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Post by Trey on Jan 29, 2011 19:01:59 GMT -5
I finally connected up my XDA-1 last night that I bought from jlafrenz (thanks again). The source is my Oppo-93 with a Monoprice HDX-401TA HDMI to Optical breakout box between the oppo and my receiver.
I used the HDX-401TA so I could get digital audio from the HDMI stream and send it to the XDA-1 via optical. It works and was only $43 plus shipping. Codes are in Harmony database as well. I only mention all of this because it was discussed a few times in previous threads so I thought I'd follow up.
Played CD's, DVD-A's and SACD. CDs sounded better than I've ever heard on my system and the DVD-a and SACD were just as good. Playing multi-channel surround music obviously lost those surround tracks when down mixed to 2-channel so staying with HDMI for those tracks makes more sense.
I noticed it on a DTS CD, Steely Dan Guacho, track - Babylon Sisters. When the singer says "babylon sisters, shake it!" (something like that), usually the backup singers accompany him but it was missing. Switched back to HDMI and it was normal. Both sounded great but obviously not ideal for 2-channel in this instance.
I did have to get a splitter to get the L/R output from the XDA-1 to go to L/R and Sub on my receiver 6/8 channel inputs.
For a few songs I wasn't getting enough bass and assumed it was just the way the XDA-1 worked then realized I needed to feed the input on the receiver.
It's PERFECT now! At one point I was listening to "At Last' and thought it was appropriate that at last, my system finally sounds like I think it should. ;D
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Post by Trey on Jan 29, 2011 19:05:38 GMT -5
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Post by pdaddy on Jan 29, 2011 20:03:31 GMT -5
Thanks Trey. Looks like I will be picking one of these up too.
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LCSeminole
Global Moderator 
Res firma mitescere nescit.
Posts: 20,495
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Post by LCSeminole on Jan 29, 2011 21:31:03 GMT -5
Nice find Trey. Good to know there is a work-around for 2 channel systems for SACD.
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Post by Mr. Ben on Jan 30, 2011 11:38:17 GMT -5
Why wouldn't you just use the analog output from the Oppo for SACD's? This seems much simpler and I would guess it would sound better.
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Post by Trey on Jan 30, 2011 12:20:01 GMT -5
SACD output on the oppo is limited to 88kHz. The XDA-1 outputs 192kHz.
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Post by Mischief on Jan 30, 2011 13:37:24 GMT -5
I thought the XDA-1 output the what was input, no upsampling.
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Post by Trey on Jan 30, 2011 14:27:58 GMT -5
That may be the case.
Full resolution SACD over optical/ coax is prohibited by Sony, which is why I got the monoprice box so it could be bypassed and optical audio sent to the XDA-1 for the D/A conversion vs the Oppo doing the D/A.
I wanted the better DAC doing the conversion. If it's still 88kHz, I'm fine with that.
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Post by Mr. Ben on Jan 30, 2011 16:33:34 GMT -5
Why wouldn't you just use the analog output from the Oppo for SACD's? This seems much simpler and I would guess it would sound better. SACD output on the oppo is limited to 88kHz. The XDA-1 outputs 192kHz. I don't think you understand what's going on here. A SACD stores its data in DSD format. DSD is a very high-bitrate digital format that closely mimics the analog signal in a digital form. When you use the analog outputs of the Oppo, you're sending that DSD data directly to the DAC's for conversion to analog. This is a very easy job for the DACs to do, partly because DSD is easy to convert, but mostly because there is a lot of data available to reconstruct it from... there aren't big gaps to fill in. What you're doing instead is converting the DSD signal to PCM in the Oppo, sending it over HDMI, converting it again for transmission over optical, sending it to the XDA-1, which then converts it to analog. With each step along the way you're adding jitter and possibly resampling errors. You're also throwing away some of the original data, and relying on the XDA-1 to fill in the missing pieces. I don't care how good the XDA-1 is - it's not made to handle DSD data. The Oppo is. It doesn't matter which one is the better DAC. PS - are you using the Analog Bypass mode of your receiver for all of this (no subwoofer, no tone controls)? |
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Post by Trey on Jan 30, 2011 22:05:50 GMT -5
I didn't, thanks for the lesson.
In my case, the XDA-1 is connected to the 6/8 channel inputs on my AVR (Left/ Right/ Sub) so the Oppo can't use them for SACD anyway.
