UMC vs. Onkyo PR-SC5507

[ntrain42]

The 885,886,5507 are all superior to the UMC. Superior video processing, superior DACs............after spending alot of time with the UMC-1 and tired of the bugs that I dont think will ever be fixed fully(waiting for one final FW code) I am ready to sell it off. GLad I kept an 886.

[flamingeye]

I agree on everything you said about the onkyo I can`t comment on the UMC of course didn`t/don`t have one and I think the UMC is in a different category/class anyway but the 5507 is impressive and on the relay clicking mine is 4 feet away in a open av rack and I beerily notes it it`s very faint sounding so you have to be anal IMHO to be bothered by it no offence intended to the once it does I`m just saying

[solarrdadd]

i do not own (and never have) the UMC-1 so i really can't speak to it. i will say that i would not trade my 5507 for anything! one of the things i was surprised and bothered by while i was waiting for the UMC-1 to finally be released is it didn't support DSD for SACD's. Emo stated that the licensing would cost too much and have to raise the price and the chip they were using just didn't support it. surprisingly enough, i purchased for my basement office secondary HT setup a new receiver, the Onkyo 308, works great, HDMI 1.4, all lossless codecs and it supports DSD (made my oppo 80 happy)and it only cost $230.oo if they could do it at that price and include DSD support i'm surprised that emo couldn't. emo also said that it wasn't something they felt their customer base was demanding as a feature. that was a big turn off for me as i have a nice size SACD w/DSD collection. i really wanted to go with the UMC-1 because i have a couple of emo amps and was very happy with them and the customer service. but, the delays, the lack of certain features made me ripe for the picking when the word of 5507 came on the scene and was relesed before the UMC-1 on the date that Onkyo promised too. not to worry, this was not an emo bashing thing here, i just purchased an Ultra Sub 10 from them and love it! I'm still a very happy emo customer, i can easily see myself buying other products from them in the future; i just went with a different pre-amp provider when the opportunity wheel went round!

[LCSeminole]

Jul 10, 2010 11:38:32 GMT -5 solarrdadd said:

i do not own (and never have) the UMC-1 so i really can't speak to it. i will say that i would not trade my 5507 for anything! one of the things i was surprised and bothered by while i was waiting for the UMC-1 to finally be released is it didn't support DSD for SACD's. Emo stated that the licensing would cost too much and have to raise the price and the chip they were using just didn't support it. surprisingly enough, i purchased for my basement office secondary HT setup a new receiver, the Onkyo 308, works great, HDMI 1.4, all lossless codecs and it supports DSD (made my oppo 80 happy)and it only cost $230.oo if they could do it at that price and include DSD support i'm surprised that emo couldn't. emo also said that it wasn't something they felt their customer base was demanding as a feature. that was a big turn off for me as i have a nice size SACD w/DSD collection. i really wanted to go with the UMC-1 because i have a couple of emo amps and was very happy with them and the customer service. but, the delays, the lack of certain features made me ripe for the picking when the word of 5507 came on the scene and was relesed before the UMC-1 on the date that Onkyo promised too. not to worry, this was not an emo bashing thing here, i just purchased an Ultra Sub 10 from them and love it! I'm still a very happy emo customer, i can easily see myself buying other products from them in the future; i just went with a different pre-amp provider when the opportunity wheel went round!

Options are great aren't they!!! Your post is a good one in so many ways as it doesn't bash one brand just because you bought another. Not all products are for everyone and it sounds like you found the one for you. Enjoy it!!!

[ntrain42]

Jul 10, 2010 11:38:32 GMT -5 solarrdadd said:

i do not own (and never have) the UMC-1 so i really can't speak to it. i will say that i would not trade my 5507 for anything! one of the things i was surprised and bothered by while i was waiting for the UMC-1 to finally be released is it didn't support DSD for SACD's. Emo stated that the licensing would cost too much and have to raise the price and the chip they were using just didn't support it. surprisingly enough, i purchased for my basement office secondary HT setup a new receiver, the Onkyo 308, works great, HDMI 1.4, all lossless codecs and it supports DSD (made my oppo 80 happy)and it only cost $230.oo if they could do it at that price and include DSD support i'm surprised that emo couldn't. emo also said that it wasn't something they felt their customer base was demanding as a feature. that was a big turn off for me as i have a nice size SACD w/DSD collection. i really wanted to go with the UMC-1 because i have a couple of emo amps and was very happy with them and the customer service. but, the delays, the lack of certain features made me ripe for the picking when the word of 5507 came on the scene and was relesed before the UMC-1 on the date that Onkyo promised too. not to worry, this was not an emo bashing thing here, i just purchased an Ultra Sub 10 from them and love it! I'm still a very happy emo customer, i can easily see myself buying other products from them in the future; i just went with a different pre-amp provider when the opportunity wheel went round!

