|
|
Post by jmasterj on Nov 25, 2013 16:06:40 GMT -5
As we approach the end of November, I'm growing more anxious each day. I'm hoping first that Emotiva will still have at least one XPA-100 mono block amp left for me to purchase next month, and second that the amp will still be on sale. I'd hate to be a week away only to see the dreaded "out of stock" when I try to check out.
Having said that, now on to the questions.
1.) The Quick Reference Manual that came with the XPA-100 I purchased earlier this month states the XPA-100 is rated at 225 watts into 8 Ohms, 360 watts into 4 Ohms. However the Products page at the Emotiva website states it's rated at 250 watts into 8 Ohms, 400 watts into 4 Ohms. This is not a big difference nor a deal breaker for me. I'm just wondering which is correct? Why the discrepancy?
2.) This question stems from a personal observation here on the forum. Which may, or may not be correct.
I'm wondering is the XPA-100 the "black sheep" of the Emotiva amp line up? The reason for this question is that I have noticed that whenever a new person on the forum ask which amp should they get and the XPA-100 is on their list. The person is almost always directed towards all the other amps in Emotiva's line up. This regardless of what the persons stated needs are or what their budget is. Is there a stigma on the XPA-100? Do forum members think that the XPA-100 is not a good amp?
I plan to go through with my purchase of the XPA-100 regardless. I'm completely confident that the amps will fulfill my needs. Equally as important the sale price fits my budget. I was just wondering ?
|
|
|
|
Post by dally on Nov 25, 2013 16:52:51 GMT -5
1. The answer is probably BOTH. Under Ideal circumstances(stable 120v) it will probably hit 250/400, but in real use, like at home with maybe 115v available and line sag it will test at less.
2. I think ever since the 1L came out, the XPA-100 plays second fiddle in the compact monobloc category.
|
|
|
|
Post by AudioHTIT on Nov 26, 2013 13:42:49 GMT -5
I'm wondering is the XPA-100 the "black sheep" of the Emotiva amp line up? The reason for this question is that I have noticed that whenever a new person on the forum ask which amp should they get and the XPA-100 is on their list. The person is almost always directed towards all the other amps in Emotiva's line up. This regardless of what the persons stated needs are, or what their budget is. Is there a stigma on the XPA-100? Do forum members think that the XPA-100 is not a good amp? The XPA-100 has a respected heritage, the UPA-1. I think many people like to recommend the most powerful or expensive option, it requires less 'engineering', however some may have experience with the other models, or like a feature they offer. In any case, if the XPA-100 meets your requirements I wouldn't shy away from it. |
|
|
|
Post by garbulky on Nov 26, 2013 16:10:48 GMT -5
The XPA-100 is the old UPA-1 with a few differences (maybe?)
I've heard the UPA-1, upa-2 and I've also heard the XPA-2. The XPA-2 is the better amp - it's faster, more powerful all around, instruments are produced in a more solid precise way. However, the UPA-1 also has a different sound signature - very similar to the old UPA-2. It's slower than the XPA-2 but I couldn't tell you which sound signature you like subjectively. To my ears the UPA-2 (and 1) is more "musical". But the XPA-2 is the better amp and is on a different level. It's not a perfect amp in "musicality", mind you - if you think in those terms. But it's better than two UPA-1's as an amp.
Either way you won't be unhappy. But there's a reason the XPA-2 was Emotiva's flagship two channel amplifier for a long time.
|
|
|
|
Post by knucklehead on Nov 26, 2013 16:14:40 GMT -5
The XPA-2 is the better amp - it's fasterWhat the hell does that mean? I've asked you in a prior thread what you meant by that - if you answered I didn't see it... |
|
|
|
Post by wiskers on Nov 26, 2013 16:28:59 GMT -5
Well I have 2 XPA-100's and love em.
