UMC vs. Onkyo PR-SC5507

[Erwin.BE]

LOTR,

I know the Denon 4810 can do things I lust for and no other AVR can do today. But it is 3000$/€ and it has not the amp force of the XPA-series, let alone that of the XPR-series. There's the 5308 and even if this becomes the 5311 or 5811 with 9/11 built-in amps, it will be expensive (maybe like 6K) and just as quickly outdated as every other AVR/SSP.

I don't mind to pay good money, just not a five-figurish sum for the AVR/SSP/Amps. The separates from Denon (15K together) are above my league, although again, these produce SQ and VQ like no competitor. I want VQ like the Oppo 83 can produce out of the box from a BluRay (we disposed our DVD's). I can live with the 1080i that the HighDef teevee stations provide.

But I want the best audio I can afford. I did not A/B the Denon 4810 vs the Onkyo 5507+XPA-5. But the reviews I read are very flattering for the Onkyo 5507 + Onkyo 5500 9ch amp combo AND especially when XLR connections are used. So the Onkyo 5508 will be on my list of candidates.

Other SSP on this list are:
1/ Rotel RSP-1580: showed almost a year ago, anounced for past January, but still total silence from Rotel. @ 4500$, it's more than I would like, but it has 4 zone independant HDMI video, even if we only need 2 video zones. But Rotel does not do XLR, to bad.

2/ Marantz if they make something above the 7005 SSP (8005 or 9005) with 11.2. This would be very easy to do if they based it on the Denon 4810 AVR's processor (both are in DM holding). It's possible, the (8ch) 8003 has no real successor in the (7ch and cheaper) 7005.

3/ Emotiva: the dual video SSP Lonnie promised when the features of the XMC-1 were anounced: "The XMC-1, as currently envisioned, will not have a dual zone video path. This has been moved to an as of yet, unannounced platform (please don't ask). We will offer another processor with a fully featured dual video processor topology, but it will not reside in the XMC-1."
If Dolby indeed comes up with a 11.2 system to compete with DSX, I see no reason not to incorporate it in a reference SSP.

Fingers crossed that the current difficulties with the UMC-1 don't discourage Emotiva.

[Erwin.BE]

"Hey Erwin, the Onkyo 5507 does not permit you to have the Front Width and Front Height speakers running at the same time (only by selection when both are connected), and I really doubt that the 5508 will."

We will have to see about the 5508. But I have the manual of the new 9.2 channel 1008. It has speaker terminals for all 11 main channels. It has 9 pre-outs that allow you to have 2 out 3 (Wide/Height/Back). You select in the menu. So you can effectivally skip the Back and enjoy Wide + Height at the same time.

The current "07" generation forces you to choose between Height and Wide. Indeed, I see the 11 speaker terminals permitting you to toggle the menu setting. But there are only 1 pair of pre-outs for the Heigth/Wide.

Here's the back of the 1008:
www.eu.onkyo.com/ir_img/21773523_e133591bac.jpg
I presume all "08" 9.2 AVR (1008/3008/5008) and the 5508 allow to run Height + Wide when the Backs are not wanted or possible.

Here is a quote from the manual on speaker selection of the 1008 (when you have connected all 11 speakers to their respective terminals)

"Press RECEIVER followed by SP LAYOUT repeatedly.
■9.1 ch playback:
􀁠Speaker Layout:SB/FH:
The sounds from surround back and front high speakers are output by priority.
􀁠Speaker Layout:SB/FW:
The sounds from surround back and front wide speakers are output by priority.
􀁠Speaker Layout:FH/FW:
The sounds from front high and front wide speakers are output by priority"

[NorthStar]

Well Erwin, if the new Integra/Onkyo receivers and pre/pros (from their xx08 and x0.2 series) allow you to run the Front Height and Width speakers simultaneoulsly, that would be just about goddamn time!
Because with all their products from the xx07 and x0.1 series you CAN'T!

And add to that two separate subwoofer locations with their own calibration and EQ adjustments, and that sounds pretty good to me, and more to come...
- But now, can you run (by adding an external stereo amp) all three variations (Front Height & Front Width & also Back Surround speakers) simultaneously???

* With the Denon 4810, you can run and the Front Height and the Front Width and the Back Surround speakers ALL TOGETHER SIMULTANEOUSLY, when adding an extra stereo amplifier (to make it 11 channels total; plus 3 subwoofers but feeded from the same mono audio signal).

