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Post by srpawski on Nov 14, 2016 10:03:58 GMT -5
I hooked up my new dual subwoofers last night and am having issues with the 12 volt triggers working. I tested out my cable system prior to running everything and it worked perfect.
I have one sub out cable coming from my receiver using a splitter and then each going to each sub. Same scenario with the 12 volt trigger cable from the out on my Emo.
If I unhook the trigger from the receiver and each trigger input into the subs, they work fine based on the LFE trigger from the receiver. it's as if the trigger is causing some sort of short preventing the subs from turning on at all even if the sub cables are hooked up.
Any ideas?
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Post by geebo on Nov 14, 2016 10:39:39 GMT -5
I hooked up my new dual subwoofers last night and am having issues with the 12 volt triggers working. I tested out my cable system prior to running everything and it worked perfect. I have one sub out cable coming from my receiver using a splitter and then each going to each sub. Same scenario with the 12 volt trigger cable from the out on my Emo. If I unhook the trigger from the receiver and each trigger input into the subs, they work fine based on the LFE trigger from the receiver. it's as if the trigger is causing some sort of short preventing the subs from turning on at all even if the sub cables are hooked up. Any ideas? I would first try a single cable from the receiver to a single sub and see if that works. |
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KeithL
Administrator 
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Post by KeithL on Nov 14, 2016 12:05:16 GMT -5
I'm a bit confused here...... You have the trigger output going from your receiver, through a splitter, and to both subs. And you ALSO have a trigger output going from your Emotiva AMP to the subs? Is that right? If so, then, unless your subs have dual trigger INPUTS, you must be combining the trigger inputs through a "reverse splitter" - which is NOT something you should be doing. If not, then please explain in more detail exactly what you have hooked up to what  I hooked up my new dual subwoofers last night and am having issues with the 12 volt triggers working. I tested out my cable system prior to running everything and it worked perfect. I have one sub out cable coming from my receiver using a splitter and then each going to each sub. Same scenario with the 12 volt trigger cable from the out on my Emo. If I unhook the trigger from the receiver and each trigger input into the subs, they work fine based on the LFE trigger from the receiver. it's as if the trigger is causing some sort of short preventing the subs from turning on at all even if the sub cables are hooked up. Any ideas? |
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Post by srpawski on Nov 14, 2016 16:42:28 GMT -5
From the trigger output on one of my amps, I have it going to a splitter which is then splitting one trigger to each sub. So the single trigger output from the amp is set up to trigger two subs instead of one. The output from the receiver is going to the input on the amp that the output is going to the splitter from. There is only one output going to the subs from the Emo Amp. Nothing from the receiver is going to the subs. I am using splitters and not combiners. Prior to fishing the cable through the ceiling I hooked it up exactly as I have it hooked up now and it worked perfectly. Now that I have the cables ran I am having issues.
If I hook up the subs only with the sub cables, they work fine. If I have both the trigger inputs plugged into the subs along with the subwoofer cables, the subs will not turn on at all. They act as if they are not plugged in even though the power light is lit up on them. I have SVS subs, so the light is red as it would be in standby mode. If I unhook the trigger inputs from each of the subs, they both turn on when they sense the LFE output from the receiver through the sub cables. The sub cables are also split from a single LFE output sub cable running from my receiver. That, too, I know is a splitter and not a combiner. Like I said before it worked perfectly before I ran the cable. It seems as if there is some sort of short. Now that I am home, I am going to play around some more with it to see what happens.
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LCSeminole
Global Moderator
Res firma mitescere nescit.
Posts: 20,850
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Post by LCSeminole on Nov 14, 2016 17:34:36 GMT -5
Why are you using the triggers for the subwoofers, when you can use the "AUTO ON" feature which automatically turns on the subwoofer amplifier when it senses a signal?
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Post by vneal on Nov 14, 2016 17:46:55 GMT -5
Why are you using the triggers for the subwoofers, when you can use the "AUTO ON" feature which automatically turns on the subwoofer amplifier when it senses a signal? Bingo |
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Post by hosko on Nov 14, 2016 19:07:27 GMT -5
Some say auto on doesn't work at low volume levels, however if the sub isn't registering any signal I don't know what it would output anyway.
