Building a dream HT room - your inputs

[mepositive]

For the first time in my life, I have an opportunity to build a media room and am super excited.

I have always been a 2.1 music person but am keen now to explore HT as well. The dimensions of the room will be 20ftX19ft with fairly high ceiling. Being a new construction, I have the ability to specify to the builder the things I'd like in it including wiring, flooring, internet access, color of walls and ceilings etc.

I will be using the room largely for 2.1 stereo listening and 5.2 HT. However, I would like your thoughts on what all I should do now so that I am future proofing the room for both stereo and critical movie sessions (possibly 7.2 or even 9.2).

Appreciate all your help - Thanks.

[djoel]

Nice, and congratulation on getting your up for dedicate music listening and movies !

If I've learn one thing about a dedicate space is, damping the space as much as your budget can allow! I would try to learn as much as possible on the subject, nothing kills listening or watching a movie experience than a knock on the door telling you to lower the volume!

Good luck and will subscribe to this thread for sure

DJoel

[vneal]

I would have studs twice as close for this room. Consider having it wired as a dedicated ac to breaker. Have no windows and have two layers of drywall installed. Also I would pre wire for speaker expansion. As for a door I would have an extra heavy wooden door no glass with lock. I would think about where I wanted the equipment be it built in or using a rack or stand.

[petew]

I'd hire a pro to design and construct the space. Don't rely on your architect or builder. A proper theater takes a specialist. AVSforum.com has a very good "home theater builder" forum.

[pletwals]

IMO, it takes a few years before one has learned enough to design a HT without to many errors. So I second the suggestion to get pro help. I believe the basic price for a design from Dennis Erskine's company is $3K. Good value for all their experience.

Some tips though:

Construct a box-in-box. This means decouple the room as much as possible from the rest of the house and prevent air leaks as air transports the noise. The weakest element counts the most. Make sure to have a heavy floor poored on top of acoustic foam. Use Green Glue in between both layers of drywall, which makes it perform as much as 4 layers, same for the ceiling. Consider the first layer in OSB which allows for later attachement of all kinds of elements.

As the future is unpredictable, consider a way to allow adding/changing cabling later. Like a grid ceiling for example.

Someting more advanced: room ratios (HxWxD). Same or exact multiple dimensions cause peaks and nulls concentrated at certain frequencies. Certain room ratios are very bad, like 1x2x2 for example. So avoid 9,5'x19'x19', it will be very bad for the 55-60Hz range and 110Hz. A few room ratios are very good independent of room size. But more room ratios are good depending on size. Here's more on the subject: Best Room Ratios
You could consider having a wall moved a bit... Starting from the 20ft you gave, I looked it up. Your space is a bit less than the 100 m³ tab in the excel sheet from Salford, so I went with that one. Among the "best" room ratios is 1/1.6/1.9 meaning 10ft6 x 16ft10 x 20ft! Another one is 1/1.5/2.13 meaning 9ft4.5 x 14ft1 x 20 (a bit narrow).
More than 20ft would be helping a lot.

There are conflicts between the needs of acoustic treatment for multichannel and stereo, as stereo benefits from a more lively room. This means a mix of absorption and diffusion for stereo listening. The more speakers, the more first reflection points need treatment, the more absorption is needed. In both cases, substantial bass trapping is beneficial, best positioned in corners (wall/wall, wall/ceiling and wall/floor).

[mepositive]

Thanks - very helpful inputs.

A couple more questions:
1. Does wood or carpet make a difference given that I will be putting up room treatment panels? I was planning on wood where the primary stereo speakers will stand and teh rest of room in carpet - what are your thoughts?
2. I know nothing about Dirac or other softwares. Would it help to have an internet cable run to this room or is wireless sufficient?

[ottaone]

Over the years visiting stores and model homes, my preference has shifted from a dedicated closed room to a semi open room with other areas like a bar or dance floor, billiards, etc.