[The practical technologies of the World we live in are only limited by the people that live in it.] - Bob A.C. (LOTR)

Cheers,
Bob

P.S. May Prince live forever!

P.P.S. "Rack them up".

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 14, 2010 6:05:29 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Well Erwin, if the new Integra/Onkyo receivers and pre/pros (from their xx08 and x0.2 series) allow you to run the Front Height and Width speakers simultaneoulsly, that would be just about goddamn time!
Because with all their products from the xx07 and x0.1 series you CAN'T!

And add to that two separate subwoofer locations with their own calibration and EQ adjustments, and that sounds pretty good to me, and more to come...
- But now, can you run (by adding an external stereo amp) all three variations (Front Height & Front Width & also Back Surround speakers) simultaneously???

* With the Denon 4810, you can run and the Front Height and the Front Width and the Back Surround speakers ALL TOGETHER SIMULTANEOUSLY, when adding an extra stereo amplifier (to make it 11 channels total; plus 3 subwoofers but feeded from the same mono audio signal).

[The practical technologies of the World we live in are only limited by the people that live in it.] - Bob A.C. (LOTR)

Cheers,
Bob

P.S. May Prince live forever!

P.P.S. "Rack them up".

I am under the impression that you like the Denon 4810? ;D
Now all I need is a SSP like the 4810 minus the amps, with XLR, plus a built-in dual videoprocessor that can output HDMI video from the HT to my living room too.
Lonnie, did you hear this?

[NorthStar]

Jul 14, 2010 8:15:32 GMT -5 Erwin.BE said:

Jul 14, 2010 6:05:29 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Well Erwin, if the new Integra/Onkyo receivers and pre/pros (from their xx08 and x0.2 series) allow you to run the Front Height and Width speakers simultaneoulsly, that would be just about goddamn time!
Because with all their products from the xx07 and x0.1 series you CAN'T!

And add to that two separate subwoofer locations with their own calibration and EQ adjustments, and that sounds pretty good to me, and more to come...
- But now, can you run (by adding an external stereo amp) all three variations (Front Height & Front Width & also Back Surround speakers) simultaneously???

* With the Denon 4810, you can run and the Front Height and the Front Width and the Back Surround speakers ALL TOGETHER SIMULTANEOUSLY, when adding an extra stereo amplifier (to make it 11 channels total; plus 3 subwoofers but feeded from the same mono audio signal).

[The practical technologies of the World we live in are only limited by the people that live in it.] - Bob A.C. (LOTR)

Cheers,
Bob

P.S. May Prince live forever!

P.P.S. "Rack them up".

I am under the impression that you like the Denon 4810? ;D
Now all I need is a SSP like the 4810 minus the amps, with XLR, plus a built-in dual videoprocessor that can output HDMI video from the HT to my living room too.
Lonnie, did you hear this?

Me? The Denon AVR-4810CI receiver? Nah, it's only Denon's way to proove that they can do it, no more. The amp section in it is nothing to write home about; just look at the lab results from these two reviews here:

1. @ hometheatermag.com/receivers/denon_avr-4810ci_av_receiver/

2. @ www.soundandvisionmag.com/tests-reviews/receivers/2010/02/denon-avr-4810ci

* Erwin, I don't know why your obsession with XLR connections as in most products they are not even fully balanced! The only advantage that you might have is for long runs of interconnects between your pre/pro and external amp(s), that's all, just to make sure that no noise contamines the sound by entering through the cables; and that is if your pre/pro is separated from your amp(s) by something like 5 meters or so.

** We are going to see dual video processors from many high end products now and with the arrival of 3D, it will become a must be feature. ...It's just inevitable.

[Erwin.BE]

XLR:
Here's a German test of the Onkyo 5507 and the amp. My German is far from perfect, but the reviewer claims that when he used the normal interconnects, the sound was no better than a AVR. If he uses XLR, he claims it's like someone cleaned and polished the glass you are looking through. He claims distortion can reach over 1% with cinch.

www.i-fidelity.net/testberichte/tests-heimkino/onkyo-pr-sc5507/seite-5.html

Power of an AVR:
Here's a quote from today's preview of the new Marantz AVR in Audioholics:
"The SR7005 is rated at 125wpc x 7 into 8 ohms. Marantz engineering informed me that all of their SR series receivers (including the SR7005) were designed to maintain 70% (88wpc) power output under a 5 channel load and 50% (63wpc) power output under 7 channels driven against its two-channel driven spec."

