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Post by Jean Genie on Dec 30, 2016 2:37:40 GMT -5
Anybody heard a Schiit Sys preamp as compared to a Emo USP-1?
I'm thinkin' I could trade my USP-1 and my XDA-1 for a Big eGo and plug that into the Sys and have a decent, compact, space saver setup, and it would only cost about $75. I would hate to give up the USP-1 for anything inferior. In my setup, the USP-1 sounds exceptional, so it'd be a gamble, but that Big eGo is soooo tempting!
Any thoughts are welcome.
Jorge
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 30, 2016 2:47:40 GMT -5
If you only have USB inputs then just the Ego will do the job, no need for a pre amp If you have a turntable then you'd go a long way to find anything better than the phono pre amp in a USP-1. I'm not convinced that the XSP-1 phono pre amp is noticeably better sounding.
Happy New Year
Gary
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Post by Jean Genie on Dec 30, 2016 3:08:03 GMT -5
If you only have USB inputs then just the Ego will do the job, no need for a pre amp If you have a turntable then you'd go a long way to find anything better than the phono pre amp in a USP-1. I'm not convinced that the XSP-1 phono pre amp is noticeably better sounding. Happy New Year Gary Good point, I hadn't considered the phono pre. Guess I'll keep the USP-1. I was actually trying to reduce my form factor by going eGo into the Sys , which has 2 RCA inputs, but neither is a dedicated phono input. Thanks Gary, and Happy New Year to you too. Jorge |
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Post by monkumonku on Dec 30, 2016 10:42:30 GMT -5
Anybody heard a Schiit Sys preamp as compared to a Emo USP-1? I'm thinkin' I could trade my USP-1 and my XDA-1 for a Big eGo and plug that into the Sys and have a decent, compact, space saver setup, and it would only cost about $75. I would hate to give up the USP-1 for anything inferior. In my setup, the USP-1 sounds exceptional, so it'd be a gamble, but that Big eGo is soooo tempting! Any thoughts are welcome. Jorge The Sys is not a preamp, it's just a passive attenuator. But if that is all you need and you don't have more than two inputs or outputs (and you can only have two inputs/one output or one input/two outputs) and don't need any other features except a straight pass-through with the ability to switch inputs/outputs then it should be fine. It is nowhere near the USP-1 in quality or features, though. I would keep the USP-1. |
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Post by garbulky on Dec 30, 2016 10:43:24 GMT -5
I've used the XDA-1, USP-1, and the XPA-2 together. I've also used the XDA-1 direct to the XPA-2 as well as the XDA-1, USP-1 and a UPA-2. So...first congratulations on a fantastic amp!! It really can grow with you. A very nice unit. Though I loved the XDA-1 for its "float in the air" see through sound, I have found that there are better DACs out there. The USP-1 produced smashing dynamics. Whack you over the head type stuff. For home theater it did quite well. However it's not the most transparent unit. It's sound appears to be almost compressed all in to the mid-range. Sort of mid-range aggressive. But (Chuckienut will love this) it is certainly musical. You can definitely enjoy the sound. But there are improvements to it that could be had from top to bottom. I wouldn't go with the Sys. It's a passive preamp. The XPA-2 also isn't driven easily - to its best. You'll notice the difference when you connect the XDA-1 direct to the XPA-2. Sounds good but there is a difference with the USP-1 in the mix. My reccomendation is the DC-1. True it costs more a bit but for me it is worth the money! If you sell the XDA-1 and the USP-1, the DC-1 by itself will make up for it. Emotiva sells a XPS-1 for $127 which is the phono module for the XSP-1 (but with a switching unit). It's quite good. If you don't like that the XPS-1 is smaller than the DC-1, you could spend more money and get the SP-1. Which is the phono companion to the DC-1 which contains more or less the same XPS-1 unit plus additional analog inputs for a matching form factor. The DC-1 + SP-1 form factor is very small and you could carry both with three fingers. So for improvements: the DC-1 is more transparent than the USP-1. Its analog input is also more transparent. Think straight wire plus gain. However it doesn't do whack you over the head dynamics like the USP-1. But its transparency really helps things out here. Also top to bottom the tone is quite balanced. You also get things....depending on your setup....like a 3 dimensional soundstage. If you are lucky, you may get to experience room dimensions in the recording. This is where you can almost hear the room it was recorded in and where are the performers in the room - to an extent. It happens on my XPA-1 gen 2 with its class A switch turned on. But I'm not sure if it happens with the XPA-2. But never the less the DC_1 and XPA-2 is capable of 3d dimensional portrayal for the soundstage. Things like the "body" of the instrument can be more noticeable. The instruments also relate to each other better. Instead of them being separate entities portrayed well, here the "space" between them (the ambience/echoes) ties them together as performing together. I.e they are performing in the same hall. Not performing separate from each other while hearing hall acoustics in the background. That right there does take some effort to get right. Compared to the XSP-1: the XSP-1 is better than the USP-1 - but it is expensive. It's not as transparent as the DC-1's preamp (surprisingly). It cannot quite do room ambience/room dimensions and it's bass is a bit muddier. However the XSP-1 scales volume very nicely and it retains lots of dynamics. Think of it as the USP-1 refined. You remember that mid-range aggression? It's not there here. It has a nice balanced sound with good tone for the most part though not 100% perfect in the treble...close. However due to its better transparency, I would suggest the DC-1. I can't guarantee you'll hear everything I'm telling you. But that has been my experience with it. Small things like your room, room acoustics and treatments, your speaker choice, and speaker placement/toe in can affect what you hear and can negate any audible benefit between your current setup and a DC-1. Or if you are like Chuckie nut, you can plug everything in to your computers 50 cent soundcard, wear just a towel and blindfold, and declare "everything sounds just the same ya phools"! Save a ton of money that way! Whatever works for ya!  |
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Post by vcautokid on Dec 30, 2016 11:34:55 GMT -5
The Sys could be very cool. But it is only going to be one input output, and the other preamplifiers like the USP-1, and XSP-1, and so on will give greater flexibility in the future. Also the Fully Differential Balanced Topology of the DC-1, or the XSP-1 could be very attractive too. I would if you are looking at Schiit Preamplifiers, you might want to look at the Freya, or the Saga for further consideration.