Suggest visiting as many finished model homes.

[Deleted]

You would want a thick carpet everywhere. If you place the speakers on hardwoods the floor bounce will be bad.

For treatments although a more reflective room for stereo is preferred I have found that a properly treated room sounds great for both 2 channel and surround

Definitely want to sound isolate if you can afford it. It gets very pricey quick. And needs to be done perfectly otherwise t will be a waste

Also plan plan plan. Draw up plans in a program like sketch up. Look through lots of build threads so you can grab ideas of what you want to do

[petew]

You cannot have too much cat-6 cabling. It's cheap and easy to run. Just rough it in and have leave buried in the walls until you need it.

[KeithL]

Actually, most old timers don't like to carpet the entire floor - because it makes the room "too dead".

The "old wisdom" used to be that the room should be half carpeted and half not - but there was serious disagreement about which half. How room reflections affect what we hear depends to a large degree on the amount of delay between the original sound and the reflection. Long delay reflections are perceived as echoes, while short delays make the room seem "more lively". For this reason, many people used to recommend leaving the front half of a medium sized room bare wood - so you had lots of very short delay reflections - which are heard more as "liveliness" than as echoes or ambiance. (A similar, but directly opposite, argument suggested that the rear half should be bare wood, based on the idea that short reflections, which aren't audible as separate reflections, tend to mess up imaging, while echoes that we HEAR as echoes are less confusing to the analyzer in our brain.)

I think that most people agree that some sort of mixture between absorption, diffusion, and reflection is best. (It takes a ridiculous amount of power to make something loud in a totally dead room - and no amount of power will make a truly dead room sound lively.)

Aug 10, 2015 11:38:55 GMT -5 @bmoney said:

You would want a thick carpet everywhere. If you place the speakers on hardwoods the floor bounce will be bad.

For treatments although a more reflective room for stereo is preferred I have found that a properly treated room sounds great for both 2 channel and surround

Definitely want to sound isolate if you can afford it. It gets very pricey quick. And needs to be done perfectly otherwise t will be a waste

Also plan plan plan. Draw up plans in a program like sketch up. Look through lots of build threads so you can grab ideas of what you want to do

[Deleted]

Aug 10, 2015 16:30:47 GMT -5 KeithL said:

Actually, most old timers don't like to carpet the entire floor - because it makes the room "too dead".

The "old wisdom" used to be that the room should be half carpeted and half not - but there was serious disagreement about which half. How room reflections affect what we hear depends to a large degree on the amount of delay between the original sound and the reflection. Long delay reflections are perceived as echoes, while short delays make the room seem "more lively". For this reason, many people used to recommend leaving the front half of a medium sized room bare wood - so you had lots of very short delay reflections - which are heard more as "liveliness" than as echoes or ambiance. (A similar, but directly opposite, argument suggested that the rear half should be bare wood, based on the idea that short reflections, which aren't audible as separate reflections, tend to mess up imaging, while echoes that we HEAR as echoes are less confusing to the analyzer in our brain.)

I think that most people agree that some sort of mixture between absorption, diffusion, and reflection is best. (It takes a ridiculous amount of power to make something loud in a totally dead room - and no amount of power will make a truly dead room sound lively.)

Aug 10, 2015 11:38:55 GMT -5 @bmoney said:

You would want a thick carpet everywhere. If you place the speakers on hardwoods the floor bounce will be bad.

For treatments although a more reflective room for stereo is preferred I have found that a properly treated room sounds great for both 2 channel and surround

Definitely want to sound isolate if you can afford it. It gets very pricey quick. And needs to be done perfectly otherwise t will be a waste

Also plan plan plan. Draw up plans in a program like sketch up. Look through lots of build threads so you can grab ideas of what you want to do

There has not been one professionally designed room (I have read about hundreds) that suggest NOT using carpet. A carpet will NOT over deaden the room.

Too many wall absorption panels yes. But not the floor.