That's correct: 50% all channels driven is all Marantz aims for! So even the most humble Emotiva UPA-series amp doubles this. And there are even brands who print 1 channel driven outputs instead of the 2 of Marantz.
(Note that the 7005 has DSX and 11 speaker terminals also, but one can only have one out three Wide, Height or Backs in the menu, because it's 7.2)

Great info about the dual video becoming standard. Am I correct in assuming that this feature makes it possible to watch 3D in 1 zone only, or alternatively: 2D in 2 independant zones? I did not know that 3D needs dual video. But I am with Big Dan on this one: 3D might be exciting in the theatre or HT, but on a normal teevee, what's the bloody point?

[NorthStar]

Hi Erwin,

Thanks for the German review of the 5507 (I get automatic English translation from Google ).
* You must be aware of AreaDvd website are you? ...Great site, with great internal & external pictures, plus several comparisons. It's in German too.

I know all about that Marantz SR7005 and Marantz's claim to its watts power into all channels. Audioholics is a great site, their forums not so.

As for two HDMI outputs, it's a must. But for 3D, no, you don't need two.
But for two 3D, yes, you do need two.

Cheers,
Bob

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 15, 2010 12:39:27 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Hi Erwin,

Thanks for the German review of the 5507 (I get automatic English translation from Google ).

Yes, but it's a horrible translation, I tried! I understand 90% of the German text. After I google-translate into English or Dutch, I only understand half!
Maybe it's the German. Because, a few months ago, my wife applied for a temporary job at Honda in Gent. She's an accountant. So she had to translate her Dutch CV into English. I used google for her and it turned out to be 99% perfect. BTW, she secured the contract all wright, so a thank you for google is in order!

On topic: I have read the review again and it turns out the guy is using active JBL monitors straight from the Onkyo, so cable runs of 10 meters are used.

[Ctuna]

I just returned my UMC-1 today, I have had nothing but problems with it. I took the option to have them fix the unit and return it. I owned some Onkyo receivers and an integrated amp at one time and never had the problems that I have had with the UMC-1. I really don't think that anyone tested my unit before it was shipped. I had a firmware version that was not even released.

I hope they get the bugs out, because I have not been able to enjoy a whole lot of music until I flashed the DSP a few times. After that the unit worked fine until I tried the EMO Q and then everything went crazy again with loss of sound to my center and rear channels and direct and stereo sounded muddy. I then triedto flash the unit again and everything was going good and all of sudden the unit powered down and was never able to get it to come back on.

If they don't get the remaining bugs fixed I for one will lose faith in them. I may even sell off the amp. As everyone else hear I just want good sound and something that works when you get it.

Maybe you do get what you pay for, that being said I am saving up some mula for maybe a good Onkyo or maybe even some Anthem equipment if I am not satisfied.

I am curious how many of you think they will get the bugs out ? If they do I will admit it will be one heck of a good price ! But only if it works !

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 26, 2010 18:29:14 GMT -5 Ctuna said:

I just returned my UMC-1 today, I have had nothing but problems with it. I took the option to have them fix the unit and return it. I owned some Onkyo receivers and an integrated amp at one time and never had the problems that I have had with the UMC-1. I really don't think that anyone tested my unit before it was shipped. I had a firmware version that was not even released.

I hope they get the bugs out, because I have not been able to enjoy a whole lot of music until I flashed the DSP a few times. After that the unit worked fine until I tried the EMO Q and then everything went crazy again with loss of sound to my center and rear channels and direct and stereo sounded muddy. I then triedto flash the unit again and everything was going good and all of sudden the unit powered down and was never able to get it to come back on.

If they don't get the remaining bugs fixed I for one will lose faith in them. I may even sell off the amp. As everyone else hear I just want good sound and something that works when you get it.

Maybe you do get what you pay for, that being said I am saving up some mula for maybe a good Onkyo or maybe even some Anthem equipment if I am not satisfied.

I am curious how many of you think they will get the bugs out ? If they do I will admit it will be one heck of a good price ! But only if it works !

