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Post by me262 on May 28, 2013 23:22:03 GMT -5
Hey Guys,
Hope all is well, had a question about speaker wire. I am about to move into a new apartment, and because of that I feel it is time to redo the speaker wiring for my surround sound system.
My setup is pretty simple.
UMC200 -> XSP-1 HTB -> XPA 2 (Front 2 channels)
UMC200 -> UPA-500 (Center, and rear 2 channels)
I am debating between buying a spool of 100ft mono price 12 gauge or buying the precut and terminated Sewell Silverback cable.
The mono price has 65 threads where the Sewell has 256 threads, but the price difference is pretty substancial. The mono price option would with terminators cost less then 45, where the Sewell option would cost over 100.
My question is, does anyone thing that the sewell is worth the extra cost? If so could I get by with just buying it for my front 2 speakers or shoudl I really do my entire system?
Thanks as always.
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Post by GreenKiwi on May 29, 2013 0:28:16 GMT -5
I fear that you'll get two sets of answers, those who believe that different speaker cable makes a huge difference and those that simply believe that if you have a large enough gauge for the distance that the cable construction doesn't have an effect. I'll say that I fall into the latter category. I have MP 12G for all my speaker cables. I tried some MIT cables, but couldn't hear any difference. As Keith has pointed out, with some tube amps, speaker cables resistance and/or capacitance can become part of the speaker, but with your XPA-2/UPA-500, I would think that it wouldn't be an issue. So my $0.02... go with the MP and some locking connectors from Orange County Speakers www.speakerrepair.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=lockingOr spades, if you need those. |
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Post by Boomzilla on May 29, 2013 3:06:00 GMT -5
...does anyone thing that the sewell is worth the extra cost?... Alas - Unless you have the opportunity to listen to them both side by side, you may never know. The odds of any of us having tried those specific two wires are also small. My advice, therefore, would be to go with the least expensive or to buy some Emotiva wires (with their "try-it-before-you-keep-it" policy, you actually DO get to listen first). Sorry I can't be more help, but wires are VERY system-specific and what works for me probably won't work for you. A cheap option might be to watch for some inexpensive used wires and listen to them on your front speakers only. If you didn't like the sound, you can resell the wires losing but the shipping costs. Happy shopping - Boomzilla |
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Post by garbulky on May 29, 2013 4:11:08 GMT -5
I have limited experience in this area. I have found that the legnth of interconnects matters with a passive pre-amp. I have also noticed better bass from 12 guage wires even at lower volumes. I have not tried super expensive wires. I would like to say there should be no difference, but I have little experience here.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2013 4:57:04 GMT -5
+1..what boomzilla said, I can say make sure not to use cheap plugs or cheap spades I did that once and ended up messin up my system.I was amazed at how much it colored the sound I am guessing it was something in the material cause I took all the plugs off and my sound was back with full robust sound now all I do. Is cut the wire back a 1/2 inch oh and I use AWG wire no less then 12 AWG.
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Post by Boomzilla on May 29, 2013 6:24:04 GMT -5
... oh and I use AWG wire no less then 12 AWG. ...And in case you don't know, me262, the AWG wire scale is funny in that as the AWG number goes down, the wire gets bigger. Therefore when cmw says " no less than 12 AWG," he actually means wire with an AWG number of 12 or less (such as 10, 8, etc.). Most common speaker wire normally doesn't go as big as 10 or 8 AWG, so you're probably looking for some 12 gauge wire (NOT 14, 16, 18, or 20 gauge). Cheers - Boomzilla |
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Post by mshump on May 29, 2013 7:24:54 GMT -5
IMO, you spent quite a bit on your set up, you should buy a decent quality wire. I'm not advocating those 1k wires etc but the 100-200 dollar range will do. These are going to be laying on the floor(most systems) hit with a vacum cleaner, possibly tripped over, dust, etc. I've noticed some differences in mine but at the same time I have changed something else in my system at the same time,so I cannot say 100% for sure that the cables did anything. Have you looked at Audio Advisor? A lot of times you can get some screaming deals from them and they are professionally terminated. Their sales staff can also recommend cables if you call them (they do ask about your system and then give cable advice you don't have to buy) but can get a decent idea of recommendations. They have never tried steering me into 1k cables etc.
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DYohn
Emo VIPs 
Posts: 18,436
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Post by DYohn on May 29, 2013 8:49:25 GMT -5
Monoiprice.
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Post by paintedklown on May 29, 2013 8:52:37 GMT -5
Monoprice 12 gauge speaker wire all the way around for me.  |
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Post by me262 on May 29, 2013 12:29:58 GMT -5
Thanks is guys,
I would like to go the Emo option, the Emo option runs about 350-500 dollars, the front left speaker is a good 11 ft away from the amp making both the left and right speakers require the 6 meter options, the rears will require a 3 and 6 and then the center will need a 3 meter option. Sadly that is most likely out of my budget. The monoprice option is what I currently use and I don't tend to have any issues with it but I do agree with some other points made, allot of money has been spent it and it would be a shame to cheap out on the wiring. I will be putting allot of thought into this in the next few days. Thanks again, more suggestions are welcome.
