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Post by geebo on Feb 7, 2013 21:14:58 GMT -5
Does that mean I'm getting further from Emotiva and stuff will take longer to get here? |
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Post by monkumonku on Feb 7, 2013 21:20:11 GMT -5
Does that mean I'm getting further from Emotiva and stuff will take longer to get here? Well yeah, that too. Especially if you live in Oz or something. ;D |
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Post by Golden Ear on Feb 7, 2013 21:22:53 GMT -5
It only make sense if there is media to support it. If you're listening to a CDs 16/44.1 and use a DAC that support 24/192khz, will it enhance anything? No, there is no information above those range for the DAC to reproduce. Another thing to consider is how well your ear can hear the very fine detail. The biggest change in sound not the DAC but the speaker itself.
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Post by srrndhound on Feb 8, 2013 4:04:21 GMT -5
Damn man, I think you've made your point. You don't like it. Fine. Don't buy it. My my. So much for enlightened discourse. I agree with Dave...if you do not like the logic he used, then just move on. I posted my complete thought about "logic" in #25. It could have ended there. Then came replies 26, 27 and 28 from three different people with statements that called for a further response. No problem, this is a forum for exchanging ideas. I'm happy to share my knowledge and to learn from others. If you wish me to 'move on' my advice would simply be physician, heal thyself. |
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Post by cwt on Feb 8, 2013 6:00:06 GMT -5
I like to look at the whole chain as has been spoken off ; not to mention the signal noise ratios the ear can distinguish .As mentioned in this post vvv and others below it < 21 bits is the best most can perceive anyway.. www.thetradersden.org/forums/showpost.php?s=d6e92fe32e9d22b935a8d64fc0765c88&p=1745600&postcount=4As for going from a 32bit processor to a 24 bit dac ; I assume if they ever release 32 bit files [wont be 24/48 movies that is all I care about along with 24/96 dvd-a's] the 200 can accept them . At a guess thats one reason they were picked ? Seems logical too me and happy enough with the rationale  |
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Post by carlp336 on Feb 8, 2013 9:07:25 GMT -5
ive been debating pulling the xda1, dvdo, and usp for this unit my living room. hows the dac between the XDa1 and UMC200
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Post by srrndhound on Feb 8, 2013 13:57:35 GMT -5
I like to look at the whole chain as has been spoken off ; not to mention the signal noise ratios the ear can distinguish .As mentioned in this post vvv and others below it < 21 bits is the best most can perceive anyway.. As for going from a 32bit processor to a 24 bit dac ; I assume if they ever release 32 bit files [wont be 24/48 movies that is all I care about along with 24/96 dvd-a's] the 200 can accept them . At a guess thats one reason they were picked ? Seems logical too me and happy enough with the rationale 24 bits is more a result of how computers are structured in 8-bit chunks, not on how humans hear. And that is why delivering content with >24 bits is totally unnecessary. In fact, it has been advocated by industry experts to use 20 bits for content delivery (where the need for efficient bandwidth and sonic transparency converge). Even so, whenever DSP operations are required either before or after transmission, larger wordlengths are appropriate and necessary. Hence, when it comes to DSP computations and DACs, it still makes sense to use 24 bits, and often more for certain computations, even if the source is 16 or 20 bits. The extended precision is needed so that the cumulative effects of computations and roundoffs do not accrue noise and distortion within the audible range. In the case of DACs, the wordlength of the audio data it ingests is no guarantee of the analog output performance down to the LSB. What was (and probably still is) the case is that the performance within the audible range (at least the upper 16 and hopefully 20 bits) is much improved using a 24-bit DAC than a 16- or 20-bit DAC. Linearity, monotonicity, dynamic range, all that rot. ESS may argue the principle is still in effect for their 32-bit DACs, but the sound quality advantages there, if they exist at all, may be as much due to its jitter reduction process as anything else. |
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Feb 8, 2013 16:31:29 GMT -5
I was just informed by a customer that I made a mistake when I was describing what chips were used in the unit. I believe I stated the i/v was the 5532 but they are in fact 082.
To many different products and projects in the works. Sorry for the mix up guys.