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Post by srpawski on Nov 14, 2016 19:22:28 GMT -5
Some say auto on doesn't work at low volume levels, however if the sub isn't registering any signal I don't know what it would output anyway. That right there is the reason. I have never had good luck at low volumes with subs turning on just by the LFE signal alone. Subs are hard to find with trigger outputs, however, they are out there. I'm not the only one who has had this issue and who finds it annoying. I have read several sub reviews with people complaining that it takes higher volume levels to get them to turn on. I was able to find out that my issue is with my primary trigger cable. I'm not sure how, but apparently its not working. I don't recall pulling too hard on it when I ran it through the ceiling, but by disconnecting my Emo ET-3 from my primary system and using it on this non functioning set up, it's not sending a signal to the subs. I also verified that its not the trigger out on the amp that is now somehow bad. I am ecstatic with the fact that I get to basically redo the wiring I did yesterday. First time I have ran into this issue and I have pulled a lot of cables. |
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Post by hosko on Nov 14, 2016 21:48:46 GMT -5
a soldering iron and continuity tester are great things to own Thats one reason I like to make my own cables, makes it really easy to fix.
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Post by srpawski on Nov 14, 2016 22:01:26 GMT -5
Whats crazy is the ends of the cable I ran have the screw on jacket connector and I unscrewed them and looked to see if a solder joint broke and they look good at both ends. I'm not sure what the deal is but it seems like a bad end.
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Post by leonski on Nov 14, 2016 22:21:12 GMT -5
a soldering iron and continuity tester are great things to own Thats one reason I like to make my own cables, makes it really easy to fix. I'd replace 'continuity tester' with 'Cheap DVM'. The 35$ level of DVM is very flexible. Mine even includes a type 'K' thermocouple input and a couple on about 3' of cable. I use it on the Grill! In addition to a soldering iron, you'll need some Solder Wick to DEsolder. And if you want the REST of the kit, you'll need some good ROSEN CORE solder, tip cleaning setup for the iron AND some diagonal cutters as well as a wire stripper. And while you're at it, a cheap OUTLET TESTER. This is the first step in tracking down ground loops / hums 5$ or so at the local home store. A good stocking stuffer? The Kill-A-Watt meter. Maybe 20$ and a good way to check line voltage, and power used by anything you can plug into it. www.p3international.com/products/p4400.htmlIf anyone is interested, we can discuss 'the minimum kit' for those who wish to get into a little DIY. The above is good info, but not the end. I keep some heat-shrink and a selection of crimp-on wire ends as well as a very good wire stripper which goes from #10 to probably #20 or so. I also have wire nuts in a variety of sizes as well as glass fuses for everything I own that takes one. And yes, my amps, which use a signal trigger will shut off if the signal gets TOO LOW for more than a couple minutes. That's how that stuff works. |
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Post by knucklehead on Nov 14, 2016 22:45:27 GMT -5
Why not daisy chain the cables? 12v output from the receiver to the input trigger on the first sub then from the first sub's 12v output to the next sub's 12v input. Most audio gear that is turned on and off via a 12v trigger signal have a 12v output too. Many receivers have two or more trigger jacks - in which case the easiest thing to do is use two separate cables from the back of the receiver.
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Post by RichGuy on Nov 14, 2016 22:59:29 GMT -5
Does it work OK if only one sub at a time is connected with only one cable? I am thinking it may be a problem with the splitter not working compatibly with the trigger cables (maybe stereo splitter/mono cable somehow shorting).
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Post by leonski on Nov 14, 2016 23:41:56 GMT -5
Does it work OK if only one sub at a time is connected with only one cable? I am thinking it may be a problem with the splitter not working compatibly with the trigger cables (maybe stereo splitter/mono cable somehow shorting). Why not TEST and save yourself some typing? Good troubleshooting. Other approach, someone suggested above, was to just use the signal sensing feature on the subs. Any reason why NOT? At least, if so equipped? |
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Post by srpawski on Nov 15, 2016 6:10:14 GMT -5
The subs only have one trigger input. Otherwise I would definitely daisy chain them. It didn't matter if only one sub was hooked up and the other unhooked. If one of the triggers were connected, it would either shut the sub off, or it would not come on at all. I don't like having to turn the volume up loud to get the subs to trigger an input signal from only the sub cable using the auto on on the sub. It also seems that if once they are triggered they shut off if there isnt a certain level of loudness for them to sense an incoming signal from the LFE. This is true with any subwoofer that I have ever owned. I can see why manufactures put 12 volt trigger inputs on subs, but it doesnt seem that its a very popular feature. I am kind of surprised more people on these forums don't like it or use it for the same reasons I do. Just seems like a step up approach in system quality not to have to crank up the system to get the subs to turn on.
