Rega RP3 vs. Technics SL1200 MKII

[AudioBear]

My current turntable is a Technics SL1200 MKII.  It works fine, but does need a bit of work.  Before I put money into it, I have been exploring options.  I've been checking around some popular review sites and other forums, and I find that opinions are either unreasonably biased and/or threads just devolve into chaos.  Being that this is a good group of people, can anyone offer some insight on a turntable that would be better than the SL1200 around or under $1000.  I have been looking particularly at the Rega RP3.  Any insight is greatly appreciated, as I want to be fully, and properly informed before I start spending money.  As a side note, the repairs/upgrades on the Technics would run about $200 plus $100 in parts and two way shipping, so probably $400 +/- total.  The deck itself is worth about $400 the way it sits, judging by the current used market.  Thoughts?  Opinions?  Suggestions?

EDIT: I also want to note that I am well aware of Pro-Ject, and I am not interested in them very much.  It seems that the vast opinion I see about them is that they have speed issues, and while visually similar to Rega, they still do not appeal to me aesthetically. 

[Boomzilla]

Only mediocre part of your Technics is the tone arm. Thought of replacing that?

[yves]

Choosing a matching cartridge is also very important of course, but yeah... changing the tonearm sure does make a truly spectacular difference on the SL-1200. (Rega isn't that good IMO because of speed issues that the Technics simply does not suffer from, and that can prove to be too costly to fix).

www.tonepublications.com/analogaholic/sl-1200-upgrades-sound-hifi/

[Boomzilla]

As I recall, 85% of the sound of an analog front end is the cartridge. 10% is the step-up device (transformer or pre-preamp if used). 4% is the tone arm, and 1% is everything else. I've had fine sound from both belt and direct drive tables both with and without suspension. I'm no longer a vinylista, but if I wanted to get back into that game, I'd go with the Pioneer turntable (direct drive) and mount a better arm on it.

Since you already have the Technics, I might consider a new arm (or cartridge) and be happy.

Boomzilla

[briank]

Oct 19, 2015 17:09:46 GMT -5 yves said:

Choosing a matching cartridge is also very important of course, but yeah... changing the tonearm sure does make a truly spectacular difference on the SL-1200. (Rega isn't that good IMO because of speed issues that the Technics simply does not suffer from, and that can prove to be too costly to fix).

www.tonepublications.com/analogaholic/sl-1200-upgrades-sound-hifi/

My Rega sounds dang good thank you very much and I for sure wouldn't trade it for the Technics.

[sidvicious]

The Technics SL1200 MKII, is a great turntable and I have one that doesn't get proper use because of my VPI, but I just can't bring myself to part with it. I had a Rega P3-24, the previous model before the RP3. Rega turntables are very good in the mids and high frequencies, but they are very bass shy compared to a Technics. The Technics has better pitch stability because it is direct drive, which means the motor doesn't slow down so that you hear a wavering in sound (ie slow sounding warbling). Boom is right when he says maybe the weakest link on the Technics was the arm.

The Rega with Groove tracer Upgrades makes a good table a great table and adds that bass definition. With the Rega you will have to add a speed control device or it's pitch will be off, usually Regas spin a little fast, which is their signature. In the price range that you are talking about there is a VPI Traveler at $1100 in blue at Music direct, right now on Demo and a Music Hall Ikura for 899 in white, "UPDATE" as of 10-19-15, a Rega RP3 for $989.00 and a Project 2Xperience for $999.00 and a Music Hall MMf 7.1 for $999.00. The Project 2Xperience is also a great table and the finish is very good looking.

My opinion the Traveler will be your best bet and a very good upgrade followed by the Project 2Xperience, Music Hall MMF 7.1 and then the RP3, they do have a Marantz tt15, which is basically a Clear Audio table made for Marantz, but it is $1399. (Please YouTube Traveler) Any previous arm issues have been ironed out a long time ago. I looked at this table before my Music Hall MMF 9.1, which was later replaced with a VPI HW-19 MK IV and its the best table that I have ever owned, period and the heaviest at 50 pounds. Some of these are photo shoot models, I have bought from them and they will take care of you. These prices are insane on great tables, you asked for a deal, snap up something before they are gone, Good Luck in Your Quest!!!