Lonnie
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DYohn
Emo VIPs 
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Post by DYohn on Feb 8, 2013 16:55:50 GMT -5
Oh no, Lonnie! Now you've stoked the Internet Hate Machine!! AVS will soon be overflowing with your quote and comments such as, "See, even their chief designer doesn't know what components their Chinese Overlords are using!!"  |
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Feb 8, 2013 17:02:29 GMT -5
Oh no, Lonnie! Now you've stoked the Internet Hate Machine!! AVS will soon be overflowing with your quote and comments such as, "See, even their chief designer doesn't know what components their Chinese Overlords are using!!" Yep, you know they are coming. I'm sure the accusation mill is ramping up to full speed. ;D |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 8, 2013 17:19:48 GMT -5
Oh no, Lonnie! Now you've stoked the Internet Hate Machine!! AVS will soon be overflowing with your quote and comments such as, "See, even their chief designer doesn't know what components their Chinese Overlords are using!!" Yep, you know they are coming. I'm sure the accusation mill is ramping up to full speed. ;D It's a sad state of affairs when this is true. |
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Feb 8, 2013 17:27:40 GMT -5
Yep, you know they are coming. I'm sure the accusation mill is ramping up to full speed. ;D It's a sad state of affairs when this is true. True, so true. |
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Post by roadrunner on Feb 8, 2013 17:40:48 GMT -5
Lonnie, Isn't it nice to know that the AVSers hang on your every word? ;D How's it feel to be so revered?  |
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Feb 8, 2013 17:59:30 GMT -5
Lonnie, Isn't it nice to know that the AVSers hang on your every word? ;D How's it feel to be so revered? I must be a really dangerous guy for people to spend their lives waiting for me to screw up or maybe I'm just that entertaining. ;D |
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LCSeminole
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Post by LCSeminole on Feb 8, 2013 18:20:23 GMT -5
It's quite entertaining to me when I do catch up on a certain thread on another forum, how much of a soap opera atmosphere there is, and you wouldn't be surprised to know the sources. Oh come on Lonnie, don't you know your every move is scrutinized. ;D |
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Feb 8, 2013 18:56:58 GMT -5
It's quite entertaining to me when I do catch up on a certain thread on another forum, how much of a soap opera atmosphere there is, and you wouldn't be surprised to know the sources. Oh come on Lonnie, don't you know your every move is scrutinized. ;D Seems that way sometimes.  OK, just to add fuel to the fire. Monday through Friday 4:20, get up 5:00 hit the gym A little after 7:00 i'm at the office. I usually leave around 6:00 in the evening. Spend a little time with the family and eat supper. Online with out production facilities at 8:00 Crash about 11:00 There you go, my exciting life. What's the old saying? "Nothing to see here folks." ;D |
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Post by Dan Laufman on Feb 8, 2013 19:00:43 GMT -5
I never should have hired that guy...  |
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Post by cwt on Feb 8, 2013 22:48:54 GMT -5
Even so, whenever DSP operations are required either before or after transmission, larger wordlengths are appropriate and necessary. Hence, when it comes to DSP computations and DACs, it still makes sense to use 24 bits, and often more for certain computations, even if the source is 16 or 20 bits. The extended precision is needed so that the cumulative effects of computations and roundoffs do not accrue noise and distortion within the audible range. Couldnt agree more srrndhound ; Bob Pariseau has said similar about rounding bit errors ; dropping the lsb's . 24bit is indeed fine. Found some interesting figures from Killian @ avs about 24 and 32 bit s/n dac ratios which illustrates marketing vs raw data All above the hearing threshold of course . SNR: PCM1791 24-bit 192kHz 113dB PCM1792A 24-bit 192kHz 132dB PCM1793 24-bit 192kHz 113dB PCM1794A 24-bit 192kHz 132dB PCM1795 32-bit 192kHz 123dB PCM1796 24-bit 192kHz 123dB PCM1798 24-bit 192kHz 123dB PCM5100 32-bit 384kHz 100dB PCM5101 32-bit 384kHz 106dB PCM5102 32-bit 384kHz 112dB |
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Post by snafujg on Feb 21, 2013 13:48:42 GMT -5
ive been debating pulling the xda1, dvdo, and usp for this unit my living room. hows the dac between the XDa1 and UMC200 +1 for this one. I too would like to know how the DAC's compare between these two machines. I'm contemplaing both of these and trying to decide which way to go. |
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quiller
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Post by quiller on Mar 24, 2013 11:30:03 GMT -5
^^^^
Bump
JP
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