I wouldnt want to trade that 5507 either...............

[NorthStar]

I want to upgrade my 886 for a new pre/pro with the new Audyssey MultEQ XT 32!
...Perhaps the 5508.

Trinnov? ...We'll see what's coming next. ...I'm sure Sherwood Newcastle is working hard on that. Maybe a pre/pro.

[ntrain42]

Jul 11, 2010 14:13:28 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

I want to upgrade my 886 for a new pre/pro with the new Audyssey MultEQ XT 32!
...Perhaps the 5508.

Trinnov? ...We'll see what's coming next. ...I'm sure Sherwood Newcastle is working hard on that. Maybe a pre/pro.

Worthless in my book, rather have good video scaling and DACs on hand, good zone 2/3 independant control etc., with multiple presets with a good eq/xover functionality, then you tailor the sound to the potential conditions on hand(like night time,daytime, 2 channel, multichannel etc), maybe include a nice on board full bandwidth pink noise generator for multichannel, 2 channel,zone 2/3 adjustments. Too much fluff and marketing on the "DSP features" end in my book on some of these "processors".

[Erwin.BE]

Q: Does the Onkyo have the same type of XLR, ie Hot/Cold/GND order as the XPA-series?

I read that USA has a different order than Asia or EU?

I'd be interested in the 5508, for the HT in the new house. Anyone here try DSX with Height or Wide? I hope the 5508 can do both at the same time if you don't run Backs. Better yet, make it 11.1...

[flamingeye]

I`m running a 9.2 with heights no wide`s and there is a slight improvement to movies and music using the heights , I get a better sense of celerity and depth in music and in movies like rain , flyovers etc. they seam more their if that makes sense I`m glad I did the heights I wish I could check out the wide`s but I do not have the room/space for them ,but I bet they would also make an improvement too and maybe more so .note ;the heights did make an improvement as noted above just not a big one so do not expect a night an day improvement also the biggest improvement I got from the 5507 was the audyssay multeq xt and the two independent sub corrections it can do - that was a hug improvement

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 12, 2010 14:35:52 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

I`m running a 9.2 with heights no wide`s and there is a slight improvement to movies and music using the heights , I get a better sense of celerity and depth in music and in movies like rain , flyovers etc. they seam more their if that makes senses I`m glad I did the heights I wish I could check out the wide`s but I do not have the room/space for them ,but I bet they would also make an improvement too and maybe more so .note ;the heights did make an improvement as noted above just not a big one so do not expect a night an day improvement also the biggest improvement I got from the 5507 was the audyssay multeq xt and the two independent sub corrections it can do - that was a hug improvement

I guess putting the Wides in position (60° off axis) is a challenge in every non-dedicated HT. Ours will be semi-dedicated and the Wides will be slim DIY towers (6 feet tall, same volume as the LCR). Heights will be B&W in-ceiling. Backs are optional. As Audissey claims, probably correct, to see clear improvement beyond 5.1 you need to double this at 10.2...

Did you know Emotiva's 2006 AV-prepro DMC-1 had 9 (!) channels, including wides of some sort ("Side-Axis"), matrixed from the LR? I wonder why Big Dan is not so keen on DSX/DPLIIz today?
Link here:
www.emotiva.com/dmc1.html

[oscartheclimber]

Nice review. I've been on the fence for a while because of the delays with the XMC and some of the UMC issues. The 5507/5508 will definitely be on the shopping list.

[NorthStar]

Jul 11, 2010 15:03:06 GMT -5 ntrain42 said:

Jul 11, 2010 14:13:28 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

I want to upgrade my 886 for a new pre/pro with the new Audyssey MultEQ XT 32!
...Perhaps the 5508.