[novisnick]

Oct 19, 2015 20:20:53 GMT -5 sidvicious said:

The Technics SL1200 MKII, is a great turntable and I have one that doesn't get proper use because of my VPI, but I just can't bring myself to part with it. I had a Rega P3-24, the previous model before the RP3. Rega turntables are very good in the mids and high frequencies, but they are very bass shy compared to a Technics. The Technics has better pitch stability because it is direct drive, which means the motor doesn't slow down so that you hear a wavering in sound (ie slow sounding warbling). Boom is right when he says maybe the weakest link on the Technics was the arm.

The Rega with Groove tracer Upgrades makes a good table a great table and adds that bass definition. With the Rega you will have to add a speed control device or it's pitch will be off, usually Regas spin a little fast, which is their signature. In the price range that you are talking about there is a VPI Traveler at $1100 in blue at Music direct, right now on Demo and a Music Hall Ikura for 899 in white. My opinion the Traveler will be your best bet and a very good upgrade. (Please YouTube Traveler) Any previous arm issues have been ironed out a long time ago. I looked at this table before my Music Hall MMF 9.1, which was later replaced with a VPI HW-19 MK IV and its the best table that I have ever owned, period and the heaviest at 50 pounds. Good Luck in Your Quest!!!

I can't comment on any Rega but the RP-6. This said, my TT is very good with bass, never shy at all, but i am running the Exact cartridge that was specifically designed for it.

[AudioBear]

Oct 19, 2015 16:45:07 GMT -5 Boomzilla said:

Only mediocre part of your Technics is the tone arm. Thought of replacing that?

Yes, I have considered that option, but I wonder if it is really still a Technics deck after something like that.  I know that some have recommended a Rega tone arm on the SL1200, but it got me wondering if simply getting a Rega wouldn't have been a better option since in most cases parts are designed to perform their best when used together.  I've seen some heavily modded SL1200's, but I want to not fall into a place where I end up spending 1000+ on mods when I could have just bought a more expensive turntable without the fuss.  I will definitely look into the option further and see if it is something that might work for me.   

[AudioBear]

Oct 19, 2015 17:09:46 GMT -5 yves said:

Choosing a matching cartridge is also very important of course, but yeah... changing the tonearm sure does make a truly spectacular difference on the SL-1200. (Rega isn't that good IMO because of speed issues that the Technics simply does not suffer from, and that can prove to be too costly to fix).

www.tonepublications.com/analogaholic/sl-1200-upgrades-sound-hifi/

So the Rega has speed issues as well?  This is the first time I've heard about that and would like to hear more.  Is this common to belt drive decks?  I've only owned one belt drive, but I didn't have issues with it. 

[AudioBear]

Oct 19, 2015 19:00:12 GMT -5 Boomzilla said:

As I recall, 85% of the sound of an analog front end is the cartridge. 10% is the step-up device (transformer or pre-preamp if used). 4% is the tone arm, and 1% is everything else. I've had fine sound from both belt and direct drive tables both with and without suspension. I'm no longer a vinylista, but if I wanted to get back into that game, I'd go with the Pioneer turntable (direct drive) and mount a better arm on it.

Since you already have the Technics, I might consider a new arm (or cartridge) and be happy.

Boomzilla

You are talking about the PLX-1000?  I have been looking at those as well as I much prefer the look over my current.  I am aware that specs are better on the Technics vs. the Pioneer, but the Pioneer also steps up in a few areas as well.  I wouldn't be against a more horizontal move like that since it gives me a lot of what I was looking for. 

[AudioBear]

Oct 19, 2015 20:20:53 GMT -5 sidvicious said:

The Technics SL1200 MKII, is a great turntable and I have one that doesn't get proper use because of my VPI, but I just can't bring myself to part with it. I had a Rega P3-24, the previous model before the RP3. Rega turntables are very good in the mids and high frequencies, but they are very bass shy compared to a Technics. The Technics has better pitch stability because it is direct drive, which means the motor doesn't slow down so that you hear a wavering in sound (ie slow sounding warbling). Boom is right when he says maybe the weakest link on the Technics was the arm.

The Rega with Groove tracer Upgrades makes a good table a great table and adds that bass definition. With the Rega you will have to add a speed control device or it's pitch will be off, usually Regas spin a little fast, which is their signature. In the price range that you are talking about there is a VPI Traveler at $1100 in blue at Music direct, right now on Demo and a Music Hall Ikura for 899 in white, "UPDATE" as of 10-19-15, a Rega RP3 for $989.00 and a Project 2Xperience for $999.00 and a Music Hall MMf 7.1 for $999.00. The Project 2Xperience is also a great table and the finish is very good looking.