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Post by Boomzilla on May 29, 2013 13:10:35 GMT -5
Well - wires I'm currently playing with include:
Kimber Kable 12TC
Home-made 8 ga. twisted pair
Morrow Audio Type 1 bi-wire
Kimber 4TC clone
Since I got my front end DAC straightened out, I find almost vanishingly little difference between any of the above. The only two that I could (probably) pick out with a blindfold on are the Morrow (less bass) and the Kimber 12TC (more bass). Overall, I think that you're probably well-served by your 12 ga. Monoprice wire.
If it worries you, try a (front R&L only) pair of Emotiva wires. If you don't think they're worth the $$, then send them back. Little risk & you can sleep easy knowing for sure. I think that there's some wire store on the internet that also offers trial before purchase.
Happy listening - Boomzilla
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Post by yves on May 29, 2013 15:18:43 GMT -5
the rears will require a 3 and 6 Regardless of whether it's a front, side or rear speaker pair, both speakers in a speaker pair (Left and Right) should always have identical cables with identical lengths. |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on May 29, 2013 15:40:16 GMT -5
the rears will require a 3 and 6 Regardless of whether it's a front, side or rear speaker pair, both speakers in a speaker pair (Left and Right) should always have identical cables with identical lengths. That is conventional wisdom however it really doesn't matter. Since audio signals travel through copper wire at approximately 60% the speed of light, it would take a length difference of many hundreds of feet before even a few milliseconds of delay is introduced. And unless you are using small wire gauge, the resistance differences of less than a few dozen feet create a completely negligible impact on power differences. Get them as close as is practical, not a bad idea, but the idea that lengths must be exactly the same or some bad effect results is simply not true. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2013 15:52:05 GMT -5
>> The monoprice option is what I currently use and I don't tend to have any issues with it but I do agree with some other points made, allot of money has been spent it and it would be a shame to cheap out on the wiring. <<
And you are wise for NOT throwing big money at speaker cabling. As long as you are using well-constructed, OFC copper of sufficient gauge (and 12 ga. is *plenty* big enough for up to 75 ft. runs) you are getting all you're gonna get out of your cables.
Any money saved would be FAR better used to improve your speaker/room interface: positioning, damping early reflections, bass traps, etc. This is where you will hear *significant* improvements, spending uber-bux on speaker cables is a fool's errand...
-RW-
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Post by monkumonku on May 29, 2013 15:52:29 GMT -5
Regardless of whether it's a front, side or rear speaker pair, both speakers in a speaker pair (Left and Right) should always have identical cables with identical lengths. That is conventional wisdom however it really doesn't matter. Since audio signals travel through copper wire at approximately 60% the speed of light, it would take a length difference of many hundreds of feet before even a few milliseconds of delay is introduced. And unless you are using small wire gauge, the resistance differences of less than a few dozen feet create a completely negligible impact on power differences. Get them as close as is practical, not a bad idea, but the idea that lengths must be exactly the same or some bad effect results is simply not true. The thing is, if you get speaker wire of exactly the same length for each speaker then you have to make sure to sit EXACTLY in the midpoint between your speakers, otherwise your efforts will be futile. Also, turning your head will cause issues as well.  Also, my center channel is not the same distance from my seat as the left and right speakers (it is about 1/2 a foot shorter) so I adjusted the length of the speaker wire accordingly. |
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Post by Boomzilla on May 29, 2013 16:02:05 GMT -5
...Since audio signals travel through copper wire at approximately 60% the speed of light, it would take a length difference of many hundreds of feet before even a few milliseconds of delay is introduced. An EXCELLENT point - It would be better to have neat wiring than to have loops of wire laying around to "equalize the wire lengths." |
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Post by yves on May 29, 2013 16:08:50 GMT -5
The speed at which the signal travels through a cable is what's irrelevant. It's how electromagnetic induction affects the signal that does matter. (Well... to my ears, it does). P.S. - I don't obsess over a quarter of an inch difference in speaker cable lenghts, but getting 3 meters for the left rear speaker and 6 meters for the right rear speaker is most definitely not the way to go IMO. Regardless of whether it's a front, side or rear speaker pair, both speakers in a speaker pair (Left and Right) should always have identical cables with identical lengths. That is conventional wisdom however it really doesn't matter. Since audio signals travel through copper wire at approximately 60% the speed of light, it would take a length difference of many hundreds of feet before even a few milliseconds of delay is introduced. And unless you are using small wire gauge, the resistance differences of less than a few dozen feet create a completely negligible impact on power differences. Get them as close as is practical, not a bad idea, but the idea that lengths must be exactly the same or some bad effect results is simply not true. |
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Post by thepcguy on May 29, 2013 16:16:53 GMT -5
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2013 16:19:43 GMT -5
>> The speed at which the signal travels through a cable is what's irrelevant. It's how electromagnetic induction affects the signal that does matter. (Well... to my ears, it does).<<
Huh? I fail to see how relatively minor differences in speaker cable length would translate into *anything* audible - or even measurable. I am totally willing to hear you out about this, but please be sure that your explanation comports with well-known, and thoroughly proven, electromagnetic theory and measurements...
-RW-
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Post by 1960broookwood on May 29, 2013 16:49:03 GMT -5
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Also, my center channel is not the same distance from my seat as the left and right speakers (it is about 1/2 a foot shorter) so I adjusted the length of the speaker wire accordingly. 
