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Post by simpleman68 on Jul 28, 2016 7:56:04 GMT -5
Very good description of what this rig sounds like. I keep telling myself, "you're just stoked about a new amp and some positive characteristics" but there is so much more depth and "separation" of instruments it's astounding. Biggest change, other than the better level matching with the Legacy sub amps, is this slightly fuzzy sound. By contrast, the JC1s are extremely clean and precise but they don't bring the softness, warmth and depth of the tubes. Wish I could split the difference a bit and have the depth, a bit of that soft "fuzz" to the highs but more clarity. I did get the new tubes today and will install and adjust bias tomorrow. Then to let them break in a bit to see if I can hear a difference. I'm worried my ears aren't that good.  Scott Simpleman68 My dedicated 2channel is listed below. The GRACE m920 monitoring system, dac and headphone amp does it all. I paired the SP14 tube pre and at first I was really impressed with the clarity that it bought to the table. However after some hours of listening I grew tired of the sound I was hearing from the SP14. I was going back and forth between the GRACE and the SP14 and for me and my taste the GRACE gave more of a flavor of authentic sound than having the tube pre in the loop. Don't get me wrong the SP14 is a superb piece of equipment and perhaps would blend in better with a SS amplifier but with tubes I can only classified what I was hearing, to use an adjective "bright". It was overwhelming with the 803's. IMO the 803's are quite natural sounding on there own. Of course everyone hears things differently and speakers of all kinds sound different to all people...so as I have said many times this is why there is chocolate and vanilla ice cream...there is something for everyone in this hobby. I just wanted to relate my impressions to you in case you have the temptation to experiment. I would like to test drive a "TUBE BUFFER" in my system...I have to first research exactly what a tube buffer does and how it affects the overall sound in a 2channel system. I am a believer to keep things simple. The less ingredients in the mix the smoother the transition of sound and if you system sounds good why fix something that is not broke. Again, Congratulations on your new acquisition! As time goes on the sound gets better..just one last thing..you may have heard about tube rolling..first IMO from what I have read tube rolling is NOT a good thing for the amplifier. Good/decent output tubes and a good driver tube will have you set. some good advice...purchase yourself a good volt meter(Fluke) and also a ceramic screwdriver for biasing. The ceramic screwdriver tales away the chance of metal to metal contact when setting the bias which would be harmful to your amplifier. Sorry to go on. Thanks for the input. I agree and can understand what you mean as far as tubes displaying a bit of a bell curve with the mids being more forward. I think that is why this amp works well with the Whispers. They have 2 X 500W ICE amps per speaker and 4-15" woofs. I've tried out 4 or 5 different SS amps and the bass was too prevalent with each. I was expecting to do a lot of editing in the DSP to correct for it but this little 35X2 tube amp is almost perfectly level matched with the ICE amps. With more listening what I'm still most pleased/impressed with is the depth and stage of every kind of music I throw at it. It brings digital recordings to life and engages me a LOT more. Not just because it is a change of amp and some sonic qualities. It is a completely different experience. Been using my Rat Shack meter but could use a better screw driver. I've had to adjust bias 5-6 times since installing the new tubes. Scott  |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Jul 28, 2016 8:26:35 GMT -5
The "legitimate purpose" of a buffer is to allow something with a high output impedance to be connected to something with a lower input impedance (other equipment, or a very long cable run). (And a "perfect buffer" would do nothing whatsoever to the sound... it's job is simply to allow two mismatched devices to work with each other, and possibly to eliminate some sound variations caused by a previous mismatch.) But, the way most people use them, what a "tube buffer" does is to add some characteristic tube sound (distortion) to the audio signal without otherwise altering it - exactly like a tube preamp with its gain permanently set to "x1.0". You will find, though, that they vary HUGELY in terms of how much they change the sound, or whether they make an audible change at all..... Different brands, and even different models from the same manufacturer, tend to sound very different... and some even sound different when you roll different tubes into them (some do; some don't). (However, because a tube buffer is there strictly to alter the sound, and has no "legitimate purpose" in most systems, it is in fact the exact opposite of "keeping things as simple as possible".) Very good description of what this rig sounds like. I keep telling myself, "you're just stoked about a new amp and some positive characteristics" but there is so much more depth and "separation" of instruments it's astounding. Biggest change, other than the better level matching with the Legacy sub amps, is this slightly fuzzy sound. By contrast, the JC1s are extremely clean and precise but they don't bring the softness, warmth and depth of the tubes. Wish I could split the difference a bit and have the depth, a bit of that soft "fuzz" to the highs but more clarity. I did get the new tubes today and will install and adjust bias tomorrow. Then to let them break in a bit to see if I can hear a difference. I'm worried my ears aren't that good. Scott Simpleman68 My dedicated 2channel is listed below. The GRACE m920 monitoring system, dac and headphone amp does it all. I paired the SP14 tube pre and at first I was really impressed with the clarity that it bought to the table. However after some hours of listening I grew tired of the sound I was hearing from the SP14. I was going back and forth between the GRACE and the SP14 and for me and my taste the GRACE gave more of a flavor of authentic sound than having the tube pre in the loop. Don't get me wrong the SP14 is a superb piece of equipment and perhaps would blend in better with a SS amplifier but with tubes I can only classified what I was hearing, to use an adjective "bright". It was overwhelming with the 803's. IMO the 803's are quite natural sounding on there own. Of course everyone hears things differently and speakers of all kinds sound different to all people...so as I have said many times this is why there is chocolate and vanilla ice cream...there is something for everyone in this hobby. I just wanted to relate my impressions to you in case you have the temptation to experiment. I would like to test drive a "TUBE BUFFER" in my system...I have to first research exactly what a tube buffer does and how it affects the overall sound in a 2channel system. I am a believer to keep things simple. The less ingredients in the mix the smoother the transition of sound and if you system sounds good why fix something that is not broke. Again, Congratulations on your new acquisition! As time goes on the sound gets better..just one last thing..you may have heard about tube rolling..first IMO from what I have read tube rolling is NOT a good thing for the amplifier. Good/decent output tubes and a good driver tube will have you set. some good advice...purchase yourself a good volt meter(Fluke) and also a ceramic screwdriver for biasing. The ceramic screwdriver tales away the chance of metal to metal contact when setting the bias which would be harmful to your amplifier. Sorry to go on. |
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Post by pedrocols on Jul 28, 2016 13:05:32 GMT -5
I have probably mentioned this over a hundred times before but let me say it again. Get a passive preamp!  They are in fact very easy to build just make sure that your rig meets the requirements for it.... |
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Post by audiobill on Jul 28, 2016 17:47:19 GMT -5
All my experience strongly points points to a tube amp/speaker interface (transformer to transformer), with tube or ss pre less important.
