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Post by goodfellas27 on Sept 26, 2016 13:25:05 GMT -5
I am getting the PS4 Pro with has 4K HDR, plus LG OLED... I am still waiting on Emotica to update their HDMI board; any idea when is coming out? Last time I checked, it was suppose to be out in August
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Post by AudioHTIT on Sept 26, 2016 13:55:41 GMT -5
I am getting the PS4 Pro with has 4K HDR, plus LG OLED... I am still waiting on Emotica to update their HDMI board; any idea when is coming out? Last time I checked, it was suppose to be out in August I don't think anyone here knows about the date. The single port board coming out soon is HDMI 2.0 as stated by Keith: "The single-input HDMI 2.0 board supports 9 gbs (as per the requirements of the HDMI 2.0 spec).
Note: this fully supports the 4:2:0 chroma subsampling used on the new 4k Blu-Ray discs."About the multi port board he says:. "The higher 18 gbs rate is a new requirement of HDMI 2.0a, and is planned for the multi-port HDMI 2.0a board available later.
HDMI 2.0a is required to support HDR and 4k computer video with 4:4:4 subsampling.
Note that some 4k TVs support 4:4:4 subsampling, but many do not, so, if that's a requirement for you, then you need to check the specs on the particular model of TV you have or plan to get." |
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Post by goodfellas27 on Sept 26, 2016 14:04:02 GMT -5
HDMI 2.0 It's just annoying
I hope the Emo team get it together and working on this. They might start losing sell due to the fact that XMC-1 doesn't have a 2.0b board yet. Oppo 4k BluRay player is coming out soon. They should have something by then. Big Dan mentioned it should be out before 4K BluRay are available...I guess we are pass that point.
In Nov --PS4 Pro will be out. It's 4K HDR and XMC-1 will not pass its signal..annoying indeed! Xbox One S has HDR 4K BluRay! XMC-1 needs that board sooner rather than later.
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Post by geebo on Sept 26, 2016 17:35:07 GMT -5
HDMI 2.0 It's just annoying I hope the Emo team get it together and working on this. They might start losing sell due to the fact that XMC-1 doesn't have a 2.0b board yet. Oppo 4k BluRay player is coming out soon. They should have something by then. Big Dan mentioned it should be out before 4K BluRay are available...I guess we are pass that point. In Nov --PS4 Pro will be out. It's 4K HDR and XMC-1 will not pass its signal..annoying indeed! Xbox One S has HDR 4K BluRay! XMC-1 needs that board sooner rather than later. The HDMI 2.0 / HDCP 2.2 upgrade Emotiva installed into my XMC-1 to test has been working flawlessly with Amazon Fire TV 4K content on my 4K TV. |
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Post by goodfellas27 on Sept 27, 2016 10:00:46 GMT -5
HDMI 2.0 It's just annoying I hope the Emo team get it together and working on this. They might start losing sell due to the fact that XMC-1 doesn't have a 2.0b board yet. Oppo 4k BluRay player is coming out soon. They should have something by then. Big Dan mentioned it should be out before 4K BluRay are available...I guess we are pass that point. In Nov --PS4 Pro will be out. It's 4K HDR and XMC-1 will not pass its signal..annoying indeed! Xbox One S has HDR 4K BluRay! XMC-1 needs that board sooner rather than later. The HDMI 2.0 / HDCP 2.2 upgrade Emotiva installed into my XMC-1 to test has been working flawlessly with Amazon Fire TV 4K content on my 4K TV. awesome that you have one...can you get HDR? |
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Post by geebo on Sept 27, 2016 10:14:11 GMT -5
The HDMI 2.0 / HDCP 2.2 upgrade Emotiva installed into my XMC-1 to test has been working flawlessly with Amazon Fire TV 4K content on my 4K TV. awesome that you have one...can you get HDR? Fire TV doesn't provide any HDR content that I'm aware of but there is protected 4K content available. The upgraded XMC does pass 4k HDCP 2.2 protected content that it would not do before the board replacement. I believe HDR is more a function of the TV's capabilities. |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Sept 27, 2016 10:33:14 GMT -5
HDR is a function of the TV and the content and everything in between.