|
|
|
|
Post by garbulky on Nov 26, 2013 16:32:36 GMT -5
The XPA-2 is the better amp - it's fasterWhat the hell does that mean? I've asked you in a prior thread what you meant by that - if you answered I didn't see it... Well HELL.  It means it's a faster amp. Well since you asked, prepare for some eye rolling literature as I attempt to fumble through describing it. It has to do with dynamics. And I'm not saying - does this amp get loud. Both amps get equally loud at the volumes I listen to. And the volumes I listen to aren't terribly loud though I do crank it at times. It's about how quickly it produces the sound or gets loud. On the XPA-2 when there is a sound it is closer to instantly appearing. Less smearing. As in "Pow, it's there". And then when it goes to the next note, the previous note isn't mushed in with it, the previous note is gone and the new one is there. So it's more immediate. Ever heard of a hang or a boominess in bass notes? Or when there are multiple bass notes sometimes they blend together. It's pleasing but it's not what it really sounds like in real life. But on a better subwoofer, the notes are clear happens instantly and change very quickly. That's what it's like with the XPA-2 in the mid-range and treble. In fact, when I first listened to it, I felt the music was on fast forward. But it obviously wasn't. It was because I wasn't hearing the time it was taking for the amplifier to produce sound. Don't get me wrong thhe UPA-2 is no slouch in quickness or smearing everything in sight. But the XPA-2 is simply faster. Lonnie confirmed that the XPA-2 amp was faster due to a better slew rate in my review. In his words to my review. "Just a couple of thoughts here on the quickness of the amp and how we perceive what we are hearing. The XPA amplifiers are indeed faster and by that I mean the slew rate is much higher than the UPA amplifiers. Slew rate is a fancy term for 0 to 60 or in reality 0 to full on. So you are correct, they are faster in their response time which minimizes slewing of the sine wave. Now what you get out of this is basically the signal, whatever it is, is reproduced with absolute accuracy. That is to say the pluck of a string has a hard edge to it, a trumpet makes you wince (if the volume is loud enough) and a bow of a violin brushing across the strings actually has metallic sound the strings make when played. So what you are hearing is the true artifacts of the music as they would he heard if you were standing in front of the instrument as it was being played live. The XPA series will not only reproduce the fundamental frequencies, but all the associated harmonics and detail associated with it and as such, you don't just hear the music, you hear everything. A lot of amplifiers are slow in response and tend to smooth out these hard edges, but the XPA series was designed from the start to be as true to life as possible and reproduce every nuance in the music. Now that doesn't mean it is right for everyone. I personally like a really fast amp. To me there is nothing more satisfying than listening to a piece of music that is so realistic it actually sucks you in and you hear every detail. Though for others, they might prefer to have things smoothed out a bit, which is OK as well. It all comes down to personal taste and what you want your system to sound like. Lonnie" My review can be found here. emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/32383/garbulkys-xpa-upa-biamp-audition |
|
|
|
Post by dally on Nov 26, 2013 16:43:03 GMT -5
The XPA-2 is the better amp - it's fasterWhat the hell does that mean? I've asked you in a prior thread what you meant by that - if you answered I didn't see it... Well, pick up a UPA-1, then pick up an XPA-2. I bet you'll want to set down the XPA-2 FASTER! |
|
|
|
Post by audiobill on Nov 26, 2013 16:48:06 GMT -5
AKA transient response.
|
|
|
|
Post by jmasterj on Nov 26, 2013 20:09:23 GMT -5
garbulky,
So if I'm understanding your response correctly the XPA-100 is the successor to the UPA-1 with some differences "maybe". That suggest to me that you might think no changes were made to the XPA-100 beyond a name change. So basically you're saying the XPA-100 is not XPA series quality it's a UPA-1 rebadged. Furthermore you are stating the XPA-2 is a better amp because it's "faster". The UPA-2, and UPA-1 are "more musical" but not equal to the sound of the XPA-2. This almost sounds like a contradiction to me.
I used the link you provided and read the review of your comparison of the UPA-2 to the XPA-2 it seemed riddled with contradiction as well. Alas, it still wasn't a direct comparison of the XPA-100 to the XPA-2 or any other amp in the XPA series. None of the statements above have you listening directly to a XPA-100 unless I missed something.
So my question was is the XPA-100 the "black sheep" of the Emotiva amps ?