Sorry to hear about your problems. I have the XPA-1 and ERC-1 and these are great machines with great value (even with the shipping cost to EU and the 30% duties and VAT on top of them). Not one flaw in 6 months. I am not qualified to know if the UMC-1 can be fully cured or not. But if you are not happy, you are absolutely right to return it. It does not matter if the UMC-1 represents great value when it is not functioning properly.

I have here a Topfield satellite high definition twin-tuner-recorder that's been bugging me for over 2 years. It provides great image quality, but many functions don't work. I brought it to the shop to update some parts and now it even shuts down sometimes by itself... We have a saying that translates "from the rain into the drop" (from bad to worse)

The Onkyo interests me because it offers DSX and it is likely that the upcoming 5508 will let me play both heights and Wides simultaneously.

If 7 channels are enough, you might want to consider the upcoming Marantz AV7005. This pre-pro is priced at 1500$ and with the balanced outputs, it will be very tough competition for the upcoming Emotiva XMC-1.

[flamingeye]

I can`t speak for the UMC but, I have 2 Emotiva amps- IPS-1 and BPA-1 for over a year now and they have worked flawlessly there the best sounding amps to date in my system IMHO and I have had Phase Linear ,Carver ,Harmond/Kardon ,Pioneer and Marantz amps , just because they have problems with the UMC dosen`t make all there other products bad and or will have problems

[NorthStar]

Jul 27, 2010 4:48:41 GMT -5 Erwin.BE said:

The Onkyo interests me because it offers DSX and it is likely that the upcoming 5508 will let me play both heights and Wides simultaneously.

If 7 channels are enough, you might want to consider the upcoming Marantz AV7005. This pre-pro is priced at 1500$ and with the balanced outputs, it will be very tough competition for the upcoming Emotiva XMC-1.

You are absolutely right Erwin about the newer Onkyo PR-SC5508P pre/pro; it will play both Height and Width channels simultaneously. And it will also have Audyssey MultEQ XT 32!

[flamingeye]

Where are you guys getting this information from ? I can`t find anything anywhere on onkyo 5508

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 28, 2010 11:20:02 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

Where are you guys getting this information from ? I can`t find anything anywhere on onkyo 5508

Elementary, my dear Holmes!
What's the Onkyo 5507? It is the 5007 AV-receiver minus the amps, plus the XLR.
We already know the new 5008 will let you use any 2 out of 3 (width, height, back). Onkyo would be shooting in it's own foot if the 5508 would not let you do this...

Here's one link already with info from a UK dealer:
www.avland.co.uk/aasp/onkyo/1020/prsc5508/prsc5508.asp

Pre-outs are "assignable"
You can hook up 11 main speakers, but you have to choose which of the heights/width/back you want to hear simultaneously

Delivery aspected Sept 1

[UT-Driven]

Jul 13, 2010 17:59:02 GMT -5 NorthStar said:

Jul 13, 2010 15:40:50 GMT -5 Erwin.BE said:

LOTR, I know about the Denon's 11.1. But I want a SSP with XLR, not a receiver.

If I am not mistaken, the new "08" series of the Onkyo 9.2 receivers (the "5008") will let you run Wides and Heights at the same time if you skip the Backs? If this is correct, the 5507 successor (5508?) will no doubt permit this also. Mind you, I have lots of time before I actually need the SSP in the new house. Trouble and delays in the build, Grr! This means I am still hoping for Emotiva to produce the SSP some day with dual video capacities (would suite me fine) as Lonnie mentioned earlier. I sure hope this will also have 11.2 surround. I bet Dolby is working on a competitor for the DSX "Wides". And Dolby is standard on every AVR or SSP, unlike Audyssey.

Actually, 384 speakers in 360° is only 2D. Do you know the EDEN project in Cornwall? These are huge hemispherical tropical green houses. THAT is the way surround should be! Speakers everywhere, equidistant to the seats. There would be between 1200 and 48,000 speakers, depending on the size of your HT... The future for Emotiva amps is looking bright! XPA-4800, anyone?

I suppose I expressed myself in the wrong way asking about the pins of the XLR connections. Obviously, the Onkyo is sold worldwide with the same order. But there actual are 2 standards, the pins labeled HOT/COLD/GROUND can be different. But since solarrrrrrrrdadddddd has both the Onkyo and an XPA-5, I trust both use the same standard.