In order to see HDR content in "full HDR", the content itself must be HDR, the service must be providing it in HDR, your TV must be HDR, and everything in between must pass HDR.
(If everything in between doesn't support HDR, then you'll generally see it, and it will look just fine, but it may not technically be HDR.)
The current HDMI 2.0 / HDCP 2.2 upgrade does not pass the HDR10 signal (you need HDMI 2.0a for that).
However, there are actually other HDR standards (some of which require HDMI 2.0b - which nothing currently supports).
(And whether you'll get any actual benefits from HDR to begin with depends on your screen and your viewing conditions.)
In any case, the current upgrade board supports HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2 .
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Post by goodfellas27 on Sept 27, 2016 12:54:52 GMT -5
Any news on when Emotiva will update their HDMI to 2.0b?
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Sept 27, 2016 13:07:03 GMT -5
As of now, we're looking at year end (or very early Q1 of next year). Any news on when Emotiva will update their HDMI to 2.0b? |
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Post by Gary Cook on Sept 27, 2016 15:52:19 GMT -5
However, there are actually other HDR standards (some of which require HDMI 2.0b - which nothing currently supports). This is what really gets up my nose, there's a brand new standard that is gradually being supported by manufacturers (ie; the necessary components can actually be purchased) and bingo there's a new standard released that nobody supports. No wonder that there is buyer scepticism and hence reluctance to spend their money, the brand new stuff they just bought was technically out of date before they bought it. In fact it was out of date before the manufacturer could even make it. That's just ridiculous  Cheers Gary |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Sept 27, 2016 16:21:33 GMT -5
Agreed..... and there's apparently no end in sight. Word is that HDMI 2.1 will be announced in December.... but there are no details yet. (Incidentally, don't bother to Google it; word is that much of the "leaked" information about it from a few months ago is incorrect.) I think I know how those guys who do log rolling feel.  Look on the bright side..... you'll be able to get a really nice TV that "only supports last year's features" cheap. However, there are actually other HDR standards (some of which require HDMI 2.0b - which nothing currently supports). This is what really gets up my nose, there's a brand new standard that is gradually being supported by manufacturers (ie; the necessary components can actually be purchased) and bingo there's a new standard released that nobody supports. No wonder that there is buyer scepticism and hence reluctance to spend their money, the brand new stuff they just bought was technically out of date before they bought it. In fact it was out of date before the manufacturer could even make it. That's just ridiculous Cheers Gary |
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Post by Gary Cook on Sept 27, 2016 18:26:11 GMT -5
Agreed..... and there's apparently no end in sight. Word is that HDMI 2.1 will be announced in December.... but there are no details yet. (Incidentally, don't bother to Google it; word is that much of the "leaked" information about it from a few months ago is incorrect.) I think I know how those guys who do log rolling feel. Look on the bright side..... you'll be able to get a really nice TV that "only supports last year's features" cheap. This is what really gets up my nose, there's a brand new standard that is gradually being supported by manufacturers (ie; the necessary components can actually be purchased) and bingo there's a new standard released that nobody supports. No wonder that there is buyer scepticism and hence reluctance to spend their money, the brand new stuff they just bought was technically out of date before they bought it. In fact it was out of date before the manufacturer could even make it. That's just ridiculous Surely the manufacturers can see the effect that the constantly changing standards has on the buyers, it's hardly rocket surgery. Maybe something like an annual update cycle, apply for a change in standards and it's approved for release from 1st January the next year. All of the changes applied for in that year are included in the update. With a sensible cut of date that enables the component manufacturers to actually design, engineer and produce appropriately. So instead of HDMI 2.1b which means absolutely nothing unless you know the sequences, for example if you don't know about HDMI 2.1a then HDMI 2.1 could be the current standard. To expect the average consumer to know the update sequence when they go to buy something is a bit much. Especially since they don't promote it. It could be, say, "HDMI 2016", that way everyone knows instantly where that sits in relation to the current year ie; it's not going out of date tomorrow or more appropriately it isn't already out of date. What ever happened to the KISS principle, which says that most systems work best if they are kept simple rather than made complicated, with simplicity a key goal in design and any unnecessary complexity should be avoided. Seriously, talk about unnecessary complexity, HDMI 2.1, 2.1a, 2.1b, they have got to be kidding  Cheers Gary |