It seems to me that you feel the XPA-100 is not as good as the other XPA series amps. I'm sitting here trying to process that since you haven't shown any evidence that you have even listened to a XPA-100.
Please feel free to correct me if I'm misunderstanding you.
My point is: This is the kind of response I see when a new member on the forum ask about the XPA-100 mono block amps. Like I said this has me wondering.
Maybe some of the other forum members who have been around for a while, and have an opinion will care to chime in.
By the way I'm not overlooking the two positive responses about the XPA-100 that's good, those I rarely see. I'm still planning to get the XPA-100. |
|
|
|
Post by knucklehead on Nov 26, 2013 20:30:26 GMT -5
The UPA-1 was marketed as having an XPA series amp channel stuffed inside the cabinet so I would assume the UPA-1 and XPA-100 are not very different. Maybe identical. ====================================================================== As for slew rates - I can't hear the difference. But then I can't hear anything much above 12khz any more. There's a great article on slew rate on Audioholics by Gene DellaSala here: www.audioholics.com/audio-amplifier/amplifier-slew-rateGene draws a conclusion that I agree with - having 'studied' slew rates years ago when the only material you could find on slew rates was in the local library. I kept getting hit with "did you read about how fast the slew rate is with (their brand) when I was shopping for audio gear 'way back' - like the 70's and 80's. Each gave a different answer than the last. I came to the conclusion years ago that slew rate is just more iffy 'meat' when audio manufacturers are making their batch of 'baloney'. With that in mind here's Gene's conclusions: By now you the reader should understand that slew rate has precious little to do with the dynamics or punchiness of an amplifier, although one can imply that a more powerful amplifier requires a higher slew rate. Slew rate is all about effective bandwidth. Further, you’ll find that you don’t necessarily need a top echelon amplifier to extend useful bandwidth well beyond 20kHz. Presuming Harman Kardon isn’t fudging their specs too badly, the slew rate of the entry level AVR 1565 is sufficient to give it full power output to 100kHz and beyond, which even a conservative engineer would consider (in a dry tone) “adequate”. Of course, now equipped with the knowledge of how slew rate and bandwidth are intertwined, you too can see just how true some claims of bandwidth out to 300kHz and beyond really are. Happy listening (and calculating)! |
|
|
|
Post by jmasterj on Nov 26, 2013 21:32:24 GMT -5
I'm sorry that was over my head.
What are you saying? That you listened to the slew rate of the UPA-1, and the XPA-100 so you assume they are identical ? Or did someone ask a question about the slew rate that I missed.
|
|
|
|
Post by knucklehead on Nov 26, 2013 21:44:16 GMT -5
I'm sorry that was over my head. What are you saying? That you listened to the slew rate of the UPA-1, and the XPA-100 so you assume they are identical ? Or did someone ask a question about the slew rate that I missed. Don't worry about slew rates - or when someone claims one amp is faster than any other amp. Slew rates are not audible in an amp that is functioning properly. Its a measurement best left to o-scopes and other precision electronics - not with ears. |
|
|
|
Post by dally on Nov 26, 2013 22:22:24 GMT -5
jmasterj- as has been previously stated,the XPA-100 is basically an improved UPA-1. The UPA-1 used the XPA-5/3 amp module, as I believe the XPA-100 does as well. The transformer size was increased from 300VA(UPA-1) to 360VA(XPA-100) and capacitance was reduced from 80,000uf(upa-1) to 60,000uf(XPA-100). As to why it's considered a "black sheep"? I think it's because it came out when other new exciting options came out. XPR series, XPA-1L. The UPA-1 was usually preferred to the XPA-2 in most of the reviews I read. They can be found in the amp review section of the lounge. I would link them but I'm on my phone.
|
|
|
|
Post by creimes on Nov 26, 2013 23:27:45 GMT -5
Don't sweat the XPA-100 amps being underdogs, I owned the UPA-1's and they are excellent amps, I now own the XPA-1L's and love them as well and have owned the XPA-5 gen1 and now gen2, a Gen1 XPA-2, UPA-200 and UPA-500 and they are all excellent amplifiers, we hear what we want to hear, if the XPA-100 amps are catching your eye and are in your budget I say go ahead, $600 for a pair of Emotiva monoblocks is unreal in today's market. You say you only have one right now so does that mean you are using it on a center channel ?