Hey Erwin, the Onkyo 5507 does not permit you to have the Front Width and Front Height speakers running at the same time (only by selection when both are connected), and I really doubt that the 5508 will.
* But you can have or the Front Width or the Front Height speakers running in tandem with the Rear Back Surround speakers, no problemo. Plus your five regular Main speakers with the two separate subwoofers of course.

Ok the 4810 is indeed just a receiver with only nine power amplifiers in it and only fourteen channel preouts, and it's an 11.3-channel Audio/Video Receiver, and it has only fifteen sets of speakers' binding posts.
Now, what you need is their newer separates (around $18,000 list), that should get you going for at least the next three months or so before something new comes up. ...And it has Fully Balanced Quad Differential mode with both RCA and XLR connections on both the 13-channel Multi amp and Surround Sound Processor with Audyssey DSX and Audyssey MultEQ XT 32, which is also Audyssey MultEQ Pro ready with the latest firmware, version 3.9 Pro.

Ya I know about the EDEN project with their 48,000 speakers.
Do you know about the ALLIN project with their 192,000 speakers? They are from the Netherlands. It is so new that only a very few number of people are in the know. I am not allowed yet to give more details, but their experimental room is huge!

Nice chatting with you, you seem to be well grounded!

The ALLIN project is working on a 192,000 speaker project? It sounds like they are going ALLOUT in regards to overkill! :-)

Doug

[flamingeye]

O of course da thank`s for the link

[Erwin.BE]

Jul 28, 2010 11:35:10 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

O of course da thank`s for the link

more info:

The PR-SC5508 is designed specifically for the serious home theatre enthusiast seeking a sophisticated pre-pro to partner a high-end power amp. You get the very best in video processing, with HQV Reon-VX and 1080p upscaling of all video sources via HDMI™ 1.4, plus ISF calibration for fine-tuning of video parameters. Along with the latest high-def audio formats from DTS and Dolby, the PR-SC5507 handles Dolby® Pro Logic® IIz and Audyssey DSX™—two expansive surround formats that make use of extra vertical or wide channels in a 9.2-channel configuration. Alternatively, these extra surround channels can be used for playback of different sources in multiple zones in your home. As with Onkyo’s latest high-end receivers, the PR-SC5507 offers home networking capability that lets you stream internet radio or PC-based audio through your main system. Ultra-low-jitter PLL circuitry, gold-plated terminals, and XLR inputs and pre outs are testament to the unit’s audiophile build quality.

