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Post by mysterymachine on Apr 29, 2010 3:04:14 GMT -5
I see this on all my sources (PS3, Oppo BDP-83, and cable box) but its easiet to see on PS3 though with the menus.
If I set the source resolution to be 720P and the output to be 720p there is something weird going on. Its most noticable on high contrast text (white on black/black on white etc). The letters will be very blocky and jaggy. If I change the source resolution to be 1080i or 1080p and have the UMC downscale to 720P its fine or even change to 480P and have it upscale again no issue. This is a big issue becuase most PS3 games are 720P. Also the image is less detailed in 720in to 720 out than it is if I plug the PS3 in directly to projector.
It doesn't matter if I have it in Auto (my projector is 768), Passthrough or manually choose 720P - same behavior.
Easiest way to see is just pick a black background on PS3 and look at the menus. This is not a slight subtle thing - its obvious.
I am on the firmware that came on my UMC: 6.02.00.06.
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Post by hakanberg on Apr 29, 2010 7:23:21 GMT -5
Perhaps you should try to upgrade to the latest firware (is V6.02.11 the latest?)?
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Post by Nemesis.ie on Apr 29, 2010 7:30:21 GMT -5
I saw this too - but in my case 1080p to 1080p - even in pass through. The solution was to drop the sharpness control in both the UMC-1 and the projector to 0 and then play with small increases on one at a time until the text looks good. It's still a little odd, even in passthrough, but better than default (sharpness enhancement on top of sharpness enhancement).
Let us know if you see the same thing.
I am using the beta from last Friday.
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Post by mysterymachine on Apr 29, 2010 12:23:42 GMT -5
Perhaps you should try to upgrade to the latest firware (is V6.02.11 the latest?)? I was all set to install the newest but got nervous when I saw Lonnies post on the beta to not install if you have not done a firmware update yourself already. Also AFAIK the beta was all focused on audio issues not video. I don't see that anyone reported this issue with video yet. I saw this too - but in my case 1080p to 1080p - even in pass through. The solution was to drop the sharpness control in both the UMC-1 and the projector to 0 and then play with small increases on one at a time until the text looks good. It's still a little odd, even in passthrough, but better than default (sharpness enhancement on top of sharpness enhancement). Let us know if you see the same thing. I am using the beta from last Friday. Thanks, I will try changing the sharpness. I know I have the projector set at 0 already. I would say its definately a bug since any other resolution scaled to 720 looks great - why would it not apply the sharpness when scaling but do it when not? Its not just HDMI either, my cable box HDMI doesn't like the UMC so I have it hooked up with component and same issue with 720P sources. Passthrough doesn't work right with my projector so if that makes anything better its no help for me. I can't test 1080P to 1080P since my projector won't accept 1080P. I am pretty sure I tested 1080i to 1080i and it looked fine but I will test again tonight and take some pictures. Once I have pictures etc I will add to the bug tracker and call/email emo about it. This is the biggest bug for me (besides one channel missing when I use analog 5.1... but I haven't started troubleshooting that - hopefully its just a bad interconnect). |
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Post by robfive on Apr 29, 2010 14:02:22 GMT -5
I see this on all my sources (PS3, Oppo BDP-83, and cable box) but its easiet to see on PS3 though with the menus. If I set the source resolution to be 720P and the output to be 720p there is something weird going on. Its most noticable on high contrast text (white on black/black on white etc). The letters will be very blocky and jaggy. If I change the source resolution to be 1080i or 1080p and have the UMC downscale to 720P its fine or even change to 480P and have it upscale again no issue. This is a big issue becuase most PS3 games are 720P. Also the image is less detailed in 720in to 720 out than it is if I plug the PS3 in directly to projector. It doesn't matter if I have it in Auto (my projector is 768), Passthrough or manually choose 720P - same behavior. Easiest way to see is just pick a black background on PS3 and look at the menus. This is not a slight subtle thing - its obvious. I am on the firmware that came on my UMC: 6.02.00.06. I have noticed the same thing on my lcd monitor and projector. The picture quality takes an obvious hit when routed through the UMC-1. Straight from the PS3 to the monitor (1440 x 900) it looks great with the PS3 set at 720p or 1080p. However, when routed through the UMC-1 the entire picture becomes less detailed (easily apparent with text on light background). With the PS3 and UMC-1 both set to 720p the issue is very pronounced and with both set to 1080p it gets better but it is still less clear than outputting 720p or 1080p from the PS3 straight to the monitor. I have tried to engage the Pass Though feature on the UMC-1 but it says my display device will not support it. I will try to take some screen shots of the projector soon to illustrate what I am describing. |
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hemster
Global Moderator 
Particle Manufacturer
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Post by hemster on Apr 29, 2010 14:09:51 GMT -5
How are you guys connecting the UMC to the display/projector? Are you using component or HDMI?