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Post by goodfellas27 on Sept 28, 2016 7:51:23 GMT -5
Agreed..... and there's apparently no end in sight. Word is that HDMI 2.1 will be announced in December.... but there are no details yet. (Incidentally, don't bother to Google it; word is that much of the "leaked" information about it from a few months ago is incorrect.) I think I know how those guys who do log rolling feel. Look on the bright side..... you'll be able to get a really nice TV that "only supports last year's features" cheap. Surely the manufacturers can see the effect that the constantly changing standards has on the buyers, it's hardly rocket surgery. Maybe something like an annual update cycle, apply for a change in standards and it's approved for release from 1st January the next year. All of the changes applied for in that year are included in the update. With a sensible cut of date that enables the component manufacturers to actually design, engineer and produce appropriately. So instead of HDMI 2.1b which means absolutely nothing unless you know the sequences, for example if you don't know about HDMI 2.1a then HDMI 2.1 could be the current standard. To expect the average consumer to know the update sequence when they go to buy something is a bit much. Especially since they don't promote it. It could be, say, "HDMI 2016", that way everyone knows instantly where that sits in relation to the current year ie; it's not going out of date tomorrow or more appropriately it isn't already out of date. What ever happened to the KISS principle, which says that most systems work best if they are kept simple rather than made complicated, with simplicity a key goal in design and any unnecessary complexity should be avoided. Seriously, talk about unnecessary complexity, HDMI 2.1, 2.1a, 2.1b, they have got to be kidding Cheers Gary i guess you mean HDMI 2.0a, HDMI 2.0b I am not sure, but I think HDMI 2.1 is not even out |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Sept 28, 2016 9:58:55 GMT -5
You need to understand that the standard is driven by a "standards body" - which is dominated by a few large manufacturers. You also need to understand that there's always going to be a strong desire to move forward...... People want new products and new features.... and manufacturers want to SELL new products with new features. And manufacturers spend a lot of money convincing people that they need the latest features.... (And, obviously, the huge manufacturers, who can get the new hardware ahead of the rest of us, are hoping that will give them an edge in sales over the rest of us....) Starting from a reasonably well informed place, I might suggest that 4k wasn't quite as well received as many manufacturers had hoped it would be. (Meaning that everyone didn't throw away all their old stuff and buy new 4k stuff as quickly as some manufacturers might have hoped.) Therefore, you might reasonably wonder if HDR was "pushed to market" more quickly than originally intended as a "compelling new feature to sell more sets". HDMI 2.0 and HDMI 2.0a are out. HDMI 2.0b is released (but I'm not sure about any HDMI 2.0b products).. HDMI 2.1 is supposedly going to be officially finalized in December or thereabouts. (And there is quite a bit of "leaked information" about HDMI 2.1 around, dating from May 2016, that is apparently wrong.) And, incidentally, support for HDCP 2.2 copy protection is required TO PLAY 4k UHD discs and broadcast content. However, HDCP 2.2 support is NOT required by the HDMI 2.0 spec. HDMI 2.0 is a video transmission format standard; 4k UHD is a content spec; they're not the same. (Don't worry if you find this confusing... everybody I know does.) Note that HDR isn't a single thing either..... There are several different "levels" or "versions" of HDR...... HDR10, HDR12, Dolby Vision, Dynamic HDR..... And, of course, how good any streaming content looks will still depend on how heavily they compress it, and how fast your connection is..... And how good your TV or projector looks is still going to depend on how good the actual electronics inside are.... And HDR isn't going to magically make a low quality panel look good, or give you great black detail in a room that isn't pitch black. And, in general, a well produced HDR movie will look very nice on a good non-HDR set (they do). And, in general, a badly produced movie will look bad - even in whiz-bang super-dooper HDR..... Cue circus music.......