So if things like Bass management is important, you may want to look closer at the XSP-1. Also the Phono Stage is excellent if you want to dabble in vinyl. If one analog and multiple digital sources are in the play, also the consider the DC-1 as this is an awesome DAC Preamplifier that is an amazing sounding performer. Also of course BAS-X.
I had a USP-1 for quite a while and liked it allot. I think with what Emotiva is doing today, along with others, you have allot of options. Depending on your budget constraints, or your component complement, you could have a terrific setup without breaking the bank. Some folks also like the Audio GD products as well. If I was doing a preamplifier again it would be the XSP-1 Gen 2. It is amazing, and at least for me checks off all the boxes on performance, and flexibility value.
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Post by Jean Genie on Dec 30, 2016 14:10:24 GMT -5
Thank you, Gary, Monku, Gar & VC for the responses. I think the USP-1 is a keeper. I guess I was just looking to take advantage of the Emo trade up offer, combined with the Holiday Sale (yeah, I'm a cheapskate!)Since I don't have 500 clams for a DC-1 at the moment, I'll just sit tight for now and keep using my Oppo 103's DAC via HDMI. It actually sounds VERY good.
Happy New Year all,
Joege
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Post by garbulky on Dec 30, 2016 15:08:38 GMT -5
Thank you, Gary, Monku, Gar & VC for the responses. I think the USP-1 is a keeper. I guess I was just looking to take advantage of the Emo trade up offer, combined with the Holiday Sale (yeah, I'm a cheapskate!)Since I don't have 500 clams for a DC-1 at the moment, I'll just sit tight for now and keep using my Oppo 103's DAC via HDMI. It actually sounds VERY good. Happy New Year all, Joege And to you! Ho ho ho! |
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Post by Gary Cook on Dec 30, 2016 17:09:56 GMT -5
In response, I have no doubt that garbulky has a strong liking for the sound quality of the DC-1 but, as it is intended for studio (professional) use, to me it has 3 weaknesses for your application;
1. It does not have the same form factor as other Emotiva gear, for example your XPA-2. To some people contiguous appearance is important, to others not so much.
2. It doesn't have any bass management and I noted the you were utilising a sub, hence highly relevant in your case.
3. It doesn't have HT bypass, again for some that's important.
For the above reasons I don't have a DC-1 and most likely never will, so I can not comment on its sound quality, which I have no doubt is excellent.
The USP-1 has (unusually) sensitive (aggressive) volume control for inputs other than the phono which has a more "normal" volume progression. This could easily be interpreted as being mid range biased as that is commonly where the most music content is. Having listened to a USP-1 (it was my first ever piece of Emotiva gear) over many years and also after measuring it several times I have found no such bias. i.e.; it's pretty dam flat.
Having recently moved to an XSP-1 Gen 2, where the volume control is much more progressive, the advantages that I have found are;
1. After playing with speaker location I have found that it has a larger sound stage, it's similarly wide to the USP-1 but has a bit more depth and more height.
2. The directionality (ability to locate in space each instrument) is slightly better, for example I can occasionally, in quality recordings, locate individual instruments in a group of the same instruments.
3. It has both trigger in and trigger out, where as the USP-1 only had trigger out. The trigger in is particularly useful when the XSP-1 is used in HT bypass mode (i.e. turning on the UMC-200 which triggers the XSP-1)
4. It has balanced inputs and the discrete circuitry that really utilises all of the sound quality that the ERC-3 can produce.