Specifications:
• THX® Ultra2 Plus™ Certified
• DTS-HD Master Audio™, DTS-HD High Resolution Audio™, Dolby® TrueHD, and Dolby® Digital Plus Decoding
•HDMI™ Version 1.4 to Support Deep Color™, x.v.Color™, LipSync, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD Master Audio, DVD-Audio, Super Audio CD, Multichannel PCM, CEC, Audio return channel and 3D
• HDMI Video Upscaling to 1080p with HQV Reon-VX
• DSD Direct for Super Audio CD
• Audio and 1080p Video Processing via HDMI (1 Front/7 Rear Inputs and 2 Outputs [Main/Sub])
• Burr-Brown 192 kHz/32-Bit DACs (PCM1795 x 6) for All Channels
• Ultra-Low-Jitter PLL (Phase Locked Loop) Circuitry to Improve Audio Quality
• Three TI (Aureus™) 32-Bit DSP Chips (DA830 x 1, DA788 x 2) for Advanced Processing
• VLSC™ (Vector Linear Shaping Circuitry) for All Channels
• ISF (Imaging Science Foundation) Video Calibration
• Audyssey DSX™ and Dolby® Pro Logic® IIz for New Surround Channels
• Audyssey MultEQ™ XT to Correct Room Acoustic Problems and to Calibrate Speakers
• Audyssey Dynamic Volume™ to Maintain Optimal Listening Level and Dynamic Range
• Audyssey Dynamic EQ™ for Loudness Correction
• Dolby® Volume for Reference-Quality Listening Experience at Any Volume
• Network Capability for Streaming Audio Files (MP3, WMA, WMA Lossless, FLAC, WAV, Ogg Vorbis, AAC, LPCM)
• Internet Radio Connectivity (Last.fm* and vTuner)
• Certified with Windows 7 and DLNA Version 1.5
• Bi-Amping Capability
• Zone 2 and Zone 3 for Playback of Separate Sources in Other Rooms
• Zone 2 Monitor Outputs (Component and Composite) and Zone 2/3 Subwoofer Pre Outs
• D-sub (15 pin) Input for PC or Analog RGB
• Universal Port for Single-Cable Connection of Optional Onkyo Dock for the iPod or DAB+ Radio Tuner
• 4 DSP Modes for Gaming: Rock, Sports, Action, and RPG (Role Playing Game)
• 2 Independent Subwoofer Pre Outs
• 9.2-Channel Balanced Line-Level XLR Pre Outs (with Front Bi-Amping Capability)
• 2-Channel Balanced XLR Audio Inputs
• Dual IR Inputs with Common Output
• Linear Optimum Gain Volume Circuitry
• Neural-THX® Surround Decoder
• Music Optimizer™ for Compressed Digital Music Files
• Theater-Dimensional Virtual Surround Function
• RIHD (Remote Interactive over HDMI) for System Control
• Direct Mode and Pure Audio Mode
• Tone Control (Bass/Treble) for All Channels
• Front-Side Auxiliary Inputs (for Camcorders, Game Consoles, etc.)
• 2 USB Ports (Front/Rear) for MP3 Audio Devices (Audio Only)
• Component Video Upscaling (Up to 1080i)
• Component Video Switching (3 Inputs and 1 Output)
• 5 Composite Video Inputs and 2 Outputs
• Color-Coded, 9 Multichannel Pre Outs
• 7 Digital Inputs (4 Optical and 3 Coaxial)
• Independent Crossover Adjustment for F/C/S/SB/FH/FW (40/50/60/70/80/90/100/120/150/200 Hz)
• A/V Sync Control Function (Up to 250 ms in 5 ms Steps)
• 40 FM/AM Random Presets with RDS (PS/RT/PTY/TP)
• Gold-Plated A/V Inputs and Outputs
• High-Rigidity Flat Chassis (1.6 mm Thick)
• 4 S-Video Inputs and 1 Output
• 5 A/V Inputs and 1 Output
• Monitor Outputs (Component Video, Composite Video, and S-Video)
• 3 Audio Inputs and 1 Output
• Phono Input
• Gold-Plated, Machined Solid Brass, 19 mm-Pitch Audio Inputs (CD and Phono)
• Color-Coded, 7.1-Multichannel Inputs
• 12V Triggers (A, B, and C) with Adjustable Delay
• Onscreen Display (OSD)
• IntelliVolume
• Aluminum Front Panel and Volume Knob
• Firmware Updates via Ethernet and USB
• Bi-Directional Ethernet Port and RS232 Port
• Compatible with RI (Remote Interactive) Dock for the iPod
• Bi-Directional, Preprogrammed, and Customizable RI Remote Control with Backlight, Onscreen Setup, Mode-Key LEDs, and Macro Presets for Four Activities
• Dimensions: 435 x 198.5 x 453.5 mm
• Weight 18.5 Kg

Mmm, it is contradictory to the other post that only 9.2 XLR pre-outs are mentioned. Maybe one can only hook up 9 speakers/amps afterall.

[flamingeye]

I`m also surprised that they still do not have video streaming capability - only audio

[Erwin.BE]

Announcement of the PR-SC5508 on ecoustics:
news.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/10381/648618.html

Back side:
www.gspr.com/onkyo/images/prsc5508_re_300.jpg
To my big surprise: wide/height not at the same time? Unless the amps can be reasigned?

German:
www.bluray-disc.de/news/player/16761-ifa-2010-onkyo-praesentiert-neuen-blu-ray-player-und-av-vorverstaerker

UK:
www.avland.co.uk/aasp/onkyo/1020/prsc5508/prsc5508.asp

Retail prices:
USA: $2,199
UK: £1,999
EU: €2,499

Very pissed off here! Should be more like €2,000 / £1,800! Who do they think they're dealing with? Moreons?

[NorthStar]

Erwin, I tought that you can use Audyssey Front Width and Height channels simultaneously with Onkyo's new pre/pro and receivers?
The PR-SC5508P should have that possibility as well the newer 1008/3008/5008 receivers.
-> I'll get back to you on this...

* As for the MSRP from different countries, well, that's totally another matter all together right?
...What truly counts is the street price.