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Post by anotherdiy on Jan 30, 2017 3:08:44 GMT -5
Hello!
I currently have an Airmotive S12, XPA 2 driving 2) JBL L890 from an UMC 200.
I'm wondering if anyone has mix matched sub sizes? Seems everyone doubles what ever they are running. I was thinking of adding Airmotive S15 to pick up the lower frequencies.
This is obviously for research purposes as I still need to get an amp (XPA Gen3 5 channel) to drive the additional 5 speakers I have (2 pairs JBL L810 and JBL LC1) to make up a 7.1 system. This will be for a 7.2 system as I have yet to hear: "Oh man, I wish I only had one Sub!"
Thanks for your time!
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Post by yeahwicked on Jan 30, 2017 6:04:55 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2017 10:35:52 GMT -5
Yeahwicked's advice is good. The real concern with multi-sub setups is that the smaller or less powerful subwoofer might be "the weak link", so set the less capable subwoofer to run at a slightly lower level such that both subwoofers hit their output limits at the same time.
You can turn off your main speakers and listen for the subwoofers to hit their electronic limiters (which the Airmotiv subwoofers have) or reach their mechanical limits, either of which can sound like a "blip" or a loss of control and definition. Then adjust the less powerful subwoofer to run at a lower level until it no longer sounds like it is reaching its limits.
It's also good to put the more powerful subwoofer up in front of the room if you can, so the impact feels like it is coming from the front, instead of the side or the rear.
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Post by anotherdiy on Jan 30, 2017 12:36:24 GMT -5
Thank you for the info.
I wondered if I was over thinking it and if there was some benefit to having different sizes. (Picking up on frequencys that might be getting missed)
Makes sense to have them working the same or complement each other and being careful to not over work the smaller of the two.
To save in the complexity, I'll just get a second of the same size.
I'm already amazed how much one sub added to the system.
I continue to hear how much of a difference 2 subs make. Really looking forward to that experience.
Trouble is keeping it at a reasonable level so my neighbors are not hearing or feeling it as well! But that's another subject...
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Post by ehmokey on Aug 13, 2017 9:13:53 GMT -5
I recently upgraded to a new PSA S1500 sub from my 15yr old MTX SW1 (perfect working condition). ...would you recommend trying to integrate both subs? or would the MTX be so inferior to the PSA that it would cause more headaches than is worth? The PSA is a sealed 15"woofer with 725w, the MTX is a vented 10"woofer with 150 watts. Compared to the PSA I would call the MTX a mid bass module
My room is a 2200 ft3 rectangle (30W x 11L x 6.5h)
Thank you.
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Post by vneal on Aug 13, 2017 11:02:11 GMT -5
Would you use non matching speakers for front left and right? The same holds true for subwoofers
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Post by novisnick on Aug 13, 2017 11:15:50 GMT -5
Would you use non matching speakers for front left and right? The same holds true for subwoofers I disagree with you my friend, is it optimal? NO ! But if what you own at any given can be blended to work together to work then try, you have only time invested. I believe that mismatched subs can be blended as some subs will emphasize a smaller range than others. Over the years I have used this practice, Ill recommend it to HT, not two channel. 2.1 should be fine. At this time I have a few smaller subs I would be willing to sell but shipping prevents such a sale. I am THRILLED with the subs I now own but they've been years in coming. Building systems takes years of progression when you don't have the funding to do it all at once. I Think that wouldn't be as fun, educational or efficient if you build a system in one shot. Bottom line is, you own what you own, till you change it. Have fun in the interim. |
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Post by rbk123 on Aug 13, 2017 14:11:30 GMT -5
I have a 15" and a 12" in my secondary HT setup. It sounds better with both of them than either of them by themselves.
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Post by simpleman68 on Aug 13, 2017 14:26:51 GMT -5
Would you use non matching speakers for front left and right? The same holds true for subwoofers A couple exceptions though: 1. Home theater (LFE) is much more forgiving of mismatched subs than 2 ch 2. Deep bass is much less subject to differentiation by the human ear as much can't be localized I'm running 2 mismatched subs in the theater and 2 matched ones in my 2 ch room and the 2 in the theater work very well together. In the 2 ch room I have sub 2 180 degrees out of phase while in the theater they are both in phase with each other but set to dual mono. I have x-over points set identically and they move a lot of air. When I set it to 2 sub stereo, the sound was not nearly as punchy. Maybe just a room gain issue, I'm not sure. But when I set it to dual mono, they complement each other exceptionally well. Scott |
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Post by Gary Cook on Aug 14, 2017 15:58:01 GMT -5
I've found it to be pretty simple, it depends on how they are being run;
Mono = mismatched subs
Stereo = matched subs
Cheers
Gary
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Post by esquire on Aug 14, 2017 17:16:37 GMT -5
I have a 15" and a 12" in my secondary HT setup. It sounds better with both of them than either of them by themselves. I have same setup and concur although its my primary setup. Couldn't be happier. |
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djreef
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Thoroughly enjoying my Schiit
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Post by djreef on Aug 15, 2017 22:18:43 GMT -5
Would you use non matching speakers for front left and right? The same holds true for subwoofers A couple exceptions though: 1. Home theater (LFE) is much more forgiving of mismatched subs than 2 ch 2. Deep bass is much less subject to differentiation by the human ear as much can't be localized I'm running 2 mismatched subs in the theater and 2 matched ones in my 2 ch room and the 2 in the theater work very well together. In the 2 ch room I have sub 2 180 degrees out of phase while in the theater they are both in phase with each other but set to dual mono. I have x-over points set identically and they move a lot of air. When I set it to 2 sub stereo, the sound was not nearly as punchy. Maybe just a room gain issue, I'm not sure. But when I set it to dual mono, they complement each other exceptionally well. Scott Werd. Music is muuuuuch less forgiving. The LF in movies tends to be much more diffuse and considerably less localizeable (if that's even a word), thus easier to cheat with. My HT rig actually has 3 subs. A 16 year old Velodyne F-1800 and 2 Polks. Oddly enough they match up prretty well. DJ |