5. It has balance outputs and the supporting discrete circuitry that, via XLR cabling to the XPA-1L's, eliminates a small noise issue that I had with the RCA connections (both being ~5 metres in length).
6. Unlike the USP-1, the phono input has exactly the same volume progression as the other inputs. I suspect that's due to an improvement in the XSP-1 phono pre amp output.
It certainly sounds equally as even through the frequency range and overlaying the measurements from the USP-1 there's not a lot of difference, at best a couple of db. FWIW almost immeasurable in the mid range frequencies.
All things being equal there is very little sound quality difference between the USP-1 and the XSP-1, except in my case not all things are equal. For example the XSP-1 has features that made it possible for me to improve the sound quality, the balanced inputs from the ERC-3 and the balanced outputs to the XPA-1L's. The latter is important for me as it has facilitated the move of the XPA-1L's close by their respective speaker (i.e. long interconnects and short speaker cables), which I have found over the years almost always makes an improvement.
Horses for courses, if I hadn't been able to take advantage of the XSP-1's more advanced features (i.e. all things being equal) then I'd most likely still be using the USP-1.
Happy New Year to all.
Gary
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2016 22:18:48 GMT -5
"Though I loved the XDA-1 for its "float in the air" see through sound"
The only thing floating in the air is Garbulky's imagination! Remember he refuses to conduct any type of blind comparison (Even the famous Easy Nut Test, I wonder why).
"like Chuckie nut, you can plug everything in to your computers 50 cent soundcard"
I still bought the XDA-2 for many logical reasons which I have posted, however, the suggestion that the PC sound card would sound almost completely the same was from a CEO of a very well known factory direct to end user brand of audio components and speakers, you are all very familiar with.
BTW, how did he hack the photo of me blind folded?
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Post by Jean Genie on Dec 30, 2016 22:38:35 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2016 4:40:05 GMT -5
"ARE YOU READY TO RUMMMMMBLLLLLE?"  Chuckienut & Garbulky, feel free to 'jack this thread with my blessing!   Sorry Jorge, I will only respond now when Garbulky starts the attack as he did in your thread here and I responded. However, thanks for the encouragement! |
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Post by Jean Genie on Dec 31, 2016 8:05:57 GMT -5
You da man, Chuckie. Happy & Healthy '17 to you and yours.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2016 9:19:38 GMT -5
Same to you! You are very lucky we don't live near you. I showed Noriko-Nut the photo of your cute puppy. If you turned your back for a second it would be on the next lane to Japan! |
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Post by gzubeck on Dec 31, 2016 12:23:21 GMT -5
im using the sys. any questions?
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Post by Jean Genie on Dec 31, 2016 12:37:21 GMT -5
im using the sys. any questions? Just the original -How's it compare to the USP-1? |
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Post by Axis on Dec 31, 2016 12:44:07 GMT -5
Schiit does not make anything better than the USP-1 for a preamp. They make all kinds of cool stuff and in cool ways but I do not see anything they make that will do what the USP-1 will do. The USP-1 let's every thing shine through and Schiit don't make anything that makes the sound, sound better.
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Post by garbulky on Dec 31, 2016 12:52:07 GMT -5
I don't know, you guys. The USP-1, though I liked my time with it, can be bettered in sound quality imo.
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Post by Axis on Dec 31, 2016 12:59:08 GMT -5
I don't know, you guys. The USP-1, though I liked my time with it, can be bettered in sound quality imo. How ? What sound and how much quality ? Nothing against you Garbulky but I don't think anyone here could tell the difference between the USP-1 and the XSP-1. The new BasX gear sounds as good as the XSP. All this gear that is discussed here sounds good and if you hear a difference ok, but different does not make it better. Have fun and listen and discuss and listen and discuss and have fun. A USP-1 sounds great everyone. |
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Post by garbulky on Dec 31, 2016 13:25:05 GMT -5
I don't know, you guys. The USP-1, though I liked my time with it, can be bettered in sound quality imo. How ? What sound and how much quality ? Nothing against you Garbulky but I don't think anyone here could tell the difference between the USP-1 and the XSP-1. The new BasX gear sounds as good as the XSP. All this gear that is discussed here sounds good and if you hear a difference ok, but different does not make it better. Have fun and listen and discuss and listen and discuss and have fun. A USP-1 sounds great everyone. No offence to anyone who owns the gear of course. And my impressions are my own. Not everybody will find it to be true. The improvements I think possible are in my post above. The DC-1 has the most transparency as a preamp including bass and treble. The XSP-1 improves over the USP-1 on top to bottom tone and transparency. I find myself preferring the DC-1 fully balanced direct to the amps over the other two in to XPA-1 (XLR). I find myself preferring the XSP-1 when running it in to a UPA-2 (RCA) due to the impression of more dynamic slam like with drums and stuff. |
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