Trinnov? ...We'll see what's coming next. ...I'm sure Sherwood Newcastle is working hard on that. Maybe a pre/pro.

Worthless in my book, rather have good video scaling and DACs on hand, good zone 2/3 independant control etc., with multiple presets with a good eq/xover functionality, then you tailor the sound to the potential conditions on hand(like night time,daytime, 2 channel, multichannel etc), maybe include a nice on board full bandwidth pink noise generator for multichannel, 2 channel,zone 2/3 adjustments. Too much fluff and marketing on the "DSP features" end in my book on some of these "processors".

Worthless? What? Audyssey MultEQ XT 32 or Trinnov?

Good video scaling? Zones 2/3?

Full bandwidth pink noise generator?

...You sure are a funny guy Ntrain!
I like to have people like you around, gives an edge to the world we live in. And I fully respect what features you want and don't want in a pre/pro, but if you were to build one and market it, I'll never buy it! ;D

[NorthStar]

Jul 12, 2010 11:23:15 GMT -5 Erwin.BE said:

Q: Does the Onkyo have the same type of XLR, ie Hot/Cold/GND order as the XPA-series?

I read that USA has a different order than Asia or EU?

I'd be interested in the 5508, for the HT in the new house. Anyone here try DSX with Height or Wide? I hope the 5508 can do both at the same time if you don't run Backs. Better yet, make it 11.1...

Yes, the 5507 has XLR (3 pins) jack outputs for all its 11 channels, plus XLR jack inputs for two-channel stereo.
But it ain't a true Balanced design.

I don't know about the model from Asia.

The 5508 does not do DSX Width and Height at the same time, sorry. But you can still connect both of these two set of speakers, plus the Back surround ones, and have the Rears active with either Front Width or Height with a simple selection from the Menu. So, at the end it is a 9.2-channel audio playback system.

* The only machine right now that can do 11.1 (or 11.3, but the sub channel is mono), is the Denon AVR-4810CI, with all speakers active at the same time! That receiver has fifteen (15) sets of speakers' binding posts in its rear! Wow!
But it still have only 9 power amps inside; so you need an external stereo amp for the full Shangri-la.
Add another two more stereo amps and you got 11.3-channel audio playback in your Main room, plus stereo playback for both Zones 2 and 3!
That is the only one in the whole world that can do that!

But the future will be even more crazy, it will have an array of speakers that will fully encircled (360 degree) your room, without any gap between each driver! ...That's about 384 discrete speakers! Plus 8 discrete subwoofers! ...That is if your room can handle this! ...And your wife too!!!

Ok, next lesson tomorrow morning same time same station.

[NorthStar]

Jul 12, 2010 14:35:52 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

I`m running a 9.2 with heights no wide`s and there is a slight improvement to movies and music using the heights , I get a better sense of celerity and depth in music and in movies like rain , flyovers etc. they seam more their if that makes sense I`m glad I did the heights I wish I could check out the wide`s but I do not have the room/space for them ,but I bet they would also make an improvement too and maybe more so .note ;the heights did make an improvement as noted above just not a big one so do not expect a night an day improvement also the biggest improvement I got from the 5507 was the audyssay multeq xt and the two independent sub corrections it can do - that was a hug improvement

From extensive reading on the subject and some experience with Yamaha Front Height 'Presence' or 'Effect' channels, and of course Back Surrounds; Front Width channels would be the most beneficial (but not for all type of material).
Also, Audyssey is saying the same, Width first, Height second, and Back last.
And from professional reviewers and owners, that is the general consensus; Front Width is the most beneficial. I'm talking about serious people here, that do take the time to set things right in their rooms that can properly accomodate the right positions of these Front Width and Front Height speakers, using Audyssey DSX and Dolby Pro Logic IIz.

- And I fully agree with you about the benefits of Audyssey MultEQ XT and the two independent subwoofers' parameter adjustments for two different positions in your room.
...And we all know that it's in the bass that we gain the most benefits (from 10 Hz to about 200 Hz, or 250 Hz with 300 Hz being the very maximum audio frequency).

Well, Audyssey MultEQ XT 32 will improve that even further more with 4 times more the resolution (from 128x to 512x) in that bass! ...And that same resolution will also apply to all the Main channels (from 16x to 512x)!
In another way, it is 4 times the resolution of the the separate unit, the SVS AS-EQ1 with Audyssey MultEQ XT for two separate subs' calibration and EQ adjustments!