[vneal]

I much prefer a room with a concrete slab Vs a second story room without. I prefer wood floor over concrete with a large added Persian type rug covering 80% of the floor. Wall treatment and bass traps can easily be added of removed.

[jlamo]

Aug 9, 2015 18:19:43 GMT -5 mepositive said:

For the first time in my life, I have an opportunity to build a media room and am super excited.

I have always been a 2.1 music person but am keen now to explore HT as well. The dimensions of the room will be 20ftX19ft with fairly high ceiling. Being a new construction, I have the ability to specify to the builder the things I'd like in it including wiring, flooring, internet access, color of walls and ceilings etc.

I will be using the room largely for 2.1 stereo listening and 5.2 HT. However, I would like your thoughts on what all I should do now so that I am future proofing the room for both stereo and critical movie sessions (possibly 7.2 or even 9.2).

Appreciate all your help - Thanks.

I finished my media room a few moths back and would advise many of the same things the other members said. run cat 5 from modem/router to media room and get one to your seating area also. Use good dimmers for lighting (they sell some controlled via apple/android device also) if equipment will be in the media room than consider the heat it will produce , a good ac guy can figure for that. Im not sure about using two layers of drywall but I can say that the type of drywall can make a difference , they sell drywall at lowes that says it x% lighter and it is but it has worse sound dampening than the heavier material that they sell in the same thickness .all interior walls can be batted with soft n sound sound dampening products instead of thermal insulation and you will get much better results than 5 sheets of drywall. im not sure how to "future proof it " but if you spend some time thinking about the equipment/devices you really use ,than this will make the process much easier.

[redog]

I would try as much as possible to build the room to eliminate hard to control standing waves. Check the measurements of your room to:

www.marktaw.com/recording/Acoustics/RoomModeStandingWaveCalcu.html

[klinemj]

If I had my house design to do over again, I would have done three things very different that would have impacted my HT.

First, I would have paid for a full basement instead of a partial one. That would have given me many more options when I finished the basement for layout of the HT vs. the rest of the space. That would have given me better acoustic options.

Second, I would have had a full plan for mechanical items laid out...specifically, where do the water lines, HVAC ducting, and drainage lines go? I paid for an extra tall basement pour, but the placement of these three things ended up cutting into the finished ceiling height that I had wanted.

Third, I would have gone overkill on circuit panel total amperage and size. I didn't expect to finish the basement, add a barn with a subpanel off my main, and add a pool.

As for future proofing, I did my best, and I still could not possibly have planned for my internet needs and the potential of ever wanting greater than 7.1. If you have an easy option to do so, I would run some large (as in 4") PVC from front to back through the ceiling along the sides and center with openings at various logical points. And, I would pre-run string through it so if some day I needed to run more lines, all I would have do is cut a small hole in my ceiling at any of the pre-planned points, hook a line to the string, and pull a new line to the appropriate next point. And, I would also have PVC at these points going down to logical heights on the front/side walls for the same reason. I did this in parts of my house as it was built and it has paid dividiends!

And, as others have said...do not skimp on internet cables in the walls. I never expected I would use all mine and need more!

Mark

[mepositive]

Aug 10, 2015 15:21:10 GMT -5 petew said:

You cannot have too much cat-6 cabling. It's cheap and easy to run. Just rough it in and have leave buried in the walls until you need it.

I was not familiar with Cat 6 cables and have just read about them, post your post. Can you suggest how many cables are likely to be needed for the media room? Also another member suggested a Cat 5 cable to the seating area - what would that be for?

Thanks.

[vneal]

Aug 10, 2015 18:41:29 GMT -5 klinemj said:

If I had my house design to do over again, I would have done three things very different that would have impacted my HT.

First, I would have paid for a full basement instead of a partial one. That would have given me many more options when I finished the basement for layout of the HT vs. the rest of the space. That would have given me better acoustic options.