Incidentally, now you see why we made the XMC-1 MODULAR.....
At least, when the dust clears... even for a minute... you can upgrade it to remain current. Surely the manufacturers can see the effect that the constantly changing standards has on the buyers, it's hardly rocket surgery. Maybe something like an annual update cycle, apply for a change in standards and it's approved for release from 1st January the next year. All of the changes applied for in that year are included in the update. With a sensible cut of date that enables the component manufacturers to actually design, engineer and produce appropriately. So instead of HDMI 2.1b which means absolutely nothing unless you know the sequences, for example if you don't know about HDMI 2.1a then HDMI 2.1 could be the current standard. To expect the average consumer to know the update sequence when they go to buy something is a bit much. Especially since they don't promote it. It could be, say, "HDMI 2016", that way everyone knows instantly where that sits in relation to the current year ie; it's not going out of date tomorrow or more appropriately it isn't already out of date. What ever happened to the KISS principle, which says that most systems work best if they are kept simple rather than made complicated, with simplicity a key goal in design and any unnecessary complexity should be avoided. Seriously, talk about unnecessary complexity, HDMI 2.1, 2.1a, 2.1b, they have got to be kidding Cheers Gary i guess you mean HDMI 2.0a, HDMI 2.0b I am not sure, but I think HDMI 2.1 is not even out |
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on Sept 28, 2016 10:26:53 GMT -5
However, there are actually other HDR standards (some of which require HDMI 2.0b - which nothing currently supports). This is what really gets up my nose, there's a brand new standard that is gradually being supported by manufacturers (ie; the necessary components can actually be purchased) and bingo there's a new standard released that nobody supports. No wonder that there is buyer scepticism and hence reluctance to spend their money, the brand new stuff they just bought was technically out of date before they bought it. In fact it was out of date before the manufacturer could even make it. That's just ridiculous Cheers Gary Just wait till they release the spec for 2.1a. I'm not kidding here. 2.0a parts as in the chip sets are just being released by the manufacturers and they just released the spec for 2.0b and I was told yesterday that the spec for 2.1a will be announced soon. 2.0b parts are just starting to roll out and they are going to release a new spec before the parts for the previous spec are fully in the market. Oh, and from what I was told, 2.1a won't be backwards compatible and no one has even started work on the chip designs yet because they are trying to get the 2.0b parts out the door. I will refrain from stating my true feelings about HDMI for now.  |
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Post by goodfellas27 on Sept 28, 2016 10:41:32 GMT -5
I guess i'll wait before sending the xmc-1 back for the board updates. I saw the hdmi board sale. the xmc-1 got a pricecut to 1999?