Coming soon this Fall (September) to a Theater near you, in the form of the Denon AVR-4311CI A/V Receiver, to start of with.

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 13, 2010 14:21:11 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Jul 12, 2010 11:23:15 GMT -5 Erwin.BE said:

Q: Does the Onkyo have the same type of XLR, ie Hot/Cold/GND order as the XPA-series?

I read that USA has a different order than Asia or EU?

I'd be interested in the 5508, for the HT in the new house. Anyone here try DSX with Height or Wide? I hope the 5508 can do both at the same time if you don't run Backs. Better yet, make it 11.1...

Yes, the 5507 has XLR (3 pins) jack outputs for all its 11 channels, plus XLR jack inputs for two-channel stereo.
But it ain't a true Balanced design.

I don't know about the model from Asia.

The 5508 does not do DSX Width and Height at the same time, sorry. But you can still connect both of these two set of speakers, plus the Back surround ones, and have the Rears active with either Front Width or Height with a simple selection from the Menu. So, at the end it is a 9.2-channel audio playback system.

* The only machine right now that can do 11.1 (or 11.3, but the sub channel is mono), is the Denon AVR-4810CI, with all speakers active at the same time! That receiver has fifteen (15) sets of speakers' binding posts in its rear! Wow!
But it still have only 9 power amps inside; so you need an external stereo amp for the full Shangri-la.
Add another two more stereo amps and you got 11.3-channel audio playback in your Main room, plus stereo playback for both Zones 2 and 3!
That is the only one in the whole world that can do that!

But the future will be even more crazy, it will have an array of speakers that will fully encircled (360 degree) your room, without any gap between each driver! ...That's about 384 discrete speakers! Plus 8 discrete subwoofers! ...That is if your room can handle this! ...And your wife too!!!

Ok, next lesson tomorrow morning same time same station.

LOTR, I know about the Denon's 11.1. But I want a SSP with XLR, not a receiver.

If I am not mistaken, the new "08" series of the Onkyo 9.2 receivers (the "5008") will let you run Wides and Heights at the same time if you skip the Backs? If this is correct, the 5507 successor (5508?) will no doubt permit this also. Mind you, I have lots of time before I actually need the SSP in the new house. Trouble and delays in the build, Grr! This means I am still hoping for Emotiva to produce the SSP some day with dual video capacities (would suite me fine) as Lonnie mentioned earlier. I sure hope this will also have 11.2 surround. I bet Dolby is working on a competitor for the DSX "Wides". And Dolby is standard on every AVR or SSP, unlike Audyssey.

Actually, 384 speakers in 360° is only 2D. Do you know the EDEN project in Cornwall? These are huge hemispherical tropical green houses. THAT is the way surround should be! Speakers everywhere, equidistant to the seats. There would be between 1200 and 48,000 speakers, depending on the size of your HT... The future for Emotiva amps is looking bright! XPA-4800, anyone?

I suppose I expressed myself in the wrong way asking about the pins of the XLR connections. Obviously, the Onkyo is sold worldwide with the same order. But there actual are 2 standards, the pins labeled HOT/COLD/GROUND can be different. But since solarrrrrrrrdadddddd has both the Onkyo and an XPA-5, I trust both use the same standard.

[flamingeye]

You guys are insane you should get jobs from these companies/engineers no doubt you would be an asset, I can see you now climbing the rafters wiring in drivers etc.

[NorthStar]

Jul 13, 2010 15:40:50 GMT -5 Erwin.BE said:

Jul 13, 2010 14:21:11 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Yes, the 5507 has XLR (3 pins) jack outputs for all its 11 channels, plus XLR jack inputs for two-channel stereo.
But it ain't a true Balanced design.

I don't know about the model from Asia.

The 5508 does not do DSX Width and Height at the same time, sorry. But you can still connect both of these two set of speakers, plus the Back surround ones, and have the Rears active with either Front Width or Height with a simple selection from the Menu. So, at the end it is a 9.2-channel audio playback system.