Second, I would have had a full plan for mechanical items laid out...specifically, where do the water lines, HVAC ducting, and drainage lines go? I paid for an extra tall basement pour, but the placement of these three things ended up cutting into the finished ceiling height that I had wanted.

Third, I would have gone overkill on circuit panel total amperage and size. I didn't expect to finish the basement, add a barn with a subpanel off my main, and add a pool.

As for future proofing, I did my best, and I still could not possibly have planned for my internet needs and the potential of ever wanting greater than 7.1. If you have an easy option to do so, I would run some large (as in 4") PVC from front to back through the ceiling along the sides and center with openings at various logical points. And, I would pre-run string through it so if some day I needed to run more lines, all I would have do is cut a small hole in my ceiling at any of the pre-planned points, hook a line to the string, and pull a new line to the appropriate next point. And, I would also have PVC at these points going down to logical heights on the front/side walls for the same reason. I did this in parts of my house as it was built and it has paid dividiends!

And, as others have said...do not skimp on internet cables in the walls. I never expected I would use all mine and need more!

Mark

I like the plan for the future idea. The PVC pipe thing is very important especially on a first level room on a multiple story house

[Deleted]

Aug 10, 2015 18:09:02 GMT -5 jlamo said:

Aug 9, 2015 18:19:43 GMT -5 mepositive said:

For the first time in my life, I have an opportunity to build a media room and am super excited.

I have always been a 2.1 music person but am keen now to explore HT as well. The dimensions of the room will be 20ftX19ft with fairly high ceiling. Being a new construction, I have the ability to specify to the builder the things I'd like in it including wiring, flooring, internet access, color of walls and ceilings etc.

I will be using the room largely for 2.1 stereo listening and 5.2 HT. However, I would like your thoughts on what all I should do now so that I am future proofing the room for both stereo and critical movie sessions (possibly 7.2 or even 9.2).

Appreciate all your help - Thanks.

I finished my media room a few moths back and would advise many of the same things the other members said. run cat 5 from modem/router to media room and get one to your seating area also. Use good dimmers for lighting (they sell some controlled via apple/android device also) if equipment will be in the media room than consider the heat it will produce , a good ac guy can figure for that. Im not sure about using two layers of drywall but I can say that the type of drywall can make a difference , they sell drywall at lowes that says it x% lighter and it is but it has worse sound dampening than the heavier material that they sell in the same thickness .all interior walls can be batted with soft n sound sound dampening products instead of thermal insulation and you will get much better results than 5 sheets of drywall. im not sure how to "future proof it " but if you spend some time thinking about the equipment/devices you really use ,than this will make the process much easier.

Not true about the safe and sound. It's hype. It has been tested to have no further sound isolation properties than regular R15 in wall pink fluffy. Don't waste your money on it

[petew]

Cat-5 cable will work with 100 Mbps Ethernet, cat-6 1000 Mbps. Cat-6 costs a bit more but gives you some future-proofing and is backward compatible with 10-base-T through 1000-base-T.

Ethernet cabling is so ubiquitous that there are a wide variety of non-Ethernet uses for the cable. I'd run all the cables back to your equipment location - four cables from the projector (control, network, HDMI over Cat-6), two from the screen (masking control), A few to the seating area (buttkickers or whatever), one or two to each subwoofer (triggering active subs). possibly to surround speakers (triggering between monopole and dipole operation with some speakers).

[pletwals]

Trouble with carpet is that it only absorbs the higher frequencies due to lack of thickness. Of course a room will sound dead if you add a lot of broadband absorption to the walls in a carpetted room.

But it helps dealing with early reflections to some degree. So if you decide on wood, you should put very thick rugs halfway between LCR and MLP. If you use carpet, select a thick undercarpet.

Our species origins from the planes in Africa. Hence we are used to grond reflections under an open sky. Translated to a HT this means broadband absorption on the ceiling and partly reflective floors...