XMC-1 $1,999 XMC-1
HDMI 1.4B Closeout $1,699
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Post by tchaik on Sept 28, 2016 11:39:17 GMT -5
This is what really gets up my nose, there's a brand new standard that is gradually being supported by manufacturers (ie; the necessary components can actually be purchased) and bingo there's a new standard released that nobody supports. No wonder that there is buyer scepticism and hence reluctance to spend their money, the brand new stuff they just bought was technically out of date before they bought it. In fact it was out of date before the manufacturer could even make it. That's just ridiculous Cheers Gary Just wait till they release the spec for 2.1a. I'm not kidding here. 2.0a parts as in the chip sets are just being released by the manufacturers and they just released the spec for 2.0b and I was told yesterday that the spec for 2.1a will be announced soon. 2.0b parts are just starting to roll out and they are going to release a new spec before the parts for the previous spec are fully in the market. Oh, and from what I was told, 2.1a won't be backwards compatible and no one has even started work on the chip designs yet because they are trying to get the 2.0b parts out the door. I will refrain from stating my true feelings about HDMI for now. you just did.  |
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Post by cwt on Sept 28, 2016 12:50:59 GMT -5
2.0b parts are just starting to roll out and they are going to release a new spec before the parts for the previous spec are fully in the market. Oh, and from what I was told, 2.1a won't be backwards compatible and no one has even started work on the chip designs yet because they are trying to get the 2.0b parts out the door. I will refrain from stating my true feelings about HDMI for now. Its disconcerting that Ive read somewhere that hdmi2.0b is whats required for dynamic HDR10 metadata Lonnie ; hopefully we wont need hdmi 2.1 for this - as Keith intimated about false info [ and if dolby vision gets traction ? this becomes moot ] Its farcical that HDR is really targetted towards panels and not projectors [ which dont generally have the nits or dynamic range to do HDR justice ] and Ive got a JVC which is well thought of for dynamic range/ black levels . In fact when the oppo uhd player is released the hdmi2.0 card will be adequate for this purpose as many want to send SDR BT2020 sans HDR ; which retains the full WCG and doesnt drop back to rec709 :)Oppo have said ; to paraphrase "So we hope to have the ability to output HDR as SDR in a wide arrange of options, which includes BT2020'' One things for sure the oppo's more likely to get things like a dynamic hdr firmware upgrade than other makes ; not getting another oppo for quite awhile  |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Sept 28, 2016 13:36:27 GMT -5
There's one little detail that everyone seems to be ignoring.... HDR will allow a video signal that has a wider dynamic range and wider color gamut than the current "SDR" standard. However, the vast majority of current sets can't even do 100% of the old standard. In other words, unless your set was "so good that it was being limited by the old standard", then it isn't going to do any better with HDR. In still other words, any set that wasn't rated "as close to perfect as you can get" with non-HDR content probably won't be much more impressive WITH HDR content. And, of course, the actual content has to be good enough to make you care.... So far I've read one review comparing identical content in regular and HDR versions. Their conclusions were (to paraphrase)..... In a really perfectly dark room a few scenes looked a little bit better in HDR. However, in a "typical dark room", some scenes actually looked worse. And the colors in a few scenes looked a bit smoother and brighter. In the end, they basically rated the two pictures as about equal overall.... the absolutely were NOT bowled over by the difference. Of course, as more content is created that is specifically designed to take advantage of HDR, we can hope for the gap to widen (or at least become visible). And you can also figure that, for anything that supports HDR, the picture will be less impressive if you turn it off....... And everything sold after the beginning of the year probably will be HDR anyway.... But it remains to be seen if the middle-of-the-line new HDR sets really look a lot better than the top-of-the-line current non-HDR ones..... In the final analysis, I've had a nice (non-HDR) 4k TV for several months now..... And I still can't find much in 4k to play on it..... And even less that I care about..... (I'm up to about two dozen discs I plan to buy, which will just about justify buying the Oppo player when it comes out  ) |
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Post by Gary Cook on Sept 28, 2016 15:45:43 GMT -5
That's really where the rubber meets the road, content, the hardware is all very well but we need to have enough content to justify buying it. After all there is some delay between shooting a movie and when we can actually buy a copy. A few friends of mine are working on Thor Ragnarok at the moment and it won't be in theatres until November ........ next year. So which standard was it shot in? Which standards will it be edited and mixed to? Which standards will it be released in? Then there is the cost factor, here a current release in DVD costs $19.95, BD $29.95, BD 3D $35.95 and 4K BD $39.95. Do they add another $5 for HDR? And the bandwidth/file size for streaming? It's a bit of a minefield for enthusiasts, let alone the average consumer.
Cheers
Gary
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