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DYohn
Emo VIPs 
Posts: 18,494
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Post by DYohn on Apr 29, 2010 14:48:20 GMT -5
I see this on all my sources (PS3, Oppo BDP-83, and cable box) but its easiet to see on PS3 though with the menus. If I set the source resolution to be 720P and the output to be 720p there is something weird going on. Its most noticable on high contrast text (white on black/black on white etc). The letters will be very blocky and jaggy. If I change the source resolution to be 1080i or 1080p and have the UMC downscale to 720P its fine or even change to 480P and have it upscale again no issue. This is a big issue becuase most PS3 games are 720P. Also the image is less detailed in 720in to 720 out than it is if I plug the PS3 in directly to projector. It doesn't matter if I have it in Auto (my projector is 768), Passthrough or manually choose 720P - same behavior. Easiest way to see is just pick a black background on PS3 and look at the menus. This is not a slight subtle thing - its obvious. I am on the firmware that came on my UMC: 6.02.00.06. I have noticed the same thing on my lcd monitor and projector. The picture quality takes an obvious hit when routed through the UMC-1. Straight from the PS3 to the monitor (1440 x 900) it looks great with the PS3 set at 720p or 1080p. However, when routed through the UMC-1 the entire picture becomes less detailed (easily apparent with text on light background). With the PS3 and UMC-1 both set to 720p the issue is very pronounced and with both set to 1080p it gets better but it is still less clear than outputting 720p or 1080p from the PS3 straight to the monitor. I have tried to engage the Pass Though feature on the UMC-1 but it says my display device will not support it. I will try to take some screen shots of the projector soon to illustrate what I am describing. Then something is wrong. The UMC-1 should not cause image degradation. Indeed in my system the processor looks great. You must have a cable or device incompatibility issue. |
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Post by mysterymachine on Apr 29, 2010 17:02:27 GMT -5
I have noticed the same thing on my lcd monitor and projector. The picture quality takes an obvious hit when routed through the UMC-1. Straight from the PS3 to the monitor (1440 x 900) it looks great with the PS3 set at 720p or 1080p. However, when routed through the UMC-1 the entire picture becomes less detailed (easily apparent with text on light background). With the PS3 and UMC-1 both set to 720p the issue is very pronounced and with both set to 1080p it gets better but it is still less clear than outputting 720p or 1080p from the PS3 straight to the monitor. I have tried to engage the Pass Though feature on the UMC-1 but it says my display device will not support it. I will try to take some screen shots of the projector soon to illustrate what I am describing. Interesting - we both get the display device not supported error when we try to passthrough. So the issues might be related. Your monitor DVI or HDMI? I'm wondering if normally input = output res the chipset essentially does passthrough - but because it thinks our devices don't support passthrough its doing something strange when encountering that situation. I dunno just guessing at this point. Then something is wrong. The UMC-1 should not cause image degradation. Indeed in my system the processor looks great. You must have a cable or device incompatibility issue. DYohn, Do you have a source device where you can set the resolution and try setting the source to 720p and setting the output in the UMC to 720p and viewing a high contrast image, specifically text or strong lines, and verify the image does not degrade drastically? Hemster, I am connecting via DVI. I have component running to the projector as well but it seems the UMC will not activate the component outs with the HDMI active. I will try via component as well. |
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Post by mysterymachine on Apr 30, 2010 1:00:47 GMT -5
The sharpness fixed it!
Its really strange that the issue only shows up on 720 to 720 etc and not 1080 to 720.
I had to turn the sharpness all the way down to 0. Text still looked good at around 10 to 15 but final fantasy 13 has a white start screen with black letters - the jaggies and blotchyness there did not go away till sharpness was all the way down to 0.
As far as loss of detail.. in general my picture is a little more washed out with the UMC but I had everything tweaked to perfection on the iScan VP50 that I was using for HDMI switching before and I can't expect the UMC to compete with the VP50 in the video department. I'm sure it will look better after some tweaking on the UMC.
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Post by Nemesis.ie on Apr 30, 2010 4:41:43 GMT -5
Good news.
IMO the default "50" sharpness setting is way too high, 10 or 15 would be a better default.
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Post by markus on Apr 30, 2010 7:41:09 GMT -5
I hope they will default to 0  |
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Post by Nemesis.ie on Apr 30, 2010 7:47:46 GMT -5
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Post by robfive on Apr 30, 2010 13:21:57 GMT -5
The sharpness fixed it! Its really strange that the issue only shows up on 720 to 720 etc and not 1080 to 720. I had to turn the sharpness all the way down to 0. Text still looked good at around 10 to 15 but final fantasy 13 has a white start screen with black letters - the jaggies and blotchyness there did not go away till sharpness was all the way down to 0. As far as loss of detail.. in general my picture is a little more washed out with the UMC but I had everything tweaked to perfection on the iScan VP50 that I was using for HDMI switching before and I can't expect the UMC to compete with the VP50 in the video department. I'm sure it will look better after some tweaking on the UMC. That's great news. I'll be sure to try it tonight. In reply to other posts: I am using only HDMI or HDMI/DVI cables, no component. Both my projector and monitor are HDCP DVI connections. I still think it is odd that the pass through feature cannot engage in mysterymachine's and my systems. |
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