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Post by dingofarmer on Jan 30, 2011 22:07:34 GMT -5
My underatanding of SACD is that 2ch SACD over optical will yield the full bandwidth while multi-channel will require HDMI. Am I wrong here? The reason I ask is that most of my SACD's are 2ch blue note remastered disk, not multi channel. I have dark side of the moon but it has a 2ch SACD track on it, so thats what I play.
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Post by Mr. Ben on Jan 31, 2011 7:03:31 GMT -5
My underatanding of SACD is that 2ch SACD over optical will yield the full bandwidth while multi-channel will require HDMI. Am I wrong here? The reason I ask is that most of my SACD's are 2ch blue note remastered disk, not multi channel. I have dark side of the moon but it has a 2ch SACD track on it, so thats what I play. DSD can not be transmitted over optical in any form. It's also rare for players to actually output DSD over HDMI (they usually convert it to PCM), and also rare for receivers to accept DSD over HDMI. In general, if you're playing a SACD, you'll want to use the analog outputs of your SACD player. |
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Post by Mr. Ben on Jan 31, 2011 13:02:46 GMT -5
In my case, the XDA-1 is connected to the 6/8 channel inputs on my AVR (Left/ Right/ Sub) so the Oppo can't use them for SACD anyway. If it were me, I would run 6 analog cables from the Oppo to the "6/8 channel input" on the receiver, an optical or digital coax cable from the Oppo into the XDA-1 (for CD's only), and the analog output from the XDA-1 into one of the 2-channel inputs of the receiver. Your other sources should all use a digital connection to the receiver if their primary role is for movies or TV (surround sound), or into the XDA-1 if you use it for music (e.g. you play CD's ripped into itunes with the Apple TV). This setup gives you full surround capabilities for SACD and DVD-Audio discs, movies, and lets you use the XDA-1 for digital music. |
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Post by Trey on Jan 31, 2011 15:06:48 GMT -5
Thanks Mr. Ben. That's basically how I have it minus the Oppo connected via 6/8 channel input on the AVR. My XB360, ATV2, DirecTV and Oppo are all connected via HDMI to the AVR for Movies and Surround music. However the Oppo has the Mono box in the middle of it's HDMI cable. HDMI for the oppo is set to LCPM, SACD is set to PCM. I also have them connected to the XDA-1 via Optical or Coax for two channel music. The XDA is connected to the AVR via 6/8 inputs. I initially had the XDA-1 connected to the AVR via a 2 channel input, with the AVR EQ turned off but it sounded different than using the 6/8 in, might have been placebo effect.  Question, wouldn't the XDA-1 also benefit from the AVR not adding any additional processing to the signal when connected via the 6/8 inputs? Thanks again for your comments! |
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Post by Mr. Ben on Jan 31, 2011 15:26:15 GMT -5
Thanks Mr. Ben. That's basically how I have it minus the Oppo connected via 6/8 channel input on the AVR. My XB360, ATV2, DirecTV and Oppo are all connected via HDMI to the AVR for Movies and Surround music. However the Oppo has the Mono box in the middle of it's HDMI cable. HDMI for the oppo is set to LCPM, SACD is set to PCM. I also have them connected to the XDA-1 via Optical or Coax for two channel music. The XDA is connected to the AVR via 6/8 inputs. I initially had the XDA-1 connected to the AVR via a 2 channel input, with the AVR EQ turned off but it sounded different than using the 6/8 in, might have been placebo effect. Question, wouldn't the XDA-1 also benefit from the AVR not adding any additional processing to the signal when connected via the 6/8 inputs? Thanks again for your comments! You're correct that most receivers will convert the stereo analog inputs to digital and back again (for room correction, tone controls, and bass management), and most won't do this with the multi-channel analog inputs, such as your 6/8 inputs. But your receiver has a true analog bypass feature, which prevents this conversion, and this should give you the same sound quality as you get through the multi-channel inputs. Your manual says how to do it, but I believe you set it to 2-channel stereo and set the tone controls to off. If you're sure you hear a difference, then ignore the manual, and do what you think sounds the best. |
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Post by Trey on Jan 31, 2011 17:47:38 GMT -5
10-4, thanks again!
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Post by KPax on Feb 6, 2011 7:08:18 GMT -5
very interesting topic - great job Mr. Ben - thanks
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