* The only machine right now that can do 11.1 (or 11.3, but the sub channel is mono), is the Denon AVR-4810CI, with all speakers active at the same time! That receiver has fifteen (15) sets of speakers' binding posts in its rear! Wow!
But it still have only 9 power amps inside; so you need an external stereo amp for the full Shangri-la.
Add another two more stereo amps and you got 11.3-channel audio playback in your Main room, plus stereo playback for both Zones 2 and 3!
That is the only one in the whole world that can do that!

But the future will be even more crazy, it will have an array of speakers that will fully encircled (360 degree) your room, without any gap between each driver! ...That's about 384 discrete speakers! Plus 8 discrete subwoofers! ...That is if your room can handle this! ...And your wife too!!!

Ok, next lesson tomorrow morning same time same station.

LOTR, I know about the Denon's 11.1. But I want a SSP with XLR, not a receiver.

If I am not mistaken, the new "08" series of the Onkyo 9.2 receivers (the "5008") will let you run Wides and Heights at the same time if you skip the Backs? If this is correct, the 5507 successor (5508?) will no doubt permit this also. Mind you, I have lots of time before I actually need the SSP in the new house. Trouble and delays in the build, Grr! This means I am still hoping for Emotiva to produce the SSP some day with dual video capacities (would suite me fine) as Lonnie mentioned earlier. I sure hope this will also have 11.2 surround. I bet Dolby is working on a competitor for the DSX "Wides". And Dolby is standard on every AVR or SSP, unlike Audyssey.

Actually, 384 speakers in 360° is only 2D. Do you know the EDEN project in Cornwall? These are huge hemispherical tropical green houses. THAT is the way surround should be! Speakers everywhere, equidistant to the seats. There would be between 1200 and 48,000 speakers, depending on the size of your HT... The future for Emotiva amps is looking bright! XPA-4800, anyone?

I suppose I expressed myself in the wrong way asking about the pins of the XLR connections. Obviously, the Onkyo is sold worldwide with the same order. But there actual are 2 standards, the pins labeled HOT/COLD/GROUND can be different. But since solarrrrrrrrdadddddd has both the Onkyo and an XPA-5, I trust both use the same standard.

Hey Erwin, the Onkyo 5507 does not permit you to have the Front Width and Front Height speakers running at the same time (only by selection when both are connected), and I really doubt that the 5508 will.
* But you can have or the Front Width or the Front Height speakers running in tandem with the Rear Back Surround speakers, no problemo. Plus your five regular Main speakers with the two separate subwoofers of course.

Ok the 4810 is indeed just a receiver with only nine power amplifiers in it and only fourteen channel preouts, and it's an 11.3-channel Audio/Video Receiver, and it has only fifteen sets of speakers' binding posts.
Now, what you need is their newer separates (around $18,000 list), that should get you going for at least the next three months or so before something new comes up. ...And it has Fully Balanced Quad Differential mode with both RCA and XLR connections on both the 13-channel Multi amp and Surround Sound Processor with Audyssey DSX and Audyssey MultEQ XT 32, which is also Audyssey MultEQ Pro ready with the latest firmware, version 3.9 Pro.

Ya I know about the EDEN project with their 48,000 speakers.
Do you know about the ALLIN project with their 192,000 speakers? They are from the Netherlands. It is so new that only a very few number of people are in the know. I am not allowed yet to give more details, but their experimental room is huge!

Nice chatting with you, you seem to be well grounded!

[NorthStar]

Jul 13, 2010 16:35:52 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

You guys are insane you should get jobs from these companies/engineers no doubt you would be an asset, I can see you now climbing the rafters wiring in drivers etc.

Einstein, Freud, Hitler, Heisenower, and all the greatest genius people of this planet were all insane.

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 13, 2010 16:35:52 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

You guys are insane you should get jobs from these companies/engineers no doubt you would be an asset, I can see you now climbing the rafters wiring in drivers etc.

Oh, but I already applied for STEG (Supreme Technical Executive Guru) at Audyssey, but those poor folks can't afford my sallary in the first place, and when I proposed to just pay me a percentage of every amplifier module and every speaker sold globally, they just turned their head away... What?


;D

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 13, 2010 18:09:39 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Jul 13, 2010 16:35:52 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

You guys are insane you should get jobs from these companies/engineers no doubt you would be an asset, I can see you now climbing the rafters wiring in drivers etc.

Einstein, Freud, Hitler, Heisenower, and all the greatest genius people of this planet were all insane.

You forgot John-Paul II...