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Post by ac2011 on Aug 16, 2017 6:32:15 GMT -5
Would you use non matching speakers for front left and right? The same holds true for subwoofers I disagree with you my friend, is it optimal? NO ! But if what you own at any given can be blended to work together to work then try, you have only time invested. I believe that mismatched subs can be blended as some subs will emphasize a smaller range than others. Over the years I have used this practice, Ill recommend it to HT, not two channel. 2.1 should be fine. At this time I have a few smaller subs I would be willing to sell but shipping prevents such a sale. I am THRILLED with the subs I now own but they've been years in coming. Building systems takes years of progression when you don't have the funding to do it all at once. I Think that wouldn't be as fun, educational or efficient if you build a system in one shot. Bottom line is, you own what you own, till you change it. Have fun in the interim. I have matching PowerSound Audio subs, but at different points in the (ongoing) process, I have had discussions with Tom V. about mixing in different subs. He agrees it can be okay, but you may need a bunch of experimentation on placement and setup to get the desired/best results. |
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Post by novisnick on Aug 16, 2017 6:45:40 GMT -5
I disagree with you my friend, is it optimal? NO ! But if what you own at any given can be blended to work together to work then try, you have only time invested. I believe that mismatched subs can be blended as some subs will emphasize a smaller range than others. Over the years I have used this practice, Ill recommend it to HT, not two channel. 2.1 should be fine. At this time I have a few smaller subs I would be willing to sell but shipping prevents such a sale. I am THRILLED with the subs I now own but they've been years in coming. Building systems takes years of progression when you don't have the funding to do it all at once. I Think that wouldn't be as fun, educational or efficient if you build a system in one shot. Bottom line is, you own what you own, till you change it. Have fun in the interim. I have matching PowerSound Audio subs, but at different points in the (ongoing) process, I have had discussions with Tom V. about mixing in different subs. He agrees it can be okay, but you may need a bunch of experimentation on placement and setup to get the desired/best results. Wow! We have almost the same system! LOL I was running the same subs, Yamaha 3020, monoblocks and a 5 channel amp. I have had the same conversation with Tom V, for years I had mixed and matched subs and have had wonderful results but now that Im running two s3000i no others. Best results to date. |
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Post by ac2011 on Aug 16, 2017 6:58:06 GMT -5
I have matching PowerSound Audio subs, but at different points in the (ongoing) process, I have had discussions with Tom V. about mixing in different subs. He agrees it can be okay, but you may need a bunch of experimentation on placement and setup to get the desired/best results. Wow! We have almost the same system! LOL I was running the same subs, Yamaha 3020, monoblocks and a 5 channel amp. I have had the same conversation with Tom V, for years I had mixed and matched subs and have had wonderful results but now that Im running two s3001i no others. Best results to date. Cool. I really like my PSA subs, and Tom always has time (and patience) to answer questions. I have been looking, for a while now, at moving both my 15's up front and adding 1 or 2 smaller nearfield subs. Looked long and hard at the 3000 a few times, but the weight of it is/was crazy for shipping to Canada. Would now love to get the 18's or the 3600's, but again, shipping would be a beast. |
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Post by novisnick on Aug 16, 2017 7:06:59 GMT -5
Wow! We have almost the same system! LOL I was running the same subs, Yamaha 3020, monoblocks and a 5 channel amp. I have had the same conversation with Tom V, for years I had mixed and matched subs and have had wonderful results but now that Im running two s3001i no others. Best results to date. Cool. I really like my PSA subs, and Tom always has time (and patience) to answer questions. I have been looking, for a while now, at moving both my 15's up front and adding 1 or 2 smaller nearfield subs. Looked long and hard at the 3000 a few times, but the weight of it is/was crazy for shipping to Canada. Would now love to get the 18's or the 3600's, but again, shipping would be a beast. I contemplated the S3600 as well, now thats a beast. If I wasn't going up a set of stairs at my age, and had room for them (really big) I may have gone that route. The s3000i 's are incredible! Ive actually shook the paneling on the studs! 😲🥜 Thats nuts! LOL So very impressed, Tom V gave me an extremely fair trade in value as well. I don't know what shipping would be for you but after the initial pirchase if you ever have a problem you wont have to ship the box back, just a component. These subs run double duty, both are used for HT and a single for 2.1. The s3000i is quick and responsive as well as accurate. |
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Post by ehmokey on Aug 20, 2017 7:33:11 GMT -5
I want to give thanks to all for your opinions, they were truly appreciated.
I did the sub crawl for the PSA and placed it in the front left corner of the room. The next step was to turn the sub volume knob to 1/3 power and use Yamaha's YPAO. Once YPAO was done I changed the front speakers to small and tweaked the volume to preference using Yamaha's bass management. I left all other settings alone.
Once I was happy, I played with the MTX did another sub crawl and placed it parallel to MLP against the wall, I spent a few hours and blended the MTX volume by ear.
In my room, and, to my ears music never sounded so sweet. The texture, sound and palpability (sp?) of the bass is awesome. In my opinion, it sounds almost as good as the theater close to home where we go to hear live music.
Cheers!
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