A tube "buffer" is essentially a stripped down fixed gain preamp without multiple inputs or controls. Nothing more or less IMO.
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 21:05:17 GMT -5
This is a test! Only a test,,,,,,of the emergency drool system, once again,,,,,this is only a test!!    |
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Post by pedrocols on Jul 28, 2016 21:13:37 GMT -5
This is a test! Only a test,,,,,,of the emergency drool system, once again,,,,,this is only a test!! View Attachment View AttachmentDon't forget to rebias the amp after half hour of power them on.... |
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 21:42:41 GMT -5
This is a test! Only a test,,,,,,of the emergency drool system, once again,,,,,this is only a test!! Don't forget to rebias the amp after half hour of power them on.... Is it time yet? |
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Post by pedrocols on Jul 28, 2016 22:06:11 GMT -5
Don't forget to rebias the amp after half hour of power them on.... Is it time yet? Exactly :30:01 |
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Post by brutiarti on Jul 28, 2016 22:08:30 GMT -5
This is a test! Only a test,,,,,,of the emergency drool system, once again,,,,,this is only a test!! View Attachment View AttachmentThose tubes look awesome! |
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Post by simpleman68 on Jul 28, 2016 22:13:37 GMT -5
This is a test! Only a test,,,,,,of the emergency drool system, once again,,,,,this is only a test!! Those tubes look awesome! Yeah they do! So small I didn't see what it was at first. Scott Bam!  |
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 22:16:00 GMT -5
My iPad resizes everything down! Or I just dont know how to post a larger picture!!! A little help please? It anybody can?
Thanks
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Post by pedrocols on Jul 28, 2016 22:33:33 GMT -5
My iPad resizes everything down! Or I just dont know how to post a larger picture!!! A little help please? It anybody can? Thanks Please allow me to respectfully recommend you ditch the iPad for taking pictures...It simply sucks... |
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 23:10:39 GMT -5
My iPad resizes everything down! Or I just dont know how to post a larger picture!!! A little help please? It anybody can? Thanks Please allow me to respectfully recommend you ditch the iPad for taking pictures...It simply sucks... Yes, but it has nothing to do with resizing now does it. Even using my Nikon 3200 it resizes pictures! Any help as to making them larger like I asked? |
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 23:13:37 GMT -5
 I guess I just have to send it to Photobucket first. |
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 23:15:42 GMT -5
Same crappy iPad!  |
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Post by pedrocols on Jul 28, 2016 23:19:39 GMT -5
Please allow me to respectfully recommend you ditch the iPad for taking pictures...It simply sucks... Yes, but it has nothing to do with resizing now does it. Even using my Nikon 3200 it resizes pictures! Any help as to making them larger like I asked? The first pic you posted can be enlarge when you click on it...Nevertheless, I mostly use photobucket as well to post pictures here. |
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Post by novisnick on Jul 28, 2016 23:25:00 GMT -5
Yes, but it has nothing to do with resizing now does it. Even using my Nikon 3200 it resizes pictures! Any help as to making them larger like I asked? The first pic you posted can be enlarge when you click on it...Nevertheless, I mostly use photobucket as well to post pictures here. Thanks, yep! Thats what it says under my Avitar. Thought that would help alot. I just don't care to have to upload every picture I want to post. But, If its something like this, I should. Its just so dang easy to post straight from my photo album. Ive gone from vinyl to Tidal now and the music??? Im undesided with digital, vinyl has a wider and deeper stage. Ill give many more hours before a real review. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jul 29, 2016 6:32:10 GMT -5
OK, so novisnick, when do I get to come hear "my" new tube amp? LOL |
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Post by garbulky on Jul 29, 2016 7:33:24 GMT -5
OK, so novisnick, when do I get to come hear "my" new tube amp? LOL Wait, y'all BOTH just got a new tube amp! |
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Post by bluemeanies on Jul 29, 2016 7:46:56 GMT -5
Same crappy iPad! Much better! |
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