My opinion the Traveler will be your best bet and a very good upgrade followed by the Project 2Xperience, Music Hall MMF 7.1 and then the RP3, they do have a Marantz tt15, which is basically a Clear Audio table made for Marantz, but it is $1399. (Please YouTube Traveler) Any previous arm issues have been ironed out a long time ago. I looked at this table before my Music Hall MMF 9.1, which was later replaced with a VPI HW-19 MK IV and its the best table that I have ever owned, period and the heaviest at 50 pounds. Some of these are photo shoot models, I have bought from them and they will take care of you. These prices are insane on great tables, you asked for a deal, snap up something before they are gone, Good Luck in Your Quest!!!

So the Traveler would be a step up?

[vneal]

Between the two

I would pick the more modern Rega 3

I owned a 1200 in the day if it matters

[briank]

The Rega can also be upgraded with Groovetracer products. I currently use an RP6 with a Groovetracer subplatter and love it.

[AudioBear]

Oct 20, 2015 7:52:43 GMT -5 vneal said:

Between the two

I would pick the more modern Rega 3

I owned a 1200 in the day if it matters

What would make you choose the Rega?

[lionear]

I'd stick with the Technics, and get a really good arm and cartridge.

A friend of mine has an SME-IV arm on his Technics and it sounds very good. The arm is pretty deep, so he had to drill a hole through the bottom of the turntable body, in order for the arm to have clearance.

I had an SME-IIIs tonearm many years ago - it's designed for MM cartridges only, but it is a fantastic arm.

[lhracing]

I have a SL1200 with a Ortofon 2M Blue cartridge that was recommended by NeedleDoctor for the TT and it seems to perform very well. I see a lot of comments about the Technics Tone Arm being the weak link. What is it about their Tone Arm that is a problem?

[yves]

Oct 19, 2015 20:20:53 GMT -5 sidvicious said:

With the Rega you will have to add a speed control device or it's pitch will be off, usually Regas spin a little fast, which is their signature.

Exactly.

[vneal]

Oct 20, 2015 9:25:14 GMT -5 lionear said:

I'd stick with the Technics, and get a really good arm and cartridge.

A friend of mine has an SME-IV arm on his Technics and it sounds very good. The arm is pretty deep, so he had to drill a hole through the bottom of the turntable body, in order for the arm to have clearance.

I had an SME-IIIs tonearm many years ago - it's designed for MM cartridges only, but it is a fantastic arm.

I like belt drive design over direct drive models. Can I hear the difference --no, Just like te simplier design. I sure as heck would not add a different arm to a table the level of the Rega or Technics. This level of table given either spend your upgrade dollars on a better MC cartridge JMHO

[yves]

Oct 20, 2015 7:41:32 GMT -5 AudioBear said:

Oct 19, 2015 17:09:46 GMT -5 yves said:

Choosing a matching cartridge is also very important of course, but yeah... changing the tonearm sure does make a truly spectacular difference on the SL-1200. (Rega isn't that good IMO because of speed issues that the Technics simply does not suffer from, and that can prove to be too costly to fix).

www.tonepublications.com/analogaholic/sl-1200-upgrades-sound-hifi/

So the Rega has speed issues as well?  This is the first time I've heard about that and would like to hear more.  Is this common to belt drive decks?  I've only owned one belt drive, but I didn't have issues with it. 

A few years ago a fellow vinyl enthusiast of mine got a used VPI Scout (that came with a used cartridge) for nearly double the cost of a new Trans-Fi Audio Terminator T3Pro tonearm *combined* with a used SL-1200. Personally, I, didn't think it (his VPI) was, even though he had equipped it with the T3Pro, truly worth the added expense soundwise until he finally decided to get a speed controller and then changed his cartridge to an AT33PTG/II. This is an amazing cartridge IMO, but not a particularly good match with an SL-1200 because it would end up being far too bass heavy so the MLX would be a much better option for the SL-1200 than the PTG would. That is, IMO anyway. This VPI setup has been a (relatively) costly affair, but it paints circles around both the Technics and that Rega that you had in mind. Lots and lots of circles, in fact. But if you can manage to put the SME 309 (or better... the T3Pro) on that SL-1200 and get a matching cartridge, then, despite the SL-1200 having its limitations that obviously can't be ignored, I promise you will be in for a really big and pleasant surprise.

[kml]

youtu.be/mNzMcH2ZbtU

cheers
ken