Chad
|
|
|
|
Post by jmasterj on Nov 27, 2013 2:03:07 GMT -5
Thanks for the input.
I already figured out nothing was wrong with the XPA-100 amps. To me right now the XPA-100 mono block amps are the best bargain Emotiva has on sale.
Chad,
In answer to your question, no I am not using the XPA-100 for a center channel. It's brand new sitting in the box it came in. I just opened it looked at it and put it away. It's currently waiting for me to purchase another one next month. Then they both will sit in the boxes and wait until I purchase the preamp for them. Then I'll finally be able to hear for myself how they sound. I'm looking at January.
I'm strictly two channel. The XPA-100s are going to become part of my system which will consist of three different power amps. A tube integrated which I just purchased last month, a hybrid tube integrated which has a tube preamp section, mated to a solid state power amp. Which I purchased about three years ago, and I'll also have the pair of solid state Emotiva mono blocks. Most likely mated with a tube preamp. I'll switch out the amps from time to time just to change things up.
I do the same thing with my speakers. My current set up is my little 50 watts/channel Yaqin MC30-L tube integrated amp with my Tekton Designs M-Lore speakers. This combo is really nice. I have a pair of Maggie MMG's in their box in the closet. They work really well with my BADA DC-222 Hybrid integrated amp. I'm actually thinking that I'll use the XPA-100 mono blocks with the MMG's with 400 watts/channel into 4 Ohms they should really have a lot of headroom. Then I'll get a pair of bookshelf speakers and stands. That way I'll have a pair of Planer speakers, a pair of floor standers, and a pair of bookshelf speakers. That's the path I've chose for my system.
The ERC-1, and the sub are constant in each ensemble. A ERC-3 might be somewhere in the not to distant future.
At this point it looks like Emotiva has until the first of the year to come up with a tube preamp for me. I just found out this month that the Pacific Valve & Electric Co. which is where I purchased my BADA DC-222 from is now importing and modifying a version of the Xiang Sheng 728A tube pre amp called the 728B. It sales for $560.00 It was already on my short list of tube preamps under consideration along with the Jolida JD5T tube preamp. Now it has sales, and service here in the US. That was the drawback. If I purchased one and it needed repair I would have to ship it back to China. Not anymore, now I can just ship it to Batavia, IL. The Jolida I've seen on line for $465.00 so it looks like it will be one of them. |
|
|
|
Post by Andrew Robinson on Nov 27, 2013 8:58:50 GMT -5
Thanks for the input.
I already figured out nothing was wrong with the XPA-100 amps. To me right now the XPA-100 mono block amps are the best bargain Emotiva has on sale.
Do not hesitate for a second if considering the XPA-1 mono amplifier. For 99% of folks with mass-market equipment the XPA-1 at $299/ea is THE STEAL of this Holiday Season! |
|
|
|
Post by audiobill on Nov 27, 2013 9:15:17 GMT -5
Thanks for the input.
I already figured out nothing was wrong with the XPA-100 amps. To me right now the XPA-100 mono block amps are the best bargain Emotiva has on sale.
Do not hesitate for a second if considering the XPA-1 mono amplifier. For 99% of folks with mass-market equipment the XPA-1 at $299/ea is THE STEAL of this Holiday Season! I think you may mean XPA-100....... |
|
|
|
Post by Andrew Robinson on Nov 27, 2013 9:22:01 GMT -5
Do not hesitate for a second if considering the XPA-1 mono amplifier. For 99% of folks with mass-market equipment the XPA-1 at $299/ea is THE STEAL of this Holiday Season! I think you may mean XPA-100....... Yes, you are correct. The XPA-100, sorry. We were testing/playing with XPA-1 Gen 2s yesterday so I had them on my mind. |
|
|
|
Post by jmasterj on Nov 27, 2013 10:18:28 GMT -5
Thanks Andrew,
I know a bargain when I see one.
|
|