I ordered new mono cables for my triggers. I ordered another Emo ET-3 and will run dedicated mono triggers to each sub. I am still going to use the subwoofer cable splitter since that doesnt appear to be causing the issues. But I am returning the Blue Rigger subwoofer cables to Amazon that I ordered cause I don't like how sloppy they fit and am replacing them with Media Bridge cables like I should have bought in the first place because their ends are better. I knew this at the start but was trying to save myself $4. I am also replacing my monoprice sub cable splitter with the Media Bridge splitter. All in all, by the time I return everything and replace I am looking at about an extra $60 to get this done plus my time redoing all the cabling. Not really happy but I guess thats how it goes and what needs to be done if I want it to work.
It is the mono cable causing some sort of short. I did test everything even the output on the back of the amp. I did all of that in between my second and third posts after I got home and replied to Keith's questions. The post I made after that was after my testing results.
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Post by USNRet on Nov 15, 2016 12:24:50 GMT -5
I would use a different method to check and see if the output of the receiver trigger (split) is enough to trigger both sub amps. While a meter will read good voltage it does tell you if you have enough current (amperage) to turn on the sub. I would look at the specs of sub to see what the required current is and then select two 12 vdc light bulbs which require the minimum amperage to light. Connect both bulbs (one to the sub end of each trigger wire) and see if they both turn on. A lot of people mistakenly believe that if the voltage is correct on the meter the circuit is good. Get two cheap circuit testing lights www.autozone.com/test-scan-and-specialty-tools/circuit-tester/dorman-conduct-tite-electrical-multi-tester/69335_0_0/ |
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Post by leonski on Nov 15, 2016 14:44:10 GMT -5
SRPAWSKI, I wouldn't sweat a few bucks for the peace of mind you get with better cables and certain connections and funcitonality.
Nothing RUINS my day than having to mess with something.
Trivial Example? Bought new plastic 'lites' for my kitchen recessed fluorescent tubes. I have 4x48" in 2 fixtures. The OLD plastic was going on 30 years old, yellowing with age AND had gotten brittle.
Each piece measured EXACTLY 24"x48" and I needed 3 pieces.
Too bad for ME. Can't get that size. No Joke. 23 3/4" x 47"3/4" is IT. And they tend to FALL OUT of the recess at unexpected and by definition Unacceptible times. A custom plastic cutter would make me exactly what I want at about
3x or 4x what the home store solution cost. I'm in process of figuring out a 'fix' that won't cost me an arm and a leg. A plastic RIB hot-glued across the width of the panel should work and provide the stiffness to prevent the BOWING and FALLING>
So, I feel your pain of working with stuff that SHOULD work but doesnt'.
Low Current HAS been mentioned in regards to triggers. I simple relay and power supply could be a fix, but is more detailed than I can do in a simple post like this. I believe in TIME DELAY relays, too. That way to can start stuff IN ORDER without a huge surge.
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Post by srpawski on Nov 15, 2016 15:00:50 GMT -5
I'm more frustrated with having to do the job twice and the fact that before I did the job I checked everything and it worked before I did it. The extra cost of an ET-3 and the extra $20 isn't that big of a deal to me. I just gambled on trying the different brand sub cable instead of sticking to what I have used in the past. Don't get me wrong, Blue Rigger makes good stuff, just the ends of their sub cables appear sloppy and it could just be the rca ends on my subs are slightly different than standard fit although I highly doubt it.
Oh well. I know it's gonna work now when I end up getting done with the extra cable lead I am gonna run for the trigger. That part is the royal pain since it involves getting into the bookcase and moving the amps in order to get to the back to hook up and the part I wanted to avoid having to do a second time.
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Post by srpawski on Nov 19, 2016 9:57:02 GMT -5
Up and running....
Got my new cables and dedicated trigger runs to each run with ET3 and everything is working perfectly.
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