need to find all the old accessories somehow or I